West Coast free kick stats to R12

[Uglybustard]

West Coast Eagles free kick stats to Round 12 this year show a remarkable difference compared to the other 17 teams in the AFL, when comparing not just Frees For, but the ratio of Frees For to Frees Against. Are the Eagles really that deserving of such a massive advantage, or is it just down to a handful of Eagles players who have learned to milk the system. The stats are very revealing http://bit.ly/N9kikX

 

[UpForGrabs]

West Coast Eagles free kick stats to Round 12 this year show a remarkable difference compared to the other 17 teams in the AFL, when comparing not just Frees For, but the ratio of Frees For to Frees Against. Are the Eagles really that deserving of such a massive advantage, or is it just down to a handful of Eagles players who have learned to milk the system. The stats are very revealing http://bit.ly/N9kikX

My oh my, where do I start??

While your article reeks of a jaded Carlton supporter who thinks the only possible reason your team lost last week was because of the umpires, I'm mindful that I'll be judged as an ignorant Eagles fan... so I'll move past it.

Since this is the stats board, I'll try to talk of the facts. Yes, we have a higher free kick ratio than other sides. The facts show that. Everything else you mention is conjecture and opinion.

For example, what proof have you to back up this statement, particularly the bolded parts?

There is no doubt that free kicks, by weight of volume, are winning matches of footy for the West Coast Eagles this year. And that the Weagles train like hell to max their free count each week. And I reckon the Selwoods have had a chat to their bro.

Where's the whingeing that Chris Mayne has a 16:1 free kick ratio? Where's the outrage of the players with a higher free kick ratio that Luke Shuey? It's not there because that would take away from the real point of your message that you think the Eagles are cheating, or that the umpires (for some reason) are deliberately favouring the Eagles.

Never once is there a counterpoint to your post that perhaps... just perhaps that there's a possibility that players get more free kicks than others simply because they've earned those free kicks. Unless you've watched each and every WCE match (and as a Blues fan, why would you?), you wouldn't know the amount of free kicks which were warranted and those that weren't.

Follow the VIC media and you'll read stories of Collingwood getting ready for the 'duckers', while AFL 360 will highlight the same 5 decisions as examples of our cheating. It's but a snapshot of the season, typical of people striving to find excuses as to why their team lost, as if the old "we weren't good enough" excuse isn't a viable excuse.

I'm just trying to figure out the point of your post, that's all.

 

[footygdzzz545]

Play any other team, and people take it on the chin

The main problem is the total inconsistency of the umpire

but just laying it on thick, in a situation that could not be avoided by the tackler, gives you a free kick, and a frequent 50m.

There's are my favorites, in fact they argue my case perfectly. The first sums up my feelings exactly.Play any other team, and get the same decisions....and teams just take it on the chin mostly...play the eagles.. OUTRAGE rabble rabble rabble. The second point...points out what we have all been saying which is THE UMPIRES MAKE THE CALLS...the players don't so why is everyone talking like the eagles are responsible for these so called unfair calls. Third....a situation that can't be avoided by the tackler....come on now...if a player tackles high..than it's high, they can always avoid it.

 

[UpForGrabs]

Yeah, basically that's a load of wank.

And now, thanks to opinions on umpiring decisions... this thread no longer belongs on the stats board.

Mods should feel free to move it to the umpiring board, where conspiracy theorists abound.

 

[Uglybustard]

Yeah, basically that's a load of wank.

And now, thanks to opinions on umpiring decisions... this thread no longer belongs on the stats board.

Mods should feel free to move it to the umpiring board, where conspiracy theorists abound.

Lets bring it back to the stats then. The bell curve is the most interesting. To have one team, out of 18, on such an outlier, is, under statistical analysis, not a fluke. The stats show it is just down to 7 players who make up the advantage. And of those 7, its really just Shuey and Cox, maybe Kerr and Hams, that are the main standouts. If you look at the situation as an unbiased stats person, you would propose a number of hypotheses and decide which one to test. IE:
1. The umpires favour WCE.
2. Home crowd advantage influences umpires decisions.
3. WCE players are simply better than the rest of the competition by that amount.
4. WCE players have learned how to milk free kicks from the umpires.

1, 2 and 3 are rubbish when you think about it. Number 4 seems reasonable, but it only applies to a couple, maybe a handful of players. EG: Cox has learned how to max chopping of the arms frees, Shuey and Hams have learned how to shrug into head high frees.

Takes the emotion out of the argument and turns it into a boring analysis. Much more fun bagging the umps and calling WCE cheats dont you think?

