Two things i needed to get off my chest

[Merv]

Name a player who hasn't struggled when carrying injuries?

Next season when he is fit and firing from getting a full season under his belt he will be back to the form he displays when his body is right and you will all be back on the bandwagon. But i will remember each and every one of you that bags him out on our board.......

Players from every team in every game carry injuries.

Are you saying that he has had injuries every year and every week that he has played since he won AA.

His form has gone backward since that year.

Yes he had Op or what ever it was, as Sheeds never real said what it was, but how does an injury have anything to do with decision making or fumbling and dropping marks?

He is a confidence player and imo, that is not what we need atm, we need some leaders in his age bracket, not front runners that play well when the team plays well.

You can remember my comments as much as you like, i have never been shy going on the record as to my thoughts.

I wonder if you would be as keen to come out and say you were wrong, if you were, as you would be to out those that had a go at him......

 

[SirJimi05]

Players from every team in every game carry injuries.

Are you saying that he has had injuries every year and every week that he has played since he won AA.

His form has gone backward since that year.

Yes he had Op or what ever it was, as Sheeds never real said what it was, but how does an injury have anything to do with decision making or fumbling and dropping marks?

He is a confidence player and imo, that is not what we need atm, we need some leaders in his age bracket, not front runners that play well when the team plays well.

You can remember my comments as much as you like, i have never been shy going on the record as to my thoughts.

I wonder if you would be as keen to come out and say you were wrong, if you were, as you would be to out those that had a go at him......

In 2006 he had a very serious bout of OP as well as some knee problems which were not reported. In 2007 he had some groin issues which may have been related to this previous OP problem. This year will be his first full pre season in 3 years and i expect that he will benefit greatly from this.

Yes, i do believe that skill errors and confidence issues can be caused by or atleast influenced by carrying injuries. All you have to do is have a look at Stantons form and his disposal after he got his ankle injury. I remember listening to some Essendon supporters at the West Coast game bagging him because he kept turning the ball over and making silly errors but it was becuase he was playing injured. Players that carry injuries into games do not have confidence in their bodies and this can filter into other areas of their games. McPhee has haf chronic groin problems which would have affected his disposal by foot. This may cause him to lose confidence in other areas. I have no doubt that he has gone into alot more games injured then people actually know of. I'm not sure if you read my earlier post but during the footy season i often see him at the Narre games and quite a few times he was clearly injured yet on the website and papers he was not on the injured list.

I am quite happy to come out and say that i was wrong after the 2008 season if he does not perform well. I will go on record saying that now. I have faith in him. I will also go on record with Dyson. If he doesn't improve next season and show all the doubters what he is capable of i will acknowledge that i got that one wrong to. I am big enough to admit my mistakes as long as all the bandwagon jumpers are prepared to do the same if they decide to jump back on the wagon....

 

[kelvin_sheedy]

I can't speak for anyone else but imo, he has been extremely disappointing, from the point of view that we know what he can do.

When he is down on his confidence, he drops marks, fumbles the ball below his knees and chips it around as if he is scared to make a mistake.

He is now one of our more experienced players and our young kids need him to stand up and lead the way.....

No more excuses, deliver or go......

Last year he was in our best 5 players. He averaged more possessions than all his previous years.

2004 he won AA but don't forget he had backline help in Fletcher, Wellman, Solomon, MJ.... pretty handy support.

05 an 06 he was servicable but had injuries.

People expect way too much from him. If he can consistently finish top 10 in our B&F for the next 5 years then I think he's more than done his job.

His problem lies in his appearance and people not being able to judge him for what he is - a very good utility that can pinch hit in places and provide awkward matchups.

 

[Merv]

Kelvin what a load of crap.

At least SirJim came out with a well backed up argument

Best 5 players?

He got his possessions running the boundary and flanks mainly.

What has his looks got to do with anything, you are really struggling with this.

Top 10 B&F and he has done his job.......get real mate.

I notice that neither of you have mentioned my point about him dropping marks, fumbling the ball below his knees and chipping the ball around.

My point being, yes he may lose some confidence from his injuries, but leaders get past that and lead from the front, not drop their heads.

I hope i am proven wrong but imo he is fast running out of chances to show us what he teased us with....

 

[kelvin_sheedy]

His form has gone backward since that year.

Or has the whole teams?

He averaged more possessions this year and was a major factor in a number of games and was more attacking.

