Jake Carlisle Updates

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I know it says no opp supporters so if I cop a ban then that's my fault, but you guys got F'd in the A with this.

I don't see how your team can cop any repercussions from this.

To be honest, the AFL can't touch him. He can say it's sherbet and he was doing it as a joke. Also, if his manager knew and withheld it from you then he should be deregistered immediately.

My honest opinion. It's a nothing story. He'll be a great player for you.
 

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southwest bomber said:
I know it says no opp supporters so if I cop a ban then that's my fault, but you guys got F'd in the A with this.

I don't see how your team can cop any repercussions from this.

To be honest, the AFL can't touch him. He can say it's sherbet and he was doing it as a joke. Also, if his manager knew and withheld it from you then he should be deregistered immediately.

My honest opinion. It's a nothing story. He'll be a great player for you.
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Doubt you'll get banned but your comment will be deleted. I get the feeling now the hysteria has died down people realise this is far from convincing evidence that Carlisle has done anything.
 
if anything it can only reflect badly on essendon, in three years time when he's a premiership AA CHB we will hold him up as an example of how well we develop our players' character and the effectiveness of our leadership. Win
 
Hey guys, I know it says no opposition supporters but just wanted to throw my 2 cents in as I have a soft spot for St.Kilda.

Assuming it's real, the footage being released so soon after he has been traded just doesn't sit right with me. If Essendon either knew about a drugs problem or knew about the footage, then don't they have an obligation to provide that information?

Otherwise, if the saints knew about the footage/drugs, then surely they must feel it won't be an issue otherwise they would never agree to bring in such a massive problem into the clubs culture of so many young players.

So how do you guys feel? Do you feel like you've been duped into getting a player with a massive issue that was hidden from you like a penis neatly tucked away under the dress of a very pretty looking 'female'? Or are you confident that your club knew about this and it won't be an issue?
 
Material details withheld at the time of contract. Any court would tear it up. As far as Saints are concerned, the issue is not the use of drugs or non use, it is that there is a loss of trust which is unacceptable in the club. Jake will not play for the Saints IMO. Our brand cannot be damaged like this by the actions of one player, or player manager. Even if we have walked away from pick 5. I want this to say more about the Essendon culture, which this all points back to.
 
Munga said:
The real investigation here should be why ACA released this just hours after he left Essendon. How long have they both known about this? Dodgy bros.
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The timing can't just be a coincidence, the whole thing stinks of a deliberate smear campaign against St Kilda and it wouldn't be the first time either.

sasaint said:
Material details withheld at the time of contract. Any court would tear it up. As far as Saints are concerned, the issue is not the use of drugs or non use, it is that there is a loss of trust which is unacceptable in the club. Jake will not play for the Saints IMO. Our brand cannot be damaged like this by the actions of one player, or player manager. Even if we have walked away from pick 5. I want this to say more about the Essendon culture, which this all points back to.
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I don't see how our brand is damaged, it should be obvious to even the ACA watching morons that St Kilda has done nothing wrong here.

It's clear the media with possibly the help of Essendon have produced this half arsed story now to try to damage our reputation and sabotage Carlisle's career with us. If we sacked him due to this bullshit then it would just be giving these scumbags what they wanted.

I agree with others here that St Kilda need to get on the front foot by calling out the people responsible for this bullshit and stick by Carlisle, I'm sick of people walking all over us while we just accept it and let them get away with it. Other clubs wouldn't put up with this bullshit.
 
Ok, as was established earlier from the Snapchat evidence, we have an indication that this footage is up to one month old. However, it is still possible that it is recent and the user hasn't updated their application, given that updates are optional on iPhones.

Here is what else we can deduce, based on the mechanics of Snapchat:
  • The person playing the video clearly knew the content of the received Snapchat, otherwise they wouldn't have recorded it
  • Snapchat videos must be taken live, in that you cannot simply record a video then send it at a later time (NB - that is with the official application. There have been some variations that allow you to circumvent this restriction)
  • In Snapchat, you may only view a picture or a video once (unless it is on your 'story', which is not the case in the ACA video)
  • There is a capacity to replay a video or a picture, so long as you choose to do so immediately after your first viewing, and can only do so once per day
  • When replaying a received picture or video, only the most recent one can be replayed - no prior ones will be replayed
Therefore, there are two possible explanations. The first explanation is that the person received the video, then chose to immediately replay it in front of the camera. Therefore, we know it was done in ONE take, as it was a replayed video. The second, is that it is a two part video, with the inside/outside parts being separate, however this would require that the individual receiving the Snapchat was told what it was.

If the first explanation is true, then I am left perplexed as to how there are two clearly separate clips. The *only* way that is possible is if Jake used a third party application to do so. In such an event, one can assume that a person would only go to such lengths to make a joke/funny video for mates; it seems silly to patch those two clips together, outside of the joke reasoning. Therefore, there is not much to worry about.
Conversely, if the second explanation is true, then that is just about proof that this was a joke by Jake, as the recipient would probably only know after having been told by Jake himself, therefore proof of it being a joke. However, having said that, there is a chance that another person was sent the video (perhaps the person who owns the phone that recorded the clip aired on ACA) had opened it, then got in touch with another friend, purely in the hope of capturing the footage. Disappointing if true.
 

