Coaching Staff Simon Dalrymple

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Kiama Chris said:
No doubt that Dalrymple was a hardworking and competent talent spotter and will continue to be so at Saints. No-one gets it 100% right with 18 yo kids. Reckon 50% is a pretty good hit rate. I hope there was nothing untoward in his leaving, just a better offer and maybe a return home.
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Hopefully it builds good relations for the Swans and Saints when we're facilitating future trades. Our recent dealings with North are a good example of such pragmatism during negotiations. Nothing worse than clubs like Adelaide and Essendon who try to take you to the cleaners every trade period!
 
Kiama Chris said:
No doubt that Dalrymple was a hardworking and competent talent spotter and will continue to be so at Saints. No-one gets it 100% right with 18 yo kids. Reckon 50% is a pretty good hit rate. I hope there was nothing untoward in his leaving, just a better offer and maybe a return home.
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I don't see how a return home when he was working remotely in melbourne would be a large factor.
 

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dosser said:
Probably thought we already had Dubai Quacker in Perth, bedford for the VFL and Bloods86 in Adelaide, so Dalrymple was surplus to requirements.
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He hasn't had to lift a finger working for Sydney as a result. Our guys have delivered recruits to make him look successful. Probably needs a challenge and feels a need to do the work himself without our guys help.
 
rustycrate said:
He hasn't had to lift a finger working for Sydney as a result. Our guys have delivered recruits to make him look successful. Probably needs a challenge and feels a need to do the work himself without our guys help.
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And yet we didn't get ZZ, a blot on the copybook. I will watch his progress with great interest.
 
I'm disappointed to lose him and feel this loss is more in the T.Mitchell category than the G.Hewett category.

I think he has done a good job for us; the careers of our more recent draftees (especially Gus and Matty) will reveal more.

Who will replace him? New blood is always exciting.

We have had some major losses of off-field personnel in the last couple of months: Pyke, Gardiner and now Dalrymple. Fortunately it comes after a period of stability. They are all hard to replace with equivalent quality. Gardiner for Cameron is reasonable. Pyke for Spike is a trade down but not a disaster by any means. We'll see who comes in for Simon. Time for the incumbents and newblood to come together and pull their weight.
 
Callipygian said:
I'm disappointed to lose him and feel this loss is more in the T.Mitchell category than the G.Hewett category.

I think he has done a good job for us; the careers of our more recent draftees (especially Gus and Matty) will reveal more.

Who will replace him? New blood is always exciting.

We have had some major losses of off-field personnel in the last couple of months: Pyke, Gardiner and now Dalrymple. Fortunately it comes after a period of stability. They are all hard to replace with equivalent quality. Gardiner for Cameron is reasonable. Pyke for Spike is a trade down but not a disaster by any means. We'll see who comes in for Simon. Time for the incumbents and newblood to come together and pull their weight.
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Cameron and Spike are both experienced and it's more about how they fit in and work with the others than what they bring. To me Gardiner was an inspired choice to work between two footy guys in Horse and Harley. A total surprise.
Dalrymple's skill set of observation, analysis and communication is a different breed of cat and I suspect his replacement might be something of a surprise.
 
Heeney2Franklin said:
Wouldnt just Kinnear take over Dalrymple role?
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From what I recall
Dalrymple was the draft selector. He was responsible for ranking all the draftees and creating a list from which we made or selections.
Kinnear was the trader. He looked at what our needs were and decided who to trade in. Of course Dalrymple reported to Kinnear. That was the relationship. But division of roles too.
 

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rustycrate said:
From what I recall
Dalrymple was the draft selector. He was responsible for ranking all the draftees and creating a list from which we made or selections.
Kinnear was the trader. He looked at what our needs were and decided who to trade in. Of course Dalrymple reported to Kinnear. That was the relationship. But division of roles too.
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About right I think. Dalrymple the researcher from a long way out. Pretty sure they would discuss both draft and trade between themselves and with coaches to build the final picture but Kinnear would have the last word, except on trades like Grundy and Adams which would be CEO sign off.
 
rustycrate said:
From what I recall
Dalrymple was the draft selector. He was responsible for ranking all the draftees and creating a list from which we made or selections.
Kinnear was the trader. He looked at what our needs were and decided who to trade in. Of course Dalrymple reported to Kinnear. That was the relationship. But division of roles too.
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We only have 4 full time recruiters (with some part timers to fill the gaps) that report to Beatson. Dalrymple got the job when Beatson called him to ask for a recommendation for a vacancy we had at the time not thinking that he was interested and when he later applied for the role he was given the National Recruiting Manager title due to his status within the game by the club.

Its very much a group effort, where each person beings something different to the table when its time to rank players but in the event of a tie Beatson gets the final say but these calls are normally sorted out well in advance of the draft.
 
Ticky009 said:
I'm curios who we're going to get. And its not like being from Vic is going to be an issue, both Kinnear and Dalrymple work out of Melbourne for us.
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Thanks for that - I didn't know in either case. I'm not surprised in Dalrymple's case, I'm a little surprised in Kinnear's case. That explains why we rarely see him around the club but he does occasionally make club events in Melbourne (like a fan day in 2023, I think?).

