What's wrong with the Bendigo Pioneers?

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beowulf

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Oct 17, 2009
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I've been watchin footy for far too long (according to my wife ;)). The last few years I have seen quite a lot of the Bendigo Pioneers. Unfortunately, it has been a VERY lean time for the Pioneers - a couple of wins each season and a handful of draftable youngsters.
Why?

When Carlton were strong, the Bendigo zone produced an impressive array of players each year. Many of the kids came from Bendigo itself. Names like Southby, Dean, Ashman and Williams are just the tip of the iceberg.

Look now and the talent just isn't there. The better players from the Pioneers are often from nearer Mildura or Echuca. Other than the Selwoods (who played cricket in Castlemaine, but went to school in Bendigo) and Dustin Martin (Castlemaine), I can't think of anyone who actually lived in Bendigo who REALLY made an impression.
This is at a time when Bendigo itself has increased in size to the point where it has overtaken Ballarat in terms of population (now over 100,000 people).
So where are all the footballers?

Lots of excuses have been tried: the logistics of the Pioneers zone are probably the hardest of all of the country zones, and fit as the most realistic excuse. However, that would suggest that fewer Mildura boys or the like be present. Nor has that stopped North Ballarat or Murray from being powerful: their logistics are almost as bad.

I'm wondering what you guys may think. I don't kow what the answer is, but I worry about footy in the NW when so few talented kids seem to be available.
 
Where do you start?

I've been really disappointed with Bendigo's performances over the past six seasons as well. Given their zone covers a large section of Victoria, I find it surprising they can't find 22 talented players to represent them week in, week out.

When I have a few moments tomorrow I will pen with thoughts on the situation. Good discussion topic :thumbsu:
 

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Sounds like a review of the Bendigo system is needed
It really does, very badly.

I think there has been a start: Pioneer home games are now at QEO rather than Golden Square. For all of the questions over QEO, it is so much better that GS that the comparisome is almost meaningless. [That makes me wonder about Essendon and their thralls, the Bendigo B*mbers, buth that is another issue.] Really, QEO is NOT is bad condition at the moment.

But there really does have to be some changes made.
 
Having watched the game on the weekend between North Ballarat and Bendigo, there was the obvious difference in skill levels, and thus North Ballarat gave them a smashing. I'm not here to sink the boots in, but North Ballarat appeared more professional, at an away game rocked up with a large contingent of coaching staff, computers etc. Further, they had two water girls who were running all over the ground, compared to Bendigo's one, who appeared more interested in watching the game. PS not having a crack at this bloke, as he obviously is giving his time for these kids, and needs to be congratulated. I know these are petty little things, but add a number of these up, and the difference can be amazing
 
Where do you start?

I've been really disappointed with Bendigo's performances over the past six seasons as well. Given their zone covers a large section of Victoria, I find it surprising they can't find 22 talented players to represent them week in, week out.

When I have a few moments tomorrow I will pen with thoughts on the situation. Good discussion topic :thumbsu:

Agree this is a vgood discussion point. Zoning years ago provided fertile grounds for some clubs, eg Bendigo for Carlton & western districts for Essendon, etc...

My understanding is that Footy Victoria now have review processes in place for TAC Clubs where personnel often with extensive AFL playing experience spend a reasonable amouunt of time assessing TAC club structures, programs etc,. Don't know how long this has been going on but seems to be a more recent initiative and can only assist clubs if findings are acted upon. Perhaps Footy Vic could consider taking a bit more control of the clubs struggling and send in hit squads to work with the kids for an extended period of time and perhaps backed up by a rotational program of regional managers and coaching/support staff. As a basic principle, key staff should be rotated on a 3-5 year basis. Whilst the TAC comp is a competitive one a key priority of Footy Vic should be to equalise the comp as much as possible.
 
What annoys me with Bendigo is that they seem to lack passion. I'm not sure the club means anything to people.

Gippsland seem to have volunteers everywhere selling raffle tickets, and have recently built a wonderful training facility. Mick Turner is a vocal spokesperson who believes in what the Falcons stand for. North Ballarat are a giant club, who have a similar professional running the joint in Phil Partington.

I couldn't even tell you who the Pioneers Regional Manager is. You look at their website and its a mess. On the field their playing list are sloppy - last time I watched Bendigo they had a player who had injured his leg - poor bloke - but rather than being in the huddle with his teammates he was over chatting to a couple of his buddies from school who had come to watch. Sorry, but thats unprofessional.

They have a huge zone. Yes, it may create more issues than benefits for them. But they should be able to find 35-40 players who can play footy at some stage! Perhaps some of those central Victorian leagues are weak. Perhaps some of those lesser levels of footy place more prestige on playing local footy than playing Pioneers footy.

Whatever it is, the Pioneers need to find an answer fast. It'd be great for the TAC Cup to see the Pioneers back on the winners list more regularly.
 
