Setanta

[Lapp_46]

There seems to be alot of people around this board that seem to speak very highly of Setanta. After watching the game on thur night, and all of his games last year im still not quite sure what the fuss is alot about. Sure, he get exited and its enjoyable to watch but to me he doesnt seem to influence games nearly enough. At a time where we are screaming for key position players in our forward line, he doesnt seem to hold a big enough physical presence, or capible of playing CHF. His skills, although getting better are still not at AFL standard and he is already 25. By the time he starts peaking in 2 years his body will start limiting his ability to play 2 years later. With his size, he is the perfect candidate to be that marking option that we so dearly need at CHF, but he doesnt have the class or ability.

People are frustrated that teams like the hawks, dons (who were down with us) had good wins, but when you compare their tall forwards (the likes of Franklin, Roughhead, lloyd, lucas) to people like Setanta those players are in a different class, and kick bags regularly. As long as we have players like setanta in our team, were never going to match it with the best. And stop being so biased... As much a people like him around here he hardly ever get more than about ten possessions and he doesnt present nearly well enough!

 

[The Maleman]

Couldnt disagree more with you mate.
Sure he's no world beater but has shown throughout late '06 & early '07 that he has the ability to hold down FB. Eeveryone knows that CHF is the hardest position on the ground, touch wood Hartlett can deliver on what we all seem to have earmarked him for at CHF.

Let the big irish man follow around his oponents & then back himself to run off and create when he gets the chance. I hope its a combo of his shoulder/illness that have been reported on bigfooty as to why he looked a little light on & out of sorts on Thursday night.

 

[Beloved]

Muppet.

Setanta's a great talent, possibly the best defender we have.

.

 

[Will.B.Worth.Da.Waite]

I actually half agree with the OP. I think we're all so happy with Setanta because he's improved out of sight and is so agile and talented for his size. However, despite how much he has improved since he arrived, I still don't know if I think he's good enough for AFL level yet. How many other teams in the comp would have him in their starting 22?

 

[prettyboy65]

I actually half agree with the OP. I think we're all so happy with Setanta because he's improved out of sight and is so agile and talented for his size. However, despite how much he has improved since he arrived, I still don't know if I think he's good enough for AFL level yet. How many other teams in the comp would have him in their starting 22?

none
not even bitchmond
he is just a player loved by carlton fans

 

[AlecDuncan]

Can't judge the guy when he's being forced to pinch-hit in the ruck. Wait 'til he goes back to defence where he's better suited.

 

[Lapp_46]

I actually half agree with the OP. I think we're all so happy with Setanta because he's improved out of sight and is so agile and talented for his size. However, despite how much he has improved since he arrived, I still don't know if I think he's good enough for AFL level yet. How many other teams in the comp would have him in their starting 22?

Thats exactly it. I really dont believe he would be in the starting 22 of any other team in the AFL... says something doesnt it

 

[thylacine60]

Muppet.

Setanta's a great talent, possibly the best defender we have.

.

Thank Christ you got rid of that avatar. It was weirding me out.

 

[marcmurphy3]

I half agree. While I think he has talent, I do think he is very overrated by a lot of blues supporters.

 

[Kramer1]

The guy did an admirable job last year. What he has achieved in a few short years is outstanding. Not sure why you are judging him on his ability to play CHF, when he has played mostly as a defender.

Also dont know what you are trying to achieve in comparing him to Lloyd, Lucas, Franklin and Roughhead. To begin, they are key forwards, Setanta is not.

Certainly Roughhead has shown no more than Setanta at AFL level. The other three are champions of the modern game. You could compare 9/10 of the current AFL playing list against them and they would fall well short.

Don't really care what other teams would take him on...much more interested in how he fits into our team, given we went and found him and have developed him onto an AFL player. On last years form (which is really all we have to go on at the moment) he would be the second defender pencilled into my team each week.

 

[blues4flag]

I actually half agree with the OP. I think we're all so happy with Setanta because he's improved out of sight and is so agile and talented for his size. However, despite how much he has improved since he arrived, I still don't know if I think he's good enough for AFL level yet. How many other teams in the comp would have him in their starting 22?

Agree with that. We've gotta keep him in defense and let him develop there - I don't see the point in throwing him around the field given his inexperience.

 

[HBF]

I actually half agree with the OP. I think we're all so happy with Setanta because he's improved out of sight and is so agile and talented for his size. However, despite how much he has improved since he arrived, I still don't know if I think he's good enough for AFL level yet. How many other teams in the comp would have him in their starting 22?

Given his athletisisn and running capacity, and then add the strength the guy posesses, he could still be anything. Anybody in doubt should have a look at the NAB Cup final against Brisbane last year, when he did a pretty good job on one J.Brown.

Like alot of other players on our list, he will get better. I really think he could hold down either FB, CHB, or play as a floating CHF.

 

[Carlton_Blues]

Will be a Blues 200 gamer.

 

[blues4flag]

Will be a Blues 200 gamer.

Next to no chance of that happening, considering his age.

 

[Monkee]

Half agree with the OP but hard to judge at this stage.
Would love to see him settle into a position on the back line and influence things there.

 

[Brighton_Diggins]

Muppet.

Setanta's a great talent, possibly the best defender we have.

.

