our best 22 come the start of 2014?

[ThePezDispenser]

any realistic appraisal of the season just passed and the Reasonable Fan says
Adams
He contributes to Wins but he is conspicuous by his absence in our Losses

Consider this:
Seems unable to play a full game at Peak Intensity
One vigorous tackle followed by visits to the bench
And misses at least as many shots as he gets

statistically speaking
Man Most Likely to be injured (apologies Nathan)
I look forward to Garner taking his spot

It's a sad fact that Adams would admit to. He still gets the first crack at it from round 1 though.

 

[Ahern2Boof]

If we were picking a team for a Grand Final right now, Adams would be first picked IMO. Would perform.

 

[GarnerSmash]

Patch is great when his shoulders let him perform. Garner could be fantastic if his shoulders let him perform.

When it comes to round one proven >>> unproven. It's up to Garner to force Patch out of the side. Harper too for that matter.

 

[Heaps of fun]

If we were picking a team for a Grand Final right now, Adams would be first picked IMO. Would perform.

The flip-side is that he would be the most likely to be injured and subbed out in the first quarter of a GF.

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

Another year of footy and still JMac has plenty of haters. I personally can't wait to see him and also atley be let loose on the wing during games this year.

It's not hating. It's realism.

We have a plethora of options in his position, some of whom can stick a tackle, won't get sidestepped by a 75 year old cripple, won't flap the arms around under the guise of "leadership".

When you have the likes of NDS & LMac who are clearly more able, something has to give. I for one, rate his finishing and would try him as a defensive forward.

Not having him & others who will remain nameless in proposed best 22's does not equate to "hating".

 

[ThePezDispenser]

It's not hating. It's realism.

We have a plethora of options in his position, some of whom can stick a tackle, won't get sidestepped by a 75 year old cripple, won't flap the arms around under the guise of "leadership".

When you have the likes of NDS & LMac who are clearly more able, something has to give. I for one, rate his finishing and would try him as a defensive forward.

Not having him & others who will remain nameless in proposed best 22's does not equate to "hating".

Sure, not hating and then you go on to mock the kid.

 

[Blanket_melb]

Jmacs a vital part of our backline and future leadership. I rate him. Kinda reminds me a bit of kingy

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

Jmacs a vital part of our backline and future leadership. I rate him. Kinda reminds me a bit of kingy

Lol. Same jumper # sans pace, skill & mongrel.

Sure, not hating and then you go on to mock the kid.

Cry me a river.

 

[ThePezDispenser]

Lol. Same jumper # sans pace, skill & mongrel.



Cry me a river.

Keep on hating champ

 

[Reginald0]

why is mullet considered to be so much better than JMac, I just don't see it
both players are not quite quick enuf to regain their feet to be real A class defenders in my book (I think they will both improve on 2013 but at present they are both bottom 6 choices

It is likely that BMac 186 and LMac 188 are better players than both of them IMHO

the $64 Question

Who is making way for NDS?
Wright

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

why is mullet considered to be so much better than JMac, I just don't see it
both players are not quite quick enuf to regain their feet to be real A class defenders in my book (I think they will both improve on 2013 but at present they are both bottom 6 choices

It is likely that BMac 186 and LMac 188 are better players than both of them IMHO

the $64 Question

Who is making way for NDS?
Wright

Regi, the main difference is Mullet can kick.
He single handedly transformed our kick ins from shambolic to very good.

As for NDS: Sierra for starters, but could easily be JMac/person who cannot be named/wright/Adams

BMac, Garner, LMac must play IMO. They are elite talents who shouldn't be rotting away in the 2's.

 

[ThePezDispenser]

LMac will have a long way to go then, afterall he did rot in the 2s last year.

 

[WesternRoo]

why is mullet considered to be so much better than JMac, I just don't see it
both players are not quite quick enuf to regain their feet to be real A class defenders in my book (I think they will both improve on 2013 but at present they are both bottom 6 choices

It is likely that BMac 186 and LMac 188 are better players than both of them IMHO

the $64 Question

Who is making way for NDS?
Wright

Wright won't play round 1.
Mullet is significantly quicker than J-Mac and his left foot is one of the best in the comp.
I would argue he is better one on one now as well.

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

LMac will have a long way to go then, afterall he did rot in the 2s last year.

Only because he was ineligible.

Question for you mate, would Jamie have dominated the VFL finals like 17 year old Luke did?

 

[Jay-Z]

Wright won't play round 1.
Mullet is significantly quicker than J-Mac and his left foot is one of the best in the comp.
I would argue he is better one on one now as well.

