Player Watch Tom Mitchell

[RobJD]

Some of it comes down to breeders - some of them are good and some are bloody awful.

My grandad used to breed purebred English Bulldogs and always said some bloodlines are simply flawed and should be bred out.

Sadly the ruling body lacks the stones to make breeders be truly responsible.

Yes, I blame the Show community (my dog training was in Obedience Trials, so I admit my conflict of interests) - showing has too much emphasis on confirmation and too little on temperament and character.

 

[RobJD]

Yes, I blame the Show community (my dog training was in Obedience Trials, so I admit my conflict of interests) - showing has too much emphasis on confirmation and too little on temperament and character.

a bit like judging a wine on it's look without assessing taste and smell.

 

[jonbe54]

Yes, I blame the Show community (my dog training was in Obedience Trials, so I admit my conflict of interests) - showing has too much emphasis on confirmation and too little on temperament and character.

True enough - the key to public safety even above and beyond breeding guidelines should be a thorough vetting of any owner wishing to buy 'pit' breeds.

There have been cases of serial abusers who replace a poor animal that has been beaten into savagery with another or similar breed. These creeps are nothing less than sadists who inflict their corrupted desires on both innocent animal and their human victims when they turn savage.

 

[Apex36]

A lot of short memories regarding Mitchell. I really hope ho goes well for us, but I recall he was ridiculed at times for his accumulating possessions but not hurting opposition teams. Bucks wouldn't tag him and Adam Treloar made fun of his ineffective handballing on-field. I think Parrish from the Bombers is a similar player.
Having said that, I hope he has a great year.

By Hawthorn supporters or opposition fans? Every oppo supporter is quick to pile on stars from other teams, Swan at his most dominant was supposedly a seagull who couldn’t really hurt you because his kicking wasn’t great. We all saw Mitchell as an accumulator who didn’t hurt you with his handballing, but Hawks supporters knew he was dishing out those handballs to players who could do damage, which is exactly what we need right now.
Funny you mention AT ridiculing him, because as I remember it, Mitchell was carving us up that night in the clearances and AT was trying (unsuccessfully I might add) to get in his head. Yes, Buckley never tagged him. And it never really worked out well for us, did it?

 

[RobJD]

True enough - the key to public safety even above and beyond breeding guidelines should be a thorough vetting of any owner wishing to buy 'pit' breeds.

There have been cases of serial abusers who replace a poor animal that has been beaten into savagery with another or similar breed. These creeps are nothing less than sadists who inflict their corrupted desires on both innocent animal and their human victims when they turn savage.

I've done some research on the pit breeds as a result of my accidental acquisition of my little Leo - seems that there's two distinct types of pit dogs - those that have been bred and conditioned to attack/fight, and those that haven't - same dog, completely different animal - all due to irresponsible breeding and conditioning. Traditional obedience training has attack work as the final set of training - for a good reason, you need to have control of your dog in every situation before contemplating attack work, doing it the other way around results in the potential for nothing more than an uncontrolled dangerous weapon

 

[Bianconeri]

Arguable he's in the best 22? Bucks loves to neg the guy. Our second favourite for brownlow behind Nick, and Bucks has him as a fringe player. & who's gonna replace him as the extractor we need... Finn, Arlo? & Pendles doesnt even play that role

Bucks doesn’t rate him after letting him collect 40 possessions against us each time

 

[jonbe54]

I've done some research on the pit breeds as a result of my accidental acquisition of my little Leo - seems that there's two distinct types of pit dogs - those that have been bred and conditioned to attack/fight, and those that haven't - same dog, completely different animal - all due to irresponsible breeding and conditioning. Traditional obedience training has attack work as the final set of training - for a good reason, you need to have control of your dog in every situation before contemplating attack work, doing it the other way around results in the potential for nothing more than an uncontrolled dangerous weapon

Couldn't agree more Rob. The Master Dog Breeders Association have been deeply careless to allow the uncontrolled ownership of those pit breeds.

It amounts to criminal negligence and governments should be held to account for not forcing the MDBA into line with community expectations.

Whether the pit breeds should ever have been developed is a moot point, but those two organizations should be held retroactively responsible for every attack of animals only doing what they were bred to do.

