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I hate big ticket trades. Luke Jackson will be a good long term player but I agree the cost even if we managed this season to finish top 6-8 as expected was way too high.

It is looking something like 13 (15), 7 (8), 25 (27) > Jackson, 42 (Emmett), 57 (Wagner).

Hogan also worried me at the time before he had played.
6 (Ben King), 25 (27-Tom Sparrow) > Hogan, 59 (Brett Bewley)

We need to avoid at all cost big ticket trades that incorporate first round picks. Melbourne convinced us to drink bathwater that we were top notch and two teen picks would not be enough.

Kozzie and Melbourne would expect more than a F1. They will again go the angle that after one year down we will rise. The cost would end up being first and second like Hogan. I’m expecting and hoping that he will end up at Port like his dad and we miss out. He is a player that would help but we can’t afford to sell the farm twice which will end up being three years given the cost of Jackson.

I also prefer 2nd round trades or player swaps. We don’t seem to get involved in player swaps too often for some reason. Some moneyball trades like Will Brodie from time to time. This is tried and tested by Geelong. They did go all chips in for Cameron (and paid a price for Dangerfield) so let’s hope the Jackson trade ends up being our Cameron trade but we need to stop there.

Trades like the following were all the point cost around 2nd round and gave value to our player list:
  • James Aish
  • Jordan Clark
  • Joel Hamling (pre-injury was very good)
  • Nathan Wilson (first 3 years were very good)
  • Brad Hill (was good player - we got more back in trading him out)

Hopefully JOM (looking dicey early days) comes on as he finds his niche in the team).

Even Lobb for mine was borderline as the cost on picks was a late second but we succumbed to Giants on demands and traded down pick 11 > 14. I wasn’t a fan of McCarthy trade even though all the later picks have turned into gold nuggets. The early trade down cost us a very good top 3 pick.

I honestly believe we could get Georgiades at a decent price. Has dropped outside best 25-27 and out of contract. I’d expect nothing more than 2nd round pick (mid to late) would be his cost. We do that trade with a F2 and that will prevent us trading out our future first. Himmelberg is prob a pipe dream but that would be an even better outcome as I don’t believe GWS would match bid. They will get a decent compo pick I reckon.

Naughton would cost too much and we just don’t the draft capital to do the trade. To get the draft capital we would need to sell players (like Darcy for e.g.) and we have seen the effect this has.

Minimal trades please and only trades that are value. We need a running wingman. Sharp we looked at and posters keep saying he and his family went the sook so whatever he hasn’t played a single afl game as yet.
 
I hate big ticket trades. Luke Jackson will be a good long term player but I agree the cost even if we managed this season to finish top 6-8 as expected was way too high.

It is looking something like 13 (15), 7 (8), 25 (27) > Jackson, 42 (Emmett), 57 (Wagner).

Hogan also worried me at the time before he had played.
6 (Ben King), 25 (27-Tom Sparrow) > Hogan, 59 (Brett Bewley)

We need to avoid at all cost big ticket trades that incorporate first round picks. Melbourne convinced us to drink bathwater that we were top notch and two teen picks would not be enough.

Kozzie and Melbourne would expect more than a F1. They will again go the angle that after one year down we will rise. The cost would end up being first and second like Hogan. I’m expecting and hoping that he will end up at Port like his dad and we miss out. He is a player that would help but we can’t afford to sell the farm twice which will end up being three years given the cost of Jackson.

I also prefer 2nd round trades or player swaps. We don’t seem to get involved in player swaps too often for some reason. Some moneyball trades like Will Brodie from time to time. This is tried and tested by Geelong. They did go all chips in for Cameron (and paid a price for Dangerfield) so let’s hope the Jackson trade ends up being our Cameron trade but we need to stop there.

Trades like the following were all the point cost around 2nd round and gave value to our player list:
  • James Aish
  • Jordan Clark
  • Joel Hamling (pre-injury was very good)
  • Nathan Wilson (first 3 years were very good)
  • Brad Hill (was good player - we got more back in trading him out)

Hopefully JOM (looking dicey early days) comes on as he finds his niche in the team).

Even Lobb for mine was borderline as the cost on picks was a late second but we succumbed to Giants on demands and traded down pick 11 > 14. I wasn’t a fan of McCarthy trade even though all the later picks have turned into gold nuggets. The early trade down cost us a very good top 3 pick.

I honestly believe we could get Georgiades at a decent price. Has dropped outside best 25-27 and out of contract. I’d expect nothing more than 2nd round pick (mid to late) would be his cost. We do that trade with a F2 and that will prevent us trading out our future first. Himmelberg is prob a pipe dream but that would be an even better outcome as I don’t believe GWS would match bid. They will get a decent compo pick I reckon.

Naughton would cost too much and we just don’t the draft capital to do the trade. To get the draft capital we would need to sell players (like Darcy for e.g.) and we have seen the effect this has.

Minimal trades please and only trades that are value. We need a running wingman. Sharp we looked at and posters keep saying he and his family went the sook so whatever he hasn’t played a single afl game as yet.

