Okay you lot Put up or shut up

[GuruJane]

Okay you lot ...

Put up or shut up.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A17471-2004Jun30.html

It occurs to me that the way Israel deals with its blacks is to fly them into the the country and make them part of the nation as in the Ethiopian airlift.

It appears the Arab Muslims methods of dealing with blacks is to eliminate them.

and not one Muslim country in the world raises so much as a whimper of protest.

And not one poster on this board except those who support democracy shows the slightest bit of interest

Your shame, pseuds.

And as for Lestat and Ah_19's SILENCE ...

What a credit to your faith you are.

 

[CharlieG]

Could you please post the article? That site requires registration, which I'm not inclined to do.

I suspect, though, that you're talking about the situation in Sudan that Powell spoke about?

I don't think you'll find me disagreeing with what he had to say.

Oh, by the way, am I a pseud?

 

[Bombers 2003]

Re: Okay you lot ...

Originally posted by GuruJane
Put up or shut up.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A17471-2004Jun30.html

It occurs to me that the way Israel deals with its blacks is to fly them into the the country and make them part of the nation as in the Ethiopian airlift.

It appears the Arab Muslims methods of dealing with blacks is to eliminate them.

and not one Muslim country in the world raises so much as a whimper of protest.

And not one poster on this board except those who support democracy shows the slightest bit of interest

Your shame, pseuds.

And as for Lestat and Ah_19's SILENCE ...

What a credit to your faith you are.

Jane,the Muslim government of Sudan have been fighting the christians +pagans in the south since '55.Numeiri attempted to eliminate them,couldnt and made a series of agreements with them.Even promised Autonomy,or a form of it anyway.The Anya guerrillas refused all muslim negogations and continued to fight.I think the sudan Government is at the end of it's patience and is only threatening retaliation to bring the south back to peaceful negogiations.

 

[Weaver]

Re: Okay you lot ...

Originally posted by GuruJane
It occurs to me that the way Israel deals with its blacks is to fly them into the the country and make them part of the nation as in the Ethiopian airlift.

This was a case of Jews welcoming Jews.

Originally posted by GuruJane
It appears the Arab Muslims methods of dealing with blacks is to eliminate them.

This is a case of Arab Muslims and a Black Christians engaged in a civil war.

I don't think this is an issue of being black, if it was how would you explain Muslim nations like Senegal, Niger and Mali, the black-on-black 'civil war' in Nigeria and similar tensions in part of Kenya?

Keep fishing Jane.

 

[afc9798]

Re: Okay you lot ...

I think you give us too much credit Jane. I for one played no role in this action and therefore I don't accept responsibility nor feel any shame for it. I think it's a great tragedy to lose any life, I don't pick and choose like you do as to which lives are more valuable than others. I have a basic philosophy that no life is more valuable than another's. I know this goes against the blueblood conservative attitude, but hey I'm supposedly a pseud.

Do you feel shame at the Palestinians killed by the IDF, are you directly responsible for their deaths? What have you done to help the situation with the blacks in the Arab countries?

You may call people pseuds or latte lefties or whatever else you like, but it doesn't detract from the fact that you are an armchair neo-con who has contributed nothing.

At least I have actually put my money where my mouth is and actually donated my time and labour to directly assist in areas where i saw injustice and suffering. What have you done other than posted the thoughts of right leaning media outlets? If you can supply any evidence of real passion for your cause, I will detract, but until then, consider yourself irrelevant to all events. Incidentally, attending AMCHAM briefings or a wine and cheese night at the Liberal Party don't count.

 

[BlueMark]

Sorry Jane been calling for more forceful UN intervention in the Sudan for years. Grotty little civil war. I would love the US to validate its alledged 'We stand for oppressed peoples everywhere' credentials. Why haven't you been calling for an invasion?

 

[Dipper]

Re: Okay you lot ...

Originally posted by GuruJane

It occurs to me that the way Israel deals with its blacks is to fly them into the the country and make them part of the nation as in the Ethiopian airlift.

OK let me first make it clear that I have no bias to either side in the Arab/Palestinian-Israel divide.

I cannot though quite understand how the Israeli Ethiopian Jews airlift can be put up as an unequivocally laudable piece of foreign aid.

I seem to remember at the time that there was a profound unease that people were being saved unashamedly on account of their religion, that in the eyes of Israel the lives & well being of Ethiopian Jews was worth more than that of the other Ethiopians.

To put it into context could you imagine the outcry if a country like Australia delivered aid to a country on the proviso that it was only delivered to Christians or to whites or by some other method that placed the well being of one group over another.

 

[MillerCHF]

You should all note that the Jews of Ethiopia were persecuted for being Jewish in Ethiopia. Having visited some of their schools and communities in Israel myself, it brings a tear to my eye to see what they have achieved in such a short time, having been given the opportunity.

Thank you for posting this GuruJane.

Everybody else may be cynical, but I for one will never treat a story that recognises a great humanitarian effort with such cynicism.

 

[GuruJane]

Re: Re: Okay you lot ...

