Game Day Round 3: Port Adelaide

[simpsonwillo]

From the AFL website
Verdict: Hogan in for Darcy, Sam Sturt in for Brandon Matera and Nathan Wilson to return in place of an unlucky Hayden Young, who didn't do much wrong in his debut

I really hope Youngy keeps his spot. I really liked what I saw from the Youngster

 

[Inveigh Slang]

Like it or not, hard running is a skill in football and not having it precludes your use of any other skills you have.

Disagree strongly. You don't need to be an elite runner to get the ball and deliver.
Sam Mtchell over Ethan Hughes

Mitchell got a whole lot more of the ball and wasn't as quick and is a superior kick.

 

[DeanS]

I really hope Youngy keeps his spot. I really liked what I saw from the Youngster

But if your only choice was between Wilson and Young, who would you take at this stage?

 

[Walkingwounded]

But if your only choice was between Wilson and Young, who would you take at this stage?

Willo in for Hughes!

 

[Wizard]

But if your only choice was between Wilson and Young, who would you take at this stage?

Young......

Seriously, what does Wilson offer thats significantly superior?

I think after a handful of games with Young finding his feet he could be equally as valuable.

 

[Inveigh Slang]

Young......

Seriously, what does Wilson offer thats significantly superior?

I think after a handful of games with Young finding his feet he could be equally as valuable.

Both
Drop Duman for Wilson and keep Young

 

[Purple_Turtle]

Young......

Seriously, what does Wilson offer thats significantly superior?

I think after a handful of games with Young finding his feet he could be equally as valuable.

Experience in a very young team. And at this stage you'd expect Willo to be used to the pace of AFL level, so his running and kicking is going to be far more useful.

Young was solid, but he was a bit off the pace and it meant that beautiful kick that we all bang on about wasn't really utilised.

 

[Kapow!!!]

How many people can afford to spend 2 weeks in isolation? How many Freo Members live in Brisbane/GC?

You rang?

 

[Scham]

Disagree strongly. You don't need to be an elite runner to get the ball and deliver.
Sam Mtchell over Ethan Hughes

Mitchell got a whole lot more of the ball and wasn't as quick and is a superior kick.

Exception rather than the rule plus he did retire a few seasons ago and the game has continued to move in the direct of mobility.

I don’t often agree with her but Taylor is spot on with that.

 

[Scham]

Experience in a very young team. And at this stage you'd expect Willo to be used to the pace of AFL level, so his running and kicking is going to be far more useful.

Young was solid, but he was a bit off the pace and it meant that beautiful kick that we all bang on about wasn't really utilised.

Why not have both???

 

[Purple_Turtle]

Why not have both???

Agreed.

But if it's one or the other I'd definitely lean Willo.

 

[Scham]

But if your only choice was between Wilson and Young, who would you take at this stage?

We can have both. I don’t know why it has to be Young for Willo?

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

At this stage in the medium / small defender stakes for me

Ryan > Hill > Wilson > Young > Duman > Hughes

Young provides maybe a little less than Duman and Hughes which is outweighed by a metric tonne of growth potential.

Seems like the wording from JL suggest Wilson AND Hill to play which would be amazing (if not a little dangerous)

Surely the first choice backline is then

Ryan Cox Conca
Wilson Logue Young

Hill off the bench

 

[Inveigh Slang]

Exception rather than the rule plus he did retire a few seasons ago and the game has continued to move in the direct of mobility.

I don’t often agree with her but Taylor is spot on with that.

The game hasn't moved on that much.

I'd take a footballer over an athlete any day.

 

[theGav56]

Good question. I'm going to go with yes, he can find his mojo. I'm hoping he hasn't lost it, more a case of being put in a position completely unsuited to his strengths/weaknesses (e.g. his kicking, which becomes way more of an issue at half back than inside mid).

I find it insane how most people have written him off, while pumping up other players. Out of Acres, Aish, Brayshaw, Cerra, Conca and Tucker ... Blakely easily has the best performances as a midfielder, and that was as a 3rd year player with 20 games entering the season. We need to see if he has still got it, and I think that requires an extended run in the seniors.

Problem is that every single one of those players has better disposal than him (and that includes Conca and Brayshaw imo, although pretty close), and so does Serong and Valente. We have been pretty clear that it is an area we want to improve in.

Most of the midfielders you name have significant defensive ability, and four of them are reasonable off half back. Doesn't seem to have harmed their midfield ability, and I suggest has rounded them as players. Far better rotating on field than off the bench.

Many midfielders find their way into a side with stints in the flanks while they develop their bodies and skills, and learn their roles. Ablett and Aish come to mind.

But the key factor is that with a new coach coming in every player gets a shot at best 22, and Longmuir clearly hasn't ticked that box.

 

[TheLastCall]

From the AFL website
Verdict: Hogan in for Darcy, Sam Sturt in for Brandon Matera and Nathan Wilson to return in place of an unlucky Hayden Young, who didn't do much wrong in his debut

I’d keep Young and replace Duman.

