How you rate our draft?

[santa claws]

Andrew Swallow captained the WA side and he slid, a long way. Bastinac slid. Greenwood slid. Ziebell slid. And that is just our club. I think a lot of mids slide, some do have good reasons for sliding but generally people do not talk about a player in the first place unless there was good reason to talk about them.

But, that is not to say you shouldn't draft guys that nobody knows much about. We took Anthony early which was a shock selection, similar with Goldstein. I think it just comes down to if your recruiters get the call right consistently enough then you just back them in that they know what they are doing.

sheesh swallow aside here i was thinking those mids went very close to where most people expected them to. that is within a ten pick range. ie prediction 20 went 15 thru 25. in ziebels case within 2 or 3 picks.

 

[santa claws]

I am still not convinced overall it was the smartest approach. If we were keen on Conca early we should have traded for pick 13 and so forth to get him. Eg Heppell and Conca

You mighn't get him but if you are going left field fine, but you need to play the odds to a certain extent.

For example could we have traded 1, 2, 3 all our picks for norths 1, 2, 3 and pick up their compo and get the same plus Harper.

Mighn't happen but you have to put yourself in a position to win big. If you miss you end up with a Atley instead of Conca or whoever so the downside isn't that great but you pick up Harper.

Bit like trading for Polak and getting JR.

So even if the Tigers picks come off they didn't necessarily play this the smartest way IMO. Easy to say in hindsight I know!

My biggest concern is who we missed at pick 30 eg. Steinberg or Mcarthy but that is history as we may have got Batchelor later and it is not, with respect, the end of the world if we just miss him with pick3.

Easy to see in hindsight but I think the Tigers may need to revaluate.or reassess/revise certain things going forward if need be. Only a suggestion!

The other thing is going forward for me, we are deficient across the half forward line including flankers but loaded in the middle. A great mid may pop up with us not needing him, and a lack of half fowards, like Rohan, Harper and Steinberg may occur let alone a good CHF which are rare as in the best of times. Risky business IMO

agree with these sentiments.

 

[UpTheGuts]

Fairly clear we will target a KPF when free agency comes in

Rather disappointed at this point, but I suppose would prefer it now than in a few years. Feels like we reached across the board

Gotta trust FJ I guess. Huge couple of drafts for him.

 

[True Thylacine]

Im in no position to comment. No SFA about these kids. If the recruiting team's decisions prove as good as last years then I'm happy with what they decide. No doubt in 18 months we will all be experts with full 20/20 hindsight but as for now I'll STFU.

 

[TigerTime88]

Look I think like others have said we have taken some pretty heavy risks and paid overs. A few points from me:

Conca: Was never going to go top 14. I like him and I am happy we have him but why not trade pick 6 to say Adelaide for pick 14 and something we want e.g 2nd and 3rd rnd picks. Not saying that is the deal, but something along those lines.

Compo Pick: I said before the draft I will cry if Harper is available at 26, which would have been our compo pick. Not only was Harper available but so was Darling. One of these two would have made it a super draft for us.

Pick 30 - Our KPP are far from set. Macarthy was still available and was tipped to go top 20 but slid. A big solid CHB would just mean we sure up our defense even more. The other guys I wanted here were Luke Parker who I rate very very highly and thought should have been taken, Viv Michie again rate him highly and also Josh Green to a lesser extent.

Happy with the other picks as pick 47+ is always a tad speculative and I like the x-factor they have chosen as well as the HFF theme which is a glaring need. Macdonald I am happy with.

Really just think we could have used the fact that Conca was not going to go super early (don't say he might of because us and Freo were the clubs that were keen) and traded ourselves into a better spot.

Harper or Darling also imo will be better than a player at pick 20 in the 2012 draft. I don't know that player but I can tell you this...Harper is top 10 for talent in this draft and if he lives up to his potential he could be an absolute didak like freak. Would have been happy with him at 6. Darling was considered a top 3 talent and would have made our forward line super potent.


I hope our recruiters are right because we really needed a strong draft here.

 

[santa claws]

North get 10/10
Us around 5/10 - Won't know for 3 years.