Originally posted by Bombers 2003
Jane,the Muslim government of Sudan have been fighting the christians +pagans in the south since '55.Numeiri attempted to eliminate them,couldnt and made a series of agreements with them.Even promised Autonomy,or a form of it anyway.The Anya guerrillas refused all muslim negogations and continued to fight.I think the sudan Government is at the end of it's patience and is only threatening retaliation to bring the south back to peaceful negogiations.

Bombers - take a breath.

They're not Christians and pagan's they're systematically exterminating - they are black MUSLIMS.

 

[GuruJane]

Re: Re: Okay you lot ...

Originally posted by afc9798
I think you give us too much credit Jane. I for one played no role in this action and therefore I don't accept responsibility nor feel any shame for it.

You don't feel any shame about fellow Muslims being SYSTEMATICALLY destroyed by other Muslims?

Is that the difference between Muslims and Jews, Ah_19?

Muslims don't care about other Muslims?. Or identify with them? Is that what you are saying?

Or is it a trait peculiar to Arab Muslims?

What does the Q'ran say?

I can't understand the mindset. Even though I am not a practising Christian I am by background, and I would be out agitating if a Christian country was committing genocide on other Christians.

What gives?

 

[DaveW]

GuruJane - why do you insist on making the Darfur genocide an issue of religion?

Last time you brought this up, I posted an article excerpt that indicated it had nothing to do with Islam.

Curiously, you chose to ignore that.

 

[MillerCHF]

Re: Re: Re: Okay you lot ...

Originally posted by GuruJane


You don't feel any shame about fellow Muslims being SYSTEMATICALLY destroyed by other Muslims?

Is that the difference between Muslims and Jews, Ah_19?

Muslims don't care about other Muslims?. Or identify with them? Is that what you are saying?

Or is it a trait peculiar to Arab Muslims?

What does the Q'ran say?

I can't understand the mindset. Even though I am not a practising Christian I am by background, and I would be out agitating if a Christian country was committing genocide on other Christians.

What gives? [/B]

Not only does he not care about other Muslims, but it takes a Christian (although non-practicing) such as yourself and a Jew (such as myself) to care about these issues.

So much for the brotherhood and unity of Islam.

 

[GuruJane]

Re: Re: Okay you lot ...

Originally posted by DIPPER
I seem to remember at the time that there was a profound unease that people were being saved unashamedly on account of their religion, that in the eyes of Israel the lives & well being of Ethiopian Jews was worth more than that of the other Ethiopians.

Er ... profound unease from whom?

The whole raison d'etre of the Israel was to provide a state/home for the Jews so they had somewhere to go and someone to save them and someone to speak for them when persecuted.

This arose, ahem, from the lessons of the Shoah.

Remember that?

Also - "religion" has nothing to do with it.

All jews by birth are entitled to be citizens of the Jewish state whether they are religious or not, Dipper.

So the airlift of the Ethiopiean Jews is analagous to Australia saving citizens of its own who were being persceuted out of the country.

 

[GuruJane]

Originally posted by CharlieG
Oh, by the way, am I a pseud?

Sorry CG ... look all I can do is post my definition of a pseud that I put on another thread in answer to a similar request:

A summary of the main points of difference:

A real Leftist is reformist and radical.

A pseudo Leftist is reactionary.

A real Leftist sees FASCISM whether of the right (German national socialism) or the Left (Stalinism) or of religion (Islamofascism) as the true enemy that must be confronted at all times.

A pseudo leftist only OPPOSES FASCISM in the wider context of anti-Americanism. For eg: East Timor, good ... Iraq, bad.

A real Leftist is always looking far ahead and accepts Marx's proposition that Capitalism must run its course to the fullest extent before it in turn will be overthrown by workers control.
Real Lefists do not just feel, they also think

A pseudo Leftist can't get beyond moment-to-moment kneejerk anti globalisation, anti Americanism. The pseudo Leftist feels but does not think .

A real Leftist would die before lining up on the same side as the Far Right, racists, blatant judeophobes, religious fundamentalists etc.

The pseudo Leftist Has no problems about getting into bed with the above. In the US the pseuds line up with the racist, far right Pat Buchanan. In the UK they formed a political party with them (!) to stand for the Eur elections.

Yes, the pseudo left in Britain actually stood on the same platform in a JOINT party as extreme Muslim fundamentalist groups and ACCEPTED their homophobic and mysogonistic agendas.

So you tell me ??

BTW registration to the WP is free and well worth it.

 

[CharlieG]

What would YOU say I am, based on my posts in this forum?

 

[JavaBlue]

Originally posted by GuruJane
A summary of the main points of difference:

A real Leftist is reformist and radical.

A pseudo Leftist is reactionary.

A real Leftist sees FASCISM whether of the right (German national socialism) or the Left (Stalinism) or of religion (Islamofascism) as the true enemy that must be confronted at all times.

A pseudo leftist only OPPOSES FASCISM in the wider context of anti-Americanism. For eg: East Timor, good ... Iraq, bad.

A real Leftist is always looking far ahead and accepts Marx's proposition that Capitalism must run its course to the fullest extent before it in turn will be overthrown by workers control.
Real Lefists do not just feel, they also think

A pseudo Leftist can't get beyond moment-to-moment kneejerk anti globalisation, anti Americanism. The pseudo Leftist feels but does not think .

