NFL Relocations and League Expansion

[Exe Gesis]

Re: NFL Expansion

The only reason why i was thinking there would be teams relocated out of USA was because of the 'rumored' North American Union, the merging of Canada, USA, and Mexico politically.

As for LA, I'm pretty sure there wont be state money involved. Just the tycoon throwing the money in himself---well, that's what i heard anyway. Cant remember his name, but there was a website about it all, showing an artists impression of the stadium and saying how he'd be funding it all.

Could be wrong, but if that's true, then it would seem to be a greater likelihood of it happening.

 

[JeffDunne]

Re: NFL Expansion

I can definately see LA happening if the right climate exists. However I'm yet to see a proposal that looks at all realistic (I have a feeling the NFL are thinking the same).

IMO LA will happen because a team is forced to move and the NFL are forced to help make it successful.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: NFL Expansion

http://www.stadiumsofnfl.com/future/LAStadium.htm

In April 2008 developer Edward P. Roski Jr., part owner of the Los Angeles Lakers and Kings, announced plans to build a NFL stadium 20 miles east of Los Angeles. This plan calls for a 75,000 seat stadium to be constructed on a 600 acre site at the intersection of the 57 and 60 freeways. No public money would be spent for constructing the $800 million stadium. The cost of construction is $400 million lower than what it would normally cost because two-thirds of the stadium would be built into a hillside, therefore it using less steel and concrete. Construction would not begin until a team agrees to move to Los Angeles. Environmental studies have already been completed at the site allowing for possible construction to begin in Fall 2008 if a team were to commit to moving. Teams that could possibly move include the Minnesota Vikings, New Orleans Saints and the San Diego Chargers. However, no discussions on any team's relocation have been discussed.

The earliest the stadium could open is in Fall 2011. It is designed to seat 75,000 fans and expandable to 80,000 for future Super Bowl games. The stadium would use the latest in environmental technology, creating a new stadium for NFL stadiums. It would feature all the modern amenities that current NFL stadiums have including 11,000 club seats, 175 luxury suites, a team store, restaurant and a NFL attraction. Furthermore, the stadium would be surrounded by retail and offices.

 

[JeffDunne]

Re: NFL Expansion

Fall 2008?

Tell 'em they're dreaming.

Yeah I saw that proposal and the nice fly-by animation they knocked up, but I had my doubts then and with the increases in the price of steal since, I reckon they're gonna need a whole lot of dirt if they are going to build it for that price. There's also lots of other reasons this proposal doesn't make sense but I'm sure you've read them on Raider's forums.

Lots of proposals gg, but not many that really make much sense.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: NFL Expansion

That's a realistic offer/proposal by Roski. As in, he's ready, got the checkbook out ready to go pending a team wanting to agree to move. There has never been an offer like this before. It's always been about trying to get state funding, etc.

This might have legs.

 

[JeffDunne]

Re: NFL Expansion

gg, if their initial proposal was to build it into a hillside so they could afford to build it due to the cost of steel then IMO they are already reaching.

The price of steel could very well have increaded by at least 200% (possibly more) from when this proposal was first costed to when they got the go ahead.

Sure it's an option for a team that might need to relocate but I can't see why any owner would willingly moving to any stadium without some guarantees on a return. Do we even know what sort of income a team could expect by playing at the stadium?

If a team's on the move then I suspect there will be some cities out there that offer more than this proposal . . . unless like I said earlier the NFL want to make it a success.

 

[Randall]

Re: NFL Expansion

Hey guys,

u make some interesting observations here. Raiders to LA? U know, I like it personally. I feel the Oakland Coliseum is no longer big enough, nor adequate, to house an NFL team, and I just feel with San Francisco also in the area, the general Bay Area region is only big enough for one franchise.

Look, just the whole logistics and population and money issues mean LA must have a team, it's just got to happen, the television audience in the LA metro area is just enormous.

As far as two teams go in LA, it didn't work before, and I would be very reluctant to jump into the deep end and put two in there straight away. If one is ultra ultra successful, then maybe consider it, but not for at least 15 years.

Just want the others thoughts on Las Vegas as a potential NFL location? Is it big enough? There have been rumblings, albeit not big, about Vegas possibly hosting a team, and the city did have a team in the XFL. What do you guys think?

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: NFL Expansion

Hey Randall...

Las Vegas I've heard some people talking as a plan c option for the Raiders. Probably just talk, like opinions rather than based on any actual discussions.

