Samantha Murphy Ballarat * Patrick Orren Stephenson Charged With Murder

[Kurve]

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The Murder of Rebecca Young - Ballarat

The Murder of Hannah McGuire - Ballarat * Lachie Young

17

Lachie Young

Age

25

Ht

189cm

Wt

81kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.5

3star

K

6.4

3star

HB

4.1

3star

M

3.3

3star

T

1.8

4star

MG

220.3

3star

D

9.0

2star

K

5.5

2star

HB

3.5

2star

M

1.0

1star

T

2.0

3star

MG

210.0

3star

D

11.2

3star

K

6.2

3star

HB

5.0

4star

M

3.8

4star

T

1.8

4star

MG

219.6

4star

charged



Allegedly

 

[31550]

The defense asked for a 12-week adjournment which was supported by the pros., the CCTV is due to be handed over this weekend, how are they wasting everybody's time? both the defense and pros are on the same page with the amount of CCTV which needs to be reviewed.

They are wasting everyone's time by turning up to a committal hearing without a complete brief of evidence, with the knowledge that it was incomplete. The committal hearing should have been deferred until this was ready. Now a second committal hearing is required. Waste of everyone's time, and part of the reason the courts are clogged. Great for the legal team who are on the clock and paid by the hour to do nothing.

 

[Underarrest_]

They are wasting everyone's time by turning up to a committal hearing without a complete brief of evidence, with the knowledge that it was incomplete. The committal hearing should have been deferred until this was ready. Now a second committal hearing is required. Waste of everyone's time, and part of the reason the courts are clogged. Great for the legal team who are on the clock and paid by the hour to do nothing.

They must have done something.
Defence have requested 3 months to go over the brief of evidence.

 

[Edna Mode]

The defence don't have to be 'ready' for a committal hearing. They only have to be ready for a trial.

along with their failure to deliver all the relevant CCTV to the defence before the committal hearing would seem to indicate that the prosecution don't have enough to go to trial (right now), and need more time to finalise the brief.
At this stage they haven't even presented enough evidence for the case to go to trial.

Not according to your previous post. The prosecutors did deliver all the relevant CCTV on July 25th to the defence team before the committal hearing, but it was his defence team who failed to view it, they are the ones who haven't looked at the evidence for the case to go to trial, there is enough evidence presented from the prosecution "unprecedented" In terms of size.. Never done or known before

 

[31550]

Not according to your previous post. The prosecutors did deliver all the relevant CCTV on July 25th to the defence team before the committal hearing, but it was his defence team who failed to view it, they are the ones who haven't looked at the evidence for the case to go to trial, there is enough evidence presented from the prosecution "unprecedented" In terms of size.. Never done or known before

No they didn't. The CCTV is to be handed over this weekend.

 

[thumbs_up]

It's not a big deal. It's a 12 week adjournment for the defence to go through the footage. There's no big failure here.

 

[jason_recliner]

Who doesn't?
POS?
Unfortunately for him it's not a matter of screaming from the rooftops innocence and let me out.
He is shutting up.under very good legal advice. A preliminary is tactical for both sides but the defence to.lock witnesses and evidence down. It's always a rubber stamp
A trial is 2 years away. Which is ridiculous. For SMs family and wanting to know what happened and POS who under the law is innocent and very well may actually be innocent and is wasting away in custody while the police stall and the legal system has its thumb up its arse.

If the defence have good evidence he's innocent they can push to get PoS out on bail.

 

[jason_recliner]

It would be great to discuss why my theory that I’m only beginning to explore, isn’t plausible?

PoS's mum would know if your theory is plausible or risible.

 

[Moist Biscuit]

I’m having a moment, please bear with me, it could be very wrong but … what if POS is biologically Sams son?
Truth is stranger than fiction

Ok I was not ready for this

 

[31550]

It's not a big deal. It's a 12 week adjournment for the defence to go through the footage. There's no big failure here.

I guess we'll know in 12 weeks if it's a big deal.

 

[Run n Spread]

I’m having a moment, please bear with me, it could be very wrong but … what if POS is biologically Sams son?
Truth is stranger than fiction

Remember reading wasn't his dad young when he had him like late teens. So SM would ve been early mid 30s. His parents are still together aren't they? Doubt a teenage girl organises to and brings up another woman's baby her teen bf had an affair with?
And even if it were by some miracle the case and that's motive how would he know she was out running that morning?

