January 26th 2025

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Cmarsh said:
Effectively persuading the centre however may be needed to tip polling to a place where politicians take notice.
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I agree. I'm just saying the rallies today aren't about doing that. They're about giving First Nations people and the Blak sovereignty movement in particular a place to speak and be listened to without being interrupted or disapproved of. I'm not surprised if that results in the outpouring of a lot of anguish people might feel forced to keep inside the rest of the year.
 
Johnny Bananas said:
I agree. I'm just saying the rallies today aren't about doing that. They're about giving First Nations people and the Blak sovereignty movement in particular a place to speak and be listened to without being interrupted or disapproved of. I'm not surprised if that results in the outpouring of a lot of anguish people might feel forced to keep inside the rest of the year.
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I cant see how the rallies are actually strengthening the cause now to be honest
 
Cmarsh said:
Citing no particular reason to change to a certain date is not going to move the dial to persuade the majority of people who believe the current date should not change.
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Perhaps not, but that's okay. I'm just giving my thoughts. One day is just as good as another if the point is to have a day off in summer while also being sensitive to First Nations people.

For those who are wedded to January 26th because they want to celebrate that date specifically, I actually don't think there's anything I can say at this point to change their minds, they know full well how First Nations people feel about it and they don't care.
 

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Johnny Bananas said:
Didn't think I'd see someone taking a race riot and playing it for laughs, but that just goes to show how disgusting some people are.
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I learnt something today.
schneebly111 might have something with the flag anger.
Was sitting inside watching Super Sunday in Adelaide and heard my dog going mental outside,when I checked it out he had been triggered by the Australian flag which had been put up by a neighbour over the back fence and was flapping madly.
Lucky Buster doesn't get triggered by fireworks.
 
Pistol Night said:
This is the sort of realism we need to take into account before whinging "What else do they want"
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I am admittedly staunchly conservative, and I have a strong perception that the left side of politics force their view on to others. And I detest this. I am proud we live in a strong democracy where the opinion of everyone counts equally!

But that does not mean I am not compassionate. I have argued with South of the Yarra a fair bit, and I have little doubt that he/she doesn't particularly like me. But their post was harrowing and poignant, poetic in a way. And I genuinely feel for the pain he/she has been through.

It will not change my fundamental belief that everyone is equal, and that we as society should be striving for equality of opportunity rather than equality of outcome.

But I genuinely wish South of the Yarra the best.
 
Pistol Night said:
I cant see how the rallies are actually strengthening the cause now to be honest
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It strengthens the cause amongst those who are already sympathetic to justice for First Nations people. People do not turn up to rallies and listen to the speeches if they don't give a stuff about the issue the rally is about. I suppose the idea is that by listening to the perspective of First Nations activists, they become more committed to the idea.

The march afterwards is probably more about influencing the average person, since it's visible and audible in multiple places and gets much more media coverage. I think some of the chants in the march would be acceptable to the average person (What do we want? Justice!), some could go either way (Always was, always will be, Aboriginal land) and some might not go down well (chants about the racism of the police).
 
Cmarsh said:
Effectively persuading the centre however may be needed to tip polling to a place where politicians take notice.
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Which for better or worse is convincing the suburbs that it's a good thing to change.

Theyre the ones most resistant.

Come up with a communication strategy there and do not let it get to insults and name calling. It doesn't help and just galvanises people the other way.

It's all doable it just requires effort.
Johnny Bananas said:
For those who are wedded to January 26th because they want to celebrate that date specifically, I actually don't think there's anything I can say at this point to change their minds, they know full well how First Nations people feel about it and they don't care.
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People's minds can be changed. It just needs good communication and a good message.
 
Johnny Bananas said:
For those who are wedded to January 26th because they want to celebrate that date specifically, I actually don't think there's anything I can say at this point to change their minds, they know full well how First Nations people feel about it and they don't care.
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the aboriginal community aren’t all against the current date either. It’s a very divided issue in all camps.
 

