Thread hijacked, don’t bother entering unless you want to be bored by repetition.

[Black_White]

Penny has expressed in the past that she has no desire to be party leader. I doubt that she has changed her mind. Seems weird she should top a leadership poll. Anyway, I suspect I am on my own in here not being particularly enamoured with her as a politician, though I suspect Paul Keating has his reservations.

It wasn’t a specific “leader” poll.
It’s a poll on how well our leaders are thought of by the public. And like all ministers and shadow ministers, they are our leaders.
That the article only referenced prime minister, oppo leader and former PM’s is misleading.
Fact still remains that Wong is #1!

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

I know you, surely, you're disenchanted with Keating's position on China, he's sort of like a CCP shill.
I think in other areas she's been a sort of unifier in the region. I'm a fan, I think she's done well TBH, couldn't have been worse than the previous government.

You're right, I don't agree with Keating's position on China, and don't have a problem with Penny being critical of that country. I do however agree with his belief that Australia is too keen to support the USA in international affairs. I also didn't mind his much earlier comment that foreign affairs was not about swanning around the Pacific Islands handing out money with a garland of flowers draped around your neck. He obviously has his doubts about Penny. I probably wouldn't be giving her a 2nd thought had Labor not unequivocally supported Israel. Giving Netanyahu a carte blanche to do what he liked didn't strike me as a smart political move.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

It wasn’t a specific “leader” poll.
It’s a poll on how well our leaders are thought of by the public. And like all ministers and shadow ministers, they are our leaders.
That the article only referenced prime minister, oppo leader and former PM’s is misleading.
Fact still remains that Wong is #1!

I didn't read the article and assumed it was one of those preferred leaders polls. Wong has one thing going for her in the current political climate - lack of any real competition in either party for the number 1 spot.

.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Jesus H Christ is there no-one in politics with any integrity left?

David McBride’s sentencing is in less than a week now.

This video is beyond brilliant. Reposted by Julia Zemiro.

 

[Maggie5]

Penny has expressed in the past that she has no desire to be party leader. I doubt that she has changed her mind. Seems weird she should top a leadership poll. Anyway, I suspect I am on my own in here not being particularly enamoured with her as a politician, though I suspect Paul Keating has his reservations.

Maybe not as a politician but a pretty good human being. Very approachable and many young girls write to her and she answers letters personally. Even arranged a meet up with a couple of teenagers I knew some years ago who were interested in politics as a career. (they didn't follow through with that career option).

 

[JB1975]

Jesus H Christ is there no-one in politics with any integrity left?

David McBride’s sentencing is in less than a week now.

This video is beyond brilliant. Reposted by Julia Zemiro.

Albanese's government is just as bad as scummy Scott on issues of transparency and accountability.

I know we should be flattered by Labor's attempts to sugarcoat its s***, but it leaves me underwhelmed.

 

[Black_White]

I didn't read the article and assumed it was one of those preferred leaders polls. Wong has one thing going for her in the current political climate - lack of any real competition in either party for the number 1 spot.

.

And the fact she’s doing a fantastic job.
And if you think Keating’s comment are worth 5 cents then you don’t understand just how much of a Chinese spokesman he has become.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

And the fact she’s doing a fantastic job.
And if you think Keating’s comment are worth 5 cents then you don’t understand just how much of a Chinese spokesman he has become.

Keating has been critical of her in other contexts. I am no fan of China. If you re 100% behind the Palestinians, your opinion of Wong is going to be very different from that of an Israel die hard. Israel is the only foreign policy issue of any genuine local concern at present, and I hate the role that Australia has chosen to play, and Penny Wong has been the face of it.

 

[Black_White]

Keating has been critical of her in other contexts. I am no fan of China. If you re 100% behind the Palestinians, your opinion of Wong is going to be very different from that of an Israel die hard. Israel is the only foreign policy issue of any genuine local concern at present, and I hate the role that Australia has chosen to play, and Penny Wong has been the face of it.