Since 2004 only this group is ahead of him - Hird, Fletch, Lloyd, Lucas, Stanton, McVeigh. The rest have a lot more to answer for then him....much much more.

 

[kelvin_sheedy]

Kelvin what a load of crap.

At least SirJim came out with a well backed up argument

Best 5 players?

He got his possessions running the boundary and flanks mainly.

What has his looks got to do with anything, you are really struggling with this.

I notice that neither of you have mentioned my point about him dropping marks, fumbling the ball below his knees and chipping the ball around.

My point being, yes he may lose some confidence from his injuries, but leaders get past that and lead from the front, not drop their heads.

I hope i am proven wrong but imo he is fast running out of chances to show us what he teased us with....

If he got so many cheap possies then why is he no.2 on the tackles count

Every player fumbles and drops a mark here or there. People tend to notice his a lot more because of his looks and his unique running style.

Your judgment(and most McPhee bashers) is clouded because of bigfooty propaganda and his appearance.

 

[SirJimi05]

Kelvin what a load of crap.

At least SirJim came out with a well backed up argument

Best 5 players?

He got his possessions running the boundary and flanks mainly.

What has his looks got to do with anything, you are really struggling with this.

Top 10 B&F and he has done his job.......get real mate.

I notice that neither of you have mentioned my point about him dropping marks, fumbling the ball below his knees and chipping the ball around.

My point being, yes he may lose some confidence from his injuries, but leaders get past that and lead from the front, not drop their heads.

I hope i am proven wrong but imo he is fast running out of chances to show us what he teased us with....

I thought i did but nevermind.

I certainly agree with you that we don't expect too much of him. In my opinion he was in the best 5 players at our club going back a few years and this is where he should be. Anything less means that he has not met his expectations for whatever reason. Next season Adam will be once again regarded as one of the top 5 players at our club, have faith Merv....atleast for one more season.

 

[BABYBOMBERS2007]

I like many other Essendon supporters am optimistic about our season ahead, but I want to pick at 2 nagging problems that I have.

Ruck division – Laycock and Hille have the potential to be the best ruck duo in the competition especially with there ability to go forward. I personally believe that Laycock showed a lot of good signs this year and will be the number one ruck next year, but he is not there yet. Hille is lethargic and looks great one game and hopeless the next, he is a big risk each game he plays because sometimes we go out there with 21 players because of him. This pair will have a lot to do with our standing with in the competition at the end of the year.

Mcphee – what happened to this bloke? Was it the proxocide? Was it all the time doing his hair and looking in the mirror? He went from a bloke who use to refuse to come off the ground because he was such a competitor to the fairy he has become(im not questioning him having time on the bench because it’s the modern game but the shift in his desire to play alla 2003) On the surface he has the perfect build great kick strong mark and is athletic but he plays as a running half back who plays along the boundary lines going throughout the whole game without contact and using his foot which can kick and penetrate 60m to send passes 11m. I hope new coach and new position changes him.

I doubt that Laycock and Hille will ever be better than the combination of Lade and Brogan, though I do think that they can be a great combination. Mcphee went down after his injury but I think he will bounce back this year. A new coach and less injuries will help him.

 

[Merv]

If he got so many cheap possies then why is he no.2 on the tackles count

Every player fumbles and drops a mark here or there. People tend to notice his a lot more because of his looks and his unique running style.

Your judgment(and most McPhee bashers) is clouded because of bigfooty propaganda and his appearance.

Being high on Essendons tackle count is probably not that good in comparison to other teams.

The posessions vs tackles is irrelevant.

You can still tackle, hence your opponent may possibly have the ball, and when we have it you leave him and sneak around the boundary to get a cheap kick.

You need to get over his looks Kelvin, i couldn't care less what he looks like.

It is time for him to stand up and lead, something along the lines of a McVeigh this year, or move on.

We need him now.....

I certainly hope to be proven wrong, i don't wish failure on any of our players.

 

[tunny25]

One thing I need to get off my chest.

STOP MAKING MCPHEE A SCAPEGOAT FOR OUR POOR FORM OF THE PAST FEW YEARS FFS!!

very well said.

 

[kelvin_sheedy]

It is time for him to stand up and lead, something along the lines of a McVeigh this year, or move on.

Is that the same McVeigh that got suspended at the most crucial time in the season?

Mcphee had more possessions. more marks, more tackles, less suspensions and more brownlow votes... but was just shaded in the B&F.

We need him now.....