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South of the Yarra said:
As a Stolen Generation Aboriginal, today does cause me to pause for solemn reflection. I think about the brothers and sisters that I never saw again (deep research found they lived sad and tortured lives). I reflect on the fact my birth mother took her own life as her children were taken from her. I reflect on the physical and emotional pain I went through in the 'hell camps' and the incredible journey I have taken to get to where I am today. I reflect on the fact that I don't even know when I was born. I reflect on the little Aboriginal children who are in our families care and the many Aboriginal students we home school. Every day, I tell myself you are not doing enough, you must do more. I torture myself every day trying to figure out how we can close the gap and how we can empower Aboriginal people to take their lives back and be proud of who they are. So many beaten and battered. I pause and contemplate not to be a victim as it has been suggested in the last 5 pages, but to ensure we move forward and never repeat the mistakes of the past. It is fantastic to have a day to celebrate who we are as Australians and that may be many different things to many different people. It is great to have a day where we celebrate all that is great about our country. I just don't understand why it has to be on a date that causes so many Aboriginal people pain.
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Beautiful post among some of the dismaying boorishness on display on here today.

I wish you well mate.
 
Johnny Bananas said:
They spoke a lot about the suffering of their ancestors and the ongoing effects on their lives. A few spoke of the solidarity between themselves and other people who have endured suffering like the Palestinians. I think none of that would be very contentious to those who are neither for nor against the cause of First Nations sovereignty.

I suppose a couple of things stood out to me as potentially being contentious.

A few speakers were openly socialist, and spoke of the capitalist system as inherently colonial and exploitative of First Nations people. One went so far as to say everyone participating in the colonial capitalist system was making their living off the backs of Aboriginal people.

I don't think is incorrect exactly, as the Australian economy is indeed built on exploiting mineral and agricultural resources that were gained by a land being stolen, and the people living on that land either being massacred or sent to camps. But, the people who are here now have little choice but to make their living as best they can in a system they didn't create. I can see how people would feel annoyed hearing that their efforts to simply survive in the modern economy with all its cost of living pressures, make them exploiters.

Another speaker was angry that the colonial system had facilitated so much immigration that the country was now overpopulated, creating ecological problems. Some people will agree with that, though I don't, I think our resource-intensive way of living is more to blame for ecological issues, and the feelings of overcrowding are less about the overall number of people in Australia than about how we've failed to distribute the population over more than just the same 5-6 big cities.

My feelings aside, there are a lot of recent immigrants who are made to feel by mainstream discourse like they are at fault for current economic pressures because they emigrated here. Discussions around the downsides of immigration often don't take care to separate the architects of immigration policy from the immigrants themselves and treat them all as the problem. So I can see how recent immigrants would similarly see this as another group blaming them for having the audacity to exist here.

One speaker asked for a million dollars a year for every First Nations person. That simply isn't going to happen. I do think there's an argument for redress of stolen land and cultural destruction, and First Nations people should have more of a say in how money is spent for them than simply being dictated to by governments that were mostly voted in by non-FN people. But that level of spending just isn't going to happen.

But as I said before, this was all being said in a context of pain and trauma from the historical suffering of First Nations people and the problems they still have to live with today. The specific wording isn't that important, the broader points are, that the modern economy still runs on exploiting the environment and the land that was stolen, and First Nations people were never making those decisions or receiving much of the benefits.


Of course they are, and sometimes that's okay. Not every single time and space has to be about changing people's minds. Some events can be simply about centring and listening to First Nations peoples' perspectives, seeing as those perspectives are not given space in mainstream discourse on the other 364 days of the year.
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Terrific report. Thank you.
 
peetoo said:
cos a large part of their vote comes from labor and green voters?

Anyway blame the rabid right of liberals for that. Ley was talking about colonising mars today? Delusional?
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So they can’t be classified “right”. What is “right” on their platform? They promoted themselves as an alternative to the Liberals - more something or other. Seems it was false advertising. They haven’t achieved anything of substance for their electorates.
 
schneebly111 said:
Because as Susssssssssan Ley said today Australia in 1788 was as uninhabited by humans as Mars is today.

The awful truth is people on the other side of the debate do not see you as a human.
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I took this as meaning under a Dutton Government the nation would be re-instating 'Terra Nullius" as a point of law.
 
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[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji6][emoji[emoji6]]z said:
Why are there Palestine and Pride flags at the protest. The mind boggles.
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Mostly carried by the white activists who were out for a walk and just joined in….

Gives them their exercise before the next rent a crowd outting.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
 

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January 26th 2025

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