*NEW point system for teams playing each other twice/making the draw even!

[D I D A K #4]

Just listening in on SEN tonight at around 7:00 and a guy sent in a proposed structure for teams that play each other twice during the season that will make it fairer.
The problem is when teams play each other twice it is either a advantage or disadvantage either the team plays are really good side and gets beaten twice so they lose 8 points or they play a play a really crap side win both times with ease and take a simple 8 points.
To make this fairer the man proposed that if two teams play each other twice each time they play the winner earns only two points so four after both matches are played, this evens it up for teams getting easy points (e.g Geelong playing Gold Coast twice) and making it harder for an average team to make finals if they have to play the top teams twice where as the other teams battling it out for the 8th spot don't.
IMO this is a great way to even up the draw which so many people complain about, although their are still a few minor flaws in this system i believe we can work them out to make it work.
So I'm wondering what do you think about this idea? Does it work? Is it the best solution to the problem and do you think it has a realistic chance to happen?

Hats off to the man who thought up this simple but clever system

 

[RupertPupkin]

How do you give ateam 2 points for beating another side? It then disadvantages a top team as they may not get top of the ladder because they play GC. Also, how do you rate the bulldogs? Crap at the start of the season then they beat the blues. What do you get for beating Richmond? Can a side be designated easybeat at the start of the season? What if you missed the finals because you played Port in the last match?

Too hard

 

[Dan26]

Just posted that I heard that is the "new season structure" thread.

Wish you checked that first before you started a whole new thread, but anyway.... sounds like a idea with some merit.

Basically every one of the 17 opponents you play over the whole season, is worth "4 premiership points"

If you play the twice it is worth 2 each, if you play them once it is worth 4.

The downside I suppose is that everytime Essendon-Collingwood-Carlton play each other for the next 200 years the individual matches themselves would be only half as important as the matches involving clubs who only meet once during a season.

 

[Defacto]

i'm pretty much a n00b when it comes to the rules of the draw so i'll ask the dumb questions.

how many times do teams play each other twice? is it always this number? can teams ever play each other 3 times? how much would a draw be worth if you play each other twice?

 

[Dan26]

How do you give ateam 2 points for beating another side? It then disadvantages a top team as they may not get top of the ladder because they play GC. Also, how do you rate the bulldogs? Crap at the start of the season then they beat the blues. What do you get for beating Richmond? Can a side be designated easybeat at the start of the season? What if you missed the finals because you played Port in the last match?

Too hard

You're missing the point.

With the 18-team comp nexy year, you play 17 opponents over the course of the 22 H&A matches

EVERY opponent is worth 4 premiership points. If you play them twice you can get 2 points for each match (4 in total) and if you play them once you get 4 points.

So, every opponent is worth the same. If you were to win every game, you can get no more or no less than 4 points against every team. All opponents are worth the same.

Mathematically it is a perfectly sound concept.

 

[Summer Nights]

That's right Dan, and in the return match, having big teams play each other wouldn't have as much of an effect on boosting overall attendances due to it only being worth two points

 

[D I D A K #4]

RupertPupkin sorry but i don't understand it doesn't put anyone at a disadvantage if it happens to everyone

Dan26 yeah probably should change it.....

 

[Dan26]

i'm pretty much a n00b when it comes to the rules of the draw so i'll ask the dumb questions.

how many times do teams play each other twice? is it always this number? can teams ever play each other 3 times? how much would a draw be worth if you play each other twice?

From next year every team will play 5 teams twice and 12 teams once.

Under the proposal, all matches against teams who you meet twice during a year would be worth only 2 points if you win, and one-point if you draw.

But because you meet those teams twice, you can get 2 points again in the return match, and therefore get 4 points against them overall.

There are "4 premiership points" up for grabs against every opponent.

This year, for example, there are 8 premiership points up for grabs in the Bulldogs matches agains the Gold Coast. So, the Dogs (to use one example) can get 8 points in total against some teams and 4 points in total against others.

Under the proposal, every team would be playing for 4 premiership points against each opponent.

 

[Jack2Johnston]

Idea really does sound like it has some merit, it would stop clubs from being penalised for a poor/hard draw.

how much would a draw be worth if you play each other twice?

