Play Nice The NM Devil's Chessboard Thread - Part II

[Chadwiko]

 

[ferball]

Okay let me pivot here for a sec to test your position on this then ferball;

Are Russia a terrorist state for the cities they've absolutely levelled in Eastern Ukraine?

That's a fair question and I honestly can't answer it because I don't know enough of the specifics...

but

The OHCHR claims that there were officially 11, 520 civilian deaths from the invasion (24/2/22) until the end of July this year. This is in a serious war with alot of high tech weapons and alot of fighting in urban areas, across alot of different urban areas. IN a conflict that must have seen hundreds of thousands of deaths in combat. In comparison there were more than twice that many civilian casualties in the first 2 years of the Iraq war (2003) as opposed to the 2 years and five months of that those OHCHR figures cover. Its probably closer to three times that number over a similar timeframe in Iraq.

So it does seem that given the scale of the conflict and the intensity of fighting and the number of military casualties on both sides Russia is making some effort to minimise the number of civilian casualties. Which suggests they are not acting as terrorists, generally.

I could change my mind in relation to specific incidents tho provided they are independently verified by the UN.

 

[Val Keating]

By what definition is the war 'lost'?

Because they can’t defeat Russia. Russia has far too much power for Ukraine to beat, and even though other nations keep sending Ukraine weapons they won’t cross the line and go to war against Russia.

They won’t risk engaging directly with Russia because of mutually assured destruction.

 

[Val Keating]

Okay but then I'm curious; why do you say nothing about the actual North Korean troops, but you do about the potential NATO troops?

Also, not once have I ever "cheered" for a global war.

Because what North Korea has sent is nothing but a token gesture.

 

[Chadwiko]

Because they can’t defeat Russia. Russia has far too much power for Ukraine to beat, and even though other nations keep sending Ukraine weapons they won’t cross the line and go to war against Russia.

That's what people said about Afghanistan when Russia invaded them. Who won there?

That's what people said about Vietnam when America joined the war. Who won there?

etc

 

[Val Keating]

That's what people said about Afghanistan when Russia invaded them. Who won there?

That's what people said about Vietnam when America joined the war. Who won there?

etc

Both those countries were left in ruins. Is that winning?

 

[Sphynx]

Because what North Korea has sent is nothing but a token gesture.

Not really.

It’s the equivalent of 20% of the current standing British Army.

Or the full deployment of the Para’s, Rifles, Scot, York, Hussars, Dragoons and Houshold Cavalry regiments in their entirety.

In US terms, it would be like deploying one of the 101st or 82nd airborne in full. Hardly token at all.

 

[Chadwiko]

Both those countries were left in ruins. Is that winning?

Have you seen Eastern Ukraine?

 

[Chadwiko]

Because what North Korea has sent is nothing but a token gesture.

This is the first time ever that North Korea has contributed to/participated in a foreign war.

It is absolutely not a 'token gesture'.

 

[The Warlord]

Sure, that's a totally normal way to view my enjoyment of American football!

I know you enjoy American football for a number of reasons. Its your inability to acknowledge just how militarised US football culture, and society in general is that's the issue.

Just like I'm sure you'd agree that anyone who enjoys Australian football is an unhinged demagogue who supports the Australian military's war crimes in Afghanistan, right?

No, I wouldn't.

I mean we centre the military in the biggest marquee game of the year, and by using your logic anyone who enjoys footy must also be guilty of full and wholehearted support for everything that the Australian military represents and has ever undertaken!

I'm glad you brought up the Anzac Day game and round. Its a dedicated memorial day, many countries have them and observe them in the sports - poppies on shirts for Remembrance Day.

But the B2 bomber in Kansas, nah, they do that to OPEN THE SEASON, they use the military as a celebration, not for remembrance.

That's because the NFL, and US society in general, is deeply militarised.

STRIKE ONE FOR THE CHAD!

And if we take your established logic even further, because Australia's special forces contains Nazis, anyone who supports Australia (and by extension, the AFL) must themselves also be Nazis!

No, let's not use your imagined crap.

Let's use facts.

North have never had an Anzac Day jumper, indeed beyond a social media post on Remembrance Day, we don't go in for that.

Your NFL team?

Oh, they have a whole program for military stuff.

Washington Salute is the official military appreciation program of the Washington Commanders. First of its kind in the NFL, Washington Salute is where the team recognizes and gives back to active duty, veterans, and their families.

Washington Salute hosts events and programming 365 days a year from VIP experiences during OTA's to the USO National Capital District at Northwest Stadium. Special events like these allow service members to connect with the team and each other, sharing stories, experiences, and passion.

Washington Commanders Foundation | Washington Commanders - Commanders.com

So the team you get up to watch at 4AM is actually the most militarised of them all! And boy, doesn't it show.

STER-RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIKE TWO for Chad!

And while we're hear, let's acknowledge the reality of what a deeply militarised society the US is on the raw figures.

Roughly 7% of the adult population in the United States has served in the military at some point in their lives. This means that there are more than 18 million living veterans in the country

Wow, 7 per cent! 18 million people with military experience.

According to the 2021 Census, 2.8% of Australians aged 15 and over have served in the Australian Defence Force (ADF), or are currently serving.

I ain't no big city math guy, but I'm pretty sure 7 per cent is more than 2.8 per cent.

