Current WAR CRIMES Israel - Hamas Conflict

[Jazny]

The existence of a Palestinian terrorist organisation called Hamas has context. Their feelings towards Israel has context. Their actions towards Israeli’s on October 7th (and before, and after) has context.

Can you give a yes or no to my question. It's not really a gotcha, you can still agree with me that it doesn't explain the atrocity Hamas committed, but at least then we can agree to disagree on what we are referring to as context or how we apply it.

We can contextualise the crimes of Israel too. The murder. The sexual abuse. The mass displacement. The starvation. The torture.

See now it sounds like you are doing a whataboutism. Nobody was contextualizing Israel's actions so there's no reason to bring that up in the context of our discussion about Hamas's actions on October 7th. I also disgaree and would find it incredibly uncomfortable and weird to contextualise any sexual abuse committed by Israel. What context would you give? Imagine trying to contextualize it by saying "Well, for context, Hamas did fire thousands or rockets into Israel prior to that IDF soldier committing sexual abuse".

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

Just says arabs mate.

More disinformation from you.

HAHAHAHAH, yes they just spray painted ARABS on the wall.

Ignore the hastily painted over parts, that's nothing.

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

So a simple question to you would be "do you think that any of the hostilities between Israel and Hamas that lead up to the October 7th terrorist attack sufficiently explains the actions that the terrorists took like sexual assault, hostage taking, bodily mutilation, torture and executions?"

It's almost like you think everything was wine and roses before Oct 7th. I don't think you have any idea of the scale of brutality Israel has dealt out since it's inception.

Hamas itself was borne of this oppression. They didn't spawn in a vacuum. Hamas didn't exist in 1948, or 1967, or 1982. The events of Oct 7th were heinous, but they weren't a result of some hostility between Hamas and Israel. Your framing this conflict as 8 months old is disingenious.

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

Interesting that Israel have released Dr Mohammad Abu Salmiya, director of Al-Shifa, after 7 months in jail.

They put him through 3 court trials, only to wind up with 0 charges.

This is the guy they said was a high ranking Hamas officer. They accused him of running the biggest terrorist HQ in the Gaza strip. Al-Shifa was a hideout for Hamas and all staff were complicit, and now the Shin Bet have let him go.

The entire propaganda campaign selling the complete destruction of Al-Shifa is proven by his release to be nothing but ideologically driven revenge destruction of critical medical infrastructure. Ethnic cleansing.

 

[Jazny]

It's almost like you think everything was wine and roses before Oct 7th.

Almost is doing a lot of heavy lifting in that sentence.

I don't think you have any idea of the scale of brutality Israel has dealt out since it's inception.

I am sure your telling of Israeli history would be balanced and fair.

Hamas itself was borne of this oppression. They didn't spawn in a vacuum. Hamas didn't exist in 1948, or 1967, or 1982. The events of Oct 7th were heinous, but they weren't a result of some hostility between Hamas and Israel. Your framing this conflict as 8 months old is disingenious.

Those events explain the rape, mutilation, and execution of civilians on October 7th?

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

I am sure your telling of Israeli history would be balanced and fair.

Why would it not be?

Those events explain the rape, mutilation, and execution of civilians on October 7th?

What did occur was bad enough, but I can imagine how a life of injustice at every turn and absolute helplessness to do anything about it could turn to horrific violence when your tormentors are suddenly in your power. Will never excuse or condone the extreme cruelty, but obviously people are capable of it.

I believe in the systemic rape and mutilation as much as I do the 40 beheaded babies, the one cut out of the womb and the one put in the oven. Atrocity propaganda for people to manufacture consent for genocide on social media all over the internet.

 

[Ghost Patrol]

But Hamas.

 

[Jazny]

I believe in the systemic rape and mutilation as much as I do the 40 beheaded babies, the one cut out of the womb and the one put in the oven. Atrocity propaganda for people to manufacture consent for genocide on social media all over the internet.

Nobody wants to hear your flat earth rape denialism. The 40 beheaded babies was never an official Israeli claim, it came from a single reporter who was reporting live in the chaotic aftermath. How on earth are you using that to support the idea Israel fabricated rapes? There are rules against misinformation on this site.

 

[DapperDon]

Nobody wants to hear your flat earth rape denialism. The 40 beheaded babies was never an official Israeli claim, it came from a single reporter who was reporting live in the chaotic aftermath. How on earth are you using that to support the idea Israel fabricated rapes? There are rules against misinformation on this site.