Otherwise about right.

 

[tonygeeks]

Duman had some great defensive efforts on the weekend , covers a heap of ground and is always making position for an outlet

Makes a few poor decisions with the ball but he’s not the Lone Ranger there


Sent from my iPad using BigFooty.com

 

[Rob]

Sarcastic me says, knobs first, plebs last !!!.

They will be offered to sponsors & associates.

How many sponsors do we have in Queensland? Wouldn't be many that would be interested in going to watch Freo v Port.

I'd imagine we have at least a few hundred members in Queensland - surely they'd all get a ticket? But I can't see why they wouldn't offer them to all members as well. There might be a few over there that might take it up.

It would certainly be better if as many of the 2000 are Freo people as possible.

 

[Taylor]

Exception rather than the rule plus he did retire a few seasons ago and the game has continued to move in the direct of mobility.

I don’t often agree with her but Taylor is spot on with that.

Quoting this to show the Israelis and Palestinians that anything is possible.

 

[Freomaniac]

We've actually done pretty well playing youth over the past few years. Certainly across '17-'18, we were fielding some of the youngest if not the youngest sides on average week to week. Last year with the influx of recruits it boosted the age average (still not in the fully mature bracket), but were lower in the games played average and as injuries took their toll the average age returned to the lower-younger range.

Again this year our depth for experienced quality isn't huge so it makes sense to save plundering youth stocks for when injury strikes. But it's not the greatest logic to bring in Hogan, Lobb, Aish, Conca, Acres Matera etc (and you've got two of the best players in the game in their late 20's) if you just want to build for 3 or 4 or 5 years down the track.

That's not to say that you don't have a percentage of the playing team reserved for blooding youth, both for development sakes and to see who's capable for the here and now. It's just a question of how big a percentage that is.

You need to keep this in mind....

Lets talk about that 2017 season. 8 wins, 14 defeats and 14th spot. Freo after 10 games were 6-4. I wasnt even angry when freo got belted by 100 points vs the crows in round 10 which was 143-43. I didnt care. 6-4 was good in 2017. It was way better than being 0-10, 12 months prior. Yeah we won 6 out of 7 in the 1st half of the season. we were 0-2 after losing to the cats in perth by 40 and losing to Port by 89 in Adelaide oval. Ross Lyon was forced to play youth vs the dogs in round 3 and freo won 13.11.89 to 10.13.73.

Freo did win a few close games in 2017, 2 of them was vs North. I didnt care. I rather finish 14th with 8 wins like we did in 2017 and 2018 than 16th with 4 wins like we did in 2016. The issues were loing by 100 points or more 3 times and that 89 point loss to Port. To me I didnt care. I rather Lose by 80-100 points away one week and win by 10-20 points the next week at home. I rather be 5-5 after 10 games or 4-6 after 10 games than 0-10.

Freos 2018 season panned out how I expected, 8 wins and 14 defeats and 14th spot. We lost 9 games by 50 points or more. 4 of those losses happened before round 14. So from rounds 16-23 we got the other 5 50 point defeats. Thats mainly due to 2 reasons....

1. Injuries to older players.

2. due to reason 1, if older players are injured, they are replaced with youth which means they cant run out 4 solid AFL quarters.

in 2019 we only had like 3 or possibly 4 50 point defeats I know we only had 1 in the 1st half of the season.

26-28 is about the peak age too. If they were 28+ sure, but gee we got Conca in when he was 26. That’s outside of our ‘rebuild’ age, right? De Boer will always be what if. He would be damn handy right about now, helping show professionalism and how to maintain fitness, optimism which would benefit Cerra, Brayshaw, greatly.
Drastic list changes will never please everyone. Just wish the list management had a rule where that no player was going to get 2 year contracts over 27 or so. D Pearce negotiate his contract superbly, 2 years at 28-29. Ballantyne getting one year deals after 2015 irked many. He was long off his best by then.

Define "rebuild" age.

I knew from that drop in 2016, It was going to be a long road back. Freo were going to spend at least 4 years out side the final 8. I could accpet that if the right things were in place.

That 1st year of the rebuild was important, Freo needed a bunch of 18-19 year olds and after 4 years, they will be 22-23 year olds and into the best 22 with at least 40-60 games under the belt

That 2016 draft netted us Logue, Darcy, Cox, Ryan and Duman. Ryan was 21 when we has picked up.... they other 4 were 18-19 years old.

You are not going to get a bunch of free agents in that 26-28 year range unless you know you will improve instantly. Because 4 years from now they will be 30-32 year olds. that means they are either retired or slowing down. Hence why I think Fyfe and walters will play finals again.... when they are saldy aged 30-32 years old just like Pav, McPharlin and Sandi.

You need to think why Danyle pearce got a 2 year extension at age 30. He was playing good footy at the time. He wasnt getting injured compared to Stephen hill. People forget that.

 

[DeanS]

I’d keep Young and replace Duman.

Otherwise about right.

