Coach Sam Mitchell's direction for the club and 2024 news

[Strapping Young Lad]

If anyone wants to have a listen about what the data is saying in regards to whether we have actually gotten worse this year have a listen to this from the 9:15 mark.

I know a few people have already touched on it, but the data is also showing that our results this year have been slightly better despite actually putting out a younger team and dealing with some injuries.




And here.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Sorry, but that’s absurd. If people can’t see how good a coach Sam is, then we’re having a laugh.

Good teams develop through continuity.

In mid 2006, Clarkson was given a 2 year extension.

We have a 5 year talent replenishment plan that’ll fuel our next flag. It’s extremely short sighted to think that Sam should be under any kind of scrutiny any time soon:

He is contracted to 2025. He has 18 months to show why he deserves another 2 years. I already follow one team who CONTINUALLY give undeserving and premature extensions to favourite son coaches which has led to us having 2 coaches over 16 years and only a solitary season where we looked in any way a contender and 15 seasons of mediocrity. I do not want this club to follow that path. Sam shouldn’t be given anything close to an extension until midway through next season when the team’s improvement over 3.5 seasons can be properly judged. Giving Sam a guaranteed further 3 years now when we have had our worst start in 54 years is madness.

 

[Hawk1986]

Moore’s comment about tiptoeing and sitting out of drills makes it sound like the coaches and players are worried about injuries, which might be the reason why we are not going hard at it? Did the injuries cause the confidence to drop amongst the group. What’s everyone’s thought on his comment?

Liked the honesty from Dylan, but thought they were worrying comments. Particularly the part about “not living to the standards required”.

 

[TylerDurden]

The media can throw a wobbly all they want.

Correct. But they can also apply an enormous amount of heat on a club.
From those I've spoken to, what I will say, is that we don't wanna be losing on Sunday.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Correct. But they can also apply an enormous amount of heat on a club.
From those I've spoken to, what I will say, is that we don't wanna be losing on Sunday.

If we lose the priority pick talk will go up a few notches too.
That could be quite funny.

 

[JR33]

Liked the honesty from Dylan, but thought they were worrying comments. Particularly the part about “not living to the standards required”.

I say we start worrying less about injuries and get to work. Injuries are bound to happen.

 

[humid hawk]

Remember Sam Mitchell's tackle on Shane Tuck

Shane Tuck

Age

43

Ht

189cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

23.4

5star

K

11.4

4star

HB

12.0

5star

M

4.5

4star

T

3.7

5star

CL

5.0

5star

No current season stats available

D

14.8

4star

K

9.2

4star

HB

5.6

4star

M

2.4

3star

T

1.4

4star

that basically saved Clarko's job?

I don't think Sam is at the crisis point yet - would be very surprised (and horrified) if anyone tried to move him on this year.

But what I AM interested in is who will step up for him and take the game on over the next few weeks. Character tests coming up.

 

[Dont_be_a_Plonka]

Mate, i was there. In no way were the conditions tough, nor did we need to make any material difference to how any team would play. As i posted above, I watched a very humid game two weeks ago and the pies reserves in real humidity and actual light rain at times had no problem handling the ball. Players vomited and cramped. Still no impact on the ball handling. If we are that concerned about playing in slightly different conditions to home then we have a big problem. The focus on the conditions is polar opposite to the mindset to play in any conditions, any time. You talk like they players never play in wet and greasy conditions in melbourne or tassie…

'Slightly different conditions'

Stop trying to defend playing games of football in that oppressive stink.

 

[Khmerhawk]

The media are coming for him hard now..if we lose this week, they'll have his head on a stake.

Not just the media but the fans too, a lot seem to be losing their shit right now.I'm still positive that Sam is the right man.
I think a big part of the current situation is that we are just really bad at covering injuries our top players. At the beginning of last year the forward line looked shocking before Lewis came back and then at least it looked half decent and then when Sicily got that ridiculous suspension the backline fell apart for those 3 weeks . This year the midfield looks terrible without Day. I know that's not the entire reason for the current form but it would be a fair chunk of it.

