Which player out of this group has the better career? The group inc. Pendles, JPK, Selwood & Danger

[Wojcinski]

Selwood was integral part of Geelong's 2009 and 2011 flags, but he was a fringe player in 2007. It was his first season, FFS. I don't think there has ever been a teenager in his debut year who was an integral part of the side.

People always tend to overcook the truth when it comes to Joel Selwood's career

He played 21 games, averaged 20 odd possessions and won the Rising Star. He was very integral to their success.

 

[PhatBoy]

Selwood was integral part of Geelong's 2009 and 2011 flags, but he was a fringe player in 2007. It was his first season, FFS. I don't think there has ever been a teenager in his debut year who was an integral part of the side.

People always tend to overcook the truth when it comes to Joel Selwood's career

You mean like you’re doing now? The benchmark debut season for a lot of people was Judd’s. Statistically Selwood has his covered. And did it on probably less game time, if someone can be bothered looking up Judd’s figures.

 

[Back One Out]

Pretty universally acknowledged by virtually every member of the 2007 team that Selwood himself was among the key figures in the turnaround from round 5. The mere fact that in such a stacked midfield, in his debut season, on 68 per cent game time, he managed to basically average 20 touches a game (19.2 if we are getting specific) tells you all you need to know. I’m not going to go through every game but the coach had enough faith in him to start him at half forward in a grand final so I’m pretty sure we can say he wasn’t a benchwarmer.

Selwood spent the least amount on the field apart from the 2 ruckmen (and the injured Max Rooke)

The All Australian selectors picks NINE Geelong players in their team and Selwood was not one of them

The Geelong coaches gave votes after every game and Selwood was not amongst the Top 10 vote-getters

I think it's fair to say that Selwood was not an integral member of the 2007 premiership side and that Geelong would've won the flag that year without him.

 

[Jcpdragonx]

JPK and Selwood swap teams, JPK wins 4 flags, Selwood wins 0

 

[PhatBoy]

Selwood spent the least amount on the field apart from the 2 ruckmen (and the injured Max Rooke)

The All Australian selectors picks NINE Geelong players in their team and Selwood was not one of them

The Geelong coaches gave votes after every game and Selwood was not amongst the Top 10 vote-getters

I think it's fair to say that Selwood was not an integral member of the 2007 premiership side and that Geelong would've won the flag that year without him.

And managed 20 touches a game competing with arguably the best middle the game has seen.

Thanks for proving my point.

Tom Harley wasn’t in the top 10 vote getters either.


I suppose he wasn’t important.

 

[Back One Out]

He played 21 games, averaged 20 odd possessions and won the Rising Star. He was very integral to their success.

LOL

Selwood averaged the least number of possessions of any of Geelong's midfileders in 2007

The Rising Star means shit - you keep mentioning it as though it's the Brownlow Medal, or something... Oliver Florent will win this year's Rising Star. Andrew McGrath won the award last year. These guys are not "integral players" for their team's success during their debut year. They're just kids. Good players, sure. But they're not integral members of the side like Franklin, Kennedy, Parker, Rampe and Grundy; or Daniher, Hurley, Merrett, Heppell and Goddard.

Do you even watch football, mate?

 

[PhatBoy]

LOL

Selwood averaged the least number of possessions of any of Geelong's midfileders in 2007

The Rising Star means shit - you keep mentioning it as though it's the Brownlow Medal, or something... Oliver Florent will win this year's Rising Star. Andrew McGrath won the award last year. These guys are not "integral players" for their team's success during their debut year. They're just kids. Good players, sure. But they're not integral members of the side like Franklin, Kennedy, Parker, Rampe and Grundy; or Daniher, Hurley, Merrett, Heppell and Goddard.

Do you even watch football, mate?

Again, for your own benefit: where does Cyril rank for a ton of forward statistical indicators in various seasons? Does that somehow lessen his impact?we are told repeatedly that he had this immediate impact in your flag year of 2008? All I see is a permanent forward who had less than a goal a game, two thirds of his touches uncontested and a couple of clangers.

Steve johnson’s Biography mentions the immediate impact Selwood had. Were you closer to the inner sanctum than Johnson? I’m going to stab at ‘no.’

I’ve already pointed out to you how stupid the ‘game time’ figure is when all it does is highlight that his disposals/game time ratio is basically identical to Ablett in the same season.

 

[Back One Out]

And managed 20 touches a game competing with arguably the best middle the game has seen.

