Mega Thread The James Hird thread - articles,theories and predictions

[fishardansin]

Once again.

Fitzroy already play from the Brunswick Oval and have done so since 2009. The club has gone back to where it started in 1883, an amateur club representing the suburb of Fitzroy.

My son plays against them in the YJFL as well. It is a long way off though and Brisbane having the Lion's monkier is an insult, for mine. Fitzroy and Sth Melb should have gone to VFL ..

 

[fishardansin]

Again with the cult of James. No one cares what he did when he played, if he studied 4 subjects at the same time, or built a time machine in his backyard.

This is about what he set out to do with Dank and Robinson( but then distanced himself from it all, while letting them burn) as senior coach, the man who claimed that he'd take full responsibility for whatever took place in the football department.

The reluctance of many, both inside the club and outside, to actually make a stand and remove him from the picture regardless of how bad it looks, and how many others have fallen, comes back to those three words, "Hird is Essendon".

It's not a cult. It is about a man who has enough credits in the bank to be able to have the chance to clear his name. You'd have to be blinded by obsessive hatred to not see that.

 

[fishardansin]

These are all good points. There is a massive tall poppy syndrome in Australia even when there is no controversy surrounding a particular person. When there is blood in the water though they go into a feeding frenzy. When I say they, I guess I am saying the media primarily, however they are a reflection of the community and what people want - it sells papers etc. It also doesn't help on the back of the Lance Armstrong deception. The heroes now can be villains so there is more of an acceptance that it could be true & he may not be the innocent golden boy portrayed.

I think your every day footy fan is horrified this has happened in our game and I don't think the average footy fan likes seeing whats happening to Hird & Essendon. I think 99% would prefer this not to ever have happened. But because it has happened you have to expect a response. Most people are angry & disappointed this black mark has been left on the game and the court of public opinion will drive the media response - fair or otherwise.

Footy illicits irrational emotional responses from people and this issue has dwarfed all those other contreversies everyone was so pent up about like tanking, recreational drugs (everyone is now relieved their players are snorting coke instead of peptides) and salary cap cheating.

There is a certain percentage of the population who want to chase ambulances and spectate the carnage. The haters will hate and as a Pies supporter we know all about that. So in a way you just have to toughen up princess. It will pass and a years time they will all be on the Hird bandwagon talking about his great comeback from adversity.

Well said mate. I know it will pass by the way, but Essendon supporters do need to participate in the public conversation to make sure this doesn't turn into a Lindy Chamberlain situation .... without the death of a child or a jail sentence!

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

It's not a cult. It is about a man who has enough credits in the bank to be able to have the chance to clear his name. You'd have to be blinded by obsessive hatred to not see that.

No, I'm 'blinded' by rational thought.

Of course, it's not a cult in the strict sense, but it's hero worship and nothing more.

I don't care how brilliant Hird was as a player.
As a senior coach, and a person in his position, considering the amount of allegations that have been made, and the subsequent findings in Ziggy's report alone, Hird should have stood down, long before now( with the others who've already gone).

This is the continual theme that Essendon supporters seem to be unable grasp.

 

[Mofra]

I don't think that's the case. People are outraged that Essendon gained an unfair advantage by cheating, not because they wanna hate for hate's sake. 99% of fans wished that it never happened, but now that it has the worst possible thing would be to let essendon to get way with murder...the outrage would simmer for years

I wouldn't say outrage, but the smugness from many Essendon supporters does form a large reason why initial sympathies with the club from opposition fans have now evaporated.

Strangely enough, it's the players themselves that seem to be the biggest victims in the whole saga - Jobe Watson is reportedly one of the "nice guys" of the AFL and not the type to take shortcuts. I have little doubt that he would never accept PEDs willingly, yet now he's the public face of the scrutiny placed upon the playing group due to his forthright admissions.

 

[fishardansin]

No, I'm 'blinded' by rational thought.

Of course, it's not a cult in the strict sense, but it's hero worship and nothing more.

I don't care how brilliant Hird was as a player.
As a senior coach, and a person in his position, considering the amount of allegations that have been made, and the subsequent findings in Ziggy's report alone, Hird should have stood down, long before now( with the others who've already gone).

This is the continual theme that Essendon supporters seem to be unable grasp.

I'm going to let this go mate. You're just wrong. There is some of that going on but that isn't the driving force here. It's respect, not worship.

 

[blackshadow]

It's not a cult. It is about a man who has enough credits in the bank to be able to have the chance to clear his name. You'd have to be blinded by obsessive hatred to not see that.

A man like Jim Jones?