 

[The Chad and I]

The conditions didn't stop new recruit, logan morris, taking marks. The skills, marking, kicking, handballs, picking the ball up off the deck, were all at a high standard for both teams. Was a great match with the pies falling just short and both teams scoring over 100 points. The conditions were brutal but it did not cause the players skills to fall off the way ours do. We are coming off a low base. Maybe we just struggle with night games generally…

I loved his highlights pre-draft.
How did he look at vfl level?

 

[Hot Cheese Rioli]

I find the switching around of line coaches really amateur hour stuff. I know we move our back coaches to the mids, forward coaches to backs etc; just to build up assistant coaches CV's. Why not get the best mid coach and keep them there for example?? Same across the board.

Does my head in. Amateur approach to a professional game.

 

[Brishawk]

I loved his highlights pre-draft.
How did he look at vfl level?

Looked great. Best kpf on the field. Faded late but understandable for a rookie.

 

[TheFourPillars]

The two weeks of light training have been on the back of 6 day breaks and recovery. We have a young team. It takes longer for them to recover then a seasoned team. That is just fact.

 

[offtherails9]

The two weeks of light training have been on the back of 6 day breaks and recovery. We have a young team. It takes longer for them to recover then a seasoned team. That is just fact.

Yeah I think this would be pretty standard across the AFL in the situation we’ve had (two taxing games with travel and six day breaks). Not that Moore’s comments don’t have merit however.

 

[mustang]

If we lose the priority pick talk will go up a few notches too.
That could be quite funny.

Haha as the media is starting to talk about how we need to be given one that’s how it starts.

It will be pick 19 anyway going by history not a pick before our pick like a lot of people want.

 

[Wingnut19]

When you have a bad season, your rewarded with first round picks that should help propel the club. We have a total of 9 first round picks on list, and on Sat we had 6 of those first round picks not playing. We can argue on the talent of those picks, but you can see why there was such a talent difference between us and Suns. Those players missing were Wingard, Stephens, DGB, Watson, Day and Mcabe. Of the 10, Stephens, Weddle and McCabe were basically last pick of first round. Wingard is coming to the end and Stephens looks like being delisted after not getting a game. Two things are true, we have alot of upside to add to that team and we simply need more first round talent to add to the list.

 

[peetoo]

I posted after there were massive melts in the Rd 2 (Melb) post mortem that we should start having serious conversations about how we are tracking if we are still playing poorly after 5-6 games.

No doubt our week to week line up has been ordinary - which points to our depth being far weaker than some here were touting in off season.

Add to that several on field senior players having crap starts (eg. Sicily, Breust, Newcombe) and frankly if we had last seasons list I reckon we’d be getting pumped by 15 goals each week.

Developing teams can’t run with a “next man up” philosophy and expect the kids with 20 games to perform as well as the player with 280 games experience.

What we have seen this year is the product of not being able to put anywhere near our best team on the park and our leaders starting the season in first gear, if not neutral or even reverse.

Yet I still feel we are ahead of where we were in 2023 at the same time.

Remember we only beat North in our first 9 games in 2023, sitting 1-8 before we got to play WCE, belted them, the confidence grew, and then things started to click.

If we can’t knock off North next week, then I’ll happily put my hand up and admit I was wrong.

I reckon the coming game will have momentum swings and go down to the wire

 

[HawthornHawk]

The third year of a rebuild is always the trickiest. The consensus is that there must be significant improvement from the previous year but it doesn’t always happen this way. Added to that there has been some unrealistic expectations of this group on this forum, talk of finals and this year mirroring our side in 2007 (which had 6 or 7 hall of famers) was ludicrous, we were always a strong chance to go 0-5 when the draw came out.

I really wanted to see us improve in how we defend transition footy and we have- significantly. I wanted to see us improve in forward pressure and we have- significantly. But we’ve significantly regressed in contested situations, and the pre-season comments about our forward recruits being a band-aid (Chol and Gunston specifically) are starting to prove true.

I also believe the loss of Blanck – though he’s no star- has had a significant impact on how we and specifically our captain play. I don’t think it’s any coincidence that Blanck was in our line-up for every non-North Melbourne win we had last year. It’s why we were prepared to pay mega bucks for an upgrade on him in free agency last year.