 

[Uglybustard]

My oh my, where do I start??

While your article reeks of a jaded Carlton supporter who thinks the only possible reason your team lost last week was because of the umpires, I'm mindful that I'll be judged as an ignorant Eagles fan... so I'll move past it.

Since this is the stats board, I'll try to talk of the facts. Yes, we have a higher free kick ratio than other sides. The facts show that. Everything else you mention is conjecture and opinion.

For example, what proof have you to back up this statement, particularly the bolded parts?



Where's the whingeing that Chris Mayne has a 16:1 free kick ratio? Where's the outrage of the players with a higher free kick ratio that Luke Shuey? It's not there because that would take away from the real point of your message that you think the Eagles are cheating, or that the umpires (for some reason) are deliberately favouring the Eagles.

Never once is there a counterpoint to your post that perhaps... just perhaps that there's a possibility that players get more free kicks than others simply because they've earned those free kicks. Unless you've watched each and every WCE match (and as a Blues fan, why would you?), you wouldn't know the amount of free kicks which were warranted and those that weren't.

Follow the VIC media and you'll read stories of Collingwood getting ready for the 'duckers', while AFL 360 will highlight the same 5 decisions as examples of our cheating. It's but a snapshot of the season, typical of people striving to find excuses as to why their team lost, as if the old "we weren't good enough" excuse isn't a viable excuse.

I'm just trying to figure out the point of your post, that's all.

like your post. see my reply to UpForGrabs below

 

[UpForGrabs]

Lets bring it back to the stats then. The bell curve is the most interesting. To have one team, out of 18, on such an outlier, is, under statistical analysis, not a fluke. The stats show it is just down to 7 players who make up the advantage. And of those 7, its really just Shuey and Cox, maybe Kerr and Hams, that are the main standouts. If you look at the situation as an unbiased stats person, you would propose a number of hypotheses and decide which one to test. IE:
1. The umpires favour WCE.
2. Home crowd advantage influences umpires decisions.
3. WCE players are simply better than the rest of the competition by that amount.
4. WCE players have learned how to milk free kicks from the umpires.

1, 2 and 3 are rubbish when you think about it. Number 4 seems reasonable, but it only applies to a couple, maybe a handful of players. EG: Cox has learned how to max chopping of the arms frees, Shuey and Hams have learned how to shrug into head high frees.

Takes the emotion out of the argument and turns it into a boring analysis. Much more fun bagging the umps and calling WCE cheats dont you think?

No, not really. This is the stats board, not Bay 13. We deal with FACTS here, not speculation.

Take the free kick stats and look at it from other angles before you come up with your arguments.

What other things could a high free kick count suggest. Can you deduce that a team with a higher free kick ratio ala WCE have the ball more often than their opponents and therefore are earning more and giving away less? Not really, because we don't have the data as to what the free kicks were for.

However when you throw in that to this stage of the season, the WCE have the lowest tackle count of any team in the league and things start to look a little clearer. What do tackle stats mean? You tackle when you don't have the ball (otherwise it's a free kick), therefore wouldn't a low tackle count suggest that they have the ball more than the opposition? Not necessarily. Then you look and see that the WCE have also been tackled the least of any team in the league. What would that suggest? Make of it what you will (and the conspiro types out there would say that the tackle count would be much higher if so many weren't paid as 'too high').

Let's look at the possession stats as well:

West Coast have had 3979 possessions this season, while their opposition has had 3757 - that's the lowest in the league. That's a 222 possession difference over 11 games. 20.18 possessions a game more than their opponents. So we know they've had more of the ball than their opponents this season.

Take things from all angles before you jump to "WCE players milk frees from the umpires". Oh, and the part where you look more like a jaded Carlton fan (aren't they all jaded by now) is when you trot out the "Cox has learned how to max chopping of the arms frees" line. Go through the WCE matches and tell me how many times he's been given a free for chopping of the arms. Then come back to me and tell me your argument wasn't based on one single decision in last week's game.

No argument is really worth having until you actually sit down, and go through each and every free kick given to the WCE this season and look at each of them objectively. Until then, as I said before, you just sound jaded and are making excuses for your team's lost when top of the list should be "1. We were outplayed and we've been outplayed for the past six weeks".

 

[Uglybustard]

No, not really. This is the stats board, not Bay 13. We deal with FACTS here, not speculation.

Take the free kick stats and look at it from other angles before you come up with your arguments.