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You have to look at this alleged incident in context:

IF its true that he was using an illegal substance on the video it is not the same as other unknown players out there that have a strike or more already against their name. This is a tangible validation of bad behavior that thrusts the issue further into the media spotlight with our brand attached which is more damaging then rumors and innuendos could ever be. It may well cause our current business sponsors to seriously look at this as something that might taint their brand (even in the slightest of ways) and potential new business sponsorship may be missed because of it.
The problem of drugs and its connection with footy culture isn't something to be lightly dismissed as "Boys will be Boys" issue. These young men represent their clubs not only on field but when out in the community and that comes with huge responsibilities.

IF its been fabricated then the saints should look into legal recourse such as defamation claims for both ourselves and Jake. In the case of the media outlet supposing they had the video for awhile then it is suspect timing to run the story when they did and even if they only had the video for a short while then i can't see how they had the time to test the validity of the video and/or the story's credibility in general.

I'm not sure what i think should happen but i believe the AFL needs to make an official statement concerning issues surrounding the video. Did Essendon know about it? Did McConville? If so when did they find out and why wasn't it disclosed and how does this effect the trades and draft pics?

Whatever happens i'm sure Gillo has our back.
 
I have no idea about the legal ramifications around all of this, but I would hate us to be left holding the bag of it turns out that Essendon and JC's manager knew about this well ahead of the trade.

I wonder- hypothetically- is it possible for the trades to be cancelled? And, if so, do we do it? Then we tell jake we have every faith that you've done nothing wrong but we just want to cover our arses. If you come up clean after we do our homework we will 100% grab you in the PSD. It could prove to be a good circuit breaker for jake to wake up to himself as well if he has to sweat on things for a while. I don't see that as doubting jake's word, I see it us being professional.

I want to stress- I'm not saying that's what we should do. To be honest I have no idea what we should do. Just wondering.

I'm sure if it became known that Essendon duped us and withheld info, no other clubs would try to undercut us in the PSD. Hell, even the Hawks won't go near him- they've got enough shit to worry about at the moment.

I cant see our boys taking this lying down or allowing us to be bent over. Going to be an interesting next 24 hours in any case.
 
Interesting few hours ahead.

Brian Speakings's tweet is interesting. But he also said we'd be getting JOM and other crazy stuff this trade period.

End of the day Carlisle could help us to a flag in the next few years. And the video looks dodgy as
 
Captain Paddy said:
Interesting few hours ahead.

Brian Speakings's tweet is interesting. But he also said we'd be getting JOM and other crazy stuff this trade period.

End of the day Carlisle could help us to a flag in the next few years. And the video looks dodgy as
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No way Carlisle gets sacked IMO. We've got a chance to turn this into a good story. "Ex Bomber party boy changes his way to become all australian CHB and premiership player" ;)
 
Gangnam Saint said:
We have been guilty of kicking own goals but this totally has nothing to do with our DD processes or governance.
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Is that true though? There have been enough rumours and so-on going around about Jake's off field nocturnal activities, his "attitude problems" at Essendon and then of course there were his on-field outbursts that raised a red flag about his character and so-on that we ought to have had a pretty fair idea of what we were getting ourselves into when we agreed to take him on. Just as we did when we rolled the dice on Lovett.

Posts like this from the main board concern me a bit and I've seen plenty of similar ones around in recent weeks:

700k a year for a coke snorting, ciggy smoking, Tramp/Revolver till 6am off chops (mid season) shit attitude player with serious knee tendinitis.....ouch
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I am actually slightly concerned about the quality of our due diligence. Our current recruiting team did take on Spencer White after all, after we made a decision to only get those with great character and work ethic to the club, so it's not like they can't get things wrong when it comes to this sort of thing, even though they look to have done a fantastic job overall.

If there is any doubt, there is no doubt.
 
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aussierulesrules said:
Is that true though? There have been enough rumours and so-on going around about Jake's off field nocturnal activities, his "attitude problems" at Essendon and then of course there were his on-field outbursts that raised a red flag about his character and so-on that we ought to have had a pretty fair idea of what we were getting ourselves into when we agreed to take him on. Just as we did when we rolled the dice on Lovett.

Posts like this from the main board concern me a bit and I've seen plenty of similar ones around in recent weeks:



I am actually slightly concerned about the quality of our due diligence. Our current recruiting team did take on Spencer White after all, so it's not like they can't get things wrong when it comes to this sort of thing, even though they look to have done a fantastic job overall.
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This time last year Spencer White was looking pretty good, I don't think you can fault the recruiters for taking him at 25 with the talent he had. And it was looking like he would come good, things change though.

I agree with your sentiment but I just think the Spencer example wasn't a great choice. I sure hope this is either a) not Carlisle b) a fake/mock video or c) we dun goofed
 
Hayes4PM said:
This time last year Spencer White was looking pretty good, I don't think you can fault the recruiters for taking him at 25 with the talent he had. And it was looking like he would come good, things change though.

I agree with your sentiment but I just think the Spencer example wasn't a great choice. I sure hope this is either a) not Carlisle b) a fake/mock video or c) we dun goofed
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There were plenty of rumours/suggestions about Spencer's laziness prior to us drafting him though, so it seemed at the time to fly in the face of all that our recruiting team were saying about only going for those who had a great work ethic and I think they would now be the first to admit that they got that one wrong and got sucked in by his pure talent and as such perhaps turned a blind eye to his laziness.

There have been more than enough warning signs about Carlisle's attitude/mental strength/floggishness/intelligence levels that we ought to have been able to see that we were taking a fair sized risk as far as all that goes, so they may have gotten this one wrong too.

Time will tell and I sincerely hope not, because we have a lot on the line here. We've now invested a big chunk of our salary cap in him, given away a top 5 pick and may lose potential sponsorships, so I really hope we've gotten this one right.
 
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