 

[31550]

Remember reading wasn't his dad young when he had him like late teens. So SM would ve been early mid 30s. His parents are still together aren't they? Doubt a teenage girl organises to and brings up another woman's baby her teen bf had an affair with?
And even if it were by some miracle the case and that's motive how would he know she was out running that morning?

Maybe aliens abducted both SM and POS mother, and harvested Sam's eggs and implanted one in POS mother?

 

[thumbs_up]

Maybe aliens abducted both SM and POS mother, and harvested Sam's eggs and implanted one in POS mother?

Now this is what I was talking about when I said "lean into the absurd"

 

[Lady O]

Maybe aliens abducted both SM and POS mother, and harvested Sam's eggs and implanted one in POS mother?

Maybe it was fertilized by an alien and he's a hybrid? Explains a lot.

 

[Underarrest_]

It's not a big deal. It's a 12 week adjournment for the defence to go through the footage. There's no big failure here.

The way I see it is the only big deal is that the pros need time to compile their evidence for justice for Sam if POS is guilty and the defence need more time to review the brief for justice for POS if he’s not guilty.
If either side stuffs up, there’s either a guilty person walking free or a not guilty person locked up for how ever many years and the real perpetrator still walking the streets who could do it again.
Better taking the time to get it right.

 

[maggiethecat]

Remember reading wasn't his dad young when he had him like late teens. So SM would ve been early mid 30s. His parents are still together aren't they? Doubt a teenage girl organises to and brings up another woman's baby her teen bf had an affair with?
And even if it were by some miracle the case and that's motive how would he know she was out running that morning?

I did say I was probably way off?

I still find the similarities in their faces a little uncanny … maybe it’s just a Ballarat thing? I really don’t know? But someone mentioned I wasn’t the only person seeing a resemblance so I’m glad I’m not the only one that noticed

 

[Irma]

It would be great to discuss why my theory that I’m only beginning to explore, isn’t plausible?

Looking at it logically from a timeline perspective:

1972 - Samantha born
1982 - Orren Stephenson born
1997 - Samantha & Mick Murphy get married
1999 - Orren and Whitney (17yr old highschool sweethearts) have their first child
2002 - Patrick born

So are you suggesting that a 19yr old Orren got a married 29yr old Samantha pregnant, who then gave the baby to the teenage Stephensons to raise…?? Pretty sure husband Mick would’ve noticed something there… alongside all that, when you look back through photo’s of the Stephenson family, Patrick has his mums mouth and more pointed chin, as does his younger sister, who he shares facial similarities with.

And if you want to go down the road of perhaps the Stephensons just randomly adopted him? As 19yr olds they wouldn’t have been considered suitable, plus couples are rarely, if ever, chosen from the same country town as the birth mother due to the obvious issues that can arise.

Now throw into the mix that Mick & Samantha’s daughter Jess is the same age as Patrick.. Nope, sorry maggiecat, I think this one needs to be put to bed.

 

[shorsky]

Remember reading wasn't his dad young when he had him like late teens. So SM would ve been early mid 30s. His parents are still together aren't they? Doubt a teenage girl organises to and brings up another woman's baby her teen bf had an affair with?
And even if it were by some miracle the case and that's motive how would he know she was out running that morning?

Agree we have the right to suggest any theory - and I did give respectful thought to what was posed, however I’ve ruled out the possibility that Sam was POS’s mother.

His father turned 42 in July this year, so he’s basically 10 years younger than Sam.

However, since we’re digging deep - what if POS thought there was something going on between Sam & his father ? ?

Police have said there was no connection, but I’d suggest that Murphys had a fairly high profile in Ballarat with their business. I think they will’ve been ‘known’ to varying degrees, by a lot of people, including where they lived etc.
POS may’ve been watching her, may’ve been familiar with her regular activities, maybe even followed her that morning…. which, if the case, could have contributed to considerable capture on CCTV.

 

[Kurve]

Time to move on from the speculation of parentage thanks, it's derailing the thread now. We'll just have to wait to see what the police have got.

Thanks.

 

[Run n Spread]

My understanding (from the media reports) is that it was the prosecution who asked for more time to go over the "unprecedented" amount of evidence including CCTV.

I'm not sure but I don't believe this evidence has to be released to the defence prior to the committal hearing. It would certainly have to be handed over prior to the commencement of any trial, and then I expect the defence would be entitled to a similar amount of time to review the evidence and prepare their defence before the trial actually commences.

