Who Takes The Blame?

[Djcjdees]

I think it's pretty simple, the same that was said after round one and shown by the playing group for three rounds after that. Tackle your hearts out and you'll go close.

Green (I think it was) after the brissy match said that it takes no skill to run and chase and tackle. This is so true. For a young side, we should at least be topping the tackle counts, like we were at the start of the season.

I know everyone will say young players get tired, but it didn't look like the intensity was there today, after a break.

This is a mindset thing. The clearances that we've been quite good at this year were a disgrace. That says to me the players simply weren't going hard enough. It was plainly visible that the crows players were working harder and wanted the ball more.

I guess now it's up to Bailey to show these players how to believe in themselves

 

[saj_21]

Good points there Djcjdees. It was clearly evident in the first 5 minutes we did not come to play despite the numerous times mentioned how important it was to start well and how bad our record was at AAMI.

The intensity was not there, we got smashed in the clearences, tackling pressure and perceived pressure all non existent. Who takes the blame?the 22 blokes that took the field, simple as that. The coach can do all he likes but if the players do not come with the right mindset then there is no hope.

 

[Crusty Demon]

I'm with you Crusty. I saw Grimsey's 32 possession, 2 goal game against the Bombers in the preseason. He smashed them. Let's see what he can do. Everyone keeps telling me Cheney is too small to play on KPF's and not quick enough to play on smalls. Let's see..

When the ball hit the ground in the forward line today, it was dispatched with no pressure. Let's see if Adam Maric can cut the mustard. I felt sorry for Nev Jetta. He was playing the lead up forward role and he is 5'6!!! And we can't hit the side of the barn at the moment.

Riv and C Garland were not significant in marking contests today and certainly gave us no run from defence. They were non-contributors. (Along with many.) Let's see what Strauss and Cheney can provide.

Yep, we have lost any kind of momentum we had early in the season. Now it's just the odd quarter here and there where we look 'competitive'. It's time to dump players like Miller, Rivers, Garland, Dunn etc and play the likes of Maric, Cheney, Gysberts and Strauss. Even Fitzpatrick would be nice to see in the goalsquare for a few games.

We have zero chance at finals footy now, so lets throw a few kids in and see what they can do for the rest of the home and away season. Strauss and Cheney should definitely be playing, which frees up Grimes to go to the midfield(which i thought was the plan for this season). And Gysberts plays the rest of the year also. Why are we playing Scully and Trengove every game when Gysberts has shown just as much in the few games he has played. He should be playing all games as well. Wouldn't mind seeing Benell get time in the middle as well. He's quick and has great skills. Could be worth a shot in bursts. Has to be better than Jetta.

Maric and Fitzpatrick should get gametime also. With possibly the worst forwardline in the comp right now, Bailey needs to change it up. Drop Miller and Dunn for good and lets see what Maric can offer at this level. Or throw Garland down there to see if he can play forward. Some changes need to be made.

 

[saj_21]

Yep, we have lost any kind of momentum we had early in the season. Now it's just the odd quarter here and there where we look 'competitive'. It's time to dump players like Miller, Rivers, Garland, Dunn etc and play the likes of Maric, Cheney, Gysberts and Strauss. Even Fitzpatrick would be nice to see in the goalsquare for a few games.

We have zero chance at finals footy now, so lets throw a few kids in and see what they can do for the rest of the home and away season. Strauss and Cheney should definitely be playing, which frees up Grimes to go to the midfield(which i thought was the plan for this season). And Gysberts plays the rest of the year also. Why are we playing Scully and Trengove every game when Gysberts has shown just as much in the few games he has played. He should be playing all games as well. Wouldn't mind seeing Benell get time in the middle as well. He's quick and has great skills. Could be worth a shot in bursts. Has to be better than Jetta.

Maric and Fitzpatrick should get gametime also. With possibly the worst forwardline in the comp right now, Bailey needs to change it up. Drop Miller and Dunn for good and lets see what Maric can offer at this level. Or throw Garland down there to see if he can play forward. Some changes need to be made.

I liked your idea of giving games into kids, especially now the season is over and on the back of that performance changes must be made. Sylvia and Junior are likely inclusions.

Fitzy needs some time to get fit, no one can play AFL without the requried fitness. I think you will find Tapscott making an appearence later in the year, i would like to see more of Struass and Maric's form has been good enough over a peroid of weeks now to get a game. Although not a big fan of Cheney he probably deserves a chance to see if he can play at AFL level.

Bit harsh on Dunn and Miller, the ball was hardly down that end of the ground.

 

[Dez!]

Yep, we have lost any kind of momentum we had early in the season. Now it's just the odd quarter here and there where we look 'competitive'. It's time to dump players like Miller, Rivers, Garland, Dunn etc and play the likes of Maric, Cheney, Gysberts and Strauss. Even Fitzpatrick would be nice to see in the goalsquare for a few games.