It’s a role we’ve had for decades and pretty much held by both sides of politics.
As far as Keatings criticisms of her in other contexts, I assume this relates her whirlwind tour of our near neighbours after the neglect that the coalition government spent on them over several years. His comments may stem from the fact that tour had pushed China back from its intentions in this region.
Keating always puts China first.

 

[vindaloo]

Fascinating article. Israel doesn't even get mentioned.

How terrible would a second Trump presidency be for Australia? Terrible enough

Now that Donald Trump is the inevitable Republican candidate, countries everywhere need to prepare. Can Australia Trump-proof itself?

www.smh.com.au

The world's a more 'interesting' place if anything else.

 

[sr36]

It’s a role we’ve had for decades and pretty much held by both sides of politics.
As far as Keatings criticisms of her in other contexts, I assume this relates her whirlwind tour of our near neighbours after the neglect that the coalition government spent on them over several years. His comments may stem from the fact that tour had pushed China back from its intentions in this region.
Keating always puts China first.

I'm with PK. Yanks are in the midst of going off the rails and we're tying ourselves to them with knots that can't be untied without dismantling our defence.

No matter what we do or who we tie ourselves to, it's China's future. I'm more positive about the future with China as the superpower than most - they'll do what's in China's interests, but their ideologues are old and dying and their beauracracy is a meritocracy which attracts the most brilliant minds in China and they think long term. Hopefully that means they'll calculate that what's in the best interests of China is global peace and prosperity. Amittedly, what they do to get that could be horrensdous. That's probably all blind optimism, but it's their future regardless and what we do won't change that. Let's not be pulled under by the flailing yanks, who won't cope well with not being top dog after decades of smug certain superiority.

 

[vindaloo]

I'm with PK. Yanks are in the midst of going off the rails and we're tying ourselves to them with knots that can't be untied without dismantling our defence.

No matter what we do or who we tie ourselves to, it's China's future. I'm more positive about the future with China as the superpower than most - they'll do what's in China's interests, but their ideologues are old and dying and their beauracracy is a meritocracy which attracts the most brilliant minds in China and they think long term. Hopefully that means they'll calculate that what's in the best interests of China is global peace and prosperity. Amittedly, what they do to get that could be horrensdous. That's probably all blind optimism, but it's their future regardless and what we do won't change that. Let's not be pulled under by the flailing yanks, who won't cope well with not being top dog after decades of smug certain superiority.

This is definitely a woke outlook especially in the face of evidence over the past few years. You musn't have read up on China's military build up, traded of with it's flailing economy, it's property market which has crashed. it's shrinking population. And on the other side the Yanks are doing OK. China have all sorts of problems at the moment and with what has happened over the past few years well, they might not ever go past the Yanks with the problems they face. With a dictator like Xi when things are going bad, makes it ripe to invade Taiwan. I'm sure you'll call this a civil war though surely?

 

[sr36]

This is definitely a woke outlook especially in the face of evidence over the past few years. You musn't have read up on China's military build up, traded of with it's flailing economy, it's property market which has crashed. it's shrinking population. And on the other side the Yanks are doing OK. China have all sorts of problems at the moment and with what has happened over the past few years well, they might not ever go past the Yanks with the problems they face. With a dictator like Xi when things are going bad, makes it ripe to invade Taiwan. I'm sure you'll call this a civil war though surely?

Xi's dead in the timeframe I'm talking about. He'll be 90 when Aukus delivers us subs.

No I won't call it a civil war when they annexTaiwan. I'll call it a horrible action. There's some shithouse decades ahead.

P.S. It's not woke, PK wasn't close to woke. It's pragmatism and risk mmt - the Yanks aren't who they were, they're a risk.

 

[vindaloo]

Xi's dead in the timeframe I'm talking about. He'll be 90 when Aukus delivers us subs.

No I won't call it a civil war when they annexTaiwan. I'll call it a horrible action. There's some shithouse decades ahead.

P.S. It's not woke, PK wasn't close to woke. It's pragmatism and risk mmt - the Yanks aren't who they were, they're a risk.