When you think our draft could have been either of the 2 below:
#6 Heppell Lynch
#30 Mitchell Hallahan
#47 Gilbee Gilbee
#51 Ugle Ugle
#63 Cope/Giles Cope/Giles

6 conca - heppell caddy atley. did we get the best.

30 batchelor - mids fasolo michie horlin-smith hallahan newton parker green.
talls mccarthy mitchell.
again was there better performed safer bets and would batchelor have been there at pick 47 or 51. imo we went to early.

47 helbig - one has to ask helbig who? and did we need to take him here. still available browne gilbee crocker johnson litherland and others.

51 macdonald - medium forward good shot at goal. could have filled this role with mid /for in green horlin-smith fasolo newton at 30.

for me
6 caddy/heppell still cant decide.

30 horlin-smith green parker hallahan.

47 alex johnson

from there the club could have their picks
51 batchelor
63 helbig
rookie derickx he would have been there i reckon. promote gourdis take houli
psd.
take the punt macdonald would be available to rookie.
to me the compensation pick should have been used and another couple should have been delisted.

rookie derickx chalwel macdonald.

anyway just a few thoughts and concerns seems to me we have again taken players a tad early you have to ask whos radar would any of helbig macdonald and at 30 batchelor have been on i could understand taking one early but 3.when such talent was still available.

anyway here is to supporting the selections we have taken no real judgement can be made for two or three seasons anyway. lets hope they have got it right.

 

[Ty German]

The recruiting and development under Hardwick in year 1 was outstanding. I have faith that this will continue in year 2. Considering picks 1-3 were a lock with Gold Coast, the only better player ahead of Conca was Polec.

 

[tigs2010]

Look I think like others have said we have taken some pretty heavy risks and paid overs. A few points from me:

Conca: Was never going to go top 14. I like him and I am happy we have him but why not trade pick 6 to say Adelaide for pick 14 and something we want e.g 2nd and 3rd rnd picks. Not saying that is the deal, but something along those lines.

Compo Pick: I said before the draft I will cry if Harper is available at 26, which would have been our compo pick. Not only was Harper available but so was Darling. One of these two would have made it a super draft for us.

Pick 30 - Our KPP are far from set. Macarthy was still available and was tipped to go top 20 but slid. A big solid CHB would just mean we sure up our defense even more. The other guys I wanted here were Luke Parker who I rate very very highly and thought should have been taken, Viv Michie again rate him highly and also Josh Green to a lesser extent.

Happy with the other picks as pick 47+ is always a tad speculative and I like the x-factor they have chosen as well as the HFF theme which is a glaring need. Macdonald I am happy with.

Really just think we could have used the fact that Conca was not going to go super early (don't say he might of because us and Freo were the clubs that were keen) and traded ourselves into a better spot.

Harper or Darling also imo will be better than a player at pick 20 in the 2012 draft. I don't know that player but I can tell you this...Harper is top 10 for talent in this draft and if he lives up to his potential he could be an absolute didak like freak. Would have been happy with him at 6. Darling was considered a top 3 talent and would have made our forward line super potent.


I hope our recruiters are right because we really needed a strong draft here.

Darling went pick before our compo pick and big risk using pick in hope of getting harper! what if he wasnt available then we would all be on here complaining we didnt use it!

 

[Mr Magic]

The recruiting and development under Hardwick in year 1 was outstanding. I have faith that this will continue in year 2. Considering picks 1-3 were a lock with Gold Coast, the only better player ahead of Conca was Polec.

IMO the recruitment last year was not outstanding. It could be outstanding but not yet.

Last year Martin was a lock, Astbury good pick, Griff fair enough and I like Dea. Grimes was later so the jury is out for the others and Griff is yet to beat the injuries.

There are still ifs and buts for last year, just the way I see it!

 

[SAtiger11]

Geez Derickx looks agile for a bigman..... Looking at the highlights he covers ground well & good skills. Could be a suprise packet for us!!

 

[TOOs_Finest]

Darling went pick before our compo pick and big risk using pick in hope of getting harper! what if he wasnt available then we would all be on here complaining we didnt use it!

