Rewarding Mediocrity

Remove this Banner Ad

scottywiper said:
It is almost sad watching Jack at the moment, he's been smashed by injury and can't even do the simple things. If he is to play it should be mainly as a forward, or maybe we just worry about getting him right for 2015.
Patch should just play as sub.
Basti is one bloke who needs a wake-up call.
Black hit rock bottom last night...
Click to expand...

Yep, agree. Jack looks like a 2nd rate player atm and it is hurting him and the team immensely.

Patch seems to play a better Q and a half than full game so i would contemplate making him the permanent sub until he really tears it up

The last 2 need to disappear to the 2's for an extended run with 3-4 right behind them
 
Robertsonroo said:
Not trying to defend individuals or the Club, but:

If our side had full available numbers we would have
Grima and Tippett and Delaney and Mullett in defence, Wells and MacMillan across the centre, Harper (?) and Garner and Nahas roaming the forward line......that's NINE changes we could consider each week, but instead we have to play half-timers like Anthony, Jacobs, Adams, McKenzie etc.
Sometimes our hands are tied.
Throw out the under-achieves from the Carlton game and we would need more than NINE !
Click to expand...

Grima, Wells, MacMillan I'll give you. That's 3.

Tippett has played less than 5 games for us coming off the rookie list iirc.

Cam Delaney must be less than 10 career games.

Harper hasn't shown enough consistency to be considered a loss from the senior side.

Garner has played 2 games and is far from a sure thing yet.

Mullett was omitted.

Nahas was being dropped after wins earlier in the season so the club can't bemoan his unavailability now.

I really don't think we have the excuses on the injury front some claim we do. Every other club has injured and underdone players too.
 
King Corey said:
Grima, Wells, MacMillan I'll give you. That's 3.

Tippett has played less than 5 games for us coming off the rookie list iirc.

Cam Delaney must be less than 10 career games.

Harper hasn't shown enough consistency to be considered a loss from the senior side.

Garner has played 2 games and is far from a sure thing yet.

Mullett was omitted.

Nahas was being dropped after wins earlier in the season so the club can't bemoan his unavailability now.

I really don't think we have the excuses on the injury front some claim we do. Every other club has injured and underdone players too.
Click to expand...
King Corey said:
Grima, Wells, MacMillan I'll give you. That's 3.

Tippett has played less than 5 games for us coming off the rookie list iirc.

Cam Delaney must be less than 10 career games.

Harper hasn't shown enough consistency to be considered a loss from the senior side.

Garner has played 2 games and is far from a sure thing yet.

Mullett was omitted.

Nahas was being dropped after wins earlier in the season so the club can't bemoan his unavailability now.

I really don't think we have the excuses on the injury front some claim we do. Every other club has injured and underdone players too.
Click to expand...

The problem from an injury point of view has been that we have not had the players available fit or in form in the 2's to promote. Tarrant's unavailability hurt us early as had he been playing and playing reasonably, Aaron Black would have been dropped earlier in the year, if only to give Wood his chance. Then when patience must have been wearing thin, Wood was injured and shortly after Black had a pretty good game against Hawthorn.

Harper is a major disappointment. Has just not shown anything much at Werribee, yet some good showings would have put some pressure on some in the 1's to perform or be demoted.

I think the loss of JMac has hurt us much more than we might have imagined. Is regarded as a leader and we certainly need some leadership.

The two biggest losses however have been Wellsy and Narni. A fit Narni on Friday night, might just have quelled either Waite or Henderson a little.

By the way Waite was playing for his career on Friday night. Probably did enough to save it but gee, I expect him to, before the end of the year, have any of a brain fade and get suspended, play a shocker or combine the both into one "quality" game.

People have gone nuts about how good he is after Friday night and are even suggesting he would be a good pick up for Geelong for next year. Why would they want to pick him up?
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Horace said:
The problem from an injury point of view has been that we have not had the players available fit or in form in the 2's to promote. Tarrant's unavailability hurt us early as had he been playing and playing reasonably, Aaron Black would have been dropped earlier in the year, if only to give Wood his chance. Then when patience must have been wearing thin, Wood was injured and shortly after Black had a pretty good game against Hawthorn.

Harper is a major disappointment. Has just not shown anything much at Werribee, yet some good showings would have put some pressure on some in the 1's to perform or be demoted.

I think the loss of JMac has hurt us much more than we might have imagined. Is regarded as a leader and we certainly need some leadership.

?
Click to expand...

JMac as well looked like he was taking that next step...his form was excellent in those early games.
 
At no point have I looked at our 22 and thought "we can't get the job done". Injuries are an excuse for weak clubs. Top four clubs just get on with it.

I'd hazard a guess that Freo and Hawthorn have had more injuries to key players than any club over the past 2-3 seasons. The difference is the blokes who come in are playing for limited spots and thus while there might be a drop off in quality, there certainly isn't one in endeavour.
 
I watched the Ess v Bulldogs game earlier. The fanatical way the players from both sides went about trying to win made me very, very envious (and angry again).
 
