Underwhelming/Underachieving players

[revo333]

Ask any player eg Gerard Healy feels unfulfilled because he did not achieve ultimate success. I am not referring to runners up or PF wins.They mean nothing.

If Gerard Healy won a flag but only played 10 games then we wouldn't even know who he is for him to be asked that question in the first place.

 

[Damon_3388]

This would be going back a ways for some, and might seem a weird pick, but Tim Watson, anyone?

Watson averaged 24.36 disposals and 1.91 goals per game, and won his club B&F and finished 5th in the Brownlow count in 1980 (in a team that won 10 games and didn't make the finals). He turned 19 in July that year, but it was his 4th season at Essendon. For a player drafted these days, that would be their first year. Imagine a first year player these days winning a B&F and finishing 5th in the Brownlow! We'd expect him to become one of the all-time elite players.

Watson also had three other seasons (1985, 1988, 1989) where he picked up double-figure Brownlow votes (equal-3rd in 1985, equal-4th in 1989), winning Essendon's B&F in each of them (and also being the AFLPA MVP in 1989 as well), and won 3 Premierships, Captained the club, played 300 games, etc.

I know he essentially is one of the all time greats, certainly at Essendon anyway, and he was cut down by injury in what should have been his peak years (played just 10 games total in 1986-1987, aged 25-26), but it just kind of feels like a player that was that good that young should have had a better, longer, more consistent prime than he did.

 

[Hard Ball Get]

This would be going back a ways for some, and might seem a weird pick, but Tim Watson, anyone?

Watson averaged 24.36 disposals and 1.91 goals per game, and won his club B&F and finished 5th in the Brownlow count in 1980 (in a team that won 10 games and didn't make the finals). He turned 19 in July that year, but it was his 4th season at Essendon. For a player drafted these days, that would be their first year. Imagine a first year player these days winning a B&F and finishing 5th in the Brownlow! We'd expect him to become one of the all-time elite players.

Watson also had three other seasons (1985, 1988, 1989) where he picked up double-figure Brownlow votes (equal-3rd in 1985, equal-4th in 1989), winning Essendon's B&F in each of them (and also being the AFLPA MVP in 1989 as well), and won 3 Premierships, Captained the club, played 300 games, etc.

I know he essentially is one of the all time greats, certainly at Essendon anyway, and he was cut down by injury in what should have been his peak years (played just 10 games total in 1986-1987, aged 25-26), but it just kind of feels like a player that was that good that young should have had a better, longer, more consistent prime than he did.

Tim Watson was a jet. Stats are irrelevant.

 

[Damon_3388]

Tim Watson was a jet. Stats are irrelevant.

I'm not denying he was a great player, and the argument isn't based on stats, but moreso achievements and standing in the game. It's probably being extremely nit-picky, but you would expect a player who finished 5th in the Brownlow at age 19 to end up having a longer and more prolific prime than Watson did.

Considering his three best years (1980, 1985, and 1989) came at different intervals of the decade, would people name Watson among the top 20 VFL players of the '80s?

 

[The Dog]

LOL @ Judd being suggested. Was the best in the comp in 07 until he pinged his groin. At Carlton he still won a Brownlow, multiple B&Fs etc.

With Ablett Jnr the two greatest players from the past 15 years. Champion at WCE. Carried Carlton on his shoulders.

 

[eth-dog]

With Ablett Jnr the two greatest players from the past 15 years. Champion at WCE. Carried Carlton on his shoulders.

I'd have Goodes at the same level. In fact I have Goodes (slightly) ahead of Judd.

 

[Get Gaffed]

Haven't read the whole thread yet so don't know if he's been mentioned but Gavin Urquhart. The wheels fell off quick really quick there, same deal with Harper.

Not meaning to shit on North or anything but while I'm at it I'll throw one more name out there, Jesse Smith. Such a shame we were robbed of this guy's career. Was an absolute jet, shame the ankle and soft tissue injuries got the best of him like they did my beloved Rusling and Dick .

That also reminded me of kangas Josh Smith who reminds me of Essendons Kyle Hardingham which got me thinking of How much Hansen underachieved at North, likewise Dee's/Hawks Frawley and Blues/Cats Henderson.......ahhhhh it's never ending

 

[StillWaiting5689]

I'm not denying he was a great player, and the argument isn't based on stats, but moreso achievements and standing in the game. It's probably being extremely nit-picky, but you would expect a player who finished 5th in the Brownlow at age 19 to end up having a longer and more prolific prime than Watson did.

Considering his three best years (1980, 1985, and 1989) came at different intervals of the decade, would people name Watson among the top 20 VFL players of the '80s?

I will say that the 80s is before my time watching, but he was one of essendons best players of the era and they were one of the best teams of the decade. Would Have to go close to top 20 in the time. All reports I’ve ever heard was he was a gun, don’t think he belongs here.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

Players always say that they would trade individual accolades for team success.

Robert Harvey has 2 Brownlows, 8 AAs, 4 B&Fs, an AFL MVP and is in the St Kilda team of the century. His last season was in 2008 then St Kilda contested the 2009 and 2010 GFs, though ended up losing both. How much of that would he cash in for one of his 383 games being a winning GF?

Gary Ablett Sr won a B&F, 4 AAs, 3 Colemans, a Norm Smith, an MVP and is in Geelong's team of the century. He also played in 4 losing GFs. Same deal.

Neither of these guys would trade their legacy for that of Mitch Morton or Richard Hadley or Jonathan Simpkin. Or even someone like Daniel Venables whose 15th game was a GF win and could end up playing 200 or being de-listed next week.