On Wednesday, a spokesman for Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told CNN that babies and toddlers were found with their “heads decapitated” in southern Israel after Hamas’ attack

An IDF spokesperson told Business Insider on Tuesday that soldiers had found decapitated babies, but said Wednesday it would not investigate or provide further evidence regarding the claim. Late Wednesday, an IDF spokesperson said in a video on X that the IDF had “relative confidence” of the claims.

Unverified reports of ‘40 babies beheaded’ in Israel-Hamas war inflame social media

No photo evidence had been made public as of Thursday morning corroborating claims that babies had been beheaded. Israel has published photos of dead infants after the terror attack.

www.nbcnews.com

This was just one quick google search, stop spreading Israel propoganda Jazny.

 

[Jazny]

Unverified reports of ‘40 babies beheaded’ in Israel-Hamas war inflame social media

No photo evidence had been made public as of Thursday morning corroborating claims that babies had been beheaded. Israel has published photos of dead infants after the terror attack.

www.nbcnews.com

This was just one quick google search, stop spreading Israel propoganda Jazny.

You can't google. The Netanyahu spokesperson did not say 40 babies were beheaded and she qualified her claims of babies beheaded came from reports of soldiers on the ground, so most likely parroting the journalist who first reported it The next day after the spokesperson said that, the Israeli government stated that they could not corroborate the reports. Israel never officially claimed 40 babies were beheaded. The Israeli government have never fabricated evidence or claimed there were 40 beheaded babies.

Archive: 'How politicians, media outlets amplified uncorroborated report of beheaded babies' | PolitiFact

PolitiFact is a fact-checking website that rates the accuracy of claims by elected officials and others on its Truth-O-Meter.

www.politifact.com

This just shows the danger of reporting and commenting on breaking news.

Contrasting this random claim with no factual basis that was never the official claim of Israel with the sexual assault of October 7th is beyond stupid. It's the dumbest thing I've read to be honest.

 

[DapperDon]

You can't google. The Netanyahu spokesperson did not say 40 babies were beheaded and she qualified her claims of babies beheaded came from reports of soldiers on the ground, so most likely parroting the journalist who first reported it The next day after the spokesperson said that, the Israeli government stated that they could not corroborate the reports. Israel never officially claimed 40 babies were beheaded. The Israeli government have never fabricated evidence or claimed there were 40 beheaded babies.

Archive: 'How politicians, media outlets amplified uncorroborated report of beheaded babies' | PolitiFact

PolitiFact is a fact-checking website that rates the accuracy of claims by elected officials and others on its Truth-O-Meter.

www.politifact.com

This just shows the danger of reporting and commenting on breaking news.

Contrasting this random claim with no factual basis that was never the official claim of Israel with the sexual assault of October 7th is beyond stupid. It's the dumbest thing I've read to be honest.

ok, so it's gone from nobody except 1 journo making the claims to multiple spokespeople within the IDF and or Israel Government making the claims but only because the journo did.

Dig deeper Jazny, and please keep bringing up Oct 07 attrocities to try and paint others as not caring while ignoring multiple attrocities by the IDF. It makes you look really really good.

 

[Jazny]

ok, so it's gone from nobody except 1 journo making the claims to multiple spokespeople within the IDF and or Israel Government making the claims but only because the journo did.

You can't google or read apparently. According to fact checkers, everything I have said is correct. I have changed nothing. The claim initially came from a live reporter amid the chaos of the aftermath.

Archive: 'How politicians, media outlets amplified uncorroborated report of beheaded babies' | PolitiFact

PolitiFact is a fact-checking website that rates the accuracy of claims by elected officials and others on its Truth-O-Meter.

www.politifact.com

So not only has the official Israeli position never been that there were 40 beheaded babies, the whole claim originated from a single report who herself never said there was 40 beheaded babies. The spokesperson from the Netanyahu office never stated there was 40 beheaded babies, just that there were beheaded babies and that these reports came from soldiers on the ground (parotting the flalse I24 report). It was immediately walked back by the actual Israeli government who said they could not corroborate the reports. Other people then parroted parts of this original uncorroborated claim.

The reason we KNEW for a fact that the initial uncorroborated reports are false so quickly, is thanks to Israeli investigations and eyewitness into these reports. There was no attempt from the Israeli government to fabricate 40 beheaded babies and this claim did not come from any government official.