And LA...i think the Raiders would be the most plausible team there also because there's a HUGE raider following there. It makes the best marriage of any team to relocate there. I mean, Vikings? No way. If LA is gonna feel they have a team it will be a team that already has the biggest following. I know LA has many people who follow many different teams, like quite a lot, but Raiders are by far the most.

Meanwhile, you have all the stadium negotiations constantly breaking down in Oakland, a city notorious for never shelling money out for their sporting teams. I think Davis himself may be reluctant to relocate a second time after all the damage the first move did, but if in the long-term interests of his franchise, handed to his son after his death, and a capless NFL, then he may already be thinking long-term.

Currently, they're still in talks about finding a new location in Oakland to build a new stadium, and the city offering only to upgrade the existing one. Mention has been made that the Raiders are interested in staying in Alameda but that could always be just talk while he's secretly thinking ahead.

 

[mcgarnacle]

Re: NFL Expansion

Randall, the Bay area is a massive market.......around 7m.......its not just Alameda and San Francisco counties. it extends north through marin, contra costa and solano to sonoma and napa, and through san mateo to santa cruz and santa clara (hence why the niners are considering moving home games there, but they have the same problems re the use of public funds as Oakland....it's not the county, rather the ratepayers themselves who oppose it). even sacramento is considered a market for the two teams.....although for broadcast blackout purposes, it falls out of the 120km range.

Vegas is big enough IMO, bigger than some other markets already in existence and growing. i dont think the culture of the town is condusive to football tho. Not yet anyway.

G, the A's vacating the colesium is a huge development IMO. I'm sure this has always been somewhat of an insurance policy for the city, but with the Raiders now becoming the only tenant, and still such an important part of the fabric of Oakland (despite their successes in the city, the A's, as with baseball in general just didnt really cut it with most of the African American population), it may put a rocket up the bum of councilors to do something. mind you, it still won't appease ratepayers who would rather see the money put into other areas such as policing, and other initiatives to rid the city crime.

 

[Randall]

Re: NFL Expansion

Randall, the Bay area is a massive market.......around 7m.......its not just Alameda and San Francisco counties. it extends north through marin, contra costa and solano to sonoma and napa, and through san mateo to santa cruz and santa clara (hence why the niners are considering moving home games there, but they have the same problems re the use of public funds as Oakland....it's not the county, rather the ratepayers themselves who oppose it). even sacramento is considered a market for the two teams.....although for broadcast blackout purposes, it falls out of the 120km range.

Hey mcgarnacle,

thanks for correcting me regarding the Bay Area. I had no idea the metro population was that big. Bearing this in mind, then I'd agree with you, there is the population there to sustain two NFL franchises.

Interesting you mention Sacramento. SEN's Steve Salisbury grew up in Sacramento, and attended Niners home games, so they probably should be considered a part of the broadcast area. That's just my opinion on that one.

Vegas is an interesting one, I mean yeah the population is there, but u make a good point regarding the culture of Vegas. The population is very transient, it's filled with people just there to visit. The NBA seems pretty keen to get a franchise there at some stage, but you don't need humongous numbers at games and watching on TV to make an NBA franchise financially viable.

I'd love to hear if anyone out there thinks Vegas could work for the NFL, and if so, why? Cheers.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: NFL Expansion

SEN's Steve Salisbury is a regular contributor on this forum, btw.
Goes under the name sjsds i think.

 

[JeffDunne]

Re: NFL Expansion

I think it's worth noting the cost blowouts on the stadiums in Dallas & New York ATM and the impact that's having on ticket prices.

The climate in the short-term doesn't look favourable for new stadiums and the like.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: NFL Expansion

Every team's hankering for a new stadium so they can get the Superbowl rights and therefore tourism, sponsorships and other corporate packages.

 

[mcgarnacle]

Re: NFL Expansion

sacramento is just outside the 75mi (120km) radius, Randall. mind you, you could be right about sacramento being included in the blackout zone.......perhaps Steve could clarify it for us. it prolly doesnt affect the raiders as they regularly sell-out their games at the coliseum. on the other hand, the niners struggle these days, particularly when the team isnt performing. archaic stadium designed as a multiple-purpose venue (so was the Coliseum tho), howling winds off the bay, not the greatest neighbourhood of the city to go through either.......the whole joint is prolly the worst place to go to when the team is losing. its understandable why the Yorks want out of there.....not that they've accomplished much else since taking over.

if your interested, you can have a read of the general NFL Broadcast Policies here (courtesy of wikipedia).

but yes, the Bay area is a big market.