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I agree that Dalrymple and Beatson had distinct roles (with Dalrymple focused on the draft); and also that they would have collaborated, and discussed all manner of list-related decisions. I think that when it came to drafting decisions that KB would not have had the final call in ordinary circumstances. I think one of the main reasons that Dalrymple was happy to come to us was because he wanted more authority and autonomy in relation to drafting decisions than he got at the Bulldogs. So, my feeling is that Dalrymple would have determined our draft rankings but KB would have made choices regarding pick trading etc and of course they would have discussed all of it extensively. In a rare case (which probably never happened), KB could perhaps have pulled rank and overruled Dalrymple about something - but I don't think the club would have been supportive of KB doing that lightly.

I don't think there was a Dalrymple equivalent before he came along (i.e. a National Recruiting Manager as distinct from a list manager). There were just subordinates to KB who had varying roles. Maybe we will revert to that model. I hope not.

I am interested to hear that it's a possibility that Dalrymple chose to leave because KB is difficult to work with. It sounds plausible but that equally makes it more likely to be true and more likely to have been made up.

I have been a big fan of our list management for a long time (i.e. the duration of KB's tenure, and probably longer). But KB is pretty old school and I would like to see us modernising and refreshing our approach to recruiting and list management. For that reason I hope that we do replace Dalrymple's role and we get another strong voice in the room and that we don't revert to a KB-and-subordinates model. Who it should be? I have no clue. I wonder if Dalrymple can be counted on to help recruit his replacement? That'd be nice.

(The Saints still have announced Dalrymple's arrival on their club website. I guess club staff are going to return to work next week across the league?)
 
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Callipygian said:
I am interested to hear that it's a possibility that Dalrymple chose to leave because KB is difficult to work with. It sounds plausible but that equally makes it more likely to be true and more likely to have been made up.

I have been a big fan of our list management for a long time (i.e. the duration of KB's tenure, and probably longer). But KB is pretty old school and I would like to see us modernising and refreshing our approach to recruiting and list management. For that reason I hope that we do replace Dalrymple's role and we get another strong voice in the room and that we don't revert to a KB-and-subordinates model. Who it should be? I have no clue. I wonder if Dalrymple can be counted on to help recruit his replacement? That'd be nice.

(The Saints still have announced Dalrymple's arrival on their club website. I guess club staff are going to return to work next week across the league?)
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That post was pure speculation and is not based on any fact. So let's not run with that.
 
Ticky009 said:
That post was pure speculation and is not based on any fact. So let's not run with that.
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I agree. Dalrymple was at the Swans 6 years. It’s a reasonable tenure in a high performance industry and when Sydney is such an expensive place to live. Isn’t Dalrymple originally from Victoria, so friends and family are there. All the reporting I have read describes Kinnear as well-respected. So easy to make baseless accusations or repeat random gossip online.
 
Ticky009 said:
That post was pure speculation and is not based on any fact. So let's not run with that.
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I'm happy to dismiss the idea that a personality clash with KB was the reason behind Dalrymple's departure. However I stand by my call for the role to be replaced and for another strong voice to co-exist with KB in the list management space.
 
robbieando said:
We only have 4 full time recruiters (with some part timers to fill the gaps) that report to Beatson. Dalrymple got the job when Beatson called him to ask for a recommendation for a vacancy we had at the time not thinking that he was interested and when he later applied for the role he was given the National Recruiting Manager title due to his status within the game by the club.

Its very much a group effort, where each person beings something different to the table when its time to rank players but in the event of a tie Beatson gets the final say but these calls are normally sorted out well in advance of the draft.
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I remember that call that Beetson made to Dalrymple. "We need someone to do recruiting blah blah do you know anyone". Dalrymple put his hand up and said take me because the Dogs including the coach were meddling in the recruitment and Dalrymple liked the Swans way where recruiters did the recruiting without interference and being over ridden by coaches and others. There was a video that Dalrymple did which explained the whole thing.
 
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Callipygian said:
I'm happy to dismiss the idea that a personality clash with KB was the reason behind Dalrymple's departure. However I stand by my call for the role to be replaced and for another strong voice to co-exist with KB in the list management space.
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I've got no reason to think they wouldn't. Swans attribute a fair part of their success to staff and players 'playing their role' and I'd imagine part of that is keeping the Dalrymple's job & Kinnears separate. If you're going to be a 'draft expert' I think it comes with the unwritten rule that you're going to be grilled on those selections. I don't think its an area that is made for shrinking violets.
 
Ticky009 said:
I've got no reason to think they wouldn't. Swans attribute a fair part of their success to staff and players 'playing their role' and I'd imagine part of that is keeping the Dalrymple's job & Kinnears separate. If you're going to be a 'draft expert' I think it comes with the unwritten rule that you're going to be grilled on those selections. I don't think its an area that is made for shrinking violets.
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I believe the fact that staff have a defined role and are free to play their role is the main reason that Dalrymple left the Bulldogs who were interfering in his role.
The Swans conversely have a culture of people "playing their role" off field. This separation of responsibility enables people to do their job to the best of their ability.
I agree in this job there would be no where to hide. The selections are there on paper. You would live or die with them.
 
rustycrate said:
I agree in this job there would be no where to hide. The selections are there on paper. You would live or die with them.
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Explain Adrian Dodoro
 

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Coaching Staff Simon Dalrymple

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