On the field their playing list are sloppy - last time I watched Bendigo they had a player who had injured his leg - poor bloke - but rather than being in the huddle with his teammates he was over chatting to a couple of his buddies from school who had come to watch. Sorry, but thats unprofessional.

Perhaps some of those lesser levels of footy place more prestige on playing local footy than playing Pioneers footy.

These 2 points here point to the answer for mine. There seems to be an attitude of sticking with your mates at your local club. Problem is with that is the culture at alot of those clubs isn't fantastic.
 
[
Some very good observations fm. Bendigo vline cup div 1 under 15 teams have been historically weak, while their secondary areas, Central Murray in Div 2 have never really set the world on fire,and their two other areas, Sunraysia and North Central have been playing Div 4. Your points on Gippsland, Ballarat and Geelong are well founded as these regions appear to have very well managed development programs. Murray also have two of the most powerful areas(Goulburn Valley and Ovens and Murray),both traditionally very strong in div 1 of vline cup.
 
They don't lose kids to school footy like Calder, Oakleigh and Sandy do either.....
 
Gents,

A friend of mine emailed me an article from the Bendigo Advertiser on the Pioneers... might give some a bit of insight into the program they run?!?

I think it is on the Bendigo Advertiser's website....
 

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http://www.bendigoadvertiser.com.au/news/local/sport/general/pioneers-in-cup-finals/1904604.aspx

“It’s another game for the boys and it gives them the chance to say they have played finals,’’ Pioneers regional manager Ray Byrne said yesterday.
“It will be a good experience for the boys.’’

A chance to say they have played finals! Should go in full of confidence on the back of a one win season.

Well found mate!!

Read the article and still shaking my head.
 
http://www.bendigoadvertiser.com.au/news/local/sport/general/pioneers-in-cup-finals/1904604.aspx

“It’s another game for the boys and it gives them the chance to say they have played finals,’’ Pioneers regional manager Ray Byrne said yesterday.
“It will be a good experience for the boys.’’

A chance to say they have played finals! Should go in full of confidence on the back of a one win season.

Read the article, appears bar is not set very high. Will be interesting to see who they play in their one final appearance: top age kids or the raft of under 16's they have brought in the last couple of weeks.
 
I think the article pointed out a few things...

They have had over 4 years 11 drafted;

- only 5 less than Gippsland and 7 less than Murray and Nth Ballarat...
- and they have been on the bottom of the ladder for all 4 years...
- Geelong doesnt count, with their demographics they should be winning flag after flag...
- The other country teams have been in the 8 every year...

I think its a great point bringing up the fact that most of the boys who do not go on and get drafted stay and play in Bendigo... does anyone think that is why Bendigo inter league squads are getting better and better? Didnt they thrash Ballarat last year and beat Gippsland this year?

Just a couple of questions you all may be able to help me out with...

If Bendigo had a boarding school like some of the other country regions that offered scholarships would that bring more players / students to the region?
Do these private schools offer scholarships to only football players?
If my daughter was any good at netball could she get a scholarship?
Are the TAC clubs working together with these Private schools to get these players / students to their region?
 
I think the article pointed out a few things...

They have had over 4 years 11 drafted;

- only 5 less than Gippsland and 7 less than Murray and Nth Ballarat...
- and they have been on the bottom of the ladder for all 4 years...
- Geelong doesnt count, with their demographics they should be winning flag after flag...
- The other country teams have been in the 8 every year...

I think its a great point bringing up the fact that most of the boys who do not go on and get drafted stay and play in Bendigo... does anyone think that is why Bendigo inter league squads are getting better and better? Didnt they thrash Ballarat last year and beat Gippsland this year?

Just a couple of questions you all may be able to help me out with...

If Bendigo had a boarding school like some of the other country regions that offered scholarships would that bring more players / students to the region?
Do these private schools offer scholarships to only football players?
If my daughter was any good at netball could she get a scholarship?
Are the TAC clubs working together with these Private schools to get these players / students to their region?

"Some of the other country regions" would only be Ballarat, with BAC College and St Pats, with a truckload of both their Under 18 and 16's enrolled.

Unsure of Geelong, but I'm fairly sure Gippsland and Murray kids don"t get a scholarship freekick.

In fact a friend of mine is thinking of boarding and enrolling his son in school in Shepparton because of the travel involved to training etc.
 
"Some of the other country regions" would only be Ballarat, with BAC College and St Pats, with a truckload of both their Under 18 and 16's enrolled.

Unsure of Geelong, but I'm fairly sure Gippsland and Murray kids don"t get a scholarship freekick.

In fact a friend of mine is thinking of boarding and enrolling his son in school in Shepparton because of the travel involved to training etc.