 

[Mollythedolly]

A lot of short memories regarding Mitchell. I really hope ho goes well for us, but I recall he was ridiculed at times for his accumulating possessions but not hurting opposition teams. Bucks wouldn't tag him and Adam Treloar made fun of his ineffective handballing on-field. I think Parrish from the Bombers is a similar player.
Having said that, I hope he has a great year.

I’ve always questioned his impact on a game. Big possession numbers with minimal hurt. That said, we needed to improve our clearance record and that’s his 1 wood.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

A lot of short memories regarding Mitchell. I really hope ho goes well for us, but I recall he was ridiculed at times for his accumulating possessions but not hurting opposition teams. Bucks wouldn't tag him and Adam Treloar made fun of his ineffective handballing on-field. I think Parrish from the Bombers is a similar player.
Having said that, I hope he has a great year.

And all of the people who say that have NFI.

Tom Mitchell has been a superstar, in 2018 when the comments were made previously (2017) he had gone (2nd in the brownlow) and then onto win it in 2018, having 54 touches and 27 contested against Collingwood R1, averaging about 16 contested for the season, 8 clearances and just dominating.

He's a star, his connection for you guys with De Goey has already been on full display, he had almost 30 and 15 contested and plenty of clearances, his lightning quick hands, decision making in tight and just ability at the contest is still the best in the competition, he spreads and runs all day and he finds the footy in link up and he'll open the play up for Collingwood, giving the ball to players in better positions, and with the amount of class in your team, you'll reap the benefits and rewards.

Parish from the Bombers isn't a good comparison bar the fact they both get high numbers, what they do with them, and their games, are way different.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

He will make DeGoey better and will help transition Nick D into the midfield.

Mitchell reduces our reliance on adams who himself becomes a weapon by not being the only clearance mid in the team. I see a lot of comparisons between mitchell arriving at the club, to Luke Ball.

 

[sr36]

No, but I was waiting to see who would be the first “ insert adjective here” to ask.

Adjectives need nouns. Inserting an adjective there wouldn't work.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Adjectives need nouns. Inserting an adjective there wouldn't work.

Good pickup… I never said it had to be grammatically correct though! A highly descriptive noun ( preceded by an adjective) was what i was looking for… but I’m sure you got the gist.

 

[Jasper84]

A lot of short memories regarding Mitchell. I really hope ho goes well for us, but I recall he was ridiculed at times for his accumulating possessions but not hurting opposition teams. Bucks wouldn't tag him and Adam Treloar made fun of his ineffective handballing on-field. I think Parrish from the Bombers is a similar player.
Having said that, I hope he has a great year.

Meanwhile Mitchell picked up 3 votes in that game in a losing side and came third in the Brownlow that year. Pretty ironic that Treloar now plays the same game with even less hurt factor.

 

[Copeland]

a bit like judging a wine on it's look without assessing taste and smell.

I have some dirty old reds that my mate loves.

 

[gouki88]

You can view most paywalled stuff at wayback type sites like archive.ph etc just paste the url.

Here's some of what was in the article.

Former Collingwood coach and now Fox Footy expert Nathan Buckley has experience being Collingwood’s great black and white hope recruited from another club, prospering to tell the tale.
He believes the Mitchell move is a winner but understands the unusually muted response from Collingwood fans.

Six years on Buckley certainly has respect for Mitchell, but his expectations of him in the black and white are tempered.
“The on-field contribution is going to be a question,” Buckley says.
“His attributes might support depth around (Scott) Pendlebury and Taylor Adams, but I think it‘s arguable if he’s in the best 22 when everyone’s up and running, for the best balance for the team.
“But, that’s no criticism of the actual decision because I think at the price he’s coming across at, that’s a pretty good investment.

Buckley is confident that a more sophisticated understanding of player movement means that Collingwood fans will be satisfied by the Mitchell deal mark two.
“He’s a low-cost, quality person and an established player,” Buckley says.
“Even if he plays only two-thirds of the games this year, that’s better than break-even

Hammering home how shit Bucks' analysis can be. He plays a role that most midfielders in our team cannot

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Hammering home how s**t Bucks' analysis can be. He plays a role that most midfielders in our team cannot

Positive spin…

If we are all up and running and the kids come along as we hope, then very few players are guaranteed selection…

It’s possible in that scenario that we can’t fit or don’t need adams and Mitchell in the same 22. But that’s an unlikely scenario and will be a good one anyway as it means we are flying.

