Preview Round 1 team

[numbwombat]

That's a very young and raw half back flank duo. Maybe one or the other for me

Yeah, I'd have to swap either Menzel or T. Hunt (probably Menzel) for Wojo's spot in the centre.

And one of Ottens or West should be spending a lot of time resting up forward, and while neither are that reliable up there I think they're good enough options to take some heat off Hawkins that Lonergan isn't necessary. Would much prefer either Mackie or Milburn in his spot.

(Though I guess Milburn might not provide enough run for a sub??)

 

[Pure_Ownage]

CE, Ling won't play. Due to the hammy (and then setback) he has missed weeks of running. Not ready.

By contrast, both Pods and Varcoe have injuries that haven't limited their conditioning, yes they lack match practice but they are running and doing heaps of trackwork. If they get medical clearance, they'll play.

As for the ruck, West has shown enough form (by all reports very good again last week) for that spot. Hawkins must be settled at FF, particularly if we have no Pods to kick to (for one week only, with Mooney more than likely out too).

 

[vinum coupe]

That's a very young and raw half back flank duo. Maybe one or the other for me

To be honest I thought either Wojo, Kelly, or Corey could probably jump into the Menzel position.
I'd actually like to see Menzel freed up on the wing.

 

[catempire]

CE, Ling won't play. Due to the hammy (and then setback) he has missed weeks of running. Not ready.

By contrast, both Pods and Varcoe have injuries that haven't limited their conditioning, yes they lack match practice but they are running and doing heaps of trackwork. If they get medical clearance, they'll play.

My bad, Hogan in for Ling then.

The last thing I read about Pods was that he would be touch and go for round 1 (e.g. See this morning's Addy).

And Varcoe will not have had a competitive match all pre-season. I can't see the need to rush him in for round 1.

I see Byrnes is also in doubt which may open the door for Menzel (Motlop will be out for a few weeks, it says).

 

[vinum coupe]

Your team looks much stronger than mine CE.
I'm probably putting too much emphasis on including youth. And maybe you're not giving enough.

 

[BIGANT]

While there is a rush too have all of Pods, Ling, Varcoe & Mooney available for round 1...maybe two of those mentioned would be more feasible for the saints clash. Yes, we would like too start the season of well (early wins on the board are a key for all teams) and whilst the pressure is somewhat off us premiership wise, a new coach & a tinkered game plan may take the first half of the season to adjust.
And with clear heads wrapped around the new game plan and in sync...the second half of the season might have to watch out for a revitalised cats line-up pushing a top 4 position and a big confidence boost for a finals assault. Is that wishful thinking, or could very well happen if things fall in place !?

 

[Farmer2Goggin]

CE, Ling won't play. Due to the hammy (and then setback) he has missed weeks of running. Not ready.

By contrast, both Pods and Varcoe have injuries that haven't limited their conditioning, yes they lack match practice but they are running and doing heaps of trackwork. If they get medical clearance, they'll play.

.

100% agree PO.
Particularly Varcoe - we saw a similar situation this season when he injured the thumb and missed the early part of the season. IIRC he came back and really tore it up with no match preparation after the Freo praccy.
Really looking forward to seeing Travis back in the side.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

My bad, Hogan in for Ling then.

The last thing I read about Pods was that he would be touch and go for round 1 (e.g. See this morning's Addy).

And Varcoe will not have had a competitive match all pre-season. I can't see the need to rush him in for round 1.

I see Byrnes is also in doubt which may open the door for Menzel (Motlop will be out for a few weeks, it says).

I'm not saying Pods or Varcoe definitely will play (they may both not, although Varcoe's had nearly 5 months which should be enough), what I am saying is that fitness (aside from match fitness) is no issue, if their surgeons clear them to play, they'll play. Whereas with Ling, even if the doctor says he's fine, will have missed so much running that I can't see him playing (especially with only 3 on the bench now), I'm pencilling him in for the first home game as he'll need that extra couple of weeks to build up fitness.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Look, he has been far more beneficial for the team down back.
Not an attacking backman what so ever. And to be truthful I am not that happy to see him getting the ball in traffic. But he is reliable.

And he is a serviceable forward. He can take a grab, and for some strange reason he looks a lot better amongst traffic at that end of the ground.

If he was out and Milburn was in that would probably mean West has to go forward. I don't think that will work if he is one out down there.

Running into the forward line to provide an additional target. Yes. But not as a sole target.

We'll find out pretty soon I guess !!

I should also add that when I was structuring the Round 1 team I was actually trying to build a team that could stick together for most of the year.

Oh crap I just realised I don't have Hogan in.
And god knows who I'd drop to put Ling and Pods in.