If anyone is still saying that Israel claimed that there were 40 beheaded babies, it's a clear sign that they are an idiot who only get their information from the most moronic sources possible. They should be ashamed and embarrassed.

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Is the desecration of ANZAC graves a war crime?

 

[faible]

Can you give a yes or no to my question. It's not really a gotcha, you can still agree with me that it doesn't explain the atrocity Hamas committed, but at least then we can agree to disagree on what we are referring to as context or how we apply it.

See now it sounds like you are doing a whataboutism. Nobody was contextualizing Israel's actions so there's no reason to bring that up in the context of our discussion about Hamas's actions on October 7th. I also disgaree and would find it incredibly uncomfortable and weird to contextualise any sexual abuse committed by Israel. What context would you give? Imagine trying to contextualize it by saying "Well, for context, Hamas did fire thousands or rockets into Israel prior to that IDF soldier committing sexual abuse".

Once again, your grasp of what context is seems lacking.

You're confusing context, with justification.

People aren't contextualising Israel's actions when they say October 7th repeatedly?

 

[Jazny]

Once again, your grasp of what context is seems lacking.

You're confusing context, with justification.

People aren't contextualising Israel's actions when they say October 7th repeatedly?

No Israel's war on Hamas is actually justified by October 7th.

If Israel commits a war crime, then you don't just say "but for context, October 7th". In fact, I would be shocked if you could show me a single example of you contextualising an Israeli war crime by referring to the October 7th atrocities.

 

[faible]

justified by October 7th.

 

[Jazny]

You can pretend to laugh because you don't have a proper argument, but Israel's right to defense under article 51 against Hamas is extremely strong particularly with credible threats from the group to carry out more and more similar attacks. Actually, I would say it's going to be close to impossible to argue against it. You can try if you like. So the Israel Hamas is justified by October 7th and the continued threat posed by Hamas. This isn't context, it's justification.

There is not proper context to explain war crimes Israel commits though based on prior grievances between Israel and Hamas. For example, if Israeli troops have been found to have straight up executed civilians knowing they pose no threat, offering October 7th as context for that atrocity would be extremely weird and gross. Do you agree?

So go ahead and show me a single instance of you providing context for an Israeli war crime. And if you havent, why not? Why do you feel the need to contextualize an atrocity when Hamas does it?

 

[faible]

You can pretend to laugh because you don't have a proper argument, but Israel's right to defense under article 51 against Hamas is extremely strong particularly with credible threats from the group to carry out more and more similar attacks. Actually, I would say it's going to be close to impossible to argue against it. You can try if you like. So the Israel Hamas is justified by October 7th and the continued threat posed by Hamas. This isn't context, it's justification.

There is not proper context to explain war crimes Israel commits though. For example, if Israeli troops have been found to have straight up executed civilians knowing they pose no threat, offering October 7th as context for that atrocity would be extremely weird and gross. Do you agree?

So go ahead and show me a single instance of you providing context for an undisputed Israeli war crime. And if you havent, why not? Why do you feel the need to contextualize an atrocity when Hamas does it?

Israel has plenty of people here defending their war crimes, doesn't seem necessary to really add anything there. Same as how we all just kind of nod and agree that Hamas has committed war crimes and is a terrorist organisation, it doesn't really tend to need further discussion. All these people you keep accusing of supporting Hamas, aren't. They're supporting civilians right to not be slaughtered, mostly Palestinians because they're by far the worst off in this situation.

Why some people feel the need to endlessly justify Israel's war crimes is beyond me though. Which is what you find yourself doing on a daily basis.

Seems to me you're seemingly coming around to the idea of Israel having committed war crimes, but that you're still convinced they're justified war crimes:

justified by October 7th.

Israeli war crime

There's a 21-page report detailing war crimes, crimes against humanity, and violations of IHL and IHRL that might be worthy of a read.

 

[Jazny]

Israel has plenty of people here defending their war crimes, doesn't seem necessary to really add anything there. Same as how we all just kind of nod and agree that Hamas has committed war crimes and is a terrorist organisation, it doesn't really tend to need further discussion. All these people you keep accusing of supporting Hamas, aren't. They're supporting civilians right to not be slaughtered, mostly Palestinians because they're by far the worst off in this situation.