Competing? LOL. Midfielders from the same team don't compete with each other. They share the ball around. Geelong had a dominant midfield with a handball happy gameplan and broke all the records for most number of possessions. Selwood's average of 19.2 touches wasn't that great. Fewer touches than Ablett, Bartel, Corey, Chapman, Kelly, Enright, Milburn, Mackie and Ling (who spent the entire game guarding the opposition's best player and kept only one eye on the ball.)

Selwood averaged way less touches than Rhys Palmer who won the Rising Star in 2008 with 23.1 avg disposals and was Freo's leading ball-getter.

He had a great year for a first year player. But let's not kid ourselves that Geelong would've finished 2nd or 3rd in 2007 if they weren't able to throw Selwood into the guts in the 2nd quarter to give Ablett, Bartel, Corey, Ling, Chappy and Kelly a spell with Geelong leading 10.10.70 to 2.4.16.

Selwood played the majority of his 2007 games against teams who were already demoralised by your All Australian midfield.

 

[Back One Out]

Again, for your own benefit: where does Cyril rank for a ton of forward statistical indicators in various seasons? Does that somehow lessen his impact?we are told repeatedly that he had this immediate impact in your flag year of 2008? All I see is a permanent forward who had less than a goal a game, two thirds of his touches uncontested and a couple of clangers.

Steve johnson’s Biography mentions the immediate impact Selwood had. Were you closer to the inner sanctum than Johnson? I’m going to stab at ‘no.’

I’ve already pointed out to you how stupid the ‘game time’ figure is when all it does is highlight that his disposals/game time ratio is basically identical to Ablett in the same season.

Selwood was so important in 2007, that he didn't even finish in the Top 10 of your best and fairest award.

 

[PhatBoy]

Competing? LOL. Midfielders from the same team don't compete with each other. They share the ball around. Geelong had a dominant midfield with a handball happy gameplan and broke all the records for most number of possessions. Selwood's average of 19.2 touches wasn't that great. Fewer touches than Ablett, Bartel, Corey, Chapman, Kelly, Enright, Milburn, Mackie and Ling (who spent the entire game guarding the opposition's best player and kept only one eye on the ball.)

Selwood averaged way less touches than Rhys Palmer who won the Rising Star in 2008 with 23.1 avg disposal and was Freo's leading ball-getter.

Hahahahahahahaha an 18-year-old in his debut season playing relatively less game time had less ball than 9 all Australians. Well this is one for the X-Files, how the **** did this happen?

Did Palmer average nearly 5 tackles, 3.5 clearances, 4 inside 50s, help facilitate a huge cultural shift in his club? Just curious.


Any danger of answering the Cyril question or are you just going to let it hang like the festering turd your general angle of posting has proven to be so far?

 

[PhatBoy]

Selwood was so important in 2007, that he didn't even finish in the Top 10 of your best and fairest award.

Our captain and all Australian defender, as already noted but seemingly not read by you, was also not in our top 10, and therefore, had no impact, relevance, or structural importance to our success.

I’ll let Tom know his contribution was relatively meaningless.

 

[Wojcinski]

Selwood was so important in 2007, that he didn't even finish in the Top 10 of your best and fairest award.

Ok so from now should they only award premiership medals to the players who were top 10 in the B&F on that given year?

 

[Back One Out]

I think when it is noted that a player has had a significant role in driving those premierships it counts for a fair bit. Selwood was among our best in two winning grand finals and was easily among the elite of the competition in those years (ie. proving that he didn't just plod along and then play one good game at the end of a given season)

Thanks for proving my point with this earlier post you made to another person well before you read my post.

You mention Selwood's significant contribution in 2 winning Grand Finals and how good he was in those two seasons (2009 and 2011)

Interesting that you didn't post about his "amazing" contribution in 2007 until you read my post and took umbrage.

 

[Back One Out]

Ok so from now should they only award premiership medals to the players who were top 10 in the B&F on that given year?

Okey mete..

All I did was the correct the person who said Selwood > JPK, Pendles, Danger because of the "integral role he played in 3 flags."

I wouldn't have responded if that person had said Selwood "played in 3 flags, and played an integral role in 2 of them"
That would've been a more accurate opinion for them to make. The facts which I've posted clearly demonstrate that.

I'm not sure about the "3 premierships" argument anyway. For 10 years, I've been reading Geelong fans on these boards whining about the irrelevancy of Gary Ablett Snr's zero premiership medals.

