Next Built for purpose AFL ground - Sydney

[Seedsfan]

None will be incoming. There is no ignorance.
Just some chest beating from yourself being very parochial about your turf.

It is 30% further from Melbourne

 

[WesternSydneyHawk]

Penrith is the same distance away by car. They are Sydney.
Puff out the chest as much as you want.

As much as it pains me to say this, the Geelong supporter is right on this one.

Yeah, Geelong is roughly around 75 kms away, but in a Gosford kind of way, rather than a Penrith kind of way.

You know how there's a lot of undeveloped farmland between Hornsby and Gosford? Well, it's the same deal between Werribee and Geelong.

Greater Geelong, the Bellarine Peninsula, and the Surf Coast is basically its own mini metro area, much like the Central Coast is its own city.

You probably wouldn't consider the Central Coast Mariners in the A-League a Sydney-based team, unless you were a Victorian who knew little about Sydney.

Well, a Sydneysider claiming Geelong is part of Melbourne is like a Melburnian calling the Central Coast a suburb of Sydney.

 

[WesternSydneyHawk]

Parra not so much. Nowhere available to put a new stadium anywhere near transport.

Ummm...

Why not Parramatta Park, right next to Parramatta Stadium, perhaps at the Old Kings Oval?

It's one block away from the new Parra light rail on Church St. And because it's near Church St, you have all the restaurants and bars along Church St to visit before and after a game.

Alternatively, you could build a new stadium in the Southern Domain of Parra Park, right next to the T1 Western suburbs line.

If you're spending roughly half a billion on a new stadium, then a new station serving the stadium between Parramatta and Westmead is probably doable.

Heck, dig down deep enough and you can put a station on the new Western Sydney Metro line too.

 

[WesternSydneyHawk]

Another area that the AFL could perhaps look to put a new, secondary stadium is southwest Sydney.

This would not replace GWS' home ground at Olympic park, or some of the other options in this thread, but rather complement it as a second home in the Sydney metro area.

Already, new housing estates are sprouting up like mushrooms in the area around Austral and Leppington.

This is only going to grow over the coming decades. The state government has earmarked the south west "aerotropolis"/Bradfield/Parklands City as being a third CBD for Sydney, alongside the Sydney CBD and Parramatta.

You have the Western Sydney airport going in. You have the Western Sydney Airport Metro line being built.

Liverpool and Campbelltown are a long way from both Olympic Park and the SCG. (Catch the train from Olympic Park to Liverpool someday if you disagree.)

With Canberra a strong option for a 20th licence, why not move those GWS Canberra home games to a part of Greater Western Sydney that's currently underserved by GWS?

The opportunity exists now to snap up a parcel of farmland close to a train station, before it's all purchased by developers.

You could have three or four ovals for local footy, plus a fenced-off main oval with a grandstand, and a seated capacity somewhere in the range if 10,000 to 20,000, with room for future expansion.

This secondary ground can be used to host a number of GWS home games when Olympic Park is out if action. It can also be used for Talent League and AFLW games.

In the very distant long-term future when the AFL is looking at expanding to 22 clubs (and to be clear, I don't anticipate this for several decades), it could be expanded and function as a home ground and training/admin base for a 3rd Sydney team in the outer southwest.

With a state government keen to create a 3rd CBD in the southwest, a facility like this could potentially attract both federal, state, and local government support. Or potentially even from a private developer, if it's part of a precinct with housing and retail.

But the time to do it I'd now, rather than in 20 or 30 years' time when the land has already been built up.

 

[Cmarsh]

Another area that the AFL could perhaps look to put a new, secondary stadium is southwest Sydney.

This would not replace GWS' home ground at Olympic park, or some of the other options in this thread, but rather complement it as a second home in the Sydney metro area.

Already, new housing estates are sprouting up like mushrooms in the area around Austral and Leppington.

This is only going to grow over the coming decades. The state government has earmarked the south west "aerotropolis"/Bradfield/Parklands City as being a third CBD for Sydney, alongside the Sydney CBD and Parramatta.

You have the Western Sydney airport going in. You have the Western Sydney Airport Metro line being built.