I see your point, and Lonners is ok forward, but he can't ruck (and Hawk shouldnt). So if he goes forward you're playing three talls (Hawk, Lonners, West) and I think we're better off playing West instead, and going smaller when West is in the ruck (circa round 12 last year, with Bartel et al forward). Not saying West is a better forward than Lonners but it gives us more run.

Happy for Lonners to play if St Kilda have three tall forwards, but since they won't have enough fit talls for that, he may have to miss out.

Milburn could work in the sense that he can take Vegas (who will effectively play FF most of the time I suspect) for periods which means you can shift Scarlo onto Riewoldt when you want Taylor to have a rest. Unlucky for Lonners, but probably better.

 

[catempire]

I'm not saying Pods or Varcoe definitely will play (they may both not, although Varcoe's had nearly 5 months which should be enough), what I am saying is that fitness (aside from match fitness) is no issue, if their surgeons clear them to play, they'll play. Whereas with Ling, even if the doctor says he's fine, will have missed so much running that I can't see him playing (especially with only 3 on the bench now), I'm pencilling him in for the first home game as he'll need that extra couple of weeks to build up fitness.

I conceded the point about Ling.

I think what I said was that Varcoe and Pods were left out due to injury or lack of match conditioning. The injury bit was to apply to Pods (obviously, a hand injury doesn't hamper fitness) and the match conditioning bit was to apply to Varcoe.

Note also, that "fitness" and "match conditioning" are two quite different things. Varcoe may well have the former but is quite likely to lack the latter.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

I conceded the point about Ling.

I think what I said was that Varcoe and Pods were left out due to injury or lack of match conditioning. The injury bit was to apply to Pods (obviously, a hand injury doesn't hamper fitness) and the match conditioning bit was to apply to Varcoe.

Note also, that "fitness" and "match conditioning" are two quite different things. Varcoe may well have the former but is quite likely to lack the latter.

Ah, thanks for the clarification.

Agree with you then.

 

[nohairandfair]

Chappies groin issue looks like it may delay his start to the season.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/blogarticlestandard/tabid/15692/newsid/108993/default.aspx

 

[AM]

My bad, Hogan in for Ling then.

The last thing I read about Pods was that he would be touch and go for round 1 (e.g. See this morning's Addy).

And Varcoe will not have had a competitive match all pre-season. I can't see the need to rush him in for round 1.

I see Byrnes is also in doubt which may open the door for Menzel (Motlop will be out for a few weeks, it says).

You certainly pick and stick, CE.

 

[maxy87]

Hawkins spent a little bit of time in the ruck vs Port so I think we'll see him provide some support there despite peoples wishes. Has Ottens really shown enough to command the 1st Ruck spot? I think he might need more time and thus West or Blake will take first ruck. If Otto plays then West will either provide support while resting in a KP spot or take up a spot on the pine. Not sure if I rate that setup to be honest unless Westy plays at FF and the Hawk at CHF, pushing up the ground to link up in the middle.

Really like the idea of Ling (if fit) playing as the defensive forward, clinging to a rebounding defender (gwilt maybe) and being an absolute pain in the backside all night. Kelly or Corey could do this well. It would have up be an experienced player.

Wojak and Varcoe on either wing is orgasmic... Maybe chuck in Stokes and Duncan to that setup too.

Agree we shouldn't go too tall in defence. Taylor and Scarlo is enough for R1, sorry Lonners. Hunt and Enright have the pockets, T Hunt one flank leaving Mackie and Milburn to fight it out. Other things being equal, I'd give it to dasher.

Menzel on the pine or as a sun and/or Mackie in this role.

So many decisions I just end up sprouting dribble sorry guys

 

[you pick one]

Hawkins spent a little bit of time in the ruck vs Port so I think we'll see him provide some support there despite peoples wishes. Has Ottens really shown enough to command the 1st Ruck spot? I think he might need more time and thus West or Blake will take first ruck. If Otto plays then West will either provide support while resting in a KP spot or take up a spot on the pine. Not sure if I rate that setup to be honest unless Westy plays at FF and the Hawk at CHF, pushing up the ground to link up in the middle.

Really like the idea of Ling (if fit) playing as the defensive forward, clinging to a rebounding defender (gwilt maybe) and being an absolute pain in the backside all night. Kelly or Corey could do this well. It would have up be an experienced player.

Wojak and Varcoe on either wing is orgasmic... Maybe chuck in Stokes and Duncan to that setup too.

