Autopsy Out of our misery

[D Mitchell]

Completely lost

1a, 1b, and 1c of this has to be getting dunkley to stay even if it means a serious payrise.

Losing him definitely makes us far worse.

I agree, he's good at the hard, tough stuff and a lot of what he does goes unnoticed. Built for finals football.

 

[_Mike_]

Bevo is a one-trick pony that everyone else in the AFL has worked out. The players look to be sick of the message and are probably sick of wearing all the blame.

Completely understand that I’m drawing a long bow here, and having already read some of his book, but I can’t help ask the question as to whether or not Bevo did enough to pull certain personalities in line that impacted Toyd’s mental health and JJ’s decline. What has gone so wrong with Wallis and Hunter? Why did he have such an issue with Roughy and Campbell.

it’s not a good environment when the coach is not challenged, it’s unhealthier when leadership players are whitewashed and sent to languish in the magoos and piss their careers away.

 

[TiAn_]

Watched the presser and like some others was a bit disappointed with Bev just laying the defeat squarely at the feet of the players. Maybe he’s right that their effort and execution wasn’t up to scratch. But then, ensuring the players enthusiastically and efficiently carry out his vision is his responsibility (as is ensuring that vision is one that can and will succeed). Perhaps Bev does see we have problems beyond effort and skill but by avoiding speaking to them is just testing everyone’s familiarity with jazz principles and the importance of the notes you don’t play. Surely he’s at least no longer of the opinion we are sufficiently “sophisticated”.

 

[dogwatch]

Watched the presser and like some others was a bit disappointed with Bev just laying the defeat squarely at the feet of the players. Maybe he’s right that their effort and execution wasn’t up to scratch. But then, ensuring the players enthusiastically and efficiently carry out his vision is his responsibility (as is ensuring that vision is one that can and will succeed). Perhaps Bev does see we have problems beyond effort and skill but by avoiding speaking to them is just testing everyone’s familiarity with jazz principles and the importance of the notes you don’t play. Surely he’s at least no longer of the opinion we are sufficiently “sophisticated”.

As always, in the absence of a clear, candid and compelling explanation the onlookers fill in the gaps for themselves. Plenty of that happening on this board. Rumour takes over where official explanation fails to satisfy.

Those jazz notes we’re not hearing seem a little discordant. We won’t be going anywhere unless we’re all on the same sheet and following the conductor.

Do they still want to bring their instruments?

 

[TiAn_]

As always, in the absence of a clear, candid and compelling explanation the onlookers fill in the gaps for themselves. Plenty of that happening on this board. Rumour takes over where official explanation fails to satisfy.

Those jazz notes we’re not hearing seem a little discordant. We won’t be going anywhere unless we’re all on the same sheet and following the conductor.

Do they still want to bring their instruments?

 

[footscray1973]

Just out of interest D Mitchell we’re you at the game?

Naughton had no appetite to run and create at times. He had space to lead into and didn’t go, he had opportunities to make space for others and didn’t and one on one he seems out of position.


Bruce is just not fit enough.

Our forward line is a shambles real shambles just an ad hoc arrangement

But it's all Jamarra's fault apparently, Dog 36 .

Naughton can do no wrong, JUH can do no right.

I don't know why you bother engaging, it seems to be a vendetta against Jamarra - I wonder why?

Poster has NFI.

 

[ScragCity]

What has gone so wrong with Wallis and Hunter?

Good question regarding Hunter. Booted out of the leadership group for drink driving. Missed half of this season due to personal issues. Now he's stuck in the twos because he isn't playing great footy. Hard to blame Bev for any of that.

Wallis just isn't a very good player. Has neither the footskills nor the speed to be a good midfielder these days. Could play as a marking forward if we didn't have all of Bruce, Jamarra, Naughton and Schache as better options. If he had the talent and attributes to play at the level then other clubs would have come calling.