Police have to.present a full brief of evidence before a prelim. Gives defence time to challenge it come up with a strategy to.get the case kicked at committal.
I reckon what has happened here is police are scrambling to get evidence and went early with charges.
Magistrate should've said hand it over now we are starting prelim on this date. If you don't have the evidence you want bad luck.
Edit checked crimes act. Brief needs to be serves 21 days after charge sheet is read.
In this case they got a 20 week extension. But all evidence should be in not we will give CCTV in due course.
Agreed with a point above. Prosecution seems to be stalling here. Need the body location to.establish a timeline of.movements

 

[Run n Spread]

In fairness to police they've been working backwards.
Normally forensics do their thing the police will track the deceased movements on the day. From there they will look at associations/ enemies match their location and physical evidence to establish motive and actions causing death.
In this case a missing person is investigated differently. (Most show up)
Where were they going?
Health issues?
Did they run off with anyone?
Money issues?
By the time they've established likelihood of foul play trail is cold and a lot of physical evidence scents that could be used are no longer useful. Plus resources are devoted to a large area not a specific crime scene.
48 hours are crucial

 

[Underarrest_]

In fairness to police they've been working backwards.
Normally forensics do their thing the police will track the deceased movements on the day. From there they will look at associations/ enemies match their location and physical evidence to establish motive and actions causing death.
In this case a missing person is investigated differently. (Most show up)
Where were they going?
Health issues?
Did they run off with anyone?
Money issues?
By the time they've established likelihood of foul play trail is cold and a lot of physical evidence scents that could be used are no longer useful.
48 hours are crucial

How do you know they were working backwards? I’d think that police would have been looking at every possibility from the minute Sam was reported missing. I’m not sure the police are going to tell the public everything. Police initially told the public that they’ve ruled out a medical episode or accident as they had not found her in the bush where she ran but surely they would be open minded from the start. If they’re going backwards why are they so certain Sam is deceased and had POS under surveillance within two weeks which means they would have had him in their sites before the two weeks. It takes time to get warrants and set up surveillance.

 

[Run n Spread]

How do you know they were working backwards? I’d think that police would have been looking at every possibility from the minute Sam was reported missing. I’m not sure the police are going to tell the public everything. Police initially told the public that they’ve ruled out a medical episode or accident as they had not found her in the bush where she ran but surely they would be open minded from the start. If they’re going backwards why are they so certain Sam is deceased and had POS under surveillance within two weeks which means they would have had him in their sites before the two weeks. It takes time to get warrants and set up surveillance.

Working backwards as in the initial investigation was into finding SM. The first 48 hours are crucial in a murder investigation.
Once it was established she was deceased days had passed. Also unless there was an exact GPS coordinate there is no.specific crime scene. Murder investigations are targeted and specific.

 

[31550]

The way I see it is the only big deal is that the pros need time to compile their evidence for justice for Sam if POS is guilty and the defence need more time to review the brief for justice for POS if he’s not guilty.
If either side stuffs up, there’s either a guilty person walking free or a not guilty person locked up for how ever many years and the real perpetrator still walking the streets who could do it again.
Better taking the time to get it right.

Fair enough and that seems to be standard practice. But then why rush to charge him with murder and get him remanded in custody and oppose bail? If he's innocent his life is pretty well stuffed. If they had enough evidence to prove otherwise, i.e. he's a danger to society then where is it, and how much more is needed for the committal?
If they were still building their case, why go for murder? Why not a lesser charge which could always be increased if more evidence emerged?

 

[Underarrest_]

Working backwards as in the initial investigation was into finding SM. The first 48 hours are crucial in a murder investigation.
Once it was established she was deceased days had passed. Also unless there was an exact GPS coordinate there is no.specific crime scene. Murder investigations are targeted and specific.

That’s true, they might not have had a specific crime scene straight away.

 

[Underarrest_]

Fair enough and that seems to be standard practice. But then why rush to charge him with murder and get him remanded in custody and oppose bail? If he's innocent his life is pretty well stuffed. If they had enough evidence to prove otherwise, i.e. he's a danger to society then where is it, and how much more is needed for the committal?
If they were still building their case, why go for murder? Why not a lesser charge which could always be increased if more evidence emerged?

I don’t know if they’ve rushed in to charge him. Maybe they believe by the evidence they had, that he’s (allegedly) murdered Samantha.
Building the case wouldn’t have just included looking for more evidence but waiting for evidence such as meeting with witnesses for witness statements, waiting for forensic expert reports, etc.
For sure, if he’s innocent, his life will never be the same and that’s a terrible situation but he’s been charged and there’s a legal process.