Agree we shouldn't go too tall in defence. Taylor and Scarlo is enough for R1, sorry Lonners. Hunt and Enright have the pockets, T Hunt one flank leaving Mackie and Milburn to fight it out. Other things being equal, I'd give it to dasher.

Menzel on the pine or as a sun and/or Mackie in this role.

So many decisions I just end up sprouting dribble sorry guys

WHAT! not content to just give them Ablett .

 

[vinum coupe]

(Though I guess Milburn might not provide enough run for a sub??)

One of my early suggestions was to use Corey as a sub. But I agree that if he is fully fit then he is wasted as a sub.

But I do think someone like a Milburn would work.

If you're in a bit of strife early in the 3rd (not due to an injury) it would be advantageous to bring someone in who has the experience to do a role.

They may go for a kid as sub, but I'd be a bit more crafty.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Hawkins spent a little bit of time in the ruck vs Port so I think we'll see him provide some support there despite peoples wishes. Has Ottens really shown enough to command the 1st Ruck spot? I think he might need more time and thus West or Blake will take first ruck. If Otto plays then West will either provide support while resting in a KP spot or take up a spot on the pine. Not sure if I rate that setup to be honest unless Westy plays at FF and the Hawk at CHF, pushing up the ground to link up in the middle.

Really like the idea of Ling (if fit) playing as the defensive forward, clinging to a rebounding defender (gwilt maybe) and being an absolute pain in the backside all night. Kelly or Corey could do this well. It would have up be an experienced player.

Wojak and Varcoe on either wing is orgasmic... Maybe chuck in Stokes and Duncan to that setup too.

Agree we shouldn't go too tall in defence. Taylor and Scarlo is enough for R1, sorry Lonners. Hunt and Enright have the pockets, T Hunt one flank leaving Mackie and Milburn to fight it out. Other things being equal, I'd give it to dasher.

Menzel on the pine or as a sun and/or Mackie in this role.

So many decisions I just end up sprouting dribble sorry guys

Can't have ruckmen on the pine with the new rule.

And West is a second ruck not a first ruck, and Blake probably can't play under said rule.

I suppose Hawkins could ruck but without either Mooney or Pods he really needs to be forward don't you think? Not sure if Hawk has the motor to play high though which is where we will really miss Pods.

The real debate is whether we play a third tall forward along with West and Hawkins. I say no, West and Hawkins along with Otto, and Scarlo and Taylor with no Lonners down back. Try and run the Saints off their feet.

Put Menzel in the 18 if Chappy is not fit.

The real issue is over the sub IMO. I would have picked Motlop if fit, but now he's injured, I have no idea. Maybe Mackie or Milburn would be a reasonable idea. Or like for like and Byrnes instead of Motlop.

 

[maxy87]

Yeah I know what you mean about having ruckmen on the pine with the new rule. I wasn't really thinking about that. Snowshoe easy it is to miss something when trying to figure out a team. Still, can see it happening.

Motlop would make a good sub in a sense that he is the wholly goal sneak that probably wouldn't be necessary to run out an entire game. It would kind of be like the sub in soccer that comes on late to strike. However, I saw him in the flesh for the first time at AAMI last week and he was like a little boy, literally. I can see how he gets knocked around (Round 2 last year which messed his shoulder up). He is obviously very skilled but do you really think he's ready to play out a game amongst the big boys? The more experienced players would need to protect him a bit and make sure he's in the right position to use his skills without being crunched.

I know you've mentioned Brown in the same category PO but he's 6 feet 5 and is slightly heavier. Still, he's as fragile as porcelain doll at the moment!

In this case, yes I can see Menzel being of use as a versatile sub. Looks like he's a bit stronger too.

As far as ricks go, I can only comment on what I've seen as I missed the first NAB Cup match and didn't see much of the Saints game. From what I saw last week, Westy is the choice I'd make. He matches Blake physically, offers more around the ground and just looked to be trying really hard to offer something more than just ruck work which was very pleasing. Blakes blunder in the goalsquare was so abysmal I actually found it amusing

 

[David the Cat]

One of my early suggestions was to use Corey as a sub. But I agree that if he is fully fit then he is wasted as a sub.

But I do think someone like a Milburn would work.

If you're in a bit of strife early in the 3rd (not due to an injury) it would be advantageous to bring someone in who has the experience to do a role.

They may go for a kid as sub, but I'd be a bit more crafty.

Dasher as a sub just might work vc...he is very capable of picking up a lazy 15 possessions in a quarter, and when he's fresh while others a little fatigued it could be a masterstroke...we will wait and see.