 

[dogwatch]

Good question regarding Hunter. Booted out of the leadership group for drink driving. Missed half of this season due to personal issues. Now he's stuck in the twos because he isn't playing great footy. Hard to blame Bev for any of that.

Wallis just isn't a very good player. Has neither the footskills not the speed to be a good midfielder these days. Could play as a marking forward if we didn't have all of Bruce, Jamarra, Naughton and Schache as better options. If he had the talent and attributes to play at the level then other clubs would have come calling.

Wallis used to be a good player. Don’t know if it’s coincidence but he hasn’t been the same player since his badly broken leg.

These days he plays on footy IQ and heart … but the flesh is weak.

 

[Some Idiot]

Wallis was ruled out for the season weeks ago, and it feels like he has had recurring problem with that foot for a while. Yes he was unlucky to only play 6 games last year - but I'm pretty sure it's mainly been the foot injury that's held him back this season.

 

[D Mitchell]

Completely understand that I’m drawing a long bow here, and having already read some of his book, but I can’t help ask the question as to whether or not Bevo did enough to pull certain personalities in line that impacted Toyd’s mental health and JJ’s decline. What has gone so wrong with Wallis and Hunter? Why did he have such an issue with Roughy and Campbell.

.....Food for thought, that. I hadn't realised that the Campbell departure was anything more than the usual turnover of the list.

 

[_Mike_]

Good question regarding Hunter. Booted out of the leadership group for drink driving. Missed half of this season due to personal issues. Now he's stuck in the twos because he isn't playing great footy. Hard to blame Bev for any of that.

That's the now - what led to that was more my question.

 

[_Mike_]

.....Food for thought, that. I hadn't realised that the Campbell departure was anything more than the usual turnover of the list.

He wasnt getting a game, there were a number of games he was overlooked a few years back before English's time when we didnt have anyone to ruck.

 

[_Mike_]

Wallis was ruled out for the season weeks ago, and it feels like he has had recurring problem with that foot for a while. Yes he was unlucky to only play 6 games last year - but I'm pretty sure it's mainly been the foot injury that's held him back this season.

Rewind the last 2+ years, he went out of favor with Bevo and wasnt getting a look in

 

[Boof09]

Rewind the last 2+ years, he went out of favor with Bevo and wasnt getting a look in

He is not one of Beveridge's "boys" take that to the bank

 

[Anja_Nees]

When the coals are raked over, our physical prep, rehab and resilience has to be part of the serious convo.

Way too many blokes playing injured this year.

On SM-G977B using BigFooty.com mobile app

I agree, but based on the current 8 there will, for a second year running, be four changes to the 8, and I have no doubt our absurd finals draw has played some part.

We finished our season five weeks after Richmond, Freo, Carlton and Collingwood. Not a complete excuse - Brisbane and Geelong have hung around in each year - but it’s not nothing.

If we miss then I’d like to see what we could do with a preseason to get players right.

 

[_Mike_]

He is not one of Beveridge's "boys" take that to the bank

aligns to my view/opinion in the absence of statements

 

[Some Idiot]

Rewind the last 2+ years, he went out of favor with Bevo and wasnt getting a look in

Only really 2021 that he didn't get a look in I think? Not sure about 2019 but IMO he was getting a decent go this year considering his injury problems.

 

[doggies ftw]

I agree, but based on the current 8 there will, for a second year running, be four changes to the 8, and I have no doubt our absurd finals draw has played some part.

We finished our season five weeks after Richmond, Freo, Carlton and Collingwood. Not a complete excuse - Brisbane and Geelong have hung around in each year - but it’s not nothing.

If we miss then I’d like to see what we could do with a preseason to get players right.

Yeah that’s a shit excuse for a shit middle of the road no hope team. We should be competing for top 4 and premierships, no team in their prime competing for top 4 has ever complained about having a rough time due to going deep the previous year, as we know it’s rare to miss finals after playing in a GF.

We’ve been comprehensively beaten early in nearly every game weve played against decent opponents this year

 

[ScragCity]

That's the now - what led to that was more my question.