I do worry about the club’s current habit of bringing former ‘Hawthorn people’ into the fold. We should be targeting those who will bring the best out of the playing group and out of Sam. Maybe the club is just really on the nose within the industry at present and its difficult to bring in fresh faces.

Sam is a great coach but given circumstances we need to wear the fact that without some really bold moves in the trade/free agency space and putting together an elite coaching panel he wont be winning a flag with our club, especially with the likes of the Suns, Port, Freo and Giants looking like they’ll be a force in years to come.

 

[The hands of stone]

The media are coming for him hard now..if we lose this week, they'll have his head on a stake.

Who cares what they think TD .
I listened to a bit of radio yesterday , watched some of the 'footy shows' .....its mainly all ill informed click bait.

Its round 6 2024 . Noone will be talking about this game in a few weeks win , lose or draw.

If the club starts listening to media we may as well start packing stumps up now.
Im listening to Sam , the club , and the guys here who attend training over the media .

 

[Tall poppy Syndrome]

Again - I 100% agree. If we put in that performance at the Australian research station in Antarctica versus some local penguins we would have still got smashed. My contention is more with those who say it doesn't play even some role in an overall performance. How much would be pretty impossible to quantify - but if you have a squad of players who haven't turned up ready to perform then you add in unfavourable conditions it might help add to the oppositions margin even just a little.

I’ve heard the Antarctic penguins, while formidable at home, really struggle away, particularly vs Phillip Island, renowned for its comparative humidity and evening dew.

 

[Gut Runner]

It really isn't a surprise where we are at.

Sam had the guts to cull the list and all commentators at the time asked the question: Will Sam survive his own rebuild?

Turning over nearly a full list to re-build doesn't take 3 years. Especially when you are bottoming out. It will take 8-9 years.

Whether Sam sees it through - who knows... I hope he does. But whatever the case I am grateful that he is bold enough to want a dynasty rather than bottom 8 finishes.

We will find out which youngsters make it when they are thrown in the deep end. We will keep trying to find great youth. Maybe the talent isn't there as first thought and we need another year or two of draft picks - so be it.

 

[Roddy]

I think the jury is still firmly out on Sammy as a coach. I'm neither falling all over myself to praise him and give him an extension nor ready to offload him.

I do think a lot about the 'favourite son' thing though. Since the 70s, it's been....

Jeans - non-Hawthorn person - massively successful (would have had 5 flags to his name if he didn't get crook)
Knights - Hawk favourite son - failure
Judge - Hawk favourite son - failure
Schwab - Hawk favourite son - one good season but overall a failure
Clarko - non-Hawthorn person - massively successful
Sammy - Hawk favourite son - Jury's out but with big concerns
(Joyce really only worked off what Yabby built)

There is definitely a trend there....

 

[MrBeefSeven]

geez people jump off quick...

give it time folks, it's a long season

 

[matey]

Last year we took two steps forward so far this year one step back. It’s not linear people.

 

[Flukey!]

Plenty were not expecting us to win any of the first 5 so thats no real surprise. The dissapointing element is how we lost them.

We still have plenty of opportunities to salvage some wins and I suspect (hope) that we again grow into the year like we did last year.

I think any negative chat about Sam is a wasted exercise. Im glad we have him and believe in his vision.

 

[Steven Tyler]

I think the jury is still firmly out on Sammy as a coach. I'm neither falling all over myself to praise him and give him an extension nor ready to offload him.

I do think a lot about the 'favourite son' thing though. Since the 70s, it's been....

Jeans - non-Hawthorn person - massively successful (would have had 5 flags to his name if he didn't get crook)
Knights - Hawk favourite son - failure
Judge - Hawk favourite son - failure
Schwab - Hawk favourite son - one good season but overall a failure
Clarko - non-Hawthorn person - massively successful
Sammy - Hawk favourite son - Jury's out but with big concerns
(Joyce really only worked off what Yabby built)

There is definitely a trend there....

I’d say it’s got more to do with the level of talent on your list

Knights failed at the Bears

Judge failed at the Eagles

Joyce failed at the Bulldogs

Even the great Allan Jeans failed at the Tigers