Why some people feel the need to endlessly justify Israel's war crimes is beyond me though. Which is what you find yourself doing on a daily basis.

Didn't think you would actually address anything I said. It was a losing argument for you. I will just take this post as you taking the L on that issue and we can move on.

Seems to me you're seemingly coming around to the idea of Israel having committed war crimes, but that you're still convinced they're justified war crimes:

Coming around? Since I started discussing it I have never denied Israel will have committed war crimes. You just don't know what a war crime is and claim basically any time a civilian dies its a war crime.

As I suggest in the other half of this post, it's actually you guys that struggle to unreservedly condemn Hamas's actions without constantly adding false context.

Also, you guys almost always seem to be wrong about everything. It's actually pretty bizarre. I'm not sure you guys have ever made a factual based case for anything, almost every claim by the anti-Israeli crew is wrong or misleading. When your collective strike rate is that bad, and all of your misses favour Hamas, intentionally or not, you guys are amplifying misinformation in a way that benefits Hamas.

 

[faible]

Didn't think you would actually address anything I said. It was a losing argument for you. I will just take this post as you taking the L on that issue and we can move on.

Coming around? Since I started discussing it I have never denied Israel will have committed war crimes. You just don't know what a war crime is and claim basically any time a civilian dies its a war crime.
View attachment 2037564
As I suggest in the other half of this post, it's actually you guys that struggle to unreservedly condemn Hamas's actions without constantly adding false context.

Also, you guys almost always seem to be wrong about everything. It's actually pretty bizarre. I'm not sure you guys have ever made a factual based case for anything, almost every claim by the anti-Israeli crew is wrong or misleading. When your collective strike rate is that bad, and all of your misses favour Hamas, intentionally or not, you guys are amplifying misinformation in a way that benefits Hamas.

You mean those of us who've been saying Israel has been committing war crimes for months? We've been wrong about 'everything' despite even you agreeing that Israel are committing war crimes?

Now you're happy to admit Israel are committing war crimes, but that they're justified war crimes?

I've been quite happy to condemn the actions of Hamas the entire time, I'm not sure what part of my repeated condemnation for Hamas has been confusing.

 

[ZEV]

HAHAHAHAH, yes they just spray painted ARABS on the wall.

Ignore the hastily painted over parts, that's nothing.

What do you think it says?

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

Didn't think you would actually address anything I said. It was a losing argument for you. I will just take this post as you taking the L on that issue and we can move on.

Coming around? Since I started discussing it I have never denied Israel will have committed war crimes. You just don't know what a war crime is and claim basically any time a civilian dies its a war crime.
View attachment 2037564
As I suggest in the other half of this post, it's actually you guys that struggle to unreservedly condemn Hamas's actions without constantly adding false context.

Also, you guys almost always seem to be wrong about everything. It's actually pretty bizarre. I'm not sure you guys have ever made a factual based case for anything, almost every claim by the anti-Israeli crew is wrong or misleading. When your collective strike rate is that bad, and all of your misses favour Hamas, intentionally or not, you guys are amplifying misinformation in a way that benefits Hamas.

I'm not sure you realise how bad it looks when someone posts like that on an internet message board.

I've had to correct you on your attempt to disregard the Times of London article (the people quoted didn't like the article, the quotes were correct; the Times are 'investigating it ).

Your irrelevant Caroline test nonsense and nebulous claims about Hamas not being a state actor and their right of resistance (there is absolutely no relevance).

Your terrible attempt at an argument defending Israel's slaughter of civilians (if they really wanted they would starve them all ).

Your belief that nobody can investigate a war crime until the offending party offers their justification, or investigates themselves.

Your attempt to say Gaza was no longer occupied post-2005 withdrawal.

Gosh the list just goes on.

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

What do you think it says?

I don't actually care, I just thought your story was hilarious.

 

[Jazny]

Now you're happy to admit Israel are committing war crimes, but that they're justified war crimes?

There is so much wrong with this sentence it's hard to know where to begin. "Now" is wrong, I said this last year. "Admit" implies I ever said or thought otherwise. I dont need to admit that Israeli forces would be committing war crimes. There is no such thing as a justified war crime I know you guys try and pretend there is by adding "context" to Hamas's war crimes, but there isn't.

 

[ZEV]

I don't actually care, I just thought your story was hilarious.

Thats all it says.

If you can tell me whats under the paint I'll translate it for you