Tell me when setanta has really done some damage
in any position? I mean, i like him, he does some pretty
good things.... but is he good enough to hold down FB for the next
2-3 years? If not, where do we look to put him.
I'd love him to prove me horribly wrong...
But he's on my cringe list I'm afraid.

carazzo
walker
etc etc

 

[Kramer1]

Tell me when setanta has really done some damage
in any position? I mean, i like him, he does some pretty
good things.... but is he good enough to hold down FB for the next
2-3 years? If not, where do we look to put him.
I'd love him to prove me horribly wrong...
But he's on my cringe list I'm afraid.

Im still trying to work out what he's done to suggest he wont be a quality defender in the coming years. Why all the scrutiny?

I could only assume that 'the irish experiment' is well ahead of the coaches expectations. He didn't tear the game apart last year, but he held some very credible players quiet. What should we be expecting from a developing backman?

 

[prettyboy65]

Im still trying to work out what he's done to suggest he wont be a quality defender in the coming years. Why all the scrutiny?

I could only assume that 'the irish experiment' is well ahead of the coaches expectations. He didn't tear the game apart last year, but he held some very credible players quiet. What should we be expecting from a developing backman?

and he has mongrel
i like that
he hates losing and loves doing good things
he wont back down (like hartlett)

 

[thylacine60]

and he has mongrel
i like that
he hates losing and loves doing good things
he wont back down (like hartlett)

He gets 2 weeks for backing down?

 

[prettyboy65]

He gets 2 weeks for backing down?

no? he gets two weeks for not letting the richmond ****er step all over him

 

[Brighton_Diggins]

Im still trying to work out what he's done to suggest he wont be a quality defender in the coming years. Why all the scrutiny?

I could only assume that 'the irish experiment' is well ahead of the coaches expectations. He didn't tear the game apart last year, but he held some very credible players quiet. What should we be expecting from a developing backman?

It's just starting to seem like a big investment for low return.
That's all. I like his passion etc etc. But I'm just not convinced
based on all his performances that he is capable of rising to
the levels that are required in the game now.
I'll give him this year, but if he's still around the same place
it'll be time to start asking some questions.
Like all our players with a big question mark over their heads
I want nothing more than for him to rise up and fulfill his potential.
Carlton are at the point now where players should be viewing
a spot in the side and stopping at nothing to make sure it's theirs.

 

[Kramer1]

It's just starting to seem like a big investment for low return.
That's all. I like his passion etc etc. But I'm just not convinced
based on all his performances that he is capable of rising to
the levels that are required in the game now.
I'll give him this year, but if he's still around the same place
it'll be time to start asking some questions.
Like all our players with a big question mark over their heads
I want nothing more than for him to rise up and fulfill his potential.

But what is it about his perfomances that makes you doubt his ability as an AFL standard defender. What has he done, or rather not done, to make you form this opnion?

What are the major flaws in his game that can prevent him developing into a valuable contributor to the team?

Carlton are at the point now where players should be viewing
a spot in the side and stopping at nothing to make sure it's theirs

The guy is playing in an elite sporting competition that he barely knew existed a handful of years ago. Im guessing he has shown a fair bit of commitment and dedication, and stopped at nothing to earn his spot.

 

[Brighton_Diggins]

But what is it about his perfomances that makes you doubt his ability as an AFL standard defender. What has he done, or rather not done, to make you form this opnion?

What are the major flaws in his game that can prevent him developing into a valuable contributor to the team?

The guy is playing in an elite sporting competition that he barely knew existed a handful of years ago. Im guessing he has shown a fair bit of commitment and dedication, and stopped at nothing to earn his spot.

His attack at the football is a little one dimensional and he often doesn't
give himself a contingency plan. No use going hard at it with hard hands
with no hope of recovery.

For starters his skills aren't as silky as they could be.
He looks quite haphazard at times when he's running along with the
ball and sometimes his decisions are totally questionable

I'm not doubting or questioning his dedication. I actually love it.
And i think he's done really well considering where he's come from.
It's just whether or not it's gonna be enough in the long run.

 

[BlueYoss]

That's all. I like his passion etc etc. But I'm just not convinced
based on all his performances that he is capable of rising to
the levels that are required in the game now.
I'll give him this year, but if he's still around the same place
it'll be time to start asking some questions.

Setanta showed some very impressive development over 2007. You only need to look at his form in the pre-season where he was all athleticism and endeavour (and total heart in mouth for the fans every time he disposed of the ball) to his final few games in the home and away season where he used his height, reach and vertical leap to take some very strong grabs and was consistently able to kick goals from about 50m out.

And this in spite of him spending much of the season filling a gap in the ruck when what his development was really calling out for was game time at FB or as a tall forward.

Admittedly he has has had an interrupted pre-season, but based on the development he showed over the course of 2007 while playing for the most part out of position, I'm confident that if his body allows him consitent game game this year, especially with Cloke back and Hampson, Aisake and Kreuzer as his backups, Setanta should have an even better development year in 2008.

 

[Lapp_46]

The problem with sentanta (like i said earlier) is that we have put in all this time on him, and he's already 25y.o. People here suggest this will be another developing year for him. By the time he finishes developing his body will force him to retire. He moves well, his 199cm tall, yet he is beaten in the ruck when he pinch hits, and is incabable of being a CHF. The fact is he played up forward on Thur night and the second half of the season, and he doesnt lead up the groud well enough, he doesnt split packs open and he doesnt take enough if any strong contested or pack marks.

He might be an alright fullback, but thats not where we have been playing him... Were shit because we have him in our forward line, and no other team in the comp would...