Liverpool and Campbelltown are a long way from both Olympic Park and the SCG. (Catch the train from Olympic Park to Liverpool someday if you disagree.)

With Canberra a strong option for a 20th licence, why not move those GWS Canberra home games to a part of Greater Western Sydney that's currently underserved by GWS?

The opportunity exists now to snap up a parcel of farmland close to a train station, before it's all purchased by developers.

You could have three or four ovals for local footy, plus a fenced-off main oval with a grandstand, and a seated capacity somewhere in the range if 10,000 to 20,000, with room for future expansion.

This secondary ground can be used to host a number of GWS home games when Olympic Park is out if action. It can also be used for Talent League and AFLW games.

In the very distant long-term future when the AFL is looking at expanding to 22 clubs (and to be clear, I don't anticipate this for several decades), it could be expanded and function as a home ground and training/admin base for a 3rd Sydney team in the outer southwest.

With a state government keen to create a 3rd CBD in the southwest, a facility like this could potentially attract both federal, state, and local government support. Or potentially even from a private developer, if it's part of a precinct with housing and retail.

But the time to do it I'd now, rather than in 20 or 30 years' time when the land has already been built up.

Personally I would like more investment into Blacktown sportspark to build it up to a stadium that people would actually want to attend, rather than it mainly just being a grassed hill.

 

[Giant YoYo]

Another area that the AFL could perhaps look to put a new, secondary stadium is southwest Sydney.

This would not replace GWS' home ground at Olympic park, or some of the other options in this thread, but rather complement it as a second home in the Sydney metro area.

Already, new housing estates are sprouting up like mushrooms in the area around Austral and Leppington.

This is only going to grow over the coming decades. The state government has earmarked the south west "aerotropolis"/Bradfield/Parklands City as being a third CBD for Sydney, alongside the Sydney CBD and Parramatta.

You have the Western Sydney airport going in. You have the Western Sydney Airport Metro line being built.

Liverpool and Campbelltown are a long way from both Olympic Park and the SCG. (Catch the train from Olympic Park to Liverpool someday if you disagree.)

With Canberra a strong option for a 20th licence, why not move those GWS Canberra home games to a part of Greater Western Sydney that's currently underserved by GWS?

The opportunity exists now to snap up a parcel of farmland close to a train station, before it's all purchased by developers.

You could have three or four ovals for local footy, plus a fenced-off main oval with a grandstand, and a seated capacity somewhere in the range if 10,000 to 20,000, with room for future expansion.

This secondary ground can be used to host a number of GWS home games when Olympic Park is out if action. It can also be used for Talent League and AFLW games.

In the very distant long-term future when the AFL is looking at expanding to 22 clubs (and to be clear, I don't anticipate this for several decades), it could be expanded and function as a home ground and training/admin base for a 3rd Sydney team in the outer southwest.

With a state government keen to create a 3rd CBD in the southwest, a facility like this could potentially attract both federal, state, and local government support. Or potentially even from a private developer, if it's part of a precinct with housing and retail.

But the time to do it I'd now, rather than in 20 or 30 years' time when the land has already been built up.

Quite like this idea for various reasons.

There's a number of footy clubs out that way and there's definitely a bit of a footy presence there. My family lives out that way and it's noticeable. Further support required, of course.

Reckon it could anchor the region, extending down to Camden/Campbelltown way and tie in the region nicely to footy.

Personally I would like more investment into Blacktown sportspark to build it up to a stadium that people would actually want to attend, rather than it mainly just being a grassed hill.

Am open to the idea but I'm afraid having a shared facility with other sports does not appear to have worked out really well for us there. Hence, there's a slow but steady move away from Blacktown. I'd be surprised if that reverses anytime soon.

I am of the belief that we need a facility that prioritises footy first.

 

[kranger]

I still think GWS need to play out of one stadium for the full season.

None of the other Non-Victorians play out of multiple stadiums. It makes it more consistent for spectators to attend match day, and concentrate funding into a single facility.

Melbournes 9 teams play out of only two stadiums and are within only 2 train stops of each other.

Parramatta and Blacktown are clearly the centre of Western Sydney (in terms of a north-south perspective). Parramatta specifically is connected to all of the transport corridor, and close enough to the rest of Sydney.



