Autopsy Round 2, 2024: St.Kilda v Collingwood *SPUD'S GAME* *ROSS 200TH* *BYRNES 50TH*

[gringo2011]

late to the party after a late night getting home and a busy day.

Just watched the RTB press conference

The Bonner one gives anyone with any concerns about a Ross 2.0 and his change. He's grown enormously as a coach.

"I sent a message, don't go back in your shell we bought you here for your run and your kick..."

"When I spoke to him at quarter time he lit up.... he smiled"

"we don't kick em"

Apart from that I'm with all the comments though I'll say this.

If Ronnie gets a bit more confidence to just "go" with his kicking then he will go from an edge of our best 23 to inside our top 10 with a bullet.

At the moment he stops, props and kicks the ball high down the line which kills his unbelievable running and ball gathering skills.

I really hope he can start to feel safe in the team and make some kicks that his speed deserves to open up the ground. And with that get confident.

He's the one for me that will be our barometer of moving forward as I feel that it's going to be sheer hard work compared to his abundantly talented team mates.

If he bridges the gap to them then oh my...

I agree on Byrnes as a barometer but starting to think we've been harsh, he's a pretty good inside 50 kick and his run and speed are elite. I think it's like buying a $50 pair of shoes that outperform you $300 Nikes, because we didn't pay much we play down his contribution. Without Wood we might need his run on the wings and it gives him opportunity to showcase his wares.

The Bonner message is a good sign he's changed a lot. He's very clear about how much autonomy he gives his line coaches as well. He sounds more like a football manager than an old fashioned head coach these days.

 

[gringo2011]

Despite the fools in here our coach obviously sees plenty in young Mr Byrnes. He's been getting better every game for the last 12 months.

He started last year looking like he'd arrived and faded, his challenge is to put together a full season now.

 

[gringo2011]

His quick handball between the centre square edge and the 50m arc that lead to the goal was sexually elite

He's very mentally quick to react. Last year he was great with those fast handballs in a chain. He looks like his confidence is a bit down right now, the good thing is that Mitch and Phillipou haven't really hit peak form yet.

 

[ScrappyDo]

He started last year looking like he'd arrived and faded, his challenge is to put together a full season now.

Improvement isn't linear. Watching the replay he was absolutely friggn everywhere and he made a big impact not allowing the pies any clean possessions. Time will take care of the rest.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

We actually have quite a decent contingent of Saints fans out here

I'm on that line and gave up trying to get home 2 years ago, I now drive into Clifton Hill or closer then train, Getting home last night we had 3 Mernda trains before 1 Hurstbridge line train, then 1/2 of the Hursty trains terminate at Greensborough making us wait even longer to get home.

I grew up in Rosanna & only had one other Sainter at primary school.

Still in the area 40 years later & there’s a heap more of us around.


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[gringo2011]

Finally got time to watch the replay. Just awesome! Here are my thoughts;

The Pies are no rabble, but we got them at the perfect time, they played poorly at times and they are not as well drilled as they have been when they've been humming.

Generally we got really lucky in that match. I'm not saying we didn't play well or didn't deserve to win, but stuff that usually evades us absolutely fell our way for a refreshing change. I'm tallking 50/50 umpire decisions, the bounce of the ball, and as stated catching an elite team at the right time.

We are not a polished team by any stretch of the imagination, plenty of fumbling, needless errors and ineffective tackling - but what won the game were a great setup, 100% buy in from all players, persistence and mental resilience; I was impressed especially with the latter, in a blockbuster that has traditionally meant mental collapse from our players, the opposition asked tough questions and our boys didn't choke. Great to see.

Loved reading the reactions on Collingwood board gameday thread, specifically about Leigh Fisher. They really showed their ignorance of his umpiring history claiming that he's in Ross's pocket (Unless?... Maybe he was traditionally hard on us when we had Richo or Ratts because he was trying to expedite their sackings in order to get RTB back in the hotseat - there is definitely Saints smoke and shadows behind the mirrors and the shady cabal of powerful ex-players continues to twist fate in our direction) But yes! I agree - they should take Fisher off Saints games in the future, especially since he's going to have to prove again that he has no alliegance to us by being extra-punitive. I thought that the Pies fans on that thread didn't really give our club enough respect, but...

... It's obvious that this club is not going to get much respect from opposition, neutrals, media or the AFL world, barring lip service. The AFL world has decided that we play ugly footy and Lyon is a blight on the game, (Unlike our ex-coach Blight who is considered a lion of the game, ha). I've given up caring, but it does lead to annoying reactions to our games. Might as well get ready for it, every win will be because the other team played badly, every free kick we get will come with implied suggestions of cheating, every triumph will be because we got lucky or scrapped our way to the top or whatever, and the club and its fans will continue to be patronised by everyone else: "It's great to see those long-suffering Saints fans finally feel some joy for once, they surely deserve it, just as long as they stay grateful for whatever success they are lucky enough to get and don't get big headed enough to believe they are as good as us" blah blah blah. We will never be lauded as true elite while Ross is in charge. Let's hope that we make our own history and opinions of the ignorant don't dilute its importance.