He said he wasn't quick enough to regain his feet, not that he wasn't quick enough. I don't think anyone on here thinks Mullett is slow

 

[Jay-Z]

Regi, the main difference is Mullet can kick.
He single handedly transformed our kick ins from shambolic to very good.

As for NDS: Sierra for starters, but could easily be JMac/person who cannot be named/wright/Adams

BMac, Garner, LMac must play IMO. They are elite talents who shouldn't be rotting away in the 2's.

I know you love the young guys, but the "elite" call is a little premature. Those 3 will all play games in 2014, no doubt. But I'd be surprised if any play all 22 (BMac a chance and LMac an outside chance).

As for who NDS replaces, I don't think it is a case of one player. There are a number of players on the fringe of our 22 who got games this year - McKenzie (10), Anthony (5), Jacobs (7), Firrito (17), Wright (16), Harper (3), Greenwood (6), Hine (14), Garner (2), L. Delaney (5) - that's 85 games available to the new "best 22" players like Dal Santo, McDonald as well as a few extras for Taz (13), Boomer (16) and Swallow (17) (and perhaps McMahon(11)) who are all best 22 but missed chunks of the year through injury/suspension.

 

[GarnerSmash]

Folk push the potential line but ignore any indication from the club about a players value. Folk can lambaste a guy because he cant kick yet Macmillan goes at 78% efficiency, lambaste him because he can't tackle yet he tackles at a similar rate to Atley and more than Mullett, bag his leadership as 'waving his arms about' when NDS has stated that he is very impressed with his leadership around the club and the club has earmarked him for a senior leadership role down the track and ignore the fact that he does more blocking and shepherding around the ground than any of our other running players.

A guy like Macmillan will polarise supporter opinions because he doesn't get a great deal of the pill, doesn't kick the long goals on the run (although 11 goals ain't too bad) and isn't particularly flashy. It doesn't take a genius to see the skills that players like Garner, LMac and BMac possess so it is easy to say that they need to be in the seniors asap. But it does take at least some nous to see what a guy like Macmillan does bring which some supporters seem to miss constantly. Things like running off the ball to create space and to drag opponents away from the man with the ball, the blocking and shepherding, recognising where the weakness in a set up is and addressing it, the nuts and bolts work that matters so much more in the modern game than ever before.

If Macmillan is one of the coaches favourites it is because he adds value to the team in who he is and what he does on game day. There is a reason why Macmillan will always get games over Greenwood and it lies between his ears. He does what is asked of him, week in week out. Sure, he may miss a tackle, he may spray a kick, he may get outbodied, but that is because he is a footballer and these things happen to every footballer, and not just those who are 22 and have played 58 games.

I am pretty confident that Macmillan will be one of those guys who gets to 100 games before he gets the kudos he deserves from those outside the club and from the majority of supporters. So be it. He wouldn't give a shit one way or the other because he is being recognised by those that matter for just how valuable he is to the NMFC.

 

[Saintly31]

He wouldn't give a shit one way or the other because he is being recognised by those that matter for just how valuable he is to the NMFC.

I'd say the JMac preachers outweigh the JMac critics by a long margin. Half the threads here end up with long spiels about how great he is, undervalued, not recognised, etc etc etc.....

There is probably less than a handful of posters who discuss his weaknesses, which is no different to any other player - yet the same kind of rearguard action doesn't occur.

Anyway - my take is he went up a level second half of 2013. He is best 22 but will need to continue to perform with our greater depth. Tackling technique and over-committing (hence far too easily sidestepped) are his biggest weaknesses, and no doubt he is working on them. His physique is perfect for AFL, he is bigger than many players he is compared against.

 

[Jay-Z]

Folk push the potential line but ignore any indication from the club about a players value. Folk can lambaste a guy because he cant kick yet Macmillan goes at 78% efficiency, lambaste him because he can't tackle yet he tackles at a similar rate to Atley and more than Mullett, bag his leadership as 'waving his arms about' when NDS has stated that he is very impressed with his leadership around the club and the club has earmarked him for a senior leadership role down the track and ignore the fact that he does more blocking and shepherding around the ground than any of our other running players.

A guy like Macmillan will polarise supporter opinions because he doesn't get a great deal of the pill, doesn't kick the long goals on the run (although 11 goals ain't too bad) and isn't particularly flashy. It doesn't take a genius to see the skills that players like Garner, LMac and BMac possess so it is easy to say that they need to be in the seniors asap. But it does take at least some nous to see what a guy like Macmillan does bring which some supporters seem to miss constantly. Things like running off the ball to create space and to drag opponents away from the man with the ball, the blocking and shepherding, recognising where the weakness in a set up is and addressing it, the nuts and bolts work that matters so much more in the modern game than ever before.