PK has been a disgrace the past few years and a China syhophant. Taiwan will be bloody from what I've read up on through people with expertise on the matter. And China probably wouldn't 'win', it's a lot harder to fight a war over sea. Not to mention China is stumbling, US is actually doing OK, and India is booming. The geopolitical future is interesting, agree with some troublesome decades ahead though.

 

[sr36]

PK has been a disgrace the past few years and a China syhophant. Taiwan will be bloody from what I've read up on through people with expertise on the matter. And China probably wouldn't 'win', it's a lot harder to fight a war over sea. Not to mention China is stumbling, US is actually doing OK, and India is booming. The geopolitical future is interesting, agree with some troublesome decades ahead though.

China will do it as a much longer and slower action than you're envisaging. The analysis of what would happen if China tried to invade tomorrow is irrelevant as that won't be their MO. They won't just storm the beach. It'll be a decade or more of cyber attacks and other hostile attacks that aren't big enough for a proper military response. They'll weaken Taiwan and gradually build up to annexation. But they'll ideally first try what they're trying - get a non-separatist government in Taiwan and have it a gradual unification without military action.

Taiwan and China is more complicated than how we view it - a lot of the Taiwanese powerbase do consider themselves and the island to be part of China, but don't won't to be part of CCP's China. In the current divide, One China messaging began in Taiwan with the former Chinese government and rulers of Taiwan in exile on the Chinese island, bombarding the communist mainland with messages of re-unification. China hasn't got much time left for that to benefit them though as the younger generation don't view it that way. Generational change in both Taiwan and the CCP might change things, but the current Chinese mob are hellbent on unification.

 

[vindaloo]

China will do it as a much longer and slower action than you're envisaging. The analysis of what would happen if China tried to invade tomorrow is irrelevant as that won't be their MO. They won't just storm the beach. It'll be a decade or more of cyber attacks and other hostile attacks that aren't big enough for a proper military response. They'll weaken Taiwan and gradually build up to annexation. But they'll ideally first try what they're trying - get a non-separatist government in Taiwan and have it a gradual unification without military action.

Taiwan and China is more complicated than how we view it - a lot of the Taiwanese powerbase do consider themselves and the island to be part of China, but don't won't to be part of CCP's China. In the current divide, One China messaging began in Taiwan with the former Chinese government and rulers of Taiwan in exile on the Chinese island, bombarding the communist mainland with messages of re-unification. China hasn't got much time left for that to benefit them though as the younger generation don't view it that way. Generational change in both Taiwan and the CCP might change things, but the current Chinese mob are hellbent on unification.

Despite warnings that from people with actual expertise that an invasion would appear more likely sooner than previously anticipated. Despite Taiwan electing a government that was not friendly with China.

Honestly with all the evidence it would seem you're writing a fictitious view of the future based on your own ideology. Stop it.

 

[sr36]

Despite warnings that from people with actual expertise that an invasion would appear more likely sooner than previously anticipated. Despite Taiwan electing a government that was not friendly with China.

Honestly with all the evidence it would seem you're writing a fictitious view of the future based on your own ideology. Stop it.

More likely doesn't make it likely. An invasion becomes more likely every year that passes, as China knows that with generational change less and less Taiwanese view Taiwan as Chinese. So a peaceful re-unification becomes more and more remote every year that passes.

They'll make a move at some stage. But, storming Taipei isn't likely. Much more likely that they'll do it slowly - a decade of further escalation of cyber attacks and other minor attacks on infrastructure - not big enough to trigger the big players. They'll weaken them for ages first - they're not taking a risk like a sudden invasion - it's not in their interests to be viewed that way - and modern China acts in her interests.

 

[JB1975]

John Howard's decision to involve Australia in the 'War on Terror' in Iraq was a crime, and the war itself did more to stimulate global terrorism than any action since the Soviet war in Afghanistan.

The release of Cabinet papers of the period show how utterly gutless the Howard government was at the time, such that it dared not to redeploy a couple hundred Australian troops from Iraq for fear of upsetting the US.

