Lights Out!

[pazza]

If solar panels were mandatory on all homes, this would help address demand on the grid. These solar panels must come with storage capacity in the home.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

If solar panels were mandatory on all homes, this would help address demand on the grid. These solar panels must come with storage capacity in the home.

Storage is slowly getting better, but not there yet.

The tesla units are a better, but need a lot of work

Also its illegal currently in au to power from the battery, without mains power

 

[E Shed]

https://www.theguardian.com/environ...k-the-fiction-behind-coalitions-coal-comeback

 

[Bleeeeeeeeep]

https://www.theguardian.com/environ...k-the-fiction-behind-coalitions-coal-comeback

https://www.theguardian.com/environ...far-worse-than-south-australia-analysis-shows

 

[Power Raid]

Investing in renewable energy that will be used for decades to come is not the same as digging a hole and filling it in. You seem to have fallen in love with this analogy, but I can't for the life of me figure out why.

Lowering productivity and increasing inputs to generate power is not sensible other than investment in the industry to promote R&D. The big issue though is WE are subsidising R&D for china. WE are merely the customer not the manufacturer.

This issue is as stupid as the Spanish being conned by the yanks telling them olive oil is not an unsaturated fat, thus they should buy US corn oil.


Secondly the net loss of jobs is a massive concern. Sure there are more jobs in renewables but the output is less than alternative technologies and at the same time we see industries that require cheap reliable power move overseas. Therefor I refer to digging holes and filling them back in......a total waste of resources but it does create jobs. Madness!


Thirdly we are seeing the transition to the electric car, therefor we need more power not less. Perhaps it will be at this time that levels above 20% renewables makes sense. Until then, the renewables industry is actually hampering the transition to a low emissions future.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Lowering productivity and increasing inputs to generate power is not sensible other than investment in the industry to promote R&D. The big issue though is WE are subsidising R&D for china. WE are merely the customer not the manufacturer.

This issue is as stupid as the Spanish being conned by the yanks telling them olive oil is not an unsaturated fat, thus they should buy US corn oil.


Secondly the net loss of jobs is a massive concern. Sure there are more jobs in renewables but the output is less than alternative technologies and at the same time we see industries that require cheap reliable power move overseas. Therefor I refer to digging holes and filling them back in......a total waste of resources but it does create jobs. Madness!


Thirdly we are seeing the transition to the electric car, therefor we need more power not less. Perhaps it will be at this time that levels above 20% renewables makes sense. Until then, the renewables industry is actually hampering the transition to a low emissions future.

Actually you may want to look into solar technology and the recent patent history

Australia developed a lot of the patents being used today, but they struggled to get investors here and the govt had no interest in supporting the projects

So we sold them to the usa, who in term have the panels manufactured in china.

The reason we are so weak in renewable r&d is because we want to focus on the wonderful world of carbon capture and storage - which has all but been abandoned now

 

[JackOutback]

Actually you may want to look into solar technology and the recent patent history

Australia developed a lot of the patents being used today, but they struggled to get investors here and the govt had no interest in supporting the projects

So we sold them to the usa, who in term have the panels manufactured in china.

The reason we are so weak in renewable r&d is because we want to focus on the wonderful world of carbon capture and storage - which has all but been abandoned now

That a country like Australia is not leading the world in solar development (and wave technology) is absurd.

 

[Gough]

That a country like Australia is not leading the world in solar development (and wave technology) is absurd.

We are, it's just that we're doing it in California.

 

[Power Raid]

Actually you may want to look into solar technology and the recent patent history

Australia developed a lot of the patents being used today, but they struggled to get investors here and the govt had no interest in supporting the projects

So we sold them to the usa, who in term have the panels manufactured in china.

The reason we are so weak in renewable r&d is because we want to focus on the wonderful world of carbon capture and storage - which has all but been abandoned now

And it will get worse if Labor get in which they most likely will.

The went to the election with a deceitful CGT policy claiming it was for property.

A little digging and we found out it directly targeted long term investment, favouring short term speculation. It also targeted R&D, technology, innovation and favoured big business over the individual.

No wonder we can't attract investment with that sovereign risk.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

And it will get worse if Labor get in which they most likely will.

The went to the election with a deceitful CGT policy claiming it was for property.

A little digging and we found out it directly targeted long term investment, favouring short term speculation. It also targeted R&D, technology, innovation and favoured big business over the individual.

No wonder we can't attract investment with that sovereign risk.

CGT has nothing to do with this

This isnt about the tax environment not being unfavourable to investors. Its about our power stratgey being about picking winners.

The solar tower in mildura failed on inability to get govt support. Same with solar panel farms. Because of our huge coal assets we put all our eggs in the clean coal basket. Tried to reprocess coal to make it burn cleaner, tried ccs in morwell. All failed, and worst still multiple scientists warned at the start these projects were pure fantasy.

The renewable game can be won in one area, storage. What is australia doing in yhat? Sfa in hydrogen. Ceramic cells have all but been abandoned. Virtually nothing in chemical means.

We have a massive whopping desert, which could be a power monster if we figured out how to capture, store, and transport this energy for later use. Instead we keep going back to coal, and trying to find ways to store its enmissions (despite failing again and again)

 

[Bradesmaen]

Lowering productivity and increasing inputs to generate power is not sensible other than investment in the industry to promote R&D. The big issue though is WE are subsidising R&D for china. WE are merely the customer not the manufacturer.