What other things could a high free kick count suggest. Can you deduce that a team with a higher free kick ratio ala WCE have the ball more often than their opponents and therefore are earning more and giving away less? Not really, because we don't have the data as to what the free kicks were for.

However when you throw in that to this stage of the season, the WCE have the lowest tackle count of any team in the league and things start to look a little clearer. What do tackle stats mean? You tackle when you don't have the ball (otherwise it's a free kick), therefore wouldn't a low tackle count suggest that they have the ball more than the opposition? Not necessarily. Then you look and see that the WCE have also been tackled the least of any team in the league. What would that suggest? Make of it what you will (and the conspiro types out there would say that the tackle count would be much higher if so many weren't paid as 'too high').

Let's look at the possession stats as well:

West Coast have had 3979 possessions this season, while their opposition has had 3757 - that's the lowest in the league. That's a 222 possession difference over 11 games. 20.18 possessions a game more than their opponents. So we know they've had more of the ball than their opponents this season.

Take things from all angles before you jump to "WCE players milk frees from the umpires". Oh, and the part where you look more like a jaded Carlton fan (aren't they all jaded by now) is when you trot out the "Cox has learned how to max chopping of the arms frees" line. Go through the WCE matches and tell me how many times he's been given a free for chopping of the arms. Then come back to me and tell me your argument wasn't based on one single decision in last week's game.

No argument is really worth having until you actually sit down, and go through each and every free kick given to the WCE this season and look at each of them objectively. Until then, as I said before, you just sound jaded and are making excuses for your team's lost when top of the list should be "1. We were outplayed and we've been outplayed for the past six weeks".

I'm glad to have elicited such a passionate response, hey, footy's an emotional sport, good on you.
1) Sure, like my original article, my hypotheses are flavoured for provocation, but are suggestions only, prefaced by IE., and my comments on Cox, Shuey and Hams is prefaced by EG., that means 'for example'. I also say you would test this. You are more than welcome to suggest and test your own hypotheses, or you can choose to laugh at mine or take them to heart if you want to.
2) Those possession and tackle stats you provide are interesting. But what is your point in relation to frees ratio? You get frees with or without the ball. Look at WCE with the ball (Shuey high tackle) and WCE without it (Aaron Joseph holding the ball) last week.
I feel you may have missed my underlying point, which is that (a) the Eagles free ratio is so extreme that its not down to luck, and (b) just 7 players are responsible, and of these, only 2 or 3 make up most of the massive difference. Dont know about you, but this surprised me, and really takes the wind out of alot of peoples sails, hence my comment "Takes the emotion out of the argument and turns it into a boring analysis. Much more fun bagging the umps and calling WCE cheats dont you think?" Not that I would of course. A person like me? No, never! but if you dont lighten up a bit and take stats too seriously, theres the risk of turning into an anal retentive old fart before your time, and I wouldnt want that.
I'll be tuned in to the Eagles game against the pies this week, as much for the frees as the result, and not just on the teams total frees, but the individual counts for the 'magnificent 7' I have mentioned.
It will be interesting to compare the ratios I've taken now, at the middle of the season, with the season's end ratios.
Cheers.

 

[Belnakor]

Then you look and see that the WCE have also been tackled the least of any team in the league. What would that suggest? Make of it what you will (and the conspiro types out there would say that the tackle count would be much higher if so many weren't paid as 'too high').

some of your post makes sense.

But that point there: doesn't this simply mean that, for every time an eagles player is tackled the opposition have a higher chance of being pinged for too high?

I think its pretty damn obvious the eagles players have been taught to duck their head in a tackle. But whatever.

 

[UpForGrabs]

some of your post makes sense.

But that point there: doesn't this simply mean that, for every time an eagles player is tackled the opposition have a higher chance of being pinged for too high?

I think its pretty damn obvious the eagles players have been taught to duck their head in a tackle. But whatever.

You see, I just can't get behind this at all. What team would actually have this as a training policy?

Worsfold commented on this today and basically laughed at the suggestion. But I guess some people have it in their heads that the eagles actually devote training time to ducking techniques.

 

[footygdzzz545]

If someone is running at you, and you brace to tackle them, then at the last minute they put their head down. What option do you have? Continue the tackle? Or jump out of the way and try to get them from the side as they run by full speed?

The umpire is there to enforce the rules that are created to make a fair game, and ensure the safety of the players.

How is the umpire to blame for the constant high tackles that the Eagles play for, when the constantly duck their heads into tackles, and receive free kicks, and some times 50ms?