Staying the course: Howard rolled Defence plan to cut Iraq presence

Seven months after the invasion of Iraq, the Defence Department said it was time to cut Australia’s troop presence. Secret documents reveal how the plan was thwarted.

www.theage.com.au

 

[frizzle]

Albanese's government is just as bad as scummy Scott on issues of transparency and accountability.

I know we should be flattered by Labor's attempts to sugarcoat its s***, but it leaves me underwhelmed.

When you start to realise that neither side of politics give a fat rats about you, then you can do some research & perhaps even awaken from the slumber most are under these days. I mean we have a massive housing crisis & they keep flooding the country with immigrants.

We have a massive cost of living issue & we keep sending billions overseas. Neither side of politics actually care about the average Australian at all.

 

[JB1975]

When you start to realise that neither side of politics give a fat rats about you, then you can do some research & perhaps even awaken from the slumber most are under these days. I mean we have a massive housing crisis & they keep flooding the country with immigrants.

We have a massive cost of living issue & we keep sending billions overseas. Neither side of politics actually care about the average Australian at all.

View attachment 1929646

A funny thing happened in the 20th century, which is that politics and technology brought the world closer together.

No country is an island, in political and economic terms.

Australia benefits more than most from the ways things are run, and it also has a responsibility to the rest of the world.

Blaming immigration for the housing crisis and COL pressures is dumb, almost as dumb as the conspiratorial nonsense surrounding the WEF.

 

[sr36]

When you start to realise that neither side of politics give a fat rats about you, then you can do some research & perhaps even awaken from the slumber most are under these days. I mean we have a massive housing crisis & they keep flooding the country with immigrants.

We have a massive cost of living issue & we keep sending billions overseas. Neither side of politics actually care about the average Australian at all.

View attachment 1929646

Our biggest number of immigration visas is company sponsored and skilled worker visas, designed to benefit the economy. The aim is for them to improve the standard of living in Australia. Then comes family reuinion. Our humanitarian visa numbers are very bloody small - and embarassing for a country that has been known to strut the global stage preaching humanitarianism.

Do you want us to not benefit the economy during a cost of living crisis - just take an economic hit - worsening the cost of living pressures?

 

[frizzle]

Our biggest number of immigration visas is company sponsored and skilled worker visas, designed to benefit the economy. The aim is for them to improve the standard of living in Australia. Then comes family reuinion. Our humanitarian visa numbers are very bloody small - and embarassing for a country that has been known to strut the global stage preaching humanitarianism.

Do you want us to not benefit the economy during a cost of living crisis - just take an economic hit - worsening the cost of living pressures?

To improve the standard of living. OMG. How’s that working out for you? You’re living under a rock. I’ll leave you there.

 

[sr36]

To improve the standard of living. OMG. How’s that working out for you? You’re living under a rock. I’ll leave you there.

I've been hit hard by interest rates and cost of living increases and have had to seriously tighten the belt, but that's cyclical.

Standard of living continues to rise. We send a heap more of our kids to university than our parents did. Go on overseas holidays a heap more. Go out to entertain ourselves more. Spend a heap more on entertaining ouselves at home. We eat out a heap more than our parents did. And are much fussier eating a higher standard of food at home. We give our kids more pocket money. Give our kids more of everything. Live in bigger houses. Go to coffee shops a heap more than our parents did. Own more cars. Own more of just about everything - from technology through to clothes. We consume more. We have better medicine. And we live longer. Expectations are higher and the gap between the rich and poor is growing, but the standard of living is increasing - in terms of both material standard of living, leisure and physical health - however, mental health has appeared to take a hit. I'd put that down to expectations as well as some other cultural changes.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Assange has won the right to an appeal of his extradition!

EDIT: The US has the ability to give renewed assurances that it will give Assange First Amendment rights, and that it will not impose the death penalty.

That will be tricky, because under the Espionage Act from which he has been charged, you are barred from pleading a public interest defence… so he can’t very well claim it comes under freedom of speech.