And I reckon most of us supporters would agree with you, but coaches think differently. I remember hearing Tony Micale at a lunch saying if at the selection table you're faced with the choice of an experienced hand or a young bloke with a massive upside, any coach will go for the experienced player. His logic is the experienced player is more likely to be there when the pressure goes on and not lose composure. A huge generalisation I know and I'm sure there are exceptions but that seems to be the general rule.

I'm dying to see more of Young and Serong but they will probably only get a handfull of games each this year. Hopefully we get to see them in 5 years time when they have built that experience base and become absolute stars.

 

[Scham]

The game hasn't moved on that much.

I'd take a footballer over an athlete any day.

So would I but not a slow one or one with poor or even mediocre endurance (or both) which is what she said.

 

[blue shark]

You need to keep this in mind....

Lets talk about that 2017 season. 8 wins, 14 defeats and 14th spot. Freo after 10 games were 6-4. I wasnt even angry when freo got belted by 100 points vs the crows in round 10 which was 143-43. I didnt care. 6-4 was good in 2017. It was way better than being 0-10, 12 months prior. Yeah we won 6 out of 7 in the 1st half of the season. we were 0-2 after losing to the cats in perth by 40 and losing to Port by 89 in Adelaide oval. Ross Lyon was forced to play youth vs the dogs in round 3 and freo won 13.11.89 to 10.13.73.

Freo did win a few close games in 2017, 2 of them was vs North. I didnt care. I rather finish 14th with 8 wins like we did in 2017 and 2018 than 16th with 4 wins like we did in 2016. The issues were loing by 100 points or more 3 times and that 89 point loss to Port. To me I didnt care. I rather Lose by 80-100 points away one week and win by 10-20 points the next week at home. I rather be 5-5 after 10 games or 4-6 after 10 games than 0-10.

Freos 2018 season panned out how I expected, 8 wins and 14 defeats and 14th spot. We lost 9 games by 50 points or more. 4 of those losses happened before round 14. So from rounds 16-23 we got the other 5 50 point defeats. Thats mainly due to 2 reasons....

1. Injuries to older players.

2. due to reason 1, if older players are injured, they are replaced with youth which means they cant run out 4 solid AFL quarters.

in 2019 we only had like 3 or possibly 4 50 point defeats I know we only had 1 in the 1st half of the season.




Define "rebuild" age.

I knew from that drop in 2016, It was going to be a long road back. Freo were going to spend at least 4 years out side the final 8. I could accpet that if the right things were in place.

That 1st year of the rebuild was important, Freo needed a bunch of 18-19 year olds and after 4 years, they will be 22-23 year olds and into the best 22 with at least 40-60 games under the belt

That 2016 draft netted us Logue, Darcy, Cox, Ryan and Duman. Ryan was 21 when we has picked up.... they other 4 were 18-19 years old.

You are not going to get a bunch of free agents in that 26-28 year range unless you know you will improve instantly. Because 4 years from now they will be 30-32 year olds. that means they are either retired or slowing down. Hence why I think Fyfe and walters will play finals again.... when they are saldy aged 30-32 years old just like Pav, McPharlin and Sandi.

You need to think why Danyle pearce got a 2 year extension at age 30. He was playing good footy at the time. He wasnt getting injured compared to Stephen hill. People forget that.

Rebuilds are only part of the solution, having good coaches, game plan can fast track the rise.
How long have Saints, Dee's, Blues been promising results?
Banking draft picks has yet to deliver GWS s flag, I will take the champion team.

 

[Freomaniac]

Rebuilds are only part of the solution, having good coaches, game plan can fast track the rise.
How long have Saints, Dee's, Blues been promising results?
Banking draft picks has yet to deliver GWS s flag, I will take the champion team.

Banking draft picks got GWS to a grand final. They lost to a good richmond side. no shame in that.

Teams can stuff up every 2nd 1st rounder they get each year but can eventually becomes a finals side.

Saints, Demons and Blues have proven that you can finish bottom 4 for 3-5 years in a row to get 3-5 top 5 picks and dont nail them, you will be bear the bottom of the ladder.

 

[Purple_Turtle]

Banking draft picks got GWS to a grand final. They lost to a good richmond side. no shame in that.

Didn't they have 3 players injured in their 22 for that game? Most teams would lose against most sides carrying 3 injured players, regardless of how many high-end drafts they have on the list.

GWS losing isn't much of an argument against the value of banking draft picks. And it's worth noting Richmond built their 2019 list from a core of players they got with high draft picks (Cotchin, Martin, Riewoldt, Vlaustin) along with guys they grabbed through free-agency (Lynch,) expensive trades (Prestia,) some cheaper trades (Nankervis, Caddy) and mining the rookie and pre-season drafts (Houli, Grimes, Castagna, etc.). At some point you need to use the top-end of the draft to get to the top, although there's obviously more to it.

Where did the Grand Finalists get their players and how much did they pay?

As part of the buildup to the Grand Final, HPN thought we’d take a look at how the two list builds have occurred by looking at the value of the player acquisition opportunities. Each trade pe…

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