1. If someone tackles deliberately pinning the arms in order the prevent the ball disposal, and in an attempt to draw a free kick for holding the ball..how is it any different to what you are ACCUSING (if we say assume your right, for arguments sake only)

2. If wce opposing teams stop attempting to pin arms and purely tackle around the waist, how can ducking/arm lifting turn that into a high tackle? U can duck your head into the tackle all you want, around the waist is around the waist and a good legal tackle (please correct me if I'm wrong)

3. Umm the umpires can help because they enforce the rules. If anyone is doing something illegal than call it, or report. If they aren't and you think they should take it up with AFL n umpires, if nothing illegal is being done than SHUT THE **** UP

4. I'm not in any way comparing the footy I play to AFL N have no idea what it's like out there but from my very lil experience a good tackle, doesn't give u time to think about ducking..cos before you know it..u is GONE. I don't know of anyone tackled by beau waters being accused of drawing a free kick...cos they were too busy being unconscious to throw there arms n duck the head. Stop ****ing around with pinning arms n shit n just learn to tackle ya pussies.

 

[Uglybustard]

You see, I just can't get behind this at all. What team would actually have this as a training policy?

Worsfold commented on this today and basically laughed at the suggestion. But I guess some people have it in their heads that the eagles actually devote training time to ducking techniques.

you train to tackle well, of course you train to break tackles well. If you can draw a free from the latter, even better, and train for that too. J Selwood been doin it for yrs, Shuey's shake off of Gibbs was a text book copy of Selwood. Met Woosha when he was asst coach at the Blues. someone you get an instant rapport with, and good sense of humour. No doubt WCE players would give everything for their coach, and that he'd be enjoying the banter on the frees.

 

[Uglybustard]

1. If someone tackles deliberately pinning the arms in order the prevent the ball disposal, and in an attempt to draw a free kick for holding the ball..how is it any different to what you are ACCUSING (if we say assume your right, for arguments sake only)

2. If wce opposing teams stop attempting to pin arms and purely tackle around the waist, how can ducking/arm lifting turn that into a high tackle? U can duck your head into the tackle all you want, around the waist is around the waist and a good legal tackle (please correct me if I'm wrong)

3. Umm the umpires can help because they enforce the rules. If anyone is doing something illegal than call it, or report. If they aren't and you think they should take it up with AFL n umpires, if nothing illegal is being done than SHUT THE **** UP

4. I'm not in any way comparing the footy I play to AFL N have no idea what it's like out there but from my very lil experience a good tackle, doesn't give u time to think about ducking..cos before you know it..u is GONE. I don't know of anyone tackled by beau waters being accused of drawing a free kick...cos they were too busy being unconscious to throw there arms n duck the head. Stop ******* around with pinning arms n shit n just learn to tackle ya pussies.

wellinghams comments prior to this arvo's game basically mirrored what you say on not pinning the arms and bringing them to ground. The big diff at afl level is that players are stronger, stand up in the tackle for longer, unless its a sling, but hence the need to pin the arms, if you dont theyll get it away. gonna be a good game.

 

[footygdzzz545]

wellinghams comments prior to this arvo's game basically mirrored what you say on not pinning the arms and bringing them to ground. The big diff at afl level is that players are stronger, stand up in the tackle for longer, unless its a sling, but hence the need to pin the arms, if you dont theyll get it away. gonna be a good game.

Well if your playing a good team, you can't always expect to lay the perfect tackle every time. I totally understand why pinning the arms is desirable but if doing so is problematic cos the eagles r a good team that's learnt to effectively avoid a tackle, then instead of doing the same thing and expecting different results n then whining when u don't get Em, change ur tactics appropriately.

Pies did that today and it worked... Surprise surprise. Sure hand balls were made off but what an amazing game of football it was because of that (not on it's own obviously) made for some great watching and....free kick count went pies way. Not rocket science people.

 

[Uglybustard]

Well if your playing a good team, you can't always expect to lay the perfect tackle every time. I totally understand why pinning the arms is desirable but if doing so is problematic cos the eagles r a good team that's learnt to effectively avoid a tackle, then instead of doing the same thing and expecting different results n then whining when u don't get Em, change ur tactics appropriately.