 

[Roylion]

My son plays against them in the YJFL as well.

The Fitzroy Junior Football Club is not the Fitzroy Football Club.

It is a long way off though

Fitzroy no longer plays in a professional league. That's about it. The Fitzroy Football Club in the VAFA is the same club that used to hold a licence to compete in the AFL.

Brisbane having the Lion's monkier is an insult, for mine.

The Lion was Fitzroy's mascot for 40 years. Wearing it (or wearing any Lion mascot, such as the bastardised one they wear now) does not make Brisbane, the Fitzroy Football Club.

Fitzroy and Sth Melb should have gone to VFL ..

Maybe. Fitzroy Football Club went to the VAFA and still exists in its own right, right here in Melbourne and South Melbourne relocated to become the Sydney Swans.

 

[Lockie]

I don't want them to fold. Just move to a league that is representative of the level of support in numbers and finance.

Port Power is different and if the new move to Adelaide Oval doesn't pay off they have to look to something like rebadging as North Adelaide so to get more non-Port Adelaide magpie supporters following.

Thats very generous that you don't want clubs to fold, but just want them to move to another league that represents their level of support and finances. Maybe you should start your own league in some new untapped horizon and get some more supporters....not sure anyone has looked at outer space as yet....and take your VFL team and you can play each other each week for the Martian cup and leave the rest of us alone.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

After 16k posts, I think you can spare the few minutes

yeah that guy obviously has no life

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

yeah that guy obviously has no life

Congrats on post number 1000 for the thread. Winner!

 

[Lance Uppercut]

Congrats on post number 1000 for the thread. Winner!

apt

 

[Moo]

In other words, what he's done over the 22 years has made him the most treasured product of Essendon. The fact he loves the club like a supporter, a fanatical supporter, makes him more loved. What he did with full time study and work while playing garnered more respect, his battles with injury, his battles with a young family, his business success and the way he carried himself in the media are other things that made nearly every single Essendon supporter love him.

I don't think anyone disputes that his onfield performances are worthy of respect.

You guys love him, we get that.....is that love so overwhelming that you guys have blinkers on - that is the question.

I knew that Mark Harvey sucked donkey balls as a game day coach - if that coach was Matty Pavlich hey I'm guessing I might be blinded by the purple light shining from his bum too.

Since arriving at Essendon as coach he turned the place around. It was a powerhouse club sliding into the realms that Richmond inhabited for 30 years and within months he had all the players wanting to stay there and supporters energised.

Aside from this year - to me as a neutral Essendon under Hird has not looked mightily different to Essendon under Knights.

Most clear thinking Essendon supporters still keep open the option that Hird stuffed up badly here. However, we hold our judgement until we see it for sure. He's earned that from the club and the faithful. In the meantime most of us will defend his reputation from scurrilous speculation. Also if it was a minor error in judgement he has enough credits in the bank that he'll be allowed to ride it out, so deal with it mate!

If Hird is implicated in this - I strongly doubt your mob will say 'woah were we wrong' or 'James time to step up'...my guess is it will be 'see you in court', 'conspiracy' and 'technically has done nought wrong'. By contrast if cleared - I would not run a guerilla campaign on the topic*

* outside the Bay

No problem with the wait and see approach.

In fact I know that I would be defending Crawford or similar when something like this breaks. The feeding frenzy around a potential "fallen champion" is disgusting. I know I always defended Cousins to the hilt. I'm sick of journalists embittered by the fact that they are always close to greatness, that is not theirs. I find it disgusting that the tribalism around football can be turned so cynically to a negative expression.

Cousins was portrayed as a drug taking tosser....check.

They are not targeting Hird because of his greatness, they are pointing out the fact that if you stand near him there is so much smoke that he should almost have to dress in plain packaging with a warning emblazoned across his chest.

Carro is attacking him because she is a journo that attacks the next target -in fact if I found out Nth Melb started this crap to get her off their case....I may just believe it.

Carlton is the team I feel the only intense rivalry and I can tell you I was as dismayed by their punishment a decade ago as any of them. I didn't want them decimated, I wanted to play them in finals. It isn't life and death here, Carlton are not another dynasty trying to wipe out mine. They are just another bunch of football followers who wear a different jumper than mine and we can "hate" each other for a few hours a couple of times a year, but not carry on like that after the game.

Carlton cheated and got such a kick in the nuts that I don't think any club will go back to under the table cashies ever again.

I had el zippo sorrow for Carlton, I had plenty of sympathy for their fan base.

Plus in my view - Bomber fans have shit canned Carlton fans as tanking cheats more than anyone else .....appears to be a case of crap it's happening to us - have sympathy.