This issue is as stupid as the Spanish being conned by the yanks telling them olive oil is not an unsaturated fat, thus they should buy US corn oil.


Secondly the net loss of jobs is a massive concern. Sure there are more jobs in renewables but the output is less than alternative technologies and at the same time we see industries that require cheap reliable power move overseas. Therefor I refer to digging holes and filling them back in......a total waste of resources but it does create jobs. Madness!


Thirdly we are seeing the transition to the electric car, therefor we need more power not less. Perhaps it will be at this time that levels above 20% renewables makes sense. Until then, the renewables industry is actually hampering the transition to a low emissions future.

Those jobs are moving overseas whether you like it or not. Get with the times old man. You're as bad as the successive SA governments who tried to deny that manufacturing was dying here. They were still trying to prop it up as business after business kept pulling out.

 

[E Shed]

Its just an utter nonsense the libs are trying to sell to the public. I hope these people are viewed as criminals in the future.
https://www.theguardian.com/environ...k-the-fiction-behind-coalitions-coal-comeback

 

[JackOutback]

And it will get worse if Labor get in which they most likely will.

The went to the election with a deceitful CGT policy claiming it was for property.

A little digging and we found out it directly targeted long term investment, favouring short term speculation. It also targeted R&D, technology, innovation and favoured big business over the individual.

No wonder we can't attract investment with that sovereign risk.

You aren't seriously dragging that ridiculous argument from a completely different thread, and which was soundly rejected, into this one are you?

 

[Power Raid]

You aren't seriously dragging that ridiculous argument from a completely different thread, and which was soundly rejected, into this one are you?

Just the opposite.

The counter arguments turned out to be false statements.

 

[Power Raid]

Those jobs are moving overseas whether you like it or not. Get with the times old man. You're as bad as the successive SA governments who tried to deny that manufacturing was dying here. They were still trying to prop it up as business after business kept pulling out.

And yet all mainland states thrive whilst the state with the most expensive and unreliable power relies on hand outs.

Hmmm......

 

[Bradesmaen]

And yet all mainland states thrive whilst the state with the most expensive and unreliable power relies on hand outs.

Hmmm......

Yeah they sure do. Completely thrive for manufacturing. Absolutely. Positively. Wrong. Manufacturing in this country is dead. Hi Tech industries are the way to go. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about on the subject. Your knowledge of SA so far has been proven to be incredibly shoddy, as if you lived here 30 years ago, never in the present.

 

[Pessimistic]

Storage is slowly getting better, but not there yet.

The tesla units are a better, but need a lot of work

Also its illegal currently in au to power from the battery, without mains power

In the case of aircon use. Keeping the house cool from the start of the day rather than at peak time is a form of stored energy. Similarly keeping it warm. Building efficient houses is another factor

 

[Pessimistic]

Morrison actually brought his sponsors product into parliament

What next. State treasurers wearing developers t shirts to question time?

 

[Gough]

Morrison actually brought his sponsors product into parliament

What next. State treasurers wearing developers t shirts to question time?

It makes a bit of a mockery of Frydenberg's assertion that they're looking at this in a non ideological manner.

 

[Pessimistic]

And goodbye to Malcolm in the middle. That's why people liked him. Talked sensibly not through either an ideological or 'paid for' lens

 

[Gough]

When you start with the premises that climate change is bullshit, and that putting a price on emissions is some sort of creeping communism as many conservatives in the Liberal party believe; it's pretty difficult to come up with even remotely sensible energy policy.

 

[Hawk Dork]

So it seems if you have 2 gas powered power stations ,its best to not turn on the one in the state thats experiencing blackouts,its best to let it get desperate and start selling from interstate for more profit.

The wonders of privatised energy the conservatives never tell us about when they sell our assets

 

[Pessimistic]

So it seems if you have 2 gas powered power stations ,its best to not turn on the one in the state thats experiencing blackouts,its best to let it get desperate and start selling from interstate for more profit.

The wonders of privatised energy the conservatives never tell us about when they sell our assets

Can't like enough

Talk about cheap energy it was never so cheap as when it was state owned. It never will be again it was accountable too

Wasn't the point of privatised that it would enable better technologies to take over?
That's not happening

 

[Pie eyed]

Nice arguments but it was clearly private aircon use which swamped the grid

Country needs to mandate being allowed to remotely turn off non essential aircon to preserve other power to all people.

People or organisations can exempt themselves by installing rooftop solar which offsets the need to beef up the distribution system

I'm sure with the smart meters out there. Aircon use can be detected

The power was switched off. it did not fail. There was adequate power in each of the recent elective shut downs, including the SA "switch off".
These shut downs are 100 percent politically motivated.

 

[Pie eyed]

If solar panels were mandatory on all homes, this would help address demand on the grid. These solar panels must come with storage capacity in the home.

Storage is not really the issue.
It would have meant I personally did not lose power for a few hours yesterday, but the fact is regardless of storage, houses with solar add to the overall toal amount the grid can supply. Our solar array produces far more electricity than we use.
I agree fully though that all new homes and businesses should have solar, of at least as much output as the basic electrical requirement of the building and more if feasible.
The wholesale electricity producers are the ones who are fighting against this though.
Given the chance I would nationalise the power grid and take the "profit imperative" away from the equation.
Privatisation has been an abject failure in every situation if you factor in the falsely claimed "price drops due to competition", a blatant lie, peddled in each case..