When Do Swan and Murphy play HFF?

[lecca]

Agree with the OP 100%.Its seriously a fricken joke picking midfielders on hff.

Pick players who actually play up forward.Steve Johnson and Andrew Walker deserved those spots.Both boys were very stiff to miss out.

If mids have to miss out coz theres not enough spots,stiff shit.

 

[crownie]

the simple thing to do would of been Murphy to the bench and Dal Santo goes out.

 

[Wallaby]

They never play the position HFF. No one does. King is Richmond's HFF and yet I distinctly saw him running around on the wings in some games..

If they are serious, the AA team should be picked something like this.

I ruck
9 midfielders - including a couple of taggers.
2 big target key forwards
2 small forwards who can still go into the midfield.
2 key Defenders
2 small defenders.

Then tweak it as you see fit - for instance if you have Cloke and Pods (eg) as the key forwards, you may need more specialised small forwards - if you have Riewoldt and Franklin, being more mobile, the small forwards are not so key.

But flanks, pockets and wings are positions on the ground - they are no longer positions players occupy.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Personally, I thought Swan was lucky to even make the final side, let alone the starting 18.

Obviously his second half of the year must have been considered strong enough to carry his first half.

Havign said that, he played forward a LOT this year and kicked 30 goals. Sounds like a half forward flanker to me. Much more so than Murphy. Murphy deserves his spot more, but Swan would have more claim to being a HHFer than Murphy would.

 

[entourage]

Swan has spent a bit of time up forward this year and when he's spent a significant amount of time he's kicked plenty of goals. Out of all the mids it's understandable that he's on the HFF, Murphy kicks goals but mostly from the midfield except for junk time when Ratts moves him to wherever..would've liked to see fyfe in the team though.

 

[AFaiL]

the simple thing to do would of been Murphy to the bench and Dal Santo goes out.

Hahaha, yeah, righty-o. Did you watch Dal Santo this year?

 

[KissStephanie]

Personally, I thought Swan was lucky to even make the final side, let alone the starting 18.

Isn't it enough that there are plenty of opposition supporters delusionally downgrading Collingwood players? Dane Swan was third in The Age Footballer of the Year, fourth in the Herald-Sun Player of the Year, and is fourth favourite for the Brownlow Medal alongside Gary Ablett. There is no doubt that Dane Swan deserved to be named in the All-Australian team of course.

 

[MarkT2]

Swan plays frward a bit and kicks goals when he does. If you added Mitchel and co to Collingwood's midfield Swan would play forward a lot more. The reality is backlines and forward lines are full of mids.

 

[MarkT2]

Personally, I thought Swan was lucky to even make the final side, let alone the starting 18.

Obviously his second half of the year must have been considered strong enough to carry his first half.

Havign said that, he played forward a LOT this year and kicked 30 goals. Sounds like a half forward flanker to me. Much more so than Murphy. Murphy deserves his spot more, but Swan would have more claim to being a HHFer than Murphy would.

Swan had a slowish month or so at the most before Arizona due to carrying injury. He was on fire early and has been as good since Arizona as he has been at any time over his careeer. He should and would have been one of the first picked.

He'll go top 3 or 4 in the Copeland at the very least and may even win it again. Thomas has missed a few and Cloke's gone quiet. Pendlebury from Swan and Reid IMO. Given Collingwood won 20 games and are favoured to at least make the GF that pouts Swan comfortably in the AA side even if a couple of players do slip in front of him in the Copeland.

 

[manicmagpie]

Swan had a slowish month or so at the most before Arizona due to carrying injury. He was on fire early and has been as good since Arizona as he has been at any time over his careeer. He should and would have been one of the first picked.

He'll go top 3 or 4 in the Copeland at the very least and may even win it again. Thomas has missed a few and Cloke's gone quiet. Pendlebury from Swan and Reid IMO. Given Collingwood won 20 games and are favoured to at least make the GF that pouts Swan comfortably in the AA side even if a couple of players do slip in front of him in the Copeland.