Specific notes on players:

I think the importance of Zac Jones's contribution is often unnoticed by many. He has a huge impact with his link up play and spread; I'm rapt to have him back in the team, and if his injuries are behind him, than there may be a few of our other mindfielders who might be waiting for their chance a while.

There was one moment I loved some time in the 3Q where Windy ferociously tackled 2 oppo players and then Owens steamed in and not to be outdone, ferociously tackled another Pies player. If I knew how to make GIFs from WatchAFL videos, that's one that I'd make. Beautiful to watch, finally.

Having Sharman and Marshall running back to clog up the backline is proving very effective, it's a great weapon to have.

Sad to see Wood and Henry will miss the next few games, what other wingers do we have ready to replace them? Henry in particular has been electric and vital since his first inclusion, I wish him a speedy recovery because we will really miss him.

Marshall is one of those player that I notice their stuff ups more than their good play. I know he's great for us and probably one of our best players, but every turnover, ineffective tackle or missed goal (or mark lol) makes me hope that Moose or Keeler can get developed quickly. But I was also the fool questioning how good NWM really was, so maybe I should just relax and enjoy the game!

Such an even spread from our group, I ran through the team in my head last night and was hard pressed to identify players who were passengers. I guess Mattaes and Darcy had off nights, but it's great experience in a blockbuster with a huge rabid oppo crowd and loud Saints crowd too!

I hope us fans don't get carried away; just as it wasn't a disaster when the Cats beat us, it isn't a fait accompli just because we kicked the Pies while they were down.

Mason Wood plays an end to end marking target and fill in defender/forward more than a pure spread running outside player. After Wood went down as you say Sharman played an end to end running role. He looked stuffed by the end but he was still running flat out. These days there are multiple wingmen who play off HFF and the back pockets and HBF move up to meet the ball rather than camp. Having a taller option that can run is a great asset at both ends.

Henry is a massive loss, he's already been one of our most important contributors in both games. He provides a huge amount of energy.

That's extremely harsh on Marshall, he's an awkward looking player at times but for pure contribution there aren't many rucks as good. It wasn't his best game by any means but still did heaps.

Agree, we are still a work in progress. Injury and suspension are already starting to erode confidence. Don't think we'll know where we stand until half way through the season. Still a great win and a reason to be proud of the club. Our mental fortitude turnaround has been huge in the last 4 years.

 

[gringo2011]

Improvement isn't linear. Watching the replay he was absolutely friggn everywhere and he made a big impact not allowing the pies any clean possessions. Time will take care of the rest.

I was at the ground and to watch the work rate of him and Wilson and even Cooper Sharman is incredible. They sprint end to end with the play. If you lose sight of them for a second they are up the other end getting to another contest.

 

[ScrappyDo]

I was at the ground and to watch the work rate of him and Wilson and even Cooper Sharman is incredible. They sprint end to end with the play. If you lose sight of them for a second they are up the other end getting to another contest.

Hugo will be added to that in due course too.

 

[gringo2011]

I posted this several pages back

I reckon Owens would have a been a gun rugby player. He's got a solid core that makes him hard to take down, can charge through traffic and if he tackles he doesn't let go until he drops you.

 

[gringo2011]

What a win. Reaffirms my belief that we win last week if Owens went through the midfield.

NAS might already be our most important player. Tall, brave, quick and one of the best kicks in the comp.
Windhager has a special ability to break free of pressure with some nice moves and seems to have great core strength.

Still think we can afford to play Caminiti or Hayes as another tall, especially if Owens is going to have more mid time.

I want to shout out our supporters at the games, we are getting louder and louder every game as we build belief. Last week we honestly sounded louder then the cats fans and last night we matched the Pies for voice. Keep it going!

And Windhager should have clamped Dangerfield.

 

[Joffaboy]

I was at the ground and to watch the work rate of him and Wilson and even Cooper Sharman is incredible. They sprint end to end with the play. If you lose sight of them for a second they are up the other end getting to another contest.

Coops, Wilson, Ronnie and Battle were all in the elite running group during the grunt work pre Christmas.
These guys are the epitome of foot soldiers (Wilson will be elite IMO) and we have got a tonne more players who run all day and run fast.
Can't think of a player we have that is slow, maybe Rohan.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[George]

Just finished watching this game back again - great viewing. Tore through them in the third (I think the Pies have now allowed 17 goals and only scored 2 themselves during 3rd quarters this year) and proud of the kids that stood up when we were challenged after Elliott's goal started a late surge for them.

Can't say the frees weren't there either - don't know what the **** anyone is complaining about.

 

[Ads734]

Coops, Wilson, Ronnie and Battle were all in the elite running group during the grunt work pre Christmas.
These guys are the epitome of foot soldiers (Wilson will be elite IMO) and we have got a tonne more players who run all day and run fast.
Can't think of a player we have that is slow, maybe Rohan.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

Only difference is that Coops for his size has elite skills and reaction time. His handballing and kicking are at the elite end.