A real Leftist would die before lining up on the same side as the Far Right, racists, blatant judeophobes, religious fundamentalists etc.

The pseudo Leftist Has no problems about getting into bed with the above. In the US the pseuds line up with the racist, far right Pat Buchanan. In the UK they formed a political party with them (!) to stand for the Eur elections.

Yes, the pseudo left in Britain actually stood on the same platform in a JOINT party as extreme Muslim fundamentalist groups and ACCEPTED their homophobic and mysogonistic agendas.

Perhaps you could dig this hole a little deeper by defining Fascism?

 

[Former]

GJ, maybe this pseudo-Leftist tag is a product of your own imagination.

Where you see pretend Lefties, maybe everyone else sees a different set of ideals. Maybe there are groups of people who can't be classified by the old Left/Right dichotomy.

Just maybe.

 

[MGREG]

Originally posted by JavaBlue
Perhaps you could dig this hole a little deeper by defining Fascism?

Fascism = Communism

 

[Moo]

Not only does he not care about other Muslims, but it takes a Christian (although non-practicing) such as yourself and a Jew (such as myself) to care about these issues.


Miller ....thou should remove thye head from thye bottom before speaking.

Read this post again ..........whilst I go and find my Carly Simon album.

 

[GuruJane]

Originally posted by JavaBlue
Perhaps you could dig this hole a little deeper by defining Fascism?

Do I have to define it more than German National Socialism (The right) or Stalinism (the Left)?

A few distinguishing features:

Totalitarian government based on an ideology of racial superiority (German Nat Socialism) and/or class superiority (Communism) and/or religious superiority (Islamofascim) and/or (d) Tribal thuggery (Saddam and Baathists)

No independant judiciary.

No separation of judicial and executive powers.

No individual recourse to Law that applies to all citizens.

No free press.

No freedom of information technology.

No enshrined rights for minorities.

And so on.

 

[JavaBlue]

Originally posted by MGREG
Fascism = Communism

You must have got lost and ended up in the wrong forum.

 

[JavaBlue]

Originally posted by GuruJane
Do I have to define it more than German National Socialism (The right) or Stalinism (the Left)?

A few distinguishing features:

Totalitarian government based on an ideology of racial superiority (German Nat Socialism) and/or class superiority (Communism) and/or religious superiority (Islamofascim) and/or (d) Tribal thuggery (Saddam and Baathists)

No independant judiciary.

No separation of judicial and executive powers.

No individual recourse to Law that applies to all citizens.

No free press.

No freedom of information technology.

No enshrined rights for minorities.

And so on.

See my reply to MGREG.

 

[MGREG]

Originally posted by JavaBlue
You must have got lost and ended up in the wrong forum.

The truth hurts doesnt it.

Extremism is the same. The two end fo the poltical spectrum are really just completing the circle and end up in the same place.

Your compelling argument doesnt convince me otherwise.

Keep trying. Rove needs some fresh comic writing.

 

[demon_dave]

Originally posted by GuruJane
Do I have to define it more than German National Socialism (The right) or Stalinism (the Left)?

A few distinguishing features:

Totalitarian government based on an ideology of racial superiority (German Nat Socialism) and/or class superiority (Communism) and/or religious superiority (Islamofascim) and/or (d) Tribal thuggery (Saddam and Baathists)

No independant judiciary.

No separation of judicial and executive powers.

No individual recourse to Law that applies to all citizens.

No free press.

No freedom of information technology.

No enshrined rights for minorities.

And so on.

ok gijoe or pseudjane, babyjane whatever, just because people do not agree with your slanted view of the world does not mean they are facsists, communists or any ists, it just means we may have a few morals and believe in the sanctity of human life and values, not all your trumped up excuses for bombing this place or not bombing the next,you are a pseudo intellect, a dumbarse

 

[afc9798]

Re: Re: Re: Okay you lot ...

Originally posted by GuruJane


You don't feel any shame about fellow Muslims being SYSTEMATICALLY destroyed by other Muslims?

Is that the difference between Muslims and Jews, Ah_19?

Muslims don't care about other Muslims?. Or identify with them? Is that what you are saying?

Or is it a trait peculiar to Arab Muslims?

What does the Q'ran say?

I can't understand the mindset. Even though I am not a practising Christian I am by background, and I would be out agitating if a Christian country was committing genocide on other Christians.

What gives? [/B]

I think you might have confused me with someone else. I am not a Muslim and if you read my post and actually responded to the whole text, rather than one tiny selective piece, you might understand a little better. I know your modus operandi is to only selectively quote and respond, but given your apparent outrage, I think I raised some valid points for you to answer. Bottom line is that I can only assume that you are an armchair neo-con who does nothing, but posts the work of others and assume a position based not on knowledge, but on which publication it comes from.

I was raised a Catholic, but this doesn't mean a thing. Where's your outrage at the violent history of Christianity? You're quite happy to go back in history when it suits, but not apparently, if it doesn't fit into your blinkered view of the world.