Pies did that today and it worked... Surprise surprise. Sure hand balls were made off but what an amazing game of football it was because of that (not on it's own obviously) made for some great watching and....free kick count went pies way. Not rocket science people.

yes great game for presha. I dont agree with you entirely though, the free count wasnt down to pies new way of tackling. Whether under instruction by the Geisch or not, in the 2nd half the umps put the whistle away. No frees at all for first half of 3rd qtr when pies had their run-on and kicked 4 goals. Cox missed out on an obvious arm tug. One 50/50 free on Pies half fwd line went pies way (holding ball vs in the back). Eagles only got one free. That was it for 3rd qtr, 1 each after 10-11 half time. Last qtr more of the same, 2-1 pies way, Beames got a 50/50, Beau Waters dropping the ball in a tackle missed, and Shuey's 50/50 high tackle on half fwd line not given. Only 5 frees for the half and I thought the Pies got the best of it. As for WCE top 4 frees receivers they all still did well in the frees dept, Cox and Hams both added to their totals 2-0 and Kerr 3-1, Shuey no frees either way. These players total 7 - 1 in a negative team count 12-14.

 

[footygdzzz545]

yes great game for presha. I dont agree with you entirely though, the free count wasnt down to pies new way of tackling. Whether under instruction by the Geisch or not, in the 2nd half the umps put the whistle away. No frees at all for first half of 3rd qtr when pies had their run-on and kicked 4 goals. Cox missed out on an obvious arm tug. One 50/50 free on Pies half fwd line went pies way (holding ball vs in the back). Eagles only got one free. That was it for 3rd qtr, 1 each after 10-11 half time. Last qtr more of the same, 2-1 pies way, Beames got a 50/50, Beau Waters dropping the ball in a tackle missed, and Shuey's 50/50 high tackle on half fwd line not given. Only 5 frees for the half and I thought the Pies got the best of it. As for WCE top 4 frees receivers they all still did well in the frees dept, Cox and Hams both added to their totals 2-0 and Kerr 3-1, Shuey no frees either way. These players total 7 - 1 in a negative team count 12-14.

Are u saying those frees to cox, hams and Kerr were bad calls. If so give more details

 

[Belnakor]

You see, I just can't get behind this at all. What team would actually have this as a training policy?

Worsfold commented on this today and basically laughed at the suggestion. But I guess some people have it in their heads that the eagles actually devote training time to ducking techniques.

The fact remains, statistically, the eagles are the least tackled team in the comp, yet they get the most head high free kicks. There is no way that is simply luck.

If they aren't being trained to do they are copying each other.

 

[footygdzzz545]

The fact remains, statistically, the eagles are the least tackled team in the comp, yet they get the most head high free kicks. There is no way that is simply luck.

If they aren't being trained to do they are copying each other.

How can people honestly suggest they are being trained to do so? I mean it's just ridiculous the AFL would be all over that like white on rice.

They are winning games, and successfully one of the top premiership contenders...whatever they are doing why the **** would they stop because some jealous Melbourne flogs are whining.

Either show me proof they are breaking some written rule, and should be penalized by the afl for doing something wrong or STFU.

 

[Belnakor]

How can people honestly suggest they are being trained to do so? I mean it's just ridiculous the AFL would be all over that like white on rice.

They are winning games, and successfully one of the top premiership contenders...whatever they are doing why the **** would they stop because some jealous Melbourne flogs are whining.

Either show me proof they are breaking some written rule, and should be penalized by the afl for doing something wrong or STFU.

It is clear they are moving in such a way as to invite head high tackles and for the opposition to infringe. the stats back it up. How else can you explain that they are the least tackled team, who gets the most high head contact frees? that simply doesn't make sense if WCE are doing exactly the same as other teams. They aren't, they are being trained in such a way that head high contact is happening.

Nothing in the rules against it, but to suggest its simply luck or WCE being "hard at it" is just a nonsense.

 

[footygdzzz545]

It is clear they are moving in such a way as to invite head high tackles and for the opposition to infringe. the stats back it up. How else can you explain that they are the least tackled team, who gets the most high head contact frees? that simply doesn't make sense if WCE are doing exactly the same as other teams. They aren't, they are being trained in such a way that head high contact is happening.

Nothing in the rules against it, but to suggest its simply luck or WCE being "hard at it" is just a nonsense.

Did I suggest it's luck?did I deny the stats?

What I said was if they aren't breaking the rules, and if the AFL has said nothing about it than they have done NOTHING WRONG accept for become an awesome team who deals with tackles in a way that benefits their game. All you flogs are doing is crapping on and on about it because your pissed they have become good and are get away with it, essentially.I personally don't believe it's on purpose, but I'm towing the line off assuming it is for the sake of my point.