What lead to Hunter's issues in his personal life? Not sure that's something we need to speculate on. And we certainly shouldn't be implying that Luke Beveridge somehow caused it all.

I'm all for criticising Bevo and even sacking him, but let's not lose our heads.

 

[Anja_Nees]

Yeah that’s a s**t excuse for a s**t middle of the road no hope team. We should be competing for top 4 and premierships, no team in their prime competing for top 4 has ever complained about having a rough time due to going deep the previous year, as we know it’s rare to miss finals after playing in a GF.

We’ve been comprehensively beaten early in nearly every game weve played against decent opponents this year

Nah.

Melbourne dropping out in ‘19-20, Richmond dropping out in ‘16 and even us in ‘07. It happens, and if it’s mostly Bev then he still did better than 16 other teams last season.

If we’re back up and about next year we’ll know, same if we’re crap.

 

[doggies ftw]

Nah.

Melbourne dropping out in ‘19-20, Richmond dropping out in ‘16 and even us in ‘07. It happens, and if it’s mostly Bev then he still did better than 16 other teams last season.

If we’re back up and about next year we’ll know, same if we’re crap.

Melbourne didn’t play finals in both ‘19 and were still struggling in ‘20 because they made it to the 2nd week of finals in ‘18?

Tigs dropped out in ‘16 because they played one week of finals in ‘15? How do you explain the 3 flags and a prelim from 17-20 then?

Weird examples, but you might be happy with one good year followed by one bad year, I’d suggest you’d be in the minority

 

[GetDimmaBack]

Why no armbands for Herb Henderson? Full Back in the team of the Century, not hard to show some respect. Piss poor day, leadership of this club leaves a lot to be desired, easy to see Freo wanted it more.

Exactly.

No tribute in the papers, either

Makes me very angry, and very disappointed in the club overall.


Can anyone imagine Collingwood, for example, letting this happen?

 

[Anja_Nees]

Melbourne didn’t play finals in both ‘19 and were still struggling in ‘20 because they made it to the 2nd week of finals in ‘18?

Tigs dropped out in ‘16 because they played one week of finals in ‘15? How do you explain the 3 flags and a prelim from 17-20 then?

Weird examples, but you might be happy with one good year followed by one bad year, I’d suggest you’d be in the minority

Ok your post makes no sense but I’ll do my best.

I’d be happy with Richmond’s dynasty, and Melbourne came back from two average seasons to win a flag.

Geelong on the other hand, a model of consistency often challenging have made a grand total of one losing grand final since their last flag. Sydney are now a decade without a flag. Both have dropped out of finals. Both are back in contention.

Most teams that win flags have a few disappointments, often including dropping out of the 8, on the way. So you don’t throw the baby out with the bath water off the back of one season.

 

[GetDimmaBack]

After watching a few moments of the game again, two things from me:

Stop messing about with Dunkley. Pay him the big money and give him 5 years.
The bloke shows passion, determination and ticker every week. He's a genuine leader.

Gameplan? The game itself was like watching under 12s who've been told to ''go out and do your best'', with no further instruction. Infuriating.
I've never been a Ross Lyon fan, but I'd love for him to come in as an assistant to teach the side to defend - right across the ground. Would rather watch a 6 goals to 5 arm wrestle than the garbage dished up this week.


Don't know if I'm making much sense ATM. Still pretty angry. Not just with the game, but with the Herb Henderson oversight, too.

 

[Dogs Rule]

Ok your post makes no sense but I’ll do my best.

I’d be happy with Richmond’s dynasty, and Melbourne came back from two average seasons to win a flag.

Geelong on the other hand, a model of consistency often challenging have made a grand total of one losing grand final since their last flag. Sydney are now a decade without a flag. Both have dropped out of finals. Both are back in contention.

Most teams that win flags have a few disappointments, often including dropping out of the 8, on the way. So you don’t throw the baby out with the bath water off the back of one season.

Can't remember Geelong missing finals too often.

Really good sides don't bomb out.