 

[Randall]

Re: NFL Expansion

Hey all,

some great points being made. Yes gg, I knew Steve from SEN was on these boards. He's a great NFL fan, and fingers crossed Channel 10 HD pick both him and Ed Wyatt up for their NFL broadcasts for the upcoming season.

Look, great point about the cost blowouts on new stadiums in New Jersey and Texas. But I've got one for u guys: Why would the New York metro area build a new stadium without a roof? The NFL has a clearly-stated policy that a cold-weather city must have a roof if it wants to host a Super Bowl.

I mean I, personally, was shattered when West Side Stadium didn't get up in Manhattan. I felt this provided a sensational opportunity for my beloved New York to host the biggest game on the calendar. But, having said this, I don't live in Manhattan, so u gotta consider what the people that live there want before u consider what others want.

Thanks for that Wikipedia link mcgarnacle, I appreciate it. Look, just to make myself known a bit to u guys, I'm hoping to help out the guys a bit on SEN's "Born In The USA" Sunday night show.

I don't know anywhere near the amount of NFL stuff that you guys do, so any help would be of great value. Keep on posting great stuff, and I appreciate you guys teaching me more and more about the whole NFL set-up.

I'm unsure when I'll be appearing on "Born In The USA", but I hope it is sometime soon. If and when I do get on, I'd love to hear from anyone on these boards, either text or phone-in, on what you think on all matters related to NFL.

Cheers all.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: NFL Expansion

I'm hoping to help out the guys a bit on SEN's "Born In The USA" Sunday night show.

so any help would be of great value.

The Raiders are the greatest franchise in American sporting history, Al Davis is a god. Be sure to help Ed and Steve acknowledge this.

But really, not sure what extent you're helping them out---providing commentary, stats, or meaty stories for them to argue about---so let us know that, or ask something specifically, and we'll give some ideas. Trawl thru the threads and there's sure to be something there that might spark an idea too.

 

[Galactic]

Re: NFL Expansion

The Raiders are the greatest franchise in American sporting history, Al Davis is a god. Be sure to help Ed and Steve acknowledge this.

Green Bay?Cowboys?Yankees? Celtics?Lakers?.............Red Sox (not basing that one on success just history)

 

[JeffDunne]

Re: NFL Expansion

Timely article: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/news/story?id=3472902

 

[Woodson]

Re: NFL Expansion

Pleased to read the Bills are getting a leg up and Goodell is talking positive about the long term future in the upstate NY region.

The 'Sota boys are under the gun through.. with a change of local government, I wouldn't be surprised if they get their new stadium at the ratepayers expense.. especially when the Governer's surname is Pawlenty !

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: NFL Expansion

[youtube]okDV5rHbozU[/youtube]

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: NFL Expansion

Some talk relating to the Chargers re: LA.
Roski and Spanos ties, etc.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/sports/canepa/20080701-9999-1s1canepa.html





.

 

[Randall]

Re: NFL Expansion

---providing commentary, stats, or meaty stories for them to argue about---so let us know that, or ask something specifically, and we'll give some ideas. Trawl thru the threads and there's sure to be something there that might spark an idea too.

G'day gg and everyone,

sorry for the lateness in replying to this message. All of the above sorts of things, I'll be touching on at various stages. Because the show is based around all major American sports, not just football, I cannot just stick with football. But anything people on here would like discussed on the program, I'll have a think about, for sure. Hope everyone's well, and I'm pumped for a big season.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: NFL Expansion

We'll see what we can do for you. Think-tank, brainstorm.

 

[SriLankanCat]

Re: NFL Expansion

I def think that the NFL will expand. LA will def have a team, Canada certainly should and mexico...the fourth team is interesting. San Antonio is def a huge market.

All i care is that the Saints stay in New Orleans! JD what do u think the odds are of the Saints staying New Orleans or at least Louisana.

I have said before that renaming the team Louisana Saints would be a great idea...

 

[JeffDunne]

Re: NFL Expansion

The Saints are looking safer by the year SLC.

Benson has pretty much handed the running of the Saints over to his grand-daughter Rita LeBlanc and she seems very bullish on the Saints staying in NO (although she's also a much better PR analyst than her grand-father)

The state seems keen to work out a deal, the Superdome management are buying properties around the dome and Benson has bought the local Fox station (which not so co-incidently shows Saints games).

I'd be very surprised if the Saints moved soon.

IMO the Jags and the Chargers are the most likely. Vikings an outside chance.


Buffalo will become the Hawthorn of the NFL playing home games in Canada.