 

[year of the cat]

My team for round one:


B: Kelly Scarlett Mackie
HB: Enright Taylor T.Hunt
C: Duncan Corey Varcoe
HF: Chapman Hawkins Johnson
F: Byrnes Mooney Stokes

R: Ottens Selwood Bartel

INT: West, Wojcinski, Menzel

SUB: Milburn

If Chappy doesn't come up then J.Hunt comes in.

A mixture of experience with the injection of some youth. Stokes gets a game off the back of some useful pre-season form. West is the no.2 ruckman for now. D.Simpson comes in for Ottens when he gets injured. Concerned about Milburn's lack of pace being exposed on the MCG, hence him being named as the sub rather than in the 21. Lonergan was considered here but with Kosi out for the Saints we probably don't need the extra tall.

Want to see Kelly play back for now - we have been exploited by small forwards regularly for a little while now - I think we need his experience, poise and hardness down back.

Hawkins has 6 weeks to cement his place. Pods will come in off the back of a decent VFL form for either him or Mooney. Brown to come in at some stage as a "third tall" rather than being expected just yet to play as a KPF.

I think this team has a bit of zip and could trouble the saints for pace.

 

[Turbocat]

The Rucks is the key area debate and it probably deserves it own thread in a way.

I'm of the opinion that Otten's is done but I also acknowledge he is on 96 games for the Cats , just like Blake is on 99. It would be crazy not ensure both get to the 100 for FS options in years to come.

As I see it atm , we look like seeing 6 guys in the ruck at different time this year but for Rd 1 I'd go with Ottens and West. Why?

If Ottens fit , we better play while he is he is. West should almost play every week because Simpson and Vardy both look to have substantial upside and we need to know his worth at years end. This may come at the cost of Mooney,Pods or Hawkins at times but we must find a way to play him.

 

[year of the cat]

The Rucks is the key area debate and it probably deserves it own thread in a way.

I'm of the opinion that Otten's is done but I also acknowledge he is on 96 games for the Cats , just like Blake is on 99. It would be crazy not ensure both get to the 100 for FS options in years to come.

As I see it atm , we look like seeing 6 guys in the ruck at different time this year but for Rd 1 I'd go with Ottens and West. Why?

If Ottens fit , we better play while he is he is. West should almost play every week because Simpson and Vardy both look to have substantial upside and we need to know his worth at years end. This may come at the cost of Mooney,Pods or Hawkins at times but we must find a way to play him.

I'm of the opinion that we can't play both Ottens and D.Simpson in the same team. We need at least one of our ruckman to have a bit of mobility. So combinations of Ottens/West, Ottens/Vardy, D.Simpson/West, D.Simpson/Vardy are the only ones I would consider.

 

[rooke33]

My team for round one:


B: Kelly Scarlett Mackie
HB: Enright Taylor T.Hunt
C: Duncan Corey Varcoe
HF: Chapman Hawkins Johnson
F: Byrnes Mooney Stokes

R: Ottens Selwood Bartel

INT: West, Wojcinski, Menzel

SUB: Milburn

quote]


Could see Brown replacing West on the bench and Hawkins as second ruck. Will be interesting to see what we do with the ruck situation this year. Personally I can't see Brown getting a run if Hawkins, Mooney and Pods are in the side so I would like to see what he can do before Pods comes back.

Where do people think Hogan is at? I thought his prospects would have improved after Ablett left and now Ling is injured even more so however since playing in the two shortend round 1 nab hit outs where I thought he played ok he has only played in one other preseason game.

 

[costanza23]

I'm of the opinion that we can't play both Ottens and D.Simpson in the same team. We need at least one of our ruckman to have a bit of mobility. So combinations of Ottens/West, Ottens/Vardy, D.Simpson/West, D.Simpson/Vardy are the only ones I would consider.

Spot on. Would be surprised to see two logs (Ottens and Simpson) or two mobiles (West and Vardy) playing in the same team. I'm not even calculating Blake anymore. He plays if Ottens and Simpson can't.

We may trial the Hawkins ruck thing again - remember it did work a few times early in 2010. He's our Koschitzke; he'll always be that 'much-maligned' forward-ruck, ruck-forward.

 

[costanza23]

Where do people think Hogan is at? I thought his prospects would have improved after Ablett left and now Ling is injured even more so however since playing in the two shortend round 1 nab hit outs where I thought he played ok he has only played in one other preseason game.

He's slowly gone backwards after a promising 2009. I can envisage him being delisted or traded at year's end. He looked to have been given Ling's old tagging role in the preseason, but younger players (Duncan, Menzel) have gone past him. Package him and Blake off to GWS for pick 90.

As for the 'traditional' midfield tagger, I think it will alternate a bit between Kelly and Enright for a year or two before Guthrie takes over.