Here are a few options around Parramatta.

• Green is pretty good for size and proximity to the train station.
• Yellow is good for size, a bit further from the train station but requires a lot of tree removal.
• Red is a good distance from the train station but too small of a space.

 

[Cmarsh]

I still think GWS need to play out of one stadium for the full season.

None of the other Non-Victorians play out of multiple stadiums. It makes it more consistent for spectators to attend match day, and concentrate funding into a single facility.

Melbournes 9 teams play out of only two stadiums and are within only 2 train stops of each other.

Parramatta and Blacktown are clearly the centre of Western Sydney (in terms of a north-south perspective). Parramatta specifically is connected to all of the transport corridor, and close enough to the rest of Sydney.

View attachment 2097418

Here are a few options around Parramatta.

• Green is pretty good for size and proximity to the train station.
• Yellow is good for size, a bit further from the train station but requires a lot of tree removal.
• Red is a good distance from the train station but too small of a space.

View attachment 2097417

Gold coast also play home games in Darwin.

 

[kranger]

Gold coast also play home games in Darwin.

I was implying home games in their own city.

Otherwise if we include secondary markets, GWS is in Canberra, Hawthorn and North Melbourne are in Tas, Bulldogs are in Ballarat and Melbourne is in Alice Springs.

 

[WesternSydneyHawk]

Here are a few options around Parramatta.

• Green is pretty good for size and proximity to the train station.
• Yellow is good for size, a bit further from the train station but requires a lot of tree removal.
• Red is a good distance from the train station but too small of a space.

There are some advantages to Robin Thomas reserve (circled in red). Yes it's a bit further to Parramatta Station and the future Parramatta Metro.

But.

The Parramatta light rail runs right in front of it along George St, turning into MacArthur St, then Macquarie St.

It's just across MacArthur St from the Parramatta ferry stop.

The area around the ferry terminal has been redeveloped in the past couple of years, with a couple of new Meriton Towers.

There's a number of new restaurants that have opened up on the ground floor of those towers, with more dining options along the riverfront.

It's also just across the street from the Albion Hotel, which has a large open-air beer garden and seating for several hundred people comfortably.

Perhaps GWS could buy it and make it the official social club?

As for the existing buildings just east of the park, that's less of an issue than if first appears.

Basically, the both the State Government and the local council have made it clear that the land around the light rail and metro stations will be zoned for apartments once they open.

I genuinely won't be surprised if many of the single storey family homes and red brick flats in the area are replaced with shiny new apartments within the next five-to-10 years.

I say find a well-connected property developer who'll buy up those parcels, who wants to build overpriced apartment high-rises on the land not used for the stadium.

Then call it something like:

A premium new entertainment and lifestyle precinct that will extend and enhance Parramatta's vibrant waterfront. This mixed-use development will cement Parramatta's place as Australia's next great CBD, effortlessly blending world-class entertainment (including AFL, cricket, and concerts), dining, leading international retail, and residential living.

 

[Bjo187]

I agree with posts above, the afl need to start buying land in nsw and qld so they have some bargaining power with other sports to share their facilities.

Cricket will no doubt wanna ride off the afl coattails as usual, then the afl can demand that other cricket clubs open their ovals to footy during the winter. This should be happening anyway, but apparently it isn't. If this does change though, then you can have footy and cricket clubs as one, like in the southern states and it would help with crossover participation.

 

[Canberra Pear]

I think GWS' "other" stadium should be Tom Wills Oval.

It's already (one day) getting upgraded for the AFLW. Upgrade it to 12k and play the Suns there during the Easter Show.

The Suns have never drawn more than 8.3k. By the time they're selling that out, that means the Giants have grown enough and they can then start taking an Easter game to Accor and push for 30k against a big opposition like Collingwood.

They're in the same precinct and it keeps consistency over the Easter break. Plus both the metro and light rail will be there in coming years.

 

[Walshawk]

Surely ACCOR is an asset that must be used at some stage in the future if AFL is to grow in Sydney? If the AFL never uses it, it will eventually be reconfigured to a rectangle. When Tassie comes in, we will likely go to 24 rounds, so if Sydney and GWS get an extra home game for SCG and Showgrounds, they should agree to play all derbies at ACCOR, including finals. Play at Easter, free entry for members of both clubs, free transport, etc.