So do we count Selwood's premiership medals, but not Ablett senior's ?

 

[Wojcinski]

Okey mete..

All I did was the correct the person who said Selwood > JPK, Pendles, Danger because of the "integral role he played in 3 flags."

I wouldn't have responded if that person had said Selwood "played in 3 flags, and played an integral role in 2 of them"
That would've been a more accurate opinion for them to make. The facts which I've posted clearly demonstrate that.

I'm not sure about the "3 premierships" argument anyway. For 10 years, I've been reading Geelong fans on these boards whining about the irrelevancy of Gary Ablett Snr's zero premiership medals.

So do we count Selwood's premiership medals, but not Ablett senior's ?

Ablett Sr didn't win any so not sure how we can count them?

 

[PhatBoy]

Thanks for proving my point with this earlier post you made to another person well before you read my post.

You mention Selwood's significant contribution in 2 winning Grand Finals and how good he was in those two seasons (2009 and 2011)

Interesting that you didn't post about his "amazing" contribution in 2007 until you read my post and took umbrage.

Are you that thick? The post I responded to talked about performing in big games. Undoubtedly Selwood played a huge role in the 09 and 11 gf wins and was excellent in defeat in 08.

That’s a totally separate discussion to playing a role in a flag. Hypothetically if you kick 100 goals in a season and your team wins the comp, and you only kick 2.4 on GF day, have you played a significant role in your team achieving success? Of course you have.

 

[SterlingArcher]

When it comes to longevity, consistency, leading by example and willing a team to win, you cannot go past Selwood.

If you are looking at silky skills, then it’s Pendles.

How can you 'not go past' Selwood in terms of longevity or consistency? How is he any better than Pendlebury at those 2?

 

[SterlingArcher]

Carey and Matthews >>>>> Ablett Snr

 

[SterlingArcher]

Voss, Black, Akermanis, McLeod, Ricciuto, Goodwin, Carey, Judd, Cousins, Ablett, Bartel, Enright, Mitchell, Hodge, Franklin, Dunstall, Hird, Williams, Wanganeen, Martin, Cotchin, Tredrea, Pendlebury, Swan, Goodes, Crawford, Platten, Matera, Rioli

There’s 29. All have won a premiership plus AA’s, B&F’s and either a Brownlow, Norm Smith, MVP or Coleman. All similar or better.

There are other guys like Buckley, Riewoldt, Harvey, Lockett and Ablett Snr who had better individual resumes but never won a flag.

Yep.

Selwood is highly 'decorated'. There's no disputing that.

But one of the most decorated players of the past 20 years? I think your post proves that point. It's objective fact that despite all he's achieved, the post that he was one of the most decorated of 20 years is wrong.

 

[ThePhantom777]

Pendles. Selwood is a ducker. Tarnishes him

 

[tony__montana]

If you are asking who is the better player then its tough, asking who has had the better career then surely the one who has had most team success would be classified as having the 'better career'

 

[Roobs321]

Selwood has the best career thus far, but it is discussion worthy, you could make a case for any of them.

JPK is the one I'll remember, definitely my midfielder of the decade (despite not being the most complete footballer). Watching the Swans most every week, I've been transfixed by him since he arrived in 2010. His level since 2014 especially has often been...immense.

Some of those mid-decade Swans-Freo clashes featured some legendary JPK performances, you couldn't take your eyes off him.

 

[Sttew]

How can you 'not go past' Selwood in terms of longevity or consistency? How is he any better than Pendlebury at those 2?

No, I am talking about a package of the 4 attributes

 

[gavaniacono]

Happy to see over 50% of BF folk are sane.
The rest range between mildly disconnected from reality to in full seizure mode.

Are better question would be which of these players you would you first pick in a team?

Actually, prob delivers the same answer.

 

[robbos13]

Selwood had a better career than everyone ( fortunate team to be apart of) could of easily been one of the others if roles reversed BUT they weren't.

danger absolute best is the best of the lot.

pendles overall fits inbetween the two mentioned above, great player and very good career achievement wise. love him as one of our own but always expected him to go to another level once swan retired and he took the mantle as our number 1 . don't think he quite did that but is still extremely good in his own right. individual best better than Selwood but not as good as dangers peak.

jpk. similar level to Selwood ( reputation would of been enhanced if swans collected a few more flags.)