The Year Of The Midfielders - How Many Do We Need ??

[LordLucifer]

Based on the Swans tactic of having their rotating mids resting across the forward line, they have dramatically increased the standard number most teams would be using.

Malthouse has signalled that we need a major boost in the midfield which is a fair enough statement but the question remains, how many do we really need ??

By my reckoning, you need at least 9 in the team every week meaning that you probably need about 15 at the club overall.

A-Grade
NIL

B-Grade
Marc Murphy
Chris Judd
Bryce Gibbs
Andrew Carrazzo

C-Grade
Dylan Buckley
Kane Lucas
Denis Armfield
Mitch Robinson
Brock McLean
David Ellard
Nick Graham

I purposely have not included Simpson & Yarran as they have played their best football off half-back.

 

[gandaal]

Based on the Swans tactic of having their rotating mids resting across the forward line, they have dramatically increased the standard number most teams would be using.

Malthouse has signalled that we need a major boost in the midfield which is a fair enough statement but the question remains, how many do we really need ??

By my reckoning, you need at least 9 in the team every week meaning that you probably need about 15 at the club overall.

A-Grade
NIL

B-Grade
Marc Murphy
Chris Judd
Bryce Gibbs
Andrew Carrazzo

C-Grade
Dylan Buckley
Kane Lucas
Denis Armfield
Mitch Robinson
Brock McLean
David Ellard
Nick Graham

I purposely have not included Simpson & Yarran as they have played their best football off half-back.

Good Thread.

You probably need a D grade and maybe even a E grade there unfortunately. Buckley and McLean aren't realistically at the same level. You also missed Tom Bell and Cachia.

We probably need about two or three top 22 mids to boost the team and increase the competition for spots.

While everyone is bagging the idea, because he's a tool and a scumbag, but the recruitment of Didak is giving us exactly the player your talking about. Someone who can play forward and rotate through the midfield.

 

[LordLucifer]

I'll tell you exactly how many we need............................lots of them, but we've known that now for three years.

Murphy at his best is an A-Grader. Played impeded this year.
Gibbs will have the heat turned on next year and I wouldn't call McLean a C-Grader either.
Menzel is being geared for a mid post and Graham is a good get for us.

We'd want a couple of mids in through the trade period and a couple of good kids in the draft................and then again next year.

Regardless of whether I agree or disagree with you about Menzel, the fact is that at present, he isn't a midfielder whatsoever. Gibbs has only just been played in the guts so there is nothing concrete we can say about his contribution there because realistically, its all purely speculation.

What my list does highlight though is how fragile our midfield fleet is right now. It has been over-rated for far too long and needs a strategic tweak if we are to match with the best in the competition.

 

[T2B_]

Frustrating thing about Robbo is, on his day, he can play like a real (berserk) A-grader, but it doesn't happen often enough.
Would still pick him every week but.

I'd also have McLean at B-grade, at least until he just can't run anymore.

 

[Silvagnis]

Stopped reading at Murphy not being an A grader.

 

[LordLucifer]

Stopped reading at Murphy not being an A grader.

Of course you did, your opinion is the only one that counts.

 

[gandaal]

Your only as good as your recent performances.

Murphy is not a A-Grader based on this season. He has his excuses but that's just the facts atm.

But this thread isn't about whether Murph is a A-grader or not, it's about our rubbish midfield.

With Graham coming on next year do we have enough talent within our team to fix this problem? I think that we do but it's whether our players have the desire and work ethic to actually turn themselves into a full time mid that will determine whether we can do it or not. Guys like Yarran and Touhy needs to build that base and start performing in the midfield. Hopefully our new fitness coach will help with that.

 

[Blues Premiers 2013]

Get Savage, Docherty, Adams.

Draft Well, and pick up a Gumbleton type.

This is all.

 

[T2B_]

Get Savage, Docherty, Adams.

Draft Well, and pick up a Gumbleton type.

This is all.

Without the injuries you mean

 

[Blues Premiers 2013]

Without the injuries you mean

Would rather Staker than Gumbleton tbh. He offers more versatility than Gumbleton and would cost us less.

 

[Bronze]

Bit tough on McLean. He is superior to Carrazzo in my opinion.
That list actually shows how much we lack depth in the midfield. Very scary actually. Blokes like Ellard, Lucas and Buckley are miles off becoming B graders too. Injuries to Murphy and Gibbs would kill the team.
I hope we get some "ready made" midfielders on to the list during trade time.

 

[Dan Cooper]

You only have to look at the Brownlow voting to recognize that midfielders are the only important players on the field now.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

AFL supporting is like being in a goldfish bowl. The 'you are only as good as your most recent performances' cliché is over-applied and applied way too soon.

Murphy was AFLCA Player of the Year in 2011, All Australian in 2011, John Nicholls medallist in 2011. He was one of the Brownlow favourites before that collision with Dangerfield in 2012. He's been down since but is still averaging about 22 disposals. He is in his prime at 26, not an aging declining former star.

Some supporters do tend to overrate our own players, no doubt, but they do so out of a sense of goodwill and wishful thinking. Some chronically underrate our players in comparison to other team's players as well. If we go that way, we should be surprised every time we are out of the bottom 4.

I think we can make allowances for Murph for a season. He'll need to step it up again next year. Any more injury hampered seasons will see his stock fall as quick as Daisy Thomas who was being touted as the best player in the comp a couple of years ago, by Ross Lyon IIRC.