If Macmillan is one of the coaches favourites it is because he adds value to the team in who he is and what he does on game day. There is a reason why Macmillan will always get games over Greenwood and it lies between his ears. He does what is asked of him, week in week out. Sure, he may miss a tackle, he may spray a kick, he may get outbodied, but that is because he is a footballer and these things happen to every footballer, and not just those who are 22 and have played 58 games.

I am pretty confident that Macmillan will be one of those guys who gets to 100 games before he gets the kudos he deserves from those outside the club and from the majority of supporters. So be it. He wouldn't give a shit one way or the other because he is being recognised by those that matter for just how valuable he is to the NMFC.

Outstanding post. He aint perfect, none of our players are and Saintly has correctly identified a few of his weaknesses in the post above. But I am confident he will improve and will end up a 200 game player for this club.

 

[GarnerSmash]

I'd say the JMac preachers outweigh the JMac critics by a long margin. Half the threads here end up with long spiels about how great he is, undervalued, not recognised, etc etc etc.....

There is probably less than a handful of posters who discuss his weaknesses, which is no different to any other player - yet the same kind of rearguard action doesn't occur.

It's fine to have a view, be it negative or positive, and that kind of discussion should be encouraged, but certain posters go so far over the top with the negative crap its not funny. Certain posters either blatantly ignore any positives or are too blind to see them. It is in response to these posters that you will find the 'rearguard' action occurs. As I said, he is a divisive player.

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

I'd say the JMac preachers outweigh the JMac critics by a long margin. Half the threads here end up with long spiels about how great he is, undervalued, not recognised, etc etc etc.....

There is probably less than a handful of posters who discuss his weaknesses, which is no different to any other player - yet the same kind of rearguard action doesn't occur.

Anyway - my take is he went up a level second half of 2013. He is best 22 but will need to continue to perform with our greater depth. Tackling technique and over-committing (hence far too easily sidestepped) are his biggest weaknesses, and no doubt he is working on them. His physique is perfect for AFL, he is bigger than many players he is compared against.

The problem being that even when you say you rate aspects of his game, acknowledge "some" of the positives he brings to the team, the macmillanists attack the anti macmillanists with vigour.

When people start talking about blocking, shepherding, team ethos, tackling technique & DE%(Brady once led this stat ffs) it's akin to clutching at straws.

He is one of the golden children, those chosen ones as it were, so no doubt he will be given countless opportunities to find form, become a footballer and good luck to him.

I just don't see how we are ever going to be better than middle of road accepting the mediocrity that he and a few others bring to the table.

 

[ThePezDispenser]

Only because he was ineligible.

Question for you mate, would Jamie have dominated the VFL finals like 17 year old Luke did?

Would have swallow or Harvey?

 

[RobZombie]

A guy like Macmillan will polarise supporter opinions because he doesn't get a great deal of the pill, doesn't kick the long goals on the run (although 11 goals ain't too bad) and isn't particularly flashy.

And further to that, I reckon that's a reason why a lot of non-NM folk misread our list a bit. A lot of our best players -- at least recent highish draft picks -- aren't especially flashy. Boomer and Wells are, but they're "old" and "inconsistent". Drew can be spectacular but is a "flat track bully" (also "old").[1] That's a bit weird, considering how spectacular the team offense can be when it's going well.


For all we see in Jack and Cunners (and now Lachie too), outside the club people see dime-a-dozen inside mids who don't play like Dangerfield or Beams or Rockliff or Cotchin. Am having fun convincing[2] a Pies supporting workmate that at least half our midfield would walk into their side.

[1] While I personally don't entirely subscribe to that, I also don't like trotting out the "decoy" line. It's more a matter of knowing how to be useful in the game structure when plan A isn't working out, and letting the best matchups work on the day. Yes, sometimes he works primarily to keep a 3rd-up or rebounding fullback away from the contest, but rarely.
[2] Not actually convincing

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

Macmillan is an interesting one. He does a stack of off the ball work that goes unnoticed by a lot of people. He covers off when teammates are caught out of position when the ball is turned over, is very vocal out on the field with regards to where players should be positioned. However, his missed tackles and overcommitment problems need to be fixed ASAP.

 

[KangaFan35]

Heard a lot of north players saying in interviews lately Macmillan is a really good leader and is very vocal at training. I can see him turning into a really good player.