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AFLW 2024 - Round 9 - Indigenous Round - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
Most talented hawk of all time (not best or most decorated pure talent)
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hawkman
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Surprised Burgoyne hasn't got a mention at least
Would have Jarman first though
Would have Jarman first though
Outside the obvious mentioned on previous pages, young Paul Hudson had talent to burn.
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killerspud
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I didn't see footy before the 00s.
To me, Cyril is skill.
It's never fair to compare anyone to him.
If they've got the marking and the freakish goals, they probably don't have the killer defensive instincts and the tackling technique. If they've got the agility, speed and advantage kicking in open play, they probably don't have the hardball nous in tight. If they've got the highlight reel and attacking flair, they probably don't have the commitment to unselfishly putting your teammates in the best position.
No one I've seen had it all like Cyril.
To me, Cyril is skill.
It's never fair to compare anyone to him.
If they've got the marking and the freakish goals, they probably don't have the killer defensive instincts and the tackling technique. If they've got the agility, speed and advantage kicking in open play, they probably don't have the hardball nous in tight. If they've got the highlight reel and attacking flair, they probably don't have the commitment to unselfishly putting your teammates in the best position.
No one I've seen had it all like Cyril.
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Oh yes he has …
(although to be fair I mis-spelled his name back on p1) …
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triangulation_squared
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Leigh Matthews kicked a goal with his first kick in the seniors when he was 16 years old, he booted 20 goals in 16 games when he was 17. Pretty hard to go past that however I never saw him play.
Buddy and Cyril were the two most talented players I have seen live in the modern era, including the 80's teams buy maybe some recency bias there. Buddy's Cale Hooker goal was an absolute gem.
Pound for pound modern talent to where they came in the draft or a trade are Sam Mitchell, Jai Newcombe, James Sicily and potentially Brian Lake.
Buddy and Cyril were the two most talented players I have seen live in the modern era, including the 80's teams buy maybe some recency bias there. Buddy's Cale Hooker goal was an absolute gem.
Pound for pound modern talent to where they came in the draft or a trade are Sam Mitchell, Jai Newcombe, James Sicily and potentially Brian Lake.
phlogiston
All Australian
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Gosh it's so hard; looking at these names and the game has evolved so much. Poor Cyril would likely be regularly ironed out in the 1970s, and 70s blokes wouldn't have the tank for today's game.
I ended up voting for Knights (just too young to see Hudson in full flight, and Knights was my first football idol, so some bias there ) because he was such a beautiful pure footballer.
And whenever I have the urge to watch ballet, I hunt down Darren Jarman highlights: that man had the ball on a strong sometimes.
And none of the above is taking anything away from Mitch, Bud, or Cyril.
I ended up voting for Knights (just too young to see Hudson in full flight, and Knights was my first football idol, so some bias there
) because he was such a beautiful pure footballer.And whenever I have the urge to watch ballet, I hunt down Darren Jarman highlights: that man had the ball on a strong sometimes.
And none of the above is taking anything away from Mitch, Bud, or Cyril.
Sam Mitchell wasn’t born with great natural ability. His success was due to hard work and perseverance.
cryptor
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I voted Mitchell and my reasoning is that he is not at all out of place in this conversation despite having pretty unremarkable athleticism compared to the others. And that counts for a lot in AFL.
Give Mitchell the physical attributes of a Buddy or Cyril and he’d clearly be more capable than he was. Whereas the reverse strips them of their strengths.
That said I think all 3 are supreme talents that are hard to split. I feel like Buddy and Sam got the best out of themselves over 300+ games. While Cyril I think we can all agree still had unreached levels and was let down by the constant soft tissue injuries that prevented him from playing midfield.
I may have just talked myself into changing my answer to Cyril…
Pretty amazing that all these guys were Hawthorn players and these three were able to play so many years together.
(The older 3 a bit before my time)
Give Mitchell the physical attributes of a Buddy or Cyril and he’d clearly be more capable than he was. Whereas the reverse strips them of their strengths.
That said I think all 3 are supreme talents that are hard to split. I feel like Buddy and Sam got the best out of themselves over 300+ games. While Cyril I think we can all agree still had unreached levels and was let down by the constant soft tissue injuries that prevented him from playing midfield.
I may have just talked myself into changing my answer to Cyril…
Pretty amazing that all these guys were Hawthorn players and these three were able to play so many years together.
(The older 3 a bit before my time)
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EFA
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Barney #3
Can't say I saw them all play, but Cyril's ability to weigh up a situation and make snap decisions that enable him to win a contest (mark the ball / dodge a tackle / secure possession for a team-mate) is unmatched from what I've seen. Not even close.
That being said, I've never seen a player win possession near the wing or outside 50 more than Buddy and still kick the goal.
That being said, I've never seen a player win possession near the wing or outside 50 more than Buddy and still kick the goal.
Tall poppy Syndrome
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Yeah Dunstall’s a funny one.Nobody had mentioned Billy ‘The Kid’ Nicholls?
Jarman and Buddy were amazing.
Sammy Mitchell was at the bottom of every pack. Had hunger and desire that can’t be taught. Amazing footy brain too.
That kid from Coorparoo wasn’t a bad sort either; thanks Carlton. Probably the one and only reason I could ever say something nice about Carlton too
First thing I’d say is he’s not in the conversation for ‘most talented’. No one would ever look at a Bunghole highlights package (compared to others) and say Wow what a freak.
But I’m very comfortable saying he’s one of the greatest of all time. For Hawthorn or any club. And it sounds kind of ridiculous, but we take him for granted. It’s like ‘compile a list of great players’ and we’ll say ‘Barrassi, Carman, Blight, Coleman, Farmer, Nicholls, Hart, Matthews, Skilton, yada yada yada, Lockett’. ‘Oh and DunstalL’ like he’s an afterthought. I mean I wasn’t even that amazed the day he kicked 17 against Richmond.
It might be because of his metronomic efficiency, the fact that he was the spearhead of one of the all time teams filled with other amazing players or that his contemporaries, Lockett and Ablett were also kicking tons for fun. I can’t quite put my finger on why.
But in an era when Tina Turner was singing ‘We don’t need another hero’ I was thinking we do, he’s got a vice-like grip and his name is Jason.
Oh and kudos to whoever mentioned Buckenara. Billy Birmingham’s version of Louie the Lip had it spot on, a ‘Buckin Beauty who was buckin hard to stop.’
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Although he won PCM in 1956,Roy Simmonds.
grumbleguts
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There's a case for adding Pritchard to this list.
Yardie
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Well it is his own fault for not being more verbose......
grumbleguts
User name to post ratio checks out
Jamie Morrisey had talent flowing out of his ar$e.
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Anyone posting a ‘talented 22’?
Notice how Hall kicked that sensational goal and just ambled back to the centre (pretty close to the goal of the year actually).
No aeroplanes or helicopters or running around in circles or punching to the crowd.
And he wasn't overwhelmed with 17 teammates giving him high 5s.
Nuh - just shuffled back.
They were the days.
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