 

[gandaal]

AFL supporting is like being in a goldfish bowl. The 'you are only as good as your most recent performances' cliché is over-applied and applied way too soon.

Murphy was AFLCA Player of the Year in 2011, All Australian in 2011, John Nicholls medallist in 2011. He was one of the Brownlow favourites before that collision with Dangerfield in 2012. He's been down since but is still averaging about 22 disposals. He is in his prime at 26, not an aging declining former star.

Some supporters do tend to overrate our own players, no doubt, but they do so out of a sense of goodwill and wishful thinking. Some chronically underrate our players in comparison to other team's players as well. If we go that way, we should be surprised every time we are out of the bottom 4.

I think we can make allowances for Murph for a season. He'll need to step it up again next year. Any more injury hampered seasons will see his stock fall as quick as Daisy Thomas who was being touted as the best player in the comp a couple of years ago, by Ross Lyon IIRC.

It's not like we're throwing him under a bus

If you're not going to judge a player after an injury effected season or two, should we really judge a player on one season alone? 2011 was a very good year for Murph but he wasn't the same player before or since.

When do you judge a player, at his peak or average it out over his career?

 

[LordLucifer]

You only have to look at the Brownlow voting to recognize that midfielders are the only important players on the field now.

The Carlton player who rec'd the most Brownlow votes was A. Walker who plays off half-back so that is a true pointer to where the quality of our midfield depth lies.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

It's not like we're throwing him under a bus

If you're not going to judge a player after an injury effected season or two, should we really judge a player on one season alone? 2011 was a very good year for Murph but he wasn't the same player before or since.

When do you judge a player, at his peak or average it out over his career?

It's only logical that if 2011 was his best season, that he wasn't that same player before or since. However 2009 was also a stellar season for him and 2008 and 2010 pretty damn solid. He was also best first year player in 2006.

He earned his right to have progressively been considered an elite midfielder by the time 2011 was done and dusted, and it wasn't just based on one good season. The fact that he was high in the betting after the first few games of 2012 before getting injured, suggested he was still on that upward curve.

You can disagree. I just think we need to have a proper look at it. I don't get why we say someone is A grade, B grade, no A grade again, wait B grade at best. I'm not asking people to think about his form many years ago. We see how much Judd gets written off only to show it up our proverbials time and time again.

 

[LordLucifer]

Yes, but it's nothing new and it's hardly by-passed Malthouse either. He knew that when he signed on.

We've been skating on thin ice for a couple of years where our mids are concerned and the development of some of the guys we had hoped would become mid-field players.

I can't but look at the situation as a "let's reload" scenario. As a matter of fact, we've got little choice. Trade well, draft well, develop extremely well.

Agreed, we need to top up with as many as we can get and as quickly as we can get too. Problem is, you can't always draft good ones so there is a hit & miss factor that comes into play.

 

[Ciretose]

Ledger anyone?

 

[thylacine60]

It's unbalanced. Whoever we get, we need about 14 of them able to spin through the middle.

 

[Mezzoculo]

Ledger anyone?

The few Saints fans i know were mystified as to why he didn't get more time in the seniors.
Reckon he'd be worth a look.

 

[Blugazi]

Grab T.Adams, and use our first pick on one. We're back in business.

 

[AB_Blue]

One wonders what the 120 cap will do to midfield rotations next year.
Less rotations, less midfielders ?
More small Fwds spending time in the rotations (and for longer)?

 

[Faz 2000]

One wonders what the 120 cap will do to midfield rotations next year.
Less rotations, less midfielders ?
More small Fwds spending time in the rotations (and for longer)?

Less room for players who cannot go through middle.... Say, small forward only types.

 

[Jock]

Thomas, Adams and the best VFL midfielder would see us right and give us the depth we are missing. What's the chance of this happening though.

 

[MightyBlue]

Think thylacine60 is right, 14 is ideal. Would like at least 4 of our back 6 to be settled, with 2 running through the middle, 3 permenant forwards (3 rotating), and 1 primary ruckman.

Murphy, Gibbs, Judd, Carazzo, Mclean are all genuine quality mids when fit (5).

Walks and Simmo can certainly run through there from defense. Thouy was great this year, but can certainly improve enough to add to the rotations more consistently (3).

Yarren and Jeffy (and Eddie if he's still around) really need to build their tanks in order to provide more value in this area, but they're certainly skilled enough (2).

Curnow I think has improved significantly, I see him developing in to run with player in the Carazzo mold. Hope Lucas signs on with us, definitely has potential especially if he can improve his tackling technique. Robinson had some pretty ordinary games, but also had a couple pretty impressive performances. If he gets his shit together consistently he can lift the team like few others can (3).

Nick Graham didn't disappoint and is only going to get better. I think Menzel is tremendously skilled, but believe he will need another 1 or 2 preseasons before he shows us what he's really capable of (2).

That's 15 all up who could conceivably contribute in the midfield next year. Obviously not all of these will improve to the level required; some may decline, some could be injured or used permanently in other roles.

Definitely an advocate for more quality mids at the club. If we can recruit 2 first choice mids and keep our existing better ones on the park I think we'll drastically improve. We were 3rd in both contested possessions and clearances, but finished dead last for disposal efficiency (how many times were our clearances cut off by an opposition half back waiting for the quick kick forward this year, Sydney killed us in this area). Get the boys to work/spread harder when we've got possession and ffs get a decent tackling coach.