 

[Jelly Bean]

Hammering home how s**t Bucks' analysis can be. He plays a role that most midfielders in our team cannot

Hard to label his analysis as s**t when the thing that he is predicting hasn't failed yet... Maybe wait until the year is half way in before assessing it.

 

[gouki88]

Hard to label his analysis as s**t when the thing that he is predicting hasn't failed yet... Maybe wait until the year is half way in before assessing it.

Yes you can, because the things he is saying are demonstrably false. His strengths are nothing like those of Pendles nor Adams, yet "his attributes might support depth around Pendlebury and Adams". It doesn't make sense as a statement, especially with Pendlebury being phased out of the midfield.

 

[stormskye]

Yes you can, because the things he is saying are demonstrably false. His strengths are nothing like those of Pendles nor Adams, yet "his attributes might support depth around Pendlebury and Adams". It doesn't make sense as a statement, especially with Pendlebury being phased out of the midfield.

I agree mate. Mitchell lightens the load on adams and Degoey who unfortunately have been injury prone. It also allows us to use the ace that is Degoey, a mid who like Martin can push forward and kick 3 goals in a quarter.

 

[Jelly Bean]

Yes you can, because the things he is saying are demonstrably false. His strengths are nothing like those of Pendles nor Adams, yet "his attributes might support depth around Pendlebury and Adams". It doesn't make sense as a statement, especially with Pendlebury being phased out of the midfield.

Geez, you are saying that you know more about the bloke who coached this team for 10ish years, including Pendles and Adams for that time.

He might underrate Tom's likely impact for the year ahead (or might not, we'll have to wait and see), but trying to make the claim that he doesn't know about Pendles or Adams is a real leap.

 

[gouki88]

Geez, you are saying that you know more about the bloke who coached this team for 10ish years, including Pendles and Adams for that time.

He might underrate Tom's likely impact for the year ahead (or might not, we'll have to wait and see), but trying to make the claim that he doesn't know about Pendles or Adams is a real leap.

Lol. Yep, that's exactly what I'm saying!

The idea that, because Buckley coached them, his analysis is infallible is just BS. He is claiming that Mitchell will be "depth" around those two, despite having completely different attributes and having been a better midfielder than both last season. Which is stupid.

 

[sr36]

Yes you can, because the things he is saying are demonstrably false. His strengths are nothing like those of Pendles nor Adams, yet "his attributes might support depth around Pendlebury and Adams". It doesn't make sense as a statement, especially with Pendlebury being phased out of the midfield.

What he's saying isn't demonstrably false. For Mitchell to play midfield, he'll be taking minutes from Adams and Pendles. I think Bucks will be wrong, particularly considering Lippas injury, but it's not demonstrably wrong to think that Pendles and Adams will offer more than Mitchell in the midfield this year.

 

[gouki88]

What he's saying isn't demonstrably false. For Mitchell to play midfield, he'll be taking minutes from Adams and Pendles. I think Bucks will be wrong, particularly considering Lippas injury, but it's not demonstrably wrong to think that Pendles and Adams will offer more than Mitchell in the midfield this year.

Given Pendlebury is already being phased out of the midfield, I do not agree. Pendlebury moving back into the midfield in the latter half of last season is something I don't think Fly wants to rely upon.

 

[sr36]

Given Pendlebury is already being phased out of the midfield, I do not agree. Pendlebury moving back into the midfield in the latter half of last season is something I don't think Fly wants to rely upon.

The great thing about the recruitment of Mitchell is that we don't have to rely on it, Nor do we have to rely on youngsters pushing up really quickly in the following couple of years. But I don't think it's outrageous for anyone to think that Pendles and Adams will perform well enough this year, along with JDG, Crisp, Nick and Lippa, when he returns, to keep Mitchell on the fringe of the team

 

[jonbe54]

The great thing about the recruitment of Mitchell is that we don't have to rely on it, Nor do we have to rely on youngsters pushing up really quickly in the following couple of years. But I don't think it's outrageous for anyone to think that Pendles and Adams will perform well enough this year, along with JDG, Crisp, Nick and Lippa, when he returns, to keep Mitchell on the fringe of the team

It depends on 'the mix' - midfields are a delicate balance of who works best with who.

Fly is a pragmatist - Brodie is a strong case in point - he and the match committee will promote / demote / shift personnel wherever the greatest benefit to the team balance and effectiveness is gained.

I think it more likely than not that Mitchell will play a strong role in that mix for the majority of the season.