 

[saintmike65]

Improvement isn't linear. Watching the replay he was absolutely friggn everywhere and he made a big impact not allowing the pies any clean possessions. Time will take care of the rest.

Byrnes is physically stronger now..one observation I’ve noticed watching him in match sim is his kicking on the run is more precise on his left!

 

[Diehard Saint]

Not mine, but Pies fans still salty...


View attachment 1936586

Any thoughts from them about Jamie Elliots’s grassed mark for the first goal, or…..crickets?

 

[CursingFijian]

I was at the ground and to watch the work rate of him and Wilson and even Cooper Sharman is incredible. They sprint end to end with the play. If you lose sight of them for a second they are up the other end getting to another contest.

Cooper Sharman marked in or near the goal square and kicked an important goal after being in a contest on the centre wing with Darcy Moore and then just burning him on the spread forward.

Sharman gets so far in front of Darcy Moore he actually gets to goal and then is able to lead back to the kicker. Darcy Moore on the other hand only gets far enough to tackle the kicker (Henry).

It was impressive running. Selwood notices the effort and mentions it in game. But Joel is such a poor commentator I don’t think it really lands with his colleagues.

 

[ScrappyDo]

I reckon Owens would have a been a gun rugby player. He's got a solid core that makes him hard to take down, can charge through traffic and if he tackles he doesn't let go until he drops you.

I reckon Mitch is yet to realize how big and strong he actually is. He's put a fair bit on over summer but needs more midfield time to put it into practice. Him, Windy and Steele in the middle is starting to look too good.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

I reckon Mitch is yet to realize how big and strong he actually is.

His behaviour on Thursday says otherwise

 

[Diehard Saint]

Agree, we are still a work in progress. Injury and suspension are already starting to erode confidence. Don't think we'll know where we stand until half way through the season. Still a great win and a reason to be proud of the club. Our mental fortitude turnaround has been huge in the last 4 years.

As bloody frustrating as the injuries and Max’s suspension are, let’s remember how we did with our cobbled together forward line last year.
Caminiti, Garcia, Arie and Collard now have a chance to stand up.
And Butler should be back you’d think.

Don’t follow vfl too much. What exactly is happening with Keeler, Van Ess, Hotton and Max H? I know there’ve been injuries for some, but is the generally feeling that any of them will make it?

 

[ScrappyDo]

His behaviour on Thursday says otherwise

Just his first proper outing. Give it another 20 games.

 

[CursingFijian]

Mitch’s kicking is his weakness. It’s not awful, but it can be inconsistent. Yet to kick one this year.

If he doesn’t put the work in there then he runs the risk of wasting his looks.

Right now he’s closer to Justin Westhoff

39

Justin Westhoff

Age

38

Ht

199cm

Wt

96kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.4

3star

K

7.0

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

4.1

4star

T

1.9

4star

CL

0.8

3star

D

10.4

3star

K

7.0

3star

HB

3.4

2star

M

4.1

4star

T

1.9

3star

CL

0.8

3star

D

12.0

3star

K

8.4

4star

HB

3.6

3star

M

4.6

5star

T

2.2

4star

CL

0.8

3star

than Jeremy Cameron

5

Jeremy Cameron

Age

31

Ht

196cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.5

3star

K

9.0

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

5.4

5star

T

1.6

4star

G

2.6

5star

D

10.0

3star

K

7.1

3star

HB

2.9

2star

M

4.6

4star

T

2.0

3star

G

1.9

5star

D

8.2

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

3.2

3star

M

4.6

5star

T

2.4

4star

G

2.0

5star

. I hope he can really improve his kicking.

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

Not mine, but Pies fans still salty...


View attachment 1936586

Bad news Pies fans that bit of the moon is inside the boundary line

 

[Leap of Faith]

Jack Higgins goal of the year to me was in , if you look at where his left foot is and how he is leaning backwards when kicking a part of the ball would of been on the boundary line.
You only need a fraction of the ball to be on the line to still be in play and people watching from the channel 7 camera have got a very deceptive view from it's positioning.
Amazing if this goal was kicked against us it would of got spoken about and forgotten.

If Higgins gets goal of the year it will be his 2nd one - only Eddie Betts has more with 4

All this ‘it was out’ speculation. There were two umpires totally in the right position to see whether it was in or out.

 

[g_TRAIN]

Mitch’s kicking is his weakness. It’s not awful, but it can be inconsistent. Yet to kick one this year.

If he doesn’t put the work in there then he runs the risk of wasting his looks.

Right now he’s closer to Justin Westhoff than Jeremy Cameron. I hope he can really improve his kicking.

Yeah, I think so too.

He rarely misses a goal on the run or when snapping but his set shots have been going at less than 40%

His around-then-ground kicking seems adequate. He has penetration in his kicks just lacks polish.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

His behaviour on Thursday says otherwise

New nickname for Mitchito?

The RWB Bison?


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