I've said it before and will say it again ... Geelong did not really go all chips in for Cameron. All you heard in the media was "3 x first rounders". But those were 3 picks in the teens and they got 2 x 2nd rounders back, and the net cost was around pick 7 in value. The points value is valid to use as the trade didn't involve the top 3-5 picks which in reality are worth more than the points system.

Geelong gave up less for Cameron (and Dangerfield) than we have for Jackson. By a considerable margin. It just beggars belief. The trade for an uncontracted Jackson should have been our 2022 1st and a F2. Even if we decided to bend over, then throw in the North PP. But what Bell did is beyond comprehension for how bad a capitulation it was.

On Georgiades, he suffered what sounds like a serious knee injury yesterday. Haven't read if it is an ACL or not.
 
I've said it before and will say it again ... Geelong did not really go all chips in for Cameron. All you heard in the media was "3 x first rounders". But those were 3 picks in the teens and they got 2 x 2nd rounders back, and the net cost was around pick 7 in value. The points value is valid to use as the trade didn't involve the top 3-5 picks which in reality are worth more than the points system.

Geelong gave up less for Cameron (and Dangerfield) than we have for Jackson. By a considerable margin. It just beggars belief. The trade for an uncontracted Jackson should have been our 2022 1st and a F2. Even if we decided to bend over, then throw in the North PP. But what Bell did is beyond comprehension for how bad a capitulation it was.

On Georgiades, he suffered what sounds like a serious knee injury yesterday. Haven't read if it is an ACL or not.
Weren’t Danger and Cameron both RFA hence the lower costs?

Either way, there was absolutely no reason why we needed to add our F1 for Jackson.
 

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If we're going after Kosi, then I hope we do finish below West Coast and walk that mofo to the PSD. Well not actually, but lowball the **** out of them with the threat there ala Logue.
Would never happen, most players these days would just re-sign with their club rather than go to the PSD.
 
Would never happen, most players these days would just re-sign with their club rather than go to the PSD.
They don't actually have to go, the threat just needs to be there. It's 100% why we only got the pick we did for Logue and Bell/Walls literally said as much.

Also, I highly doubt players actually backtrack unless the buying club is being a total campaigner. We don't have to be that, just give the minimum to avoid it.

If we finish bottom 4 this year and trade for someone and don't roger them in trade(unless below us), then I'm taking my pitchfork to Cockburn.
 
We have Sturt play all year at Peel last year, decide to say it's because he needs to work on his defensive game, he comes in last week, has an immediate impact, and plays well again this week, why did we wait so long????? Just because Longmuir likes Banfield? I like Banfield, he seems like a lovely bloke, but he's not someone that belongs in the team every week.
I think that Sturt spent time out with injury last season as well>But late in the season he began to show what he had.But the club wanted him to build on defending the ball and takling in the forward line.Which, I now see as a huge set back for all our forwards.The yjust don't tackle, they do not keep the ball in our forward line.
 
We're literally running out of kids to play at this point. Already one of the least experienced teams in the league. Only 1 player who's played more than 150 games last night. 18 players under 100 games. 8 under 50.
My point exactly.Sheeits me to tears hearing the bleating "play the kids". GGRRRRRRR
 
I wish people would stop including Meek, Tucker, and Lobb in this conversation. Meek got dropped from Hawthorn, and is miles behind Jackson and Darcy. Tucker is a nothing player and would be playing over both Johnson and Ras at the moment, which everyone would sook over. Lobb was gone from before last season even started and knowing him he'd be throwing a tanty and staying in Melbourne instead of suiting up for us every week.

Poor management was with Acres, Logue, and Mundy.
Did Meek get dropped ? Or was he suspended!!!!!
 
Luke Ryan now reminds me of Ash Macintosh in his final years. He increases his stats by receiving sideways kicks that opponents never defend. His speed is gone and he often trails his defender to the ball. He does not seem to be able to leap, and intercept marks (Which was a strength) do not happen at all. He’s getting picked on past reputation only (the same as Macintosh in final years)
The scary thing is we have just signed him up to a 4 year deal.
 

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Here to vent about how little critical thinking goes on after several losses.

If we drafted JVR and Amiss can guarantee one of them would be in the WAFL atm and we’d be looking at Erasmus and/or Johnson tearing it up for other teams and be having this exact same sook.

We got 3/4 of the top rated WA players in that draft. The highest rated Key forward and two top 10 rated midfielders.

Not every player we miss is a bad list management decision, especially not one and a half years after the draft.
 
Here to vent about how little critical thinking goes on after several losses.

If we drafted JVR and Amiss can guarantee one of them would be in the WAFL atm and we’d be looking at Erasmus and/or Johnson tearing it up for other teams and be having this exact same sook.

We got 3/4 of the top rated WA players in that draft. The highest rated Key forward and two top 10 rated midfielders.

Not every player we miss is a bad list management decision, especially not one and a half years after the draft.

