Well, well, well...lookie here!

[apuchar]

Huh? What would one have to do with the other? You don't believe that he is playing too much midfield because that is one of weakest areas? Not many if any players have the ability to play both positions well. He was meant to play more forward in 2011 but injuries killed us and although I hate seeing him play midfield I didn agree that it was needed. It was no coincidence that in the three of games where he did play more forward ie Suns, Brisbane and Essendon he kicked 11 out of his 21 season goals. Not a bad return if you ask me.

It was a joke Yakka Man. I am not going to make any judgements on whether Pav is in decline or on his forward ability until he is back playing there consistently and the players up the ground have a game plan to work by. This board needs a smilie for sarcastic, sorry.

 

[tacopavlich]

Well, this year's definitely was. More of a default victory.

But his AA record proves my point entirely and absolutely.

When was he last selected and when has he been the best in his position?

He was selected in 2008. 2009 wasn't his best season. 2010 he was on fire again before hurting his ankle. Still a bit stiff to miss out.

So you realy are only basing your criticism of Pav on one season three years ago.

Hardly proves your point entirely and absolutely.

 

[Freomaniac]

On recent form this is the case.

I don't think he will ever have a 2006 again, and he will need to do something special to get close. Not saying it can't happen, but we haven't seen signs of a dominating Pav for quite a while.

I reckon its still possible.

I said this before, hes with us until 2014. So theres 3 good years left. A lot can happen from now and 2014.

I just Dont think that he should be chucked in the midfield.

A good 20 games in the forward 50 for Pavlich equals 60 goals minimum Ross Lyon will make sure of it.

 

[Chops_a_must]

He was selected in 2008. 2009 wasn't his best season. 2010 he was on fire again before hurting his ankle. Still a bit stiff to miss out.

So you realy are only basing your criticism of Pav on one season three years ago.

Hardly proves your point entirely and absolutely.

It actually does.

Apart from 2006, I don't think he's ever been the best exponent on the position that he is actually playing, forward of centre.

That is the point. Those expecting him to be that dominating force again I feel are going to be disappointed. Based on the fact that he hasn't done it for many years, and when he has, he can no longer keep it going for an extended period of time.

We have one dominant player in our team. One player who is unquestionably the best player of that position when fit. Our fortunes hang on him, not Pav.

There are still questions Pav needs to answer when it comes to how he wants to be remembered. He is a rung below, and justifiably so, below what most Freo supporters think of Pav's standing.

I'm not saying he can't pull something out of the hat. Because he has always had the talent and ability. I'm saying it is unlikely he will be that level of player that the matches are dictated by. He can no longer "will" the team to victory like he did against North Melbourne years ago.

 

[Chops_a_must]

I reckon its still possible.

I said this before, hes with us until 2014. So theres 3 good years left. A lot can happen from now and 2014.

I just Dont think that he should be chucked in the midfield.

A good 20 games in the forward 50 for Pavlich equals 60 goals minimum Ross Lyon will make sure of it.

That is the caveat.

I don't think he's ever had a coach that has known how to structure around him.

 

[tacopavlich]

It actually does.

Apart from 2006, I don't think he's ever been the best exponent on the position that he is actually playing, forward of centre.

That is the point. Those expecting him to be that dominating force again I feel are going to be disappointed. Based on the fact that he hasn't done it for many years, and when he has, he can no longer keep it going for an extended period of time.

We have one dominant player in our team. One player who is unquestionably the best player of that position when fit. Our fortunes hang on him, not Pav.

There are still questions Pav needs to answer when it comes to how he wants to be remembered. He is a rung below, and justifiably so, below what most Freo supporters think of Pav's standing.

I'm not saying he can't pull something out of the hat. Because he has always had the talent and ability. I'm saying it is unlikely he will be that level of player that the matches are dictated by. He can no longer "will" the team to victory like he did against North Melbourne years ago.

Some people thought Cox's best was behind him in 2010. Given a good run without injury and he was the best ruck of 2011.

Pav given the chance at CHF i see no reason he can't do the same and relive his dominating form. He's even proven he can.

Of course given his age he will eventually slow down, even by next year, but i see no evidence of it so far.

 

[Dr Ralph Dagg]

Apart from 2006, I don't think he's ever been the best exponent on the position that he is actually playing, forward of centre.

That is the point. Those expecting him to be that dominating force again I feel are going to be disappointed. Based on the fact that he hasn't done it for many years, and when he has, he can no longer keep it going for an extended period of time.

No, he has done it, just in fits and spurts. The reason he did well in 2006 was the team was on fire particularly Murphy in the second half. After 2006, we went with Tarrants and so Pav was copnsistently double-teamed.

We have one dominant player in our team. One player who is unquestionably the best player of that position when fit. Our fortunes hang on him, not Pav.