So not only do you get up at 4AM to immerse yourself in a deeply militarised sporting culture, you actually support the most militarised of all the possible teams (without going for the literal Army or Navy teams, oh when they play in front of an enormous crowd)

And that's STRIKE THREE for the Chaderino, he trudges away from the plate dejected, having been bested by the FACT BALL yet again.

 

[The Warlord]

Have you seen Eastern Ukraine?

Yes, tell us, how did Donetsk City end up with so much damage?

 

[Chadwiko]

I know you enjoy American football for a number of reasons. Its your inability to acknowledge just how militarised US football culture, and society in general is that's the issue.

The issue for who, exactly?

And that's STRIKE THREE for the Chaderino, he trudges away from the plate dejected, having been bested by the FACT BALL yet again.

Hahaha you took all weekend to come up with this dross, and you think it's good?! To the point you're celebrating your own post?!


Hahahahahahahaha

 

[The Warlord]

And just before the CIA style spin comes in, let's not forget the facts:

(Berlin) – Ukrainian government forces used cluster munitions in populated areas in Donetsk city in early October 2014, Human Rights Watch said today. The use of cluster munitions in populated areas violates the laws of war due to the indiscriminate nature of the weapon and may amount to war crimes.

Ukraine: Widespread Use of Cluster Munitions

www.hrw.org

They kept this kind of stuff - shelling civilians - up for a another eight or so years ...

 

[ferball]

That's what people said about Afghanistan when Russia invaded them. Who won there?

That's what people said about Vietnam when America joined the war. Who won there?

etc

You know there are clear differences between those conflicts and this one.

Also it wasn't Russia, it was the USSR.

 

[Chadwiko]

You know there are clear differences between those conflicts and this one.

Every conflict is different from every other conflict in some way.

Comparisons can still be made.

Also it wasn't Russia, it was the USSR.

Okay sure. Not certain why you felt the need to point that out. But sure.

 

[ferball]

Every conflict is different from every other conflict in some way.

Comparisons can still be made.

There's a very specific reason why what happened in Afghanistan and Vietnam won't happen in Ukraine if the war continues as it is now.

Okay sure. Not certain why you felt the need to point that out. But sure.

Because its a fact. The USSR wasn't Russia. It included Ukraine and a whole bunch of other nations.

 

[Dan]

Let's be clear on a few things here;

1. Biden is still fit to be President. If he wasn't, then he wouldn't be the President. That's why the 25th Amendment exists.
2. Biden's own party did not "force him to withdraw".
3. Biden was not "losing his mind before he was elected".
4. Biden withdrew from running again because he decided that it was the right thing to do. Which was noble.

Quite frankly, if you think Biden was "losing his mind" before he was even elected then you and I are not going to find common ground here. You say you don't even follow any Republicans for them to trick you? Well then you've just embraced their propaganda independently. That's impressive.

Your guy got pushed out because team blue knew they couldn't win with Biden still running. Instead of losing with dignity they've thrown Harris in only months out from the vote.

The public sees what it sees......if none of the Biden fumbles mattered (and there's a lot) and he was still a chance of beating Trump he'd still be in the race.

In an ideal scenario...team blue would rather have a declining Biden in power so that he can be controlled and they can push their agenda with Biden merely being the figure head.


and you knew what Val meant when he said Biden was no longer President. Yes....Biden is still President till Inauguration Day but that's just a formality.

 

[Chadwiko]

 

[The Warlord]

 

[travelli]

He's such a weirdo. Doesnt fill you with much confidence if he gets in.

 

[The Warlord]

That's what people said about Afghanistan when Russia invaded them. Who won there?

That's what people said about Vietnam when America joined the war. Who won there?

etc

You're so Russia obsessed it's quite funny.

But Afghanistan is a good comparison nevertheless.

The Soviets actually withdrew in good order in the late 80s. The government they left behind fought very well against the psychpathic jihadis you Americans armed and funded for years.

Najibullah fell in 1992 because Soviet funding dried up after that polity collapsed.

Now let's look at what happened in Afghanistan far more recently.

After promising they would never abandon the girls and women of Afghanistan, you Americans promptly changed your mind, shamefully surrendered to the Taliban and the world saw the shambling rout at Kabul Airport.

Ukraine will be different again, their main issue is manpower. US support has already tailed off dramatically and Israel is now the priority for everything.

Israel gets THAAD and is so well supplied by the US it can afford to drop dozens of advanced bombs on a single target.

Ukraine gets the odd Patriot the Russians patiently sniff out then pulverise with missiles.

I don't know how Ukraine ends, but already the Ukrainians are crying betrayal and the Yanks promised them the world if they fought and are now selling them out.

Like how every US ally eventually gets sold out.

 

[Chadwiko]

He's such a weirdo. Doesnt fill you with much confidence if he gets in.

Yeah. I can't imagine supporting him or ever being in lock-step with him in terms of his policies and worldview.

Would make me take a massive pause.

 

[The Warlord]

If he does get in Vance and Thiel will knock him off as quickly as they can IMO

 

[Chadwiko]

You're so Russia obsessed it's quite funny.

Imagine saying this to someone else, and then proceeding to go on a rant about how Russia is great and apparently it was AKSHUALLY a good thing that they invaded Afghanistan and then left.

I am begging you to get some self-awareness. Begging.

 

[The Warlord]

Yeah. I can't imagine supporting him or ever being in lock-step with him in terms of his policies and worldview.

Can you imagine why people do support him though?

It's not only possible but necessary to defeating him.

Like, why do you think after everything that's happened tens of millions of Americans still support him?