Part of me agrees with you (especially that we would be typically impatient and completely melting about either JVR or Amiss being in the WAFL, or about MJ or Ras debuting for another team).

But the more melty part of me is still pretty annoyed that we've neglected drafting KPF's for years and still baulked at what could have been a once in a lifetime opportunity to grab two top 20 rated WA KPF's in the one draft. How often does that even happen, let alone in a year when we actually have the opportunity to grab them both?

It's easy for me to say in hindsight, but I'd like to think I'd be understanding if the club took the risk only for one of them to bomb.

I mean, Erasmus is hardly looking like some complete package superstar that couldn't be overlooked under any circumstances. Tough inside mids with dodgy disposal aren't exactly rare diamonds.
 
Part of me agrees with you (especially that we would be typically impatient and completely melting about either JVR or Amiss being in the WAFL, or about MJ or Ras debuting for another team).

But the more melty part of me is still pretty annoyed that we've neglected drafting KPF's for years and still baulked at what could have been a once in a lifetime opportunity to grab two top 20 rated WA KPF's in the one draft. How often does that even happen, let alone in a year when we actually have the opportunity to grab them both?

It's easy for me to say in hindsight, but I'd like to think I'd be understanding if the club took the risk only for one of them to bomb.

I mean, Erasmus is hardly looking like some complete package superstar that couldn't be overlooked under any circumstances. Tough inside mids with dodgy disposal aren't exactly rare diamonds.
Yeah look I'm pissed off that we tried to trade in KPFs instead of drafting but JVR was very likely to end up being available at our third pick. He got taken at pick 19. Was expected to go in the second round. We also had Treacy who had looked pretty good that season and were in LJs ear. That would've been too many developing KPFs and at this point in time it's unlikely both JVR and Amiss would be playing in the same AFL team.

Meanwhile we had just lost Cerra, Mundy nearing retirement. It made sense to grab a couple of highly rated mids.

JVR also has the added benefit of a competent midfield right now. Our forward line looks good when we can move the ball well. They have scored over 100 twice this season when we move the ball fast. That's more important than an extra KPF. Look at Carlton. Two Coleman Medallist KPF and they score worse than us.
 
Luke Ryan now reminds me of Ash Macintosh in his final years. He increases his stats by receiving sideways kicks that opponents never defend. His speed is gone and he often trails his defender to the ball. He does not seem to be able to leap, and intercept marks (Which was a strength) do not happen at all. He’s getting picked on past reputation only (the same as Macintosh in final years)
The scary thing is we have just signed him up to a 4 year deal.

The thing that annoys me most about him is he’s afraid to pass the ball from anywhere near goal. The number of times he stands there in the square while someone like Young is leading for a simple pass 30-40m away in the corridor. He chickens out every single time, looks around for another 30 seconds to make sure their zone is completely set & then goes the bomb to the boundary. You can set your watch to it.

And the coach just keeps letting him do it.
I just don’t get it. I’m not letting him kick in & if he does & goes the bomb I’m dragging him.

It’s pathetic & symptomatic of everything wrong with us at the moment.
 
Luke Ryan now reminds me of Ash Macintosh in his final years. He increases his stats by receiving sideways kicks that opponents never defend. His speed is gone and he often trails his defender to the ball. He does not seem to be able to leap, and intercept marks (Which was a strength) do not happen at all. He’s getting picked on past reputation only (the same as Macintosh in final years)
The scary thing is we have just signed him up to a 4 year deal.

Crook back.
 
Management backed themselves into a corner with Jackson by savin da money for ljs big money offer. Losing Logue and Acres in the whole shamozzle.
They would have felt pressure to get their man after the mini route we had.
 
The thing that annoys me most about him is he’s afraid to pass the ball from anywhere near goal. The number of times he stands there in the square while someone like Young is leading for a simple pass 30-40m away in the corridor. He chickens out every single time, looks around for another 30 seconds to make sure their zone is completely set & then goes the bomb to the boundary. You can set your watch to it.

And the coach just keeps letting him do it.
I just don’t get it. I’m not letting him kick in & if he does & goes the bomb I’m dragging him.

It’s pathetic & symptomatic of everything wrong with us at the moment.
You look at even teams like the Bombers today, they kick the short one about 35 metres to the free player but then they move it on quick and before you know it the ball is at half forward. We had all summer to practice kick ins yet we have no idea except for Ryan to kick to the pack.
 
You look at even teams like the Bombers today, they kick the short one about 35 metres to the free player but then they move it on quick and before you know it the ball is at half forward. We had all summer to practice kick ins yet we have no idea except for Ryan to kick to the pack.
It only works if the guys down the line mark it, which often the case they don't. Darcy and Jackson seem to get beaten often. Also when it goes to ground the crumbers get beaten with the ground ball
 
I've been thinking more about how we can be so bad, we seriously ****ed pre season up

We aren't fit enough, look at all these teams just surging the ball, you can't do that unless you are fit

I think we need to completely overhaul our pre season program next year, its too late this year
 

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