Stop making wholesale changes for the sake of it, we don't need to overhaul everything and you need to get that through your head.

Only drop Rivers and Miller for a Strauss and a Maric, that gives us another good boot in Strauss coming out of defense and makes us a bit more mobile out of defense. We are better off going with a smaller forward line if the big forward we have is Brad Miller, he's had his time I agree and needs to go.

We have zero chance at finals footy now, so lets throw a few kids in and see what they can do for the rest of the home and away season. Strauss and Cheney should definitely be playing, which frees up Grimes to go to the midfield(which i thought was the plan for this season). And Gysberts plays the rest of the year also. Why are we playing Scully and Trengove every game when Gysberts has shown just as much in the few games he has played. He should be playing all games as well. Wouldn't mind seeing Benell get time in the middle as well. He's quick and has great skills. Could be worth a shot in bursts. Has to be better than Jetta.

Why can't just throw in more kids or we will get absolutely murdered, they will get their chance but they can't all play together right now if we want to achieve something. Jetta had one bad game and you're writing him off? Get real, he'd been very good since he came back into the team and just had an off game.

Gysberts was probably sent back to Casey to work on aspects of his game, he's in his first seasons and he'll get plenty of chances.

Maric and Fitzpatrick should get gametime also. With possibly the worst forwardline in the comp right now, Bailey needs to change it up. Drop Miller and Dunn for good and lets see what Maric can offer at this level. Or throw Garland down there to see if he can play forward. Some changes need to be made.

Some changes need to be made yes, however we don't need to overhaul everything like you seem hellbent on suggesting.

Fitzpatrick has only played 1 Casey reserves and 1 Casey seniors game after returning from injury, let him build a bit of fitness first. He is a project player and is being treated as such, can't rush everyone into the team at once.

We've got Jurrah and Sylvia to return to the forward line in the coming weeks and that can change the whole dimension of our forward line.

 

[Crusty Demon]

Stop making wholesale changes for the sake of it, we don't need to overhaul everything and you need to get that through your head.

Only drop Rivers and Miller for a Strauss and a Maric, that gives us another good boot in Strauss coming out of defense and makes us a bit more mobile out of defense. We are better off going with a smaller forward line if the big forward we have is Brad Miller, he's had his time I agree and needs to go.



Why can't just throw in more kids or we will get absolutely murdered, they will get their chance but they can't all play together right now if we want to achieve something. Jetta had one bad game and you're writing him off? Get real, he'd been very good since he came back into the team and just had an off game.

Gysberts was probably sent back to Casey to work on aspects of his game, he's in his first seasons and he'll get plenty of chances.



Some changes need to be made yes, however we don't need to overhaul everything like you seem hellbent on suggesting.

Fitzpatrick has only played 1 Casey reserves and 1 Casey seniors game after returning from injury, let him build a bit of fitness first. He is a project player and is being treated as such, can't rush everyone into the team at once.

We've got Jurrah and Sylvia to return to the forward line in the coming weeks and that can change the whole dimension of our forward line.

I don't think I'm overreacting at all. And i haven't called for wholesale changes. I simply stated we should drop Miller and Dunn indefinitely, and one of Rivers or Garland. Happy to keep both in the side if one of them plays forward. Having both of them in our side down back is becoming a major liability. Jetta has been ok at best. I just feel we have Benell, Gysberts and Maric playing for Casey who should be getting a game ahead of him. I think Jetta will be dropped this week, probably for Sylvia.

As for Fitzpatrick, I'm not saying throw the kid in when unfit. He's ran out a couple of games now, and i don't see any harm in giving him a few games later in the season in the F50. He would also be very handy to have in the side to help in the ruck.

Jurrah and Petterd are major losses to our forward structure, but we still need a tall target in the F50 to contest and bring the ball to ground. Fitzpatrick will do this, and hopefully we see him later in the season. But why hasn't Bailey tried Garland or Rivers down there? Is he that blind he cannot see both have struggled all year down back?

 

[Scully 31]

Many of us have big ideas on how we should play and where we should be at. I to, want the demons to make the finals but one step at a time. Too many of us expected us to go close to the finals this year after seeing our first 5 weeks of the season. We must remember last year we won 4 games. The year before that we won 3 games. Yes 8 wins is still on the cards but please give the team a fair chance to mature and experience because we will be a good team but time is what we need. Keep the faith.
As for the AAMI hoo doo, it sucks but theres nothing we can do about it. I only hope that in the coming years when we are up and about we go to AAMI and smash the crows and port to get some payback for the pain they have caused us.

 

[easter31]

Many of us have big ideas on how we should play and where we should be at. I to, want the demons to make the finals but one step at a time. Too many of us expected us to go close to the finals this year after seeing our first 5 weeks of the season. We must remember last year we won 4 games. The year before that we won 3 games. Yes 8 wins is still on the cards but please give the team a fair chance to mature and experience because we will be a good team but time is what we need. Keep the faith.
As for the AAMI hoo doo, it sucks but theres nothing we can do about it. I only hope that in the coming years when we are up and about we go to AAMI and smash the crows and port to get some payback for the pain they have caused us.