I'll also repeat what I've said elsewhere numerous times which is no matter how much a player "ducks" if the tackler just went for the waist instead of constantly attempting to pin the arms, than no high tackle can be faked. For years in a tackle players go for pinning the arms in an effort to FORCE holding the ball and EARN A FREE KICK, when this is done successfully we commend it as a good tackle. When the eagles do their best to LEGALLY avoid giving away that free, they are labelled as cheaters. Before the game on the weekend collingwood publicly stated they would combat this tactic by just changing the way they tackle and going for the waist not the arms. They did that, and surprise surprise the free kick count went pies way, and shuey, the player that gets the most bullshit from flogs, got ZERO free kicks. So maybe instead of spending time airing your offended on here you should be complaining to your teams about not actually trying to learn to tackle, and just doing the same thing every time expecting differ results.

 

[Belnakor]

Did I suggest it's luck?did I deny the stats?

What I said was if they aren't breaking the rules, and if the AFL has said nothing about it than they have done NOTHING WRONG accept for become an awesome team who deals with tackles in a way that benefits their game. All you flogs are doing is crapping on and on about it because your pissed they have become good and are get away with it, essentially.I personally don't believe it's on purpose, but I'm towing the line off assuming it is for the sake of my point.

I'll also repeat what I've said elsewhere numerous times which is no matter how much a player "ducks" if the tackler just went for the waist instead of constantly attempting to pin the arms, than no high tackle can be faked. For years in a tackle players go for pinning the arms in an effort to FORCE holding the ball and EARN A FREE KICK, when this is done successfully we commend it as a good tackle. When the eagles do their best to LEGALLY avoid giving away that free, they are labelled as cheaters. Before the game on the weekend collingwood publicly stated they would combat this tactic by just changing the way they tackle and going for the waist not the arms. They did that, and surprise surprise the free kick count went pies way, and shuey, the player that gets the most bullshit from flogs, got ZERO free kicks. So maybe instead of spending time airing your offended on here you should be complaining to your teams about not actually trying to learn to tackle, and just doing the same thing every time expecting differ results.

TLDR

 

[Uglybustard]

hey everyone, for those who havent seen it, latest stats on home based WA umpires in Subiaco weagels games http://bit.ly/MKfMJz
From the heraldsun superfooty site. Reposted the bulk below cos you need a login.

"...an Inside Football study this week shows the discrepancy is even greater when home-town umpires are involved.​

The Eagles have received an average 10.1 frees for this year from WA umpires, compared with 5.2 for their opponents.​

Non-WA whistleblowers reduced that discrepancy to 8.8 to 5.9.​

South Australian umpires give the two Adelaide-based teams an average 8.3-5.9 edge at AAMI Stadium, compared with 5.9-5.8 from non-SA umpires.​

But in Victoria, local clubs receive only a 5.6-5.3 edge from home-grown umpires, while non-Victorian umpires take that even further, giving the home clubs 5.0 frees compared with 6.2 for interstate rivals.​

The study also revealed West Coast was the big winner in scores directly from free kicks and 50m penalties.​

The Eagles have scored 40.18 this year from those sources combined, almost double Richmond and Hawthorn in equal second place at 24.16.​

Collingwood had the lowest scores, 12.14."​

 

[UpForGrabs]

So according to the Herald Sun, it's not that the WCE are receiving an advantage at home... because Vic teams also receive an advantage when they play at home. It's that we're receiving TOO MUCH of an advantage.

Gotcha.

 

[Uglybustard]

So according to the Herald Sun, it's not that the WCE are receiving an advantage at home... because Vic teams also receive an advantage when they play at home. It's that we're receiving TOO MUCH of an advantage.

Gotcha.

got to laugh at this. Hard facts from 12 months ago, and look at your response. Fox footy analysts list high contact frees for last 4 years, and it dominated by Selwoods and others from the WCE. How much more evidence do you need. There is a technique for drawing high contact, and they've gotten away with it. Smart footy. But extremely frustrating for opposition supporters. I suggest you begin trying to lose your bias and look at the facts.

 

[UpForGrabs]

got to laugh at this. Hard facts from 12 months ago, and look at your response. Fox footy analysts list high contact frees for last 4 years, and it dominated by Selwoods and others from the WCE. How much more evidence do you need. There is a technique for drawing high contact, and they've gotten away with it. Smart footy. But extremely frustrating for opposition supporters. I suggest you begin trying to lose your bias and look at the facts.

That list was interesting for sure if it's the same one I'm thinking about. But it also showed that the current North skipper received more head-high free kicks than either Scott Selwood or Luke Shuey (and they're apparently two of the more notorious). No bleating on about how Andrew Swallow flaunts the rules.