If Essendon have cheated using illegal means - for the sake of the game they need to receive a similar decimation to act as a warning to not go there.

So when I hear people carry on about Buddy being a cokehead or Martin being a whatever I tell them to shut it. I hate the way people WANT to ruin people's reputations. Time, place, relevance!

Buddy's rumoured social dalliances versus systematic cheating are not even in the same post code.

Without doubt it looks like Essendon have ****ed up big time - who wears the responsibility is the important Q .....it will be one hell of a report that clears Hird but hey I'm willing to wait before casting my stones.

 

[CF]

James Hird before all this started was considered one of the main poster boys of the AFL brand. A brilliant footballer, a clever likeable bloke, a family man, a club legend, and good looking to boot.

The question I have for the footy public is regardless of the outcome of the ASADA findings and given that we know dodgy things were going even by Essendons own report... Has this whole scandal tarnished Hirds name now and forever?

Have we seen another great AFL icon fall?

I find now that I have lost the respect I once had for the man. This has nothing to do with the Robinson interview as I didn't even get to see that thanks to Foxtel ****ing up my recording of it. I just wonder if he can ever come back from this in terms of his football and public reputation.

 

[Dustin Credible]

There are probably several more twists in the story to come. But you'd have to think that it would need to be an almighty twist for this not to have irreparably damaged his reputation.

 

[ESKIE]

Yes his reputation shot, hard to see the Bombers really oving forward with hi there after the dust has settled..club legend or not

 

[BOMBERS 4 LIFE!!!!]

If he's guilty of doing bad things then yes he should be gone no player is bigger than the club but don't forget we haven't heard his side of the story yet and if i turns out that his not guilty then there will defamation lawsuits coming left,right and center.

 

[Mr Magic]

Some things mentioned if not prove as lies don't out him in a good light. The word architect seemed appropriately mentioned and it was pointed towards Hird as opposed to Bomber.

Whether Hird is guilty of this or not he might be guilty in other senses regarding management etc.. At the end of the day, can a golden boy work , or can he step away from the gold??


I would be concerned for McVeigh. He appeared evasive, seemed to play the corporate protective stooge well on appearance. Not sure if the media can see any value in him going on into the future to be frank. Is their a conflict of interest?? Is there cause for bias? He seemed more attached to his prior club than Lingy IMO

 

[Mr Magic]

Can the police come out and say his house wasn't raided??

 

[BOMBERS 4 LIFE!!!!]

Some things mentioned if not prove as lies don't out him in a good light. The word architect seemed appropriately mentioned and it was pointed towards Hird as opposed to Bomber.

Whether Hird is guilty of this or not he might be guilty in other senses regarding management etc.. At the end of the day, can a golden boy work , or can he step away from the gold??


I would be concerned for McVeigh. He appeared evasive, seemed to play the corporate protective stooge well on appearance. Not sure if the media can see any value in him going on into the future to be frank. Is their a conflict of interest?? Is there cause for bias? He seemed more attached to his prior club than Lingy IMO

Why because Spike could be telling the truth? he it might sound biased towards Essendon but he was at the club last year i think you will find that he will have a better understanding than most on what happened at Essendon last year.

And theirs nothing wrong what he said,he believes that what he got told and took was legal by the club.

 

[ESKIE]

Spike is lke most at *Essendon not the sharpest tools in the shed

 

[Mr Magic]

Why because Spike could be telling the truth? he it might sound biased towards Essendon but he was at the club last year i think you will find that he will have a better understanding than most on what happened at Essendon last year.

And theirs nothing wrong what he said,he believes that what he got told and took was legal by the club.

well just looking at the richmond board on the relevant thread the content towards McVeigh's apparent bias was hilarious so clearly I am not alone in my observation and interpretation. With that I will check out the bay

 

[FuManchu]

Why because Spike could be telling the truth? he it might sound biased towards Essendon but he was at the club last year i think you will find that he will have a better understanding than most on what happened at Essendon last year.

And theirs nothing wrong what he said,he believes that what he got told and took was legal by the club.

McVeigh lost all credibility the minute he tried to have everyone believe it was only vitamin c he was administered. Which is clearly now a huge porky

 

[lones37]

So clearly all the players are covering it up.

Thankfully ASADA has every last text message and phone call that went on from the key players.

Fairly certain that will put an end to who is lying.

 

[Wizard]

Does all this stuff make any one else question Hirdys career?

Clearly a fair ring leader in all of this stuff thats gone on at the club recently so makes you think how resourceful he might have been during his playing days.