Use it or lose it.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

Surely ACCOR is an asset that must be used at some stage in the future if AFL is to grow in Sydney? If the AFL never uses it, it will eventually be reconfigured to a rectangle. When Tassie comes in, we will likely go to 24 rounds, so if Sydney and GWS get an extra home game for SCG and Showgrounds, they should agree to play all derbies at ACCOR, including finals. Play at Easter, free entry for members of both clubs, free transport, etc.

Use it or lose it.

Every redevelopment since the Olympics has made it worse to watch for footy. It's probably the worst modern ground in the entire AFL that has recently hosted games in terms of experience and quality of watching the game.

 

[kranger]

Every redevelopment since the Olympics has made it worse to watch for footy. It's probably the worst modern ground in the entire AFL that has recently hosted games in terms of experience and quality of watching the game.

I’ve only been to Stadium Australia once and that was for a cricket game around 2008, but I am curious how the redevelopments have made it worse?

Reading Austadiums, the only redevelopments mentioned don’t seem like they would have affected the spectators experience for Aussie Rules.

Accor Stadium (Stadium Australia) | Austadiums

Information about Accor Stadium (Stadium Australia) in Sydney including venue layout, history, records, events, map, tickets, directions and accommodation.

www.austadiums.com

“The stadium has had major redevelopment work done throughout 2001 and 2002 to reduce the size and convert the playing field into an oval shape to enable Australian Football to be played. Stage two of the project was completed in March 2002 and included the removal of the two stands at either end, remodelling of the lower level of seating into an oval shape. Stage three included the extension of the roof at either end which used to be occupied by the two large stands - this was completed in 2003.

Stadium Australia was set to receive a major $810 redevelopment to convert the Olympic stadium into a world-class 70,000-capacity rectangular stadium, commencing in mid-2020 - however the NSW Government then abandoned the project.

In 2022, a new super-sized LED video screen known as 'the great southern screen' was installed - this included the removal of some seating reducing the capacity from 83,500 to approx. 82,000.”


It’s interesting that of the 56 games played at Stadium Australia over 20 years, only 12 of them have an attendance greater than the current capacity of the SCG.

AFL Tables - Stadium Australia

 

[Johnny Bananas]

I still think GWS need to play out of one stadium for the full season.

None of the other Non-Victorians play out of multiple stadiums. It makes it more consistent for spectators to attend match day, and concentrate funding into a single facility.

Melbournes 9 teams play out of only two stadiums and are within only 2 train stops of each other.

Parramatta and Blacktown are clearly the centre of Western Sydney (in terms of a north-south perspective). Parramatta specifically is connected to all of the transport corridor, and close enough to the rest of Sydney.

View attachment 2097418

Here are a few options around Parramatta.

• Green is pretty good for size and proximity to the train station.
• Yellow is good for size, a bit further from the train station but requires a lot of tree removal.
• Red is a good distance from the train station but too small of a space.

View attachment 2097417

This discussion is about 15 years too late. I agree the Giants would have been better served playing all their games in Parramatta, but they picked the Showground for better or worse and they have to live with it now. The NSW government is putting a lot of money into transport to Sydney Olympic Park, between the metro line and the light rail, so why would they agree to fund a stadium anywhere else and draw events away from an area they're investing in greatly? Aside from Wentworth Point on the outer edge, SOP doesn't have much of a residential community around it to get good use out of that public transport, it's all in service of events.

So I like Canberra Pear 's suggestion of Tom Wills Oval. At least it's also within SOP and has the women's team as a carrot to attract government funding.

 

[HBFlanker]

Sydney are the main club in the league that should consider building their own stadium.

The revenues would be unbelievable.

 

[Rob]

Sydney are the main club in the league that should consider building their own stadium.

The revenues would be unbelievable.

I would say the opposite - they're just about the last club where it's a viable option as they would have no other tenants. A stadium is pretty unprofitable if there are only 11 event days a year.

But if 4 Melbourne clubs got together you could probably make a business case for it. It's only current AFL contracts that are in the way.