We have him now. He did his job last season and did it well. He finished 5th in our B&F.

Top 10 B&F and he has done his job.......get real mate.

Well I expect our two forwards Lloyd, Lucas to be there. 2 midfielders and or a ruckman and or a defender. That doesn't leave room for a utility to get into the top 5 unless the others aren't doing their job properly.

The more you believe he should be some sort of superstar the more you'll be disappointed.

 

[Boris_Bewick]

Being high on Essendons tackle count is probably not that good in comparison to other teams.

The posessions vs tackles is irrelevant.

You can still tackle, hence your opponent may possibly have the ball, and when we have it you leave him and sneak around the boundary to get a cheap kick.

You need to get over his looks Kelvin, i couldn't care less what he looks like.

It is time for him to stand up and lead, something along the lines of a McVeigh this year, or move on.

We need him now.....

I certainly hope to be proven wrong, i don't wish failure on any of our players.

I've noticed you've wanted to trade McPhee for a while now Merv. What do you honestly think we could get for him that would make it a win for us?

 

[foj1]

In simplest terms McPhee is the icing on the cake sort of player. He will do okay on a flank playing on the third/fourth best player but will always struggle against the blue chippers.
There is nothing wrong with that as long as he is paid and spoken about accordingly.
He had one real standout year where he went under the guard of opponents somewhat and wasnt required to play on the oppositions best players.
I reckon you wouldnt get half as much as you thought you would for McPhee.

 

[SirJimi05]

In simplest terms McPhee is the icing on the cake sort of player. He will do okay on a flank playing on the third/fourth best player but will always struggle against the blue chippers.
There is nothing wrong with that as long as he is paid and spoken about accordingly.
He had one real standout year where he went under the guard of opponents somewhat and wasnt required to play on the oppositions best players.
I reckon you wouldnt get half as much as you thought you would for McPhee.

What a stupid comment. We have already got more than we expected we were going to get when we first got McPhee.

Also, you are wrong in saying he went under the guard the year he won AA selection. He had already had two very good seasons with Essendon by that stage and many considered him to be in our best 5 players at the club. If you put the stars in Hird, Lloyd and Lucas aside, McPhee was probably under the spotlight more than any other player at the club so how could you possible say that he went under the radar or under the guard of opposition clubs?

 

[kelvin_sheedy]

[/b]

What a stupid comment. We have already got more than we expected we were going to get when we first got McPhee.

Also, you are wrong in saying he went under the guard the year he won AA selection. He had already had two very good seasons with Essendon by that stage and many considered him to be in our best 5 players at the club. If you put the stars in Hird, Lloyd and Lucas aside, McPhee was probably under the spotlight more than any other player at the club so how could you possible say that he went under the radar or under the guard of opposition clubs?

It was McPhee's second season at Essendon when he won AA. He had only played 40 odd games by that stage.

He was in a back line that consisted of Fletch, Wellman, Solomon, MJ. He got under the guard and was assisted by a very good group of players around him.

 

[Longy413]

Wellman only played 12 games in 2004, Solly played a stack of footy in the midfield, MJ likewise (as well as forward).

I don't think he was so good in 2004 because he went under the guard, I think it had more to do with him being full fit for the only time in his career.

We probably had a better key defensive post in 2007 than we did in 2004.

 

[SirJimi05]

It was McPhee's second season at Essendon when he won AA. He had only played 40 odd games by that stage.

He was in a back line that consisted of Fletch, Wellman, Solomon, MJ. He got under the guard and was assisted by a very good group of players around him.

He wasn't under the guard at that point of time....

Only one player you listed actually spent a lot of time in the backline that year.......

 

[Merv]

I've noticed you've wanted to trade McPhee for a while now Merv. What do you honestly think we could get for him that would make it a win for us?

Boris, I've only said that i would trade McPhee if we got a good deal.

The issue i have with McPhee is that he is at an age and a games played bracket where he should be able to lead from the front.

We lack leadership and will only lose more in the nest few years, so it is important that we have players, especially in that age group, step up and lead the way to all our young players.

If you look at the list analysis i did, you can see how many young players we have now and they need to be shown the way.

McPhee is big enough, experienced enough and skillful enough to stand up and deliver.

Not when we are playing well and the team is doing well as a whole, yet this is generally when he plays well, but when the chips are down and we need someone to stand up and lead the way.