DarwinRoo said:
It's simple. It's about attitude and work rate. I don't believe for a second that the team we put on the ground last night is as bad as that. They are all skilled, fit footballers. It's the distinct lack of self motivation that annoys the **** out of me
Click to expand...
This post should be made into it's own thread and stickied at the top of this board to remind everyone that no; the guys who are 'gifted' games are NOT bad footballers. And in every one one of our great wins this year (of that there have been quite a few) people have sang the praises of these players. How often do you hear after a win, "oh it's so hard to pick the best on ground, everyone played so well, it was a team effort!". And yet the week after (usually) there's some kind of amnesia around this board, and the footy media in general, attacking specific players, calling them duds. Now I'm for not minute excusing the performances that certain players have dished up time and time again this year, I agree, it's not good enough. But to make 8-9 changes, bring in your Anthony's, Dumonts even Kieren f***ing Harper who hasn't impacted a game of footy VFL or AFL for about 2 years is ridiculous. It's a shame there isn't more competition for spots, and the reason for that is because every player that could put pressure on the team is injured this year, but as DarwinRoo said, it's all mental with these guys. They are skillfull, fit footballers, and we know that because they've shown how good they can be when they apply themselves. It just has to be more often.
 
Last edited:
LB2Snake said:
Good post. And what's your opinion of wtf they fail to self motivate.
Click to expand...

I'm guessing that's why the **** as opposed to what the **** and the honest answer is I don't know because I can't speak for the players and what drives them.

Most people know I was in the military for almost a decade. Dickhead didn't hold on for long service. And at the end of basic training is what's called the challenge. Now people have done it before and after me so it's not like climbing Everest or anything like that but at the time it was the most physically and mentally exhausting thing I've ever done in my life. The only way I got through it was that i just kept going. The Dorie effect of just keep swimming I guess is one way of putting it.

I just don't understand how they can see Hawthorn on the fixture and just work hard and to the structures from go to woe and then the next two weeks put in token efforts.

The greatest in any sport drive themselves. Yes they will get the occasional kick up the arse or critique of performance but largely they are the best because they want to be the best.

Our players must want to be the best and therefore make the team the best.
 
DarwinRoo said:
I'm guessing that's why the **** as opposed to what the **** and the honest answer is I don't know because I can't speak for the players and what drives them.

Most people know I was in the military for almost a decade. Dickhead didn't hold on for long service. And at the end of basic training is what's called the challenge. Now people have done it before and after me so it's not like climbing Everest or anything like that but at the time it was the most physically and mentally exhausting thing I've ever done in my life. The only way I got through it was that i just kept going. The Dorie effect of just keep swimming I guess is one way of putting it.

I just don't understand how they can see Hawthorn on the fixture and just work hard and to the structures from go to woe and then the next two weeks put in token efforts.

The greatest in any sport drive themselves. Yes they will get the occasional kick up the arse or critique of performance but largely they are the best because they want to be the best.

Our players must want to be the best and therefore make the team the best.
Click to expand...
Yep it was most definitely a "why" DarwinRoo. Re your answer, or thoughts, surely there is a question mark on who's running the whole collective group....so coaching structure and or leadership? We are starved of strength in both these areas, for some ridiculous reason. Why don't they self motivate? I find myself internally screaming when I hear spitta and brad speak about "hopefully" and "probably" and "mystery".
Good leaders lead, they don't guide. Fine line between arrogance and frailty, but you ain't supposed to show the world how close you are to not being sure. Something isn't right at Arden st IMO.
 
Leaders got to lead. It starts at the top. Not sure if I've mentioned this before. :stern look
 
Horace said:
I think the loss of JMac has hurt us much more than we might have imagined. Is regarded as a leader and we certainly need some leadership.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't worry about JMac; he's to focussed on his career as a pirate :sternlook
 
Zondor said:
Leaders got to lead. It starts at the top. Not sure if I've mentioned this before. :stern look
Click to expand...
And this is the WHOLE problem. As much as I love the way Andrew Swallow goes about work rate, he is much too quiet to be the captain. I know too nice doesn't cut it but I think you know what I mean. We need someone who will grab a bloke by the jumper and yell at him if he does something wrong, point out what it is and get his buy in to it. Same with the coach - not tough enough. Happy with the softly softly approach and its not working. Big games YES definitely he can get them up but when we are thought to be likely winners we fall to pieces. The analogy I have heard all weekend is that we can hunt but don't like being the hunted. I think this sums it up precisely and all good teams can do both. You don't seethe Swans , Hawks or Cats fail against the lower teams most of the time, yes they might have a bad game once in a while but no where as consistently as us and until we get that out of our game we wont progress further up the ladder.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

As supporters, all we want is to see a 100% effort given by the players each week. If we give 100% and get beaten by a better team, so be it.

If we give less than 100% and get beaten, that is unacceptable. Unfortunately this has happened way to often this year.

I'd like Brad Scott to sit the players down and show them the 3rd quarter against Hawthorn. Then show them the last quarter against Carlton. Two weeks apart, virtually the same team, polar opposites in effort. Why?