Also, I think Darling was only a speculative top 3 pick after his first U18 carnival, not so much after this year, where he seemed to drop in both progression and favour due to off-field issues. I think he was taken around the right mark, but happy to have kept our compo pick rather than using on Darling. Harper, well I'd have been happy to use it on him, which would've meant pick 51 could've been used elsewhere. Even then, I'm happy we still have it. Will be interesting to track progress of Harper v MacDonald.

Anyone think we may be able to upgrade our compo pick a little next year by trading to GWS for them to use down the track? Say, maybe to a mid first rounder?

 

[Tiger2709]

The recruiting and development under Hardwick in year 1 was outstanding. I have faith that this will continue in year 2. Considering picks 1-3 were a lock with Gold Coast, the only better player ahead of Conca was Polec.

Agreed, lets not forget most off us select who we think should be picked by what we read and hear, our recruitment staff actually watch these kids play and get the full reports on them, if they picked the picks that everyone thought they would, then what is the purpose of having recruiters, surely thier aim is to uncover talent missed by other clubs.

I will back them all the way, only time will tell, but lets be honest some of our high picks in past drafts haven't set the world on fire, to me we seem to be building to a plan, which is the way to go.

 

[Ty German]

IMO the recruitment last year was not outstanding. It could be outstanding but not yet.

Last year Martin was a lock, Astbury good pick, Griff fair enough and I like Dea. Grimes was later so the jury is out for the others and Griff is yet to beat the injuries.

There are still ifs and buts for last year, just the way I see it!

C'mon, your expectation are too high.

Martin,Astbury,Griff,Webberly,Nason,Hicks,Taylor,Dea,O'Reilly,Robert. All played senior footy. I don't think any other club had that many debutants. It was an outstanding year compared to the last two decade we have had to endure.

 

[RFC_Official]

Find out how Francis Jackson rated it:

http://www.richmondfc.com.au/roar vision archive/tabid/11454/contentid/314631/default.aspx

 

[Richm0ndrule]

We shall see what eventuates.

 

[Mr Magic]

C'mon, your expectation are too high.

Martin,Astbury,Griff,Webberly,Nason,Hicks,Taylor,Dea,O'Reilly,Robert. All played senior footy. I don't think any other club had that many debutants. It was an outstanding year compared to the last two decade we have had to endure.

We are second last on the ladder for a reason.Webberly, Nason, Hicks maybe, Oreilly and Dea s well as Roberts wouldn't have played senior footy for the teams in the finals in 2010 I suspect

 

[NQTIGER]

Pretty happy

I'm going to view our overall acquisitions in light of who has left the club, to see if we have addressed issues:

Trade:

Grigg (Collins)pretty much a dead even trade in terms of position. We still shouldn't have had to give up anything for Grigg

Rookie Upgrades:

Gourdis (Polo) we were probably short a tall on the senior list going into 2010, which is why several talls were used off the rookie list. Gourdis deserves to get this spot after a great year at VFL level and some promising performances at AFL level.

Draft:

Conca (Tambling)sounds like a beauty - polished outside running mid to compliment our many inside midfielders.

Batchelor (McMahon) fits the blueprint to release Deledio if needed and put pressure on Connors - quality rebounding defender who can play lock down on a mid sized forward.

Helbig (Thomson) seems to be just a standard inside mid midfield depth, but has good skills which is promising.

MacDonald (Hislop) fills the role of Morton now that he is a midfielder. Morton fills the role of someone like Hislop. So in a way its like for like.

Tom Derickx (Simmonds)is a beast of a ruckman, but if he is half as athletic as people are saying than he is an upgrade on Gus!

PSD:

Houli (Cousins) mid for mid.

We have effectively only switched a forward for a midfielder by upgrading Gourdis and delisting Polo, as far as our senior list goes. I would argue that we could have done with another mid sized forward at the expense of a small midfielder/forward like nahas or white. 1 mid sized forward on an entire AFL list is simply not enough. Look at collingwood...didak, beams, sidebottom, thomas, maccaffer etc.

Great analysys rancid, and the most impressive may turn out to be Derickx

WE havent had a mean looking ruckman for ages.