Not drop easy marks under little pressure and fumble the ball below the knees only to have the opposition bump you off the ball and run away and punish you again.
Not racking up possessions by sneaking away and taking easy marks and then holding up play deciding where to go until he chips it sideways again.

If he can't be that player we need, then i don't believe he is worth having and if we could get a descent trade for him, then i think we should consider it.

 

[Slattery_20]

wasn't his most prolific game vs Port Adelaide (= relentless pantsing, yet again) this year? IIRC he did pretty well in close gasmes v Sydney, Richmond

I reckon there is a negative perception of McPHee
Dons supporters do not take well to "outsiders"
& Added to this, is if McPhee's having a bad game he tends to just make a lot of fck-ups, not go missing like most other players will. He always gets amongst it

 

[kelvin_sheedy]

Wellman only played 12 games in 2004, Solly played a stack of footy in the midfield, MJ likewise (as well as forward).

I don't think he was so good in 2004 because he went under the guard, I think it had more to do with him being full fit for the only time in his career.

We probably had a better key defensive post in 2007 than we did in 2004.

We had a better midfield in 2004 also. We had less ball pumped into the defensive half.

All those players played a fair bit in the back half also.

I don't think he was that much better in 2004 than last year. The difference probably lies in the players around him.

 

[Mean Muggin]

Mcphee – what happened to this bloke? Was it the proxocide? Was it all the time doing his hair and looking in the mirror? He went from a bloke who use to refuse to come off the ground because he was such a competitor to the fairy he has become(im not questioning him having time on the bench because it’s the modern game but the shift in his desire to play alla 2003) On the surface he has the perfect build great kick strong mark and is athletic but he plays as a running half back who plays along the boundary lines going throughout the whole game without contact and using his foot which can kick and penetrate 60m to send passes 11m. I hope new coach and new position changes him.

If my memory serves me correctly he become a coward after he copped a hiding from Vanders....I could be wrong though.

 

[dapto]

Boris, I've only said that i would trade McPhee if we got a good deal.

The issue i have with McPhee is that he is at an age and a games played bracket where he should be able to lead from the front.

We lack leadership and will only lose more in the nest few years, so it is important that we have players, especially in that age group, step up and lead the way to all our young players.

If you look at the list analysis i did, you can see how many young players we have now and they need to be shown the way.

McPhee is big enough, experienced enough and skillful enough to stand up and deliver.

Not when we are playing well and the team is doing well as a whole, yet this is generally when he plays well, but when the chips are down and we need someone to stand up and lead the way.

Not drop easy marks under little pressure and fumble the ball below the knees only to have the opposition bump you off the ball and run away and punish you again.
Not racking up possessions by sneaking away and taking easy marks and then holding up play deciding where to go until he chips it sideways again.

If he can't be that player we need, then i don't believe he is worth having and if we could get a descent trade for him, then i think we should consider it.

The problem is the future leadership though, as you have noted. Take away Lloyd, Lucas, Fletch, JJ, Mal you are left with Stanton, Watson, Mkveigh, Winderlich, Welsh and McPhee which while walk-up starts and more than servicable they also become the elders of the playing group. None have the real charisma and on field pressence you want in a "premiership" captain. It becomes a very democratic ensemble which is weakened by diluting the group; i.e trading Mcphee. I am not sure that leadership groups work so well in the absense of some individual brillance. If you traded him I would hope he be part of a package to address this but Knights has kind of ruled out that kind of list shopping. He gets his fair share of the TPP. He just needs to earn it now. Moving him on is a poor result for both parties.

 

[Merv]

If my memory serves me correctly he become a coward after he copped a hiding from Vanders....I could be wrong though.

You knew you were before you posted.

 

[dapto]

If my memory serves me correctly he become a coward after he copped a hiding from Vanders....I could be wrong though.

Trolling with crap like that.

And if you think Hawthorn is the epitome of courage, how pathetic you need Dermot to walk into the rooms 10 years post playing to tell you what football is reallly like. You guys must think you have already won a flag. Go flog yourself before you present your flogself here pal

 

[TheCoach]

If my memory serves me correctly he become a coward after he copped a hiding from Vanders....I could be wrong though.

If it serves me correctly... you came out and got whoppped by 12 goals and the only hit Hawthorn made was on a 19yr old player on his way off the ground...
Courageous that.
And now Hawthorn use the line "we've won all but one game between the two teams since that incident.. it worked" ... Hawthorn, if u haven't realised we haven't been a good team for 4 years... its not just u we lose to.