It's really only 3 weeks. Rounds 9, 10 & 11 he only averaged 22 possessions and two goals per game in that period (imagine the shame!).

Before then he averaged 28 disposals and in the 14 games since Arizona he's averaged an incredible 35 (and better than a goal a game).

If the AA team was expected to actually play a game there's no doubt that there would be extra midfielders on the flanks. Including rucks, Collingwood would rotate 12 or more players through there every week.

 

[Footy guru]

Isn't it enough that there are plenty of opposition supporters delusionally downgrading Collingwood players? Dane Swan was third in The Age Footballer of the Year, fourth in the Herald-Sun Player of the Year, and is fourth favourite for the Brownlow Medal alongside Gary Ablett. There is no doubt that Dane Swan deserved to be named in the All-Australian team of course.

He also won the triple M footballer and SEN footballer of the year finished 10 votes in front of judd for this one. He also came equal second to Goodes for the ABC footballer of the year. Probably would have won if Parkin didnt show bias against him in round 23 because Mitchell was winning. Has more clearances than Murphy and Pendlebury and kicked more goals than both of them. Some people are not checking the stats has had 71.5 efficiency in last 6 or 7 rounds.

 

[Bollox]

Murphy and Swan on the HF line doesnt worry me...sign of the times and the way of the future.
Half Forwards are going the way of the open paddock winger. Most are just midfielders anyway.
The bizzaro onefor me is Thomas on a wing..positionally ahead of Murphy for this season is way wrong.
Thomas had a good season but would have been far more suitably selected on the bench with better quality and performed midfielders selected in position.
In terms of relative value and performance you could have strengthened it a lot by selecting either Murphy or Dal Santo (even Swan) on that wing with Thomas off the bench.

 

[Blueboys7]

They never play the position HFF. No one does. King is Richmond's HFF and yet I distinctly saw him running around on the wings in some games..

You do know that a HFF doesn't have to stay inside the forward 50 to play in that position?

They obviously lead up the ground to provide a link up option from the middle and the HB line.

So why does seeing King on a wing surprise you? It shouldn't.

 

[KissStephanie]

He also won the triple M footballer and SEN footballer of the year finished 10 votes in front of judd for this one. He also came equal second to Goodes for the ABC footballer of the year. Probably would have won if Parkin didnt show bias against him in round 23 because Mitchell was winning. Has more clearances than Murphy and Pendlebury and kicked more goals than both of them. Some people are not checking the stats has had 71.5 efficiency in last 6 or 7 rounds.

Swanny's definitely had another great season! He was very good before he went to AZ, but has risen a few levels since then. I didn't expect Robert Murphy and Drew Petrie to make the All-Australian team though, and I thought Corey Enright and Nick Dal Santo may have just missed out as well.

 

[demondavey]

Swan had 6 matches this year where he kicked 3 goals or more.

I am normally all over this when the AA team gets picked, pretty unfair for plenty of forwards and defenders that miss out because of midfielders, but this is a good point. Kicking 3+ goals on more than 6 occasions is a big stat, and especially for midfielders who do push forward like Swan. I don't think Murphy should have got it though, Walker and Johnson were clearly better, but i think its difficult because guys like Swan do push forward a lot and really have an influence over that HF line.

Swan in
Murphy out for Walker or Johnson

 

[MarkT2]

The bizzaro onefor me is Thomas on a wing..positionally ahead of Murphy for this season is way wrong.
Thomas had a good season but would have been far more suitably selected on the bench with better quality and performed midfielders selected in position.
In terms of relative value and performance you could have strengthened it a lot by selecting either Murphy or Dal Santo (even Swan) on that wing with Thomas off the bench.

Thomas has had a great year and on the wing. He's missed a few games but he is probably the best performed winger in the comp over the year. He's pone of the few who actuall play the posuition like an old winger albeint in the context of modern tactics. He's often the get out option from the backline and he turns that into attack. That's pretty much the ask for the position.