Well considering for a normal game it is 4 for win 2 for draw, and the idea is that when teams play each other twice both games will be worth 2 points each, so a draw would logically be worth 1 point per game.

 

[Defacto]

From next year every team will play 5 teams twice and 12 teams once.

Under the proposal, all matches against teams who you meet twice during a year would be worth only 2 points if you win, and one-point if you draw.

But because you meet those teams twice, you can get 2 points again in the return match, and therefore get 4 points against them overall.

There are "4 premiership points" up for grabs against every opponent.

This year, for example, there are 8 premiership points up for grabs in the Bulldogs matches agains the Gold Coast. So, the Dogs (to use one example) can get 8 points in total against some teams and 4 points in total against others.

Under the proposal, every team would be playing for 4 premiership points against each opponent.

hey you've sold it to me. sounds like a bloody great idea!!!! how come we didnt do it earlier?

 

[RupertPupkin]

Thanks for the clarification. It makes some sense now. I think I looked at the crap/good remark and was drawn by that. Essentially, playing a good or crap side is irrelevant, it is just impetus for the rule change.

I still think it is tough on teams to play for half points. Every game counts. Injuries. Reports. Recovery. I'd almost say you may as well cut the season back to 18 games.

Another funny one: the one point draw.

 

[Boppo]

Very interesting concept. It may have legs.

 

[RupertPupkin]

Would you only be reported for half a match during one of these games?

 

[D I D A K #4]

thanks Dan26 fro clearing it up makes more sense when you say it

 

[D I D A K #4]

i think everything else would stay the same reports,votes,etc
each game is still exactly the same except the points are a bit different.

 

[Dan26]

thanks Dan26 fro clearing it up makes more sense when you say it

 

[THE EQUALIZER]

Leave it at 4 points for teams you play twice, but play for 8 points for teams you play once.

The wild fluctuations in the ladder would bring it's own excitement.

 

[Dan26]

Leave it at 4 points for teams you play twice, but play for 8 points for teams you play once.

The wild fluctuations in the ladder would bring it's own excitement.

You do realise that's exactly the same thing, don't you?

 

[THE EQUALIZER]

You do realise that's exactly the same thing, don't you?

Yes.

You didn't ignore my second point, did you?

 

[chelseacarlton]

Great concept and obviously a smart bloke or just beautiful light-bulb moment.
Utterly fair,but i dont think Andy D likes the concept of fair,he kinda just likes it his way.

 

[hawkman]

How many teams would rest players for the games worth 2 points so they can be fit for the games worth 4 points?

 

[RupertPupkin]

i think everything else would stay the same reports,votes,etc
each game is still exactly the same except the points are a bit different.

Then it is not fair. Essentially you get rubbed out for one match and your team could lose four points or only two. Imagine the loss of Jonathan Brown, it would make a difference. And if you got 6 brownlow votes against GWS, the same problem. And imagine you injure yourself in a two point game. Or its the final round and you only stand to gain two points, send on the B team.

Another funny idea: add the scores from the two games

 

[Jack2Johnston]

How many teams would rest players for the games worth 2 points so they can be fit for the games worth 4 points?

Would it matter if they did, since every team would have the same number of games worth 2 points.

Also a number of 2 point games would make the ladder very interesting, especially the typical 6th > 12th.

Then it is not fair. Essentially you get rubbed out for one match and your team could lose four points or only two. Imagine the loss of Jonathan Brown, it would make a difference. And if you got 6 brownlow votes against GWS, the same problem. And imagine you injure yourself in a two point game. Or its the final round and you only stand to gain two points, send on the B team.

Another funny idea: add the scores from the two games

You're right it isn't perfectly fair, however i'd say its fairer than the system we currently have, don't get tied down looking for unattainable perfection at the expense of an attainable improvement.

 

[SirJimi05]

Great idea! AFL still gets to maximise revenue but the draw is alot fairer for all clubs.

Just imagine how unfair it could become next year with GWS. Imagine a team gets to play GC and GWS 2 times. That is 16 points right there.

The other option would be a conference style system.

Doubt the AFL will seriously consider either though.

 

[MWPP]

I think it's a brilliant idea
Except would they 1/2 the scoreline of 2 points games to adjust the relative weighting given to a team's overall %? And I agree that suspensions/brownlow points should be adjusted for games which become half as important, lol