What area is your friends son from? From that article in the Bendigo Advertiser 3 players were boarded out to geelong and Ballarat... should these players be then recognised as bendigo players in the draft, if drafted and rep squads vic country or metro???? your thoughts
 
Gents,

A friend of mine emailed me an article from the Bendigo Advertiser on the Pioneers... might give some a bit of insight into the program they run?!?

I think it is on the Bendigo Advertiser's website....

How accurate is this article as theere is no news about it from GWS. You would think they would say something altho maybe trying to keep enthusiasm up
 
"Some of the other country regions" would only be Ballarat, with BAC College and St Pats, with a truckload of both their Under 18 and 16's enrolled.

Unsure of Geelong, but I'm fairly sure Gippsland and Murray kids don"t get a scholarship freekick.

In fact a friend of mine is thinking of boarding and enrolling his son in school in Shepparton because of the travel involved to training etc.

Huh? There's no boarding school in Shepparton mate. Unless you mean boarding externally and going to school in Shepparton. Certainly would be better if he can crack the Bushies squad for travel.

I know of a kid who was offered a scholarship to St Pats (Ballarat) and play with the Rebels, but then found out it involved playing school footy on a Wednesday and TAC on the weekends. He took another scholarship to Melbourne and only had to play once a week. Far better for a young body.
 
Huh? There's no boarding school in Shepparton mate. Unless you mean boarding externally and going to school in Shepparton. Certainly would be better if he can crack the Bushies squad for travel.

I know of a kid who was offered a scholarship to St Pats (Ballarat) and play with the Rebels, but then found out it involved playing school footy on a Wednesday and TAC on the weekends. He took another scholarship to Melbourne and only had to play once a week. Far better for a young body.


Thanks for the grammar lesson. Spot on, should have written boarding privately and enrolled at one of the secondary colleges.
 
Thanks for the grammar lesson. Spot on, should have written boarding privately and enrolled at one of the secondary colleges.

Heads up for ya mate. Goulburn Valley Grammar is the pick of the schools but terrible for football. Goulburn Valley Football League U18's is a top shelf competition. Best of both worlds.
 
Just a couple of questions you all may be able to help me out with...

If Bendigo had a boarding school like some of the other country regions that offered scholarships would that bring more players / students to the region?
Do these private schools offer scholarships to only football players?
If my daughter was any good at netball could she get a scholarship?
Are the TAC clubs working together with these Private schools to get these players / students to their region?
Bendigo is not overendowed with private schools, or boarding schools.
Girton Grammar does offer scholarships, but they hunt far more for brains not sporting ability. Sport is not their focus.
Girton has been a boarding school, but they have closed down their boarding house. There are students who do board, but not in a school run facility any more.
[I spent a number of years teaching there. Footy was very low on their priorities.]

Catholic College is huge and is into footy in a big way, but they also have distinct limitations of their scholarships. A lot of kids of former Carlton - Bendigo players have gone to Catholic College. But they don't hunt for top sportspersons like, say, Haileybury.
[I have also worked there.]

The other privates in Bendigo are small Christian schools that to not emphasize sport at all. Most don't even go up to Year 12, but finish at Year 10.

There isn't that close a relationship between any of the schools and the Pioneers. Some guys who work at either CC or Girton have been involved with the Pioneers, but I don't think any are at the moment.

The Pioneers had such a low profile at Girton that they may as well not have existed. Only a few Girton boys play with them - Andrew Collins was the last to be drafted who went to Girton. Girton only play a handful of games each year.

Catholic College don't play a lot more games, but they do spread their wings much wider than Girton to get a game. They also tend to go further and have more lads drafted.

Bendigo Senior Secondary dominates school footy in Bendigo. They have over 2000 Year 11s and 12s, so they ALWAYS have the strongest team. But with only 3 school entities playing footy in Bendigo, it means games are just not as prevalent as it is down in Melbourne or in Geelong or Ballarat. Ballarat has lots of private schools, most of whom offer boarding and who take their footy extremely seriously. Bendigo just doesn't have that.
 
Heads up for ya mate. Goulburn Valley Grammar is the pick of the schools but terrible for football. Goulburn Valley Football League U18's is a top shelf competition. Best of both worlds.
Goulburn Vallay Grammar may not be the strongest at footy, but at least have a bit of competition. The other schools in Shep do go up to Year 12.
One of Girton's 3 games per year is against Goulburn Valley Grammar, and they don't often win.
 
Goulburn Vallay Grammar may not be the strongest at footy, but at least have a bit of competition. The other schools in Shep do go up to Year 12.
One of Girton's 3 games per year is against Goulburn Valley Grammar, and they don't often win.

Goulburn Valley Grammar don't have team in the local U16 Shepparton and District Comp that the other high participate in.

GVGS had a good win over Girton today. Alex Keath (U19 world cup cricketer and GC potential draftee and AIS footballer) and Luke Lowden (Hawthorn) went there before being scholarshipped to Melbourne.
 
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