And I doubt Shaunie Burgoyne would trade his 4 flags for any amount of B&Fs, a Coleman, a Norm Smith, a MVP, or a Brownlow...

 

[dmoore30]

Aish and Scharenburg. Both were hugely hyped up in their draft years but neither have shown much at AFL level. Aish is a role player and that's all he will ever be. Scharenburg has been unlucky with injuries but has had a few opportunities and hasn't lived up to the hype.

Scharenberg was our best defender last season before he went down, 1 on 1 he rarely got beaten and never missed a target by foot.

A little hard to judge someone who has been severely hampered by injury. Has impressed when given a small block last year so not sure what you're talking about.

 

[Scotland]

And I doubt Shaunie Burgoyne would trade his 4 flags for any amount of B&Fs, a Coleman, a Norm Smith, a MVP, or a Brownlow...

He has been a top 5-10 player in two different premiership winning teams and has played 362 games, though. Doesn't have a huge amount of personal accolades (single AA, don't think he has won a B&F) but he was never a passenger.

 

[Flip Side]

Amongst the current players, Chad Wingard owns this thread.

For season 2013, only his second season, he averaged 21.3 disposals a game and kicked 43 goals. He was named in the 2013 all Australian team, making him the youngest player to make an All-Australian team since Mark Ricciuto in 1994. Wingard's 2013 season also saw him win the Showdown Medal for his five-goal performance against the Crows where he was described after the match as "Port's most exciting player since Gavin Wanganeen”. At season's end, he was rewarded with the John Cahill Medal, making him the youngest player to win a best and fairest at Port Adelaide since Craig Bradley in 1982.

Season 2015 was considered Wingard's greatest season. He booted a career high 53 goals to be the club's leading goal kicker of the season by kicking multiple goals in every game from rounds 8 to 22 as well as kicking at least one goal in every game until round 23. Wingard also averaged 19.2 disposals a game and was recognised with the All-Australian selection, a stunning achievement for a player having completed just his fourth year at AFL level.

In 2018 his goal average was lower than all but his debut season, only managing 24 goals from 19 games.
In 2019 his inside 50s and disposal numbers have followed suit. He now averages 13.6 disposals and just over a goal a game.

At his best he is one of the silkiest dynamic and entertaining players in the league, at his worst he is one of the sulkiest, and looks disinterested.

He has proven he can be elite, so for a guy with his talent and ability he is currently, arguably, the most underwhelming and underachieving player in the league.

 

[Damon_3388]

Eric Hipwood. Expected more by year 4. Just doesn't get enough of the ball, perform consistently, or really seem to be getting better.

 

[Old M8]

Daniel Rioli is struggling. He’s riding on the coattails of previous performances, and hasn’t been able to show much/if any consistency despite entering year 4 of his career.

He contributed to a flag in year 2, but that doesn’t buy you a 10 year AFL career. He needs to wake up.

K

Yes! Rioli is playing hurt.

Spin it whatever way you like.

He played VFL last week, and it may not be the last time for the year.

 

[PAFC_1870]

In 2018 his goal average was lower than all but his debut season, only managing 24 goals from 19 games.

He did play more midfield in fairness. But I won't argue he's not where he should be.

 

[PAFC_1870]

T Boyd - One really good game, when it was needed, yet has not been able to consolidate and step up since.
T Scully - The great disappointment, touted as a champion midfielder, went to GWS, didnt do a great deal and returned to Vic.
M Kreuzer - Talented tall, continually plagued by

3 players dogged by injuries/health issues?

Seriously?

 

[PAFC_1870]

You could throw most of GC's 2010 draft and 17 year old concessions in this thread.

Swallow - Co-captain, but he hasn't delivered enough for a #1 pick.
Bennell - Showed glimpses of brilliance at the Suns but can't get on the park now.
Day - #3 pick and has shown next to nothing at AFL level.
Caddy - Has done very well at Richmond but took a while to get going. Borderline pass.
Prestia - Has his moments but has been disappointing overall for a top 10 pick.
Gorringe - Complete bust
Lynch - The best performing player that they picked. He gets a definite pass.
Tape - Somehow lasted 6 years on their list. Bust.
Matera - Looked like he would be a star in his first year, had traits of his uncle Phil, but he's only ever lived on potential.
Dixon - Not a spud but not the star forward many predicted him to be.

Many of those had ongoing injuries and as a result I don't think they should be included here.

 

[_Mike_]

3 players dogged by injuries/health issues?

Seriously?

For each of their own personal battles, be it physical or mental health injuries, they have not been able to reach their potential. If you're trying to draw a long bow and claim that I'm trolling these players because of it, you're way off the mark.

 

[Craze]

I think it was around 2013 when I saw Jack Ziebull absolutely carve Richmond up at Docklands (might have been 2015?). Thought he was better than Dusty at that stage. Don’t think he’s got the best out of himself, as much as I like him as a player.

 

[PAFC_1870]

For each of their own personal battles, be it physical or mental health injuries, they have not been able to reach their potential. If you're trying to draw a long bow and claim that I'm trolling these players because of it, you're way off the mark.

No. Clearly you are drawing that bow by suggesting it.

It's hardly their fault. Hence why it's harsh to suggest them. Stringer is entirely different however. If they were fit and able they all would have likely had better careers.

 

[Coops93]

I reckon Brendan Fevola ended up having a underwhelming career. If he played out his career he would've finished with over 800 goals and probably would've been remembered alongside Buddy for the best forward of the modern era. Instead he's remembered for being a superstar talent that was cut short by off field demons.