 

[La Dispute]

I can't be bothered looking, but is there a single available statistic that Fyfe bettered Swan at this season?

Not one club in the AFL play a permanent front 6, or even 5 - so why would the AA team?

If you're stuck on a permanent flank, you're either not good enough or not fit enough to play midfield and one step from being delisted.

I'd have Fyfe on a flank ahead of Swan any day, regardless of any statistics you can throw about. Stevie J also.

Most Forward Flankers rotate between Wing, HFF and a Forward pocket. Swan rests there are stints in the midfield.

Last comment is laughable.

 

[Wallaby]

You do know that a HFF doesn't have to stay inside the forward 50 to play in that position?

They obviously lead up the ground to provide a link up option from the middle and the HB line.

So why does seeing King on a wing surprise you? It shouldn't.

Sorry, I left of the sarcasm smiley.

What I was trying to say (obviously badly) was that the traditional football positions are meaningless in today's game. The top mids run 12-15 Ks a game - back in the 60s the best probably ran about 7. Half-forward flankers probably only ran about 2 Ks.

Sure Collingwood have had Blair, Sidebotton and Krakoeur kicking goals in the forward line. But if they could afford to play Pendlebury, Thomas and Swan more there (because of having Judd, Hodge and Ablett in the middle) they would.

 

[Nerv_01]

I am normally all over this when the AA team gets picked, pretty unfair for plenty of forwards and defenders that miss out because of midfielders, but this is a good point. Kicking 3+ goals on more than 6 occasions is a big stat, and especially for midfielders who do push forward like Swan. I don't think Murphy should have got it though, Walker and Johnson were clearly better, but i think its difficult because guys like Swan do push forward a lot and really have an influence over that HF line.

Swan in
Murphy out for Walker or Johnson

Murphy's has been leading the Coaches award all year and has been better than both of those players if anything you would swap Murphy to the Wing and Thomas to HFF.

 

[Thommo 42]

I'd have Fyfe on a flank ahead of Swan any day, regardless of any statistics you can throw about.

.

Why? Fyfe is a midfielder. Swan is a midfielder. Swan is a better midfielder

Both of them rest forward and are strong marks for their size, but Swan is also a better forward than Fyfe.

Swan is one of the best players in the competition, Fyfe is an outstanding young player.

You can't seriously be telling me that you think Nat Fyfe is better than Dane Swan?

The only possible reason you could have for such a misguided view is that you think Fyfe is a flanker, and want people picked in position. However, this would mean you are 12 months behind and didn't watch any football in 2011, as anyone who has been watching, knows Fyfe is in fact a midfielder

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Whether or not the players play in that position all the time is not relevant.

The AA selectors pick them and then put them in a position and therefor it should go to the players who perform best in that position.

The last few years we have had some great CHF's like Brown, Reiwoldt, Pavlich.

Only one of them should be picked, not find other spots for the others to reward them for their year. One of them has a slightly better year he is awarded the spot and it may just drive the other two to work harder the following year to try and win that spot.

Do it correctly if you are going to name them in a position, otherwise just read out a list of thebest 22 players for the season.

 

[La Dispute]

Why? Fyfe is a midfielder. Swan is a midfielder. Swan is a better midfielder

Both of them rest forward and are strong marks for their size, but Swan is also a better forward than Fyfe.

Swan is one of the best players in the competition, Fyfe is an outstanding young player.

You can't seriously be telling me that you think Nat Fyfe is better than Dane Swan?

The only possible reason you could have for such a misguided view is that you think Fyfe is a flanker, and want people picked in position. However, this would mean you are 12 months behind and didn't watch any football in 2011, as anyone who has been watching, knows Fyfe is in fact a midfielder

Swan is an inside mid, Fyfe is more an outside mid who can play as an inside mid.

Disagree about Swan being a better natural forward.

Fyfe isn't better yet, but will be. No bearing on th AA team obviously.

Fyfe played on the HFF and on the Wing. He has more reason to be included in that position than Swan.