This is what gets us angry, this is why we call for changes, this is why it appears we are accepting mediocrity at the club.
 
Devil Fish said:
We've done it all year - under-performing guys like Black, Adams, Bastinac, Wright, Goldy, Ziebell etc. have been gifted game after game despite very mediocre performances. We've handed out 2 year contracts to guys in their 4th, 5th and 6th seasons who still have not shown they can play 3 good games a month.
So really, is it any surprise we are so inconsistent when mediocrity is so richly rewarded at Arden St? Probably not.
Time to grow some balls BS and make a statement. But I can see it now - changes vs Geel:
Out - McMahon, Jacobs
In - Anthony, MacKenzie
Yep, that'll send a message to the group.
Click to expand...

It should be our motto, can we get it under the Kangaroo emblem? Google translate says in Latin it is...
si sciens fallo, honos

The problem is we are just shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic when we keep swapping mediocre out for mediocre in. What you need to do is mediocre out, unknown young kid in.

Ben Brown was a change forced by... injury more than anything.

We could push Black out and give Wood a crack.

We could push any number of mediocre mids out and give someone like Dumont a crack.

We could give Harper a crack as a half forward instead of Adams.

We are just turning over one mediocre mid for another most of the time.
 
The most dissapointing thing about these losses is the players are well aware of the implications of the loss. So when things are going against the grain - really noone stands up - so its definately a leadership thing.

Selection has to also be questioned - how does McMahon, Wright, Firrito ever start in the same backline let alone the same team. Are these guys f..... in the head.

I dont think getting rid of Brad will solve anything - what needs to be done is a complete shift in handing out games to under perfroming players - there comfortable.

Ross Lyon dropped Nick Dal Santo

Geelong almost traded Stevie J

North Melb....... well they will just be happy to make the 8. Time will tell - but the time for statements is well overdue..swallow needs a kick up the ass - you lead these guys yet take no responsibility - stand up and demand more of your playing group.

Leadership is the problem - dont get me wrong there are other issues - but this is number 1.
 
Joey7 said:
The most dissapointing thing about these losses is the players are well aware of the implications of the loss. So when things are going against the grain - really noone stands up - so its definately a leadership thing.

Selection has to also be questioned - how does McMahon, Wright, Firrito ever start in the same backline let alone the same team. Are these guys f..... in the head.

I dont think getting rid of Brad will solve anything - what needs to be done is a complete shift in handing out games to under perfroming players - there comfortable.

Ross Lyon dropped Nick Dal Santo

Geelong almost traded Stevie J

North Melb....... well they will just be happy to make the 8. Time will tell - but the time for statements is well overdue..swallow needs a kick up the ass - you lead these guys yet take no responsibility - stand up and demand more of your playing group.

Leadership is the problem - dont get me wrong there are other issues - but this is number 1.
Click to expand...
Who do you want in the team that is not playing?? All I see is Dumont and Wood who both need more time and will not add anything to the playing group.
 
Wild Bill said:
Who do you want in the team that is not playing?? All I see is Dumont and Wood who both need more time and will not add anything to the playing group.
Click to expand...

True, there's is constant noise on here about blokes being gifted games, but if you look at who is available for selection from our 2s all you find are a bunch of green rookies like Mcguinness, Warren, Turner, Wilkins, Wallace. Then you have blokes like Mullet, Mckenzie and Anthony who have stunk it up big time when they're been given a chance in the seniors. That leaves Harper, who can't get a kick and Dumont and Wood.

Now, both of these blokes have been unlucky because they've both suffered injuries just as they look likely to debut. They deserve their shot, but if selected they aren't suddenly going to make us a 4 goal better team.

How many debtautants come in an influence games from the get go? Not many.
 
I think over the years, mediocrity has been rewarded.

Especially when there has been blokes performing in the VFL that have not been given the same chance others have. Sometimes too, these guys would probably step up, but we would never know.

Never know until you try!!
 
Gasometer said:
Its not the whinging that is the issue...its the blow ins to the Board that don't post anything else except for after a loss...that is the issue...
Click to expand...

Me, I love 'North' supporters who feed the trolls on the main board by starting their own version of 'North are shit, let me count the ways'.

They will be the first ones doing high fives if this group go deep into September; they will say, 'See BS should have listened to us years ago'.

I am not saying there are not problems, but **** me this board is fickle.
 
floss_7 said:
I think over the years, mediocrity has been rewarded.

Especially when there has been blokes performing in the VFL that have not been given the same chance others have. Sometimes too, these guys would probably step up, but we would never know.

Never know until you try!!
Click to expand...
Like who? We have give games to players who did well in the twos - Anthony will nearly win the VFL Brownlow this year. Our depth is weak - especially when replacing a Wells.
 
Great posts DR!

You should put the pom poms down and tell stories more often that was wonderful, should have added a "what would Stevo have done" or something for a bit of a kicker, but I really enjoyed you opening up.

Kudos.
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Rewarding Mediocrity

Remove this Banner Ad

Back
Top