 

[Barnzy]

I think we addressed some needs. Midfield depth which we clearly want to add to which is fair enough, we don't have any. A mid-sized forward which we needed very badly and an athletic ruckman who are now more valuable with the new interchange rules. Not sure on the HB flanker at pick 30, acceptable if they move Lids back into the midfield. We have a stacks of HBF'ers.

Seems we've gone for a fair few out of the box types, in fact nearly all of them seem to be which is interesting. That's all well and good to look for those types but did we do that to the detriment of just looking at what is right in front of us? Time will tell. BIG negative is we didn't pick up another young tall forward, specifically a CHF. Will have to load up in the Rookie Draft and the Hislop and Miller selections limit us by taking spots.

A lot of highly rated juniors went either right before our picks or right after. For example we chose Batchelor over the likes of Green, Horlin-Smith, Hallahan, Parker, etc so they will always be compared. I also would've used the compo pick as I've been saying. We would've had a choice of Lycett, Harper, Green, etc. Going off the FJ video they might've taken Lycett. Could be a draft of near misses.

Those are my thoughts but it's impossible to rate it at least for another few years. See how it all pans out I guess. In terms of our development it's very important we nailed the 2009 draft, this draft and the next couple or we will be in the toilet still for a long while yet especially with the GC/GWS and their concessions. It will make or break or club and make or break FJ.

 

[tiggywigs]

I sense Dimma's hand in this draft much more so than last year. The theme is "tough, competent, tough & tough". The boys from Morwell and West Adelaide are the intriguing ones. Both are reported as having a bit of devil. Given that we have been a bit introverted in the recent past (JR and Cuz aside) that might not be a bad thing.

 

[THE_GUN]

The players i was most dissapointed in missing out on was darling at 30 & farmer with 47 both players going just before our pick's

Conca
Darling
Farmer

Would of been a great haul.

 

[Ty German]

The players i was most dissapointed in missing out on was darling at 30 & farmer with 47 both players going just before our pick's

Conca
Darling
Farmer

Would of been a great haul.

We picked up Griff last year, plus Jack and Kingy are dominating up forward so another power forward not priority. We need some quality and toughness down back, hence why Batchelor was picked ahead of the likes of Darling and Hallahan.
As for Farmer, we already have one at the club, plus we picked a McDonald. Having another Farmer on the field would have just turned the players into a herd of sheep.

 

[CallMeAl]

Darling was gone when we picked Batchelor.
Jackson said they wanted Darling or Lycette but both were gone

 

[Rancid_Beasties]

Great analysys rancid, and the most impressive may turn out to be Derickx

WE havent had a mean looking ruckman for ages.

I know! All of our ruckman in the last 20 or so years have been the dorky/tame type, save perhaps for stafford.

Ottens, Knobel, Gus, Browne, Vickery, Cartledge, Greg Dear, Benny Gale, Patto and to a lesser extend the snakeman Simmo - all your dorky oaf type ruckmen in my opinion - and all quite tame.

Justin Charles was fairly scary come to think of it, but it may have just been the roids

Fingers crossed on Derickx, he is either going to come in and start playing straight away, or be off the list in 2 years. One look at him says there is very little natural development left in him, although he'll get a bit of a boost from a professional environment.

 

[folester41]

we may have a shitload of half back flankers, but only two of them are any good, deledio and newman.

 

[Rancid_Beasties]

we may have a shitload of half back flankers, but only two of them are any good, deledio and newman.

I wouldn't go that far, but its true that they are the only two genuine half back flankers, the rest we have are mainly part timers or youngsters with promise.

Part timers:

Connors: was pretty good in 2010. I wouldnt mind seeing him as a half forward again though.
Edwards played some good footy there.
Kel Moore, Rance - both tall defenders who can play on the back flank.

Youngsters:

Matty Dea has shown signs he is going to be a good rebounding defender.
Farmer played through the backline, occasionally as a back flanker and has shown signs he could play there.
Grimes is taller than your average back flanker, but is otherwise suited to the position (not the greatest kick though!).
Webberley is one my favourite up and comers and is a genuine rebounding defender.
O'Reilly is raw but promising.

The position of half back flanker is one of the most important in modern footy, particularly having guys who can also rotate through the midfield. Almost all of these guys can do that, or otherwise can play lock down defense if needed.