Sandi is not a dominant player? When fit you can add in Mundy, Barlow, Fyfe, McPharlin and Hill. Maybe Morabito who could be anything.

There are still questions Pav needs to answer when it comes to how he wants to be remembered. He is a rung below, and justifiably so, below what most Freo supporters think of Pav's standing.

I'm not saying he can't pull something out of the hat. Because he has always had the talent and ability. I'm saying it is unlikely he will be that level of player that the matches are dictated by. He can no longer "will" the team to victory like he did against North Melbourne years ago.

If we need Pav to will us over the line then we haven't progressed at all in 5 years.

This is a wonderful thread crossing from biology through to wishing to change the past drafting.

In terms of key forwards I think we are well set for 3 years. Firstly, Pav is a 60+ goal a year forward in the right structure. I think Bradley showed last year he can be a 40+ goal a year forward, similarly Mayne.

I don't know about the rest of you but when I do the magnetic board thing I look at that midfield and think we are slipping way under the radar for next season. Mundy, Fyfe, Hill, Morabito, Barlow are all goal kickers. De Boer would be if he could kick straight. It's the midfield where we will win games and if you add in Crowley, McPhee, Lower with their bigger bodies we are in great position to give finals a shake this year.

I'll worry about forwards for 2014-15 next year. I want a big leap in performance from those players who we have been developing for three years.

 

[Sigwald]

Sandi is not a dominant player?

I do believe that is exactly the player Chops is referring too.

 

[E Shed]

No, he has done it, just in fits and spurts. The reason he did well in 2006 was the team was on fire particularly Murphy in the second half. After 2006, we went with Tarrants and so Pav was copnsistently double-teamed.

Point of order, I believe Murphy kicked 23 goals for the entire year. It was just that he kicked them without missing until someone in the press noticed and wrote an article about his deadeye kicking at which point he went to water and started shanking them. He was decent in the final we won against Melbourne when he was one out in the forward line with Pav playing more as a decoy. It was so long since we'd had anybody that even looked like it up forward that Murphy looked like the messiah. Of course we all know what happened next, cheque book schabolly mortgaged our future for Tarrant and Murphy never played a decent game of footy again. People including myself maintained for a long time that it was because of the Tarrant trade but really how long do you keep making excuses for someone that simply wasn't good enough at the top level.
As you were.

 

[Dr Ralph Dagg]

Point of order, I believe Murphy kicked 23 goals for the entire year. It was just that he kicked them without missing until someone in the press noticed and wrote an article about his deadeye kicking at which point he went to water and started shanking them. He was decent in the final we won against Melbourne when he was one out in the forward line with Pav playing more as a decoy. It was so long since we'd had anybody that even looked like it up forward that Murphy looked like the messiah. Of course we all know what happened next, cheque book schabolly mortgaged our future for Tarrant and Murphy never played a decent game of footy again. People including myself maintained for a long time that it was because of the Tarrant trade but really how long do you keep making excuses for someone that simply wasn't good enough at the top level.
As you were.

Yeah ... but my recollection was 16 of those goals was in the last 7-8 games.

You could argue that Schwabolly knew exactly how good Murphy was by then immediately seeking to get Tarrant.

You could also argue that one thing Connolly did very effectively was kill off the career aspirations of forwards -- Croad, Tarrant, Medhurst, Murphy and Polak. (Wasn't Polak a star forward in th 18's before being drafted and played in the backline). Then there was his use of JLo and Simmonds in the forward line when both were excellent ruckman.

 

[Clay Davis]

The thing about Murphy is that he had shown something as a 21 year old key forward. May not have been a great deal, but Freo's never had many promising key forwards anyway. There was something with which a good coach could work with.

Tarrant might have been the better player, but his strike rate in 2007 was no better than Murphy's in 2006. 33 goals from 21 games in Tarrant vs 22 goals from 12 in Murphy.

It's easy to say that Murphy was a spud, and he may well have always gone that way, but ranked against other key forwards who have won premierships (Hansen, N Ablett, Dawes), he was as good as could be expected at that age.

 

[theGav56]

I do believe that is exactly the player Chops is referring too.

Shows how opinions can change.

 

[IAMJUNGLEMUFFIN]

Bump :/

Would have thought we'd pick up a couple of Baby Gorillas in the RD :/

Guess we've gone looking for players who can make the grade, rather than ticking a semi obselete box. I guess the reason why I'm relaxed about it is we've clearly got different views on the future of football than the must have lots of KPP herd.

 

[BananaOnTheRun]

We've got a really exciting team. Fast, great endurance, great marks, highly skilled. On players alone, Ross will have to change the game plan he had with the saints. That's the interest now, how it all gels together.