Last year we won 4 games trying to tank. This year we will be lucky to win 5 games going flat-chat to win. Wer'e no better than last year. We have light bodied players, soft in the head dept and no decent KP players (apart from Frawley) who can lead the way for the kids.

 

[Scottish Lobster]

Last year we won 4 games trying to tank. This year we will be lucky to win 5 games going flat-chat to win. Wer'e no better than last year. We have light bodied players, soft in the head dept and no decent KP players (apart from Frawley) who can lead the way for the kids.

spot on

 

[Dez!]

Last year we won 4 games trying to tank. This year we will be lucky to win 5 games going flat-chat to win. Wer'e no better than last year. We have light bodied players, soft in the head dept and no decent KP players (apart from Frawley) who can lead the way for the kids.

Oh please, lucky to win 5 games? We've got 4 and a half wins with 9 games left.

Those games include:

Essendon - Who have been as up and down as we have.
Richmond - They'll be back playing the putrid football they were at the start of the season.
Swans - At the G it is winnable.
Brisbane - Not counting on this one but Brisbane are struggling.
North - At the MCG it will be an entirely different game than the one played at Jiihad.

All of those winnable.

I find it amazing that people are acting so surprised that our young, inexperienced team is inconsistent.

 

[Gazza_11]

Exactly Dez. Young, inexperienced team is young and inexperienced. Anyone who's expecting u us to perform well every week of win all our 50-50 games is kidding themselves.

 

[cannons]

Yeah, a poor performance, particularly one which was interstate, is hardly surprising given the developmental stage the club currently finds itself in.

 

[Crusty Demon]

Oh please, lucky to win 5 games? We've got 4 and a half wins with 9 games left.

Those games include:

Essendon - Who have been as up and down as we have.
Richmond - They'll be back playing the putrid football they were at the start of the season.
Swans - At the G it is winnable.
Brisbane - Not counting on this one but Brisbane are struggling.
North - At the MCG it will be an entirely different game than the one played at Jiihad.

All of those winnable.

I find it amazing that people are acting so surprised that our young, inexperienced team is inconsistent.

Can see us maybe winning 1 or 2 of these games tops. Maybe Richmond, maybe Swans. Maybe...

And I'd accept the fact we have been inconsistent due to our inexperienced team. If our young players were crumbling under the pressure, I'd accept that. But they are standing tall. Look at our best few players yesterday! Grimes, Trengove and Scully were all in our best players. Bate was the other standout who is still young. Where are our senior players and why don't they stand up and be counted when it matters?

Our youngsters needed our senior players to help them out, and yet again they went missing. Moloney and Davey continue to struggle once a tag is placed on them. Bruce and Rivers have lost all ability to be useful. Warnock is extremely inconsistent and can't be trusted with using the ball in any way in defense. Miller and Dunn continue to get game time when clearly they wouldn't get a game for any other side and are not a part of our future. Joel Mac was shocking when it mattered yesterday. Jamar lowered his colours as well, but i'll give him a pass as he has been monstrous all year.

I would rather see us giving another 2-3 youngsters a game now instead of some of these players. Namely, Rivers, Miller and Dunn. Lost patience with all 3 of these guys and they should be dropped. We have Strauss, Gysberts, Maric and Cheney all knocking down the door for a senior spot. Jurrah will be back, but if we are relying on 1 player to change the way the whole club is playing, then we are kidding ourselves. The senior players must be held responsible for a performance like yesterday, and Bailey must grow some balls and start dropping some of these guys back to Casey, immediately....

 

[cannons]

Can see us maybe winning 1 or 2 of these games tops. Maybe Richmond, maybe Swans. Maybe...

And I'd accept the fact we have been inconsistent due to our inexperienced team. If our young players were crumbling under the pressure, I'd accept that. But they are standing tall. Look at our best few players yesterday! Grimes, Trengove and Scully were all in our best players. Bate was the other standout who is still young. Where are our senior players and why don't they stand up and be counted when it matters?

Our youngsters needed our senior players to help them out, and yet again they went missing. Moloney and Davey continue to struggle once a tag is placed on them. Bruce and Rivers have lost all ability to be useful. Warnock is extremely inconsistent and can't be trusted with using the ball in any way in defense. Miller and Dunn continue to get game time when clearly they wouldn't get a game for any other side and are not a part of our future. Joel Mac was shocking when it mattered yesterday. Jamar lowered his colours as well, but i'll give him a pass as he has been monstrous all year.

I would rather see us giving another 2-3 youngsters a game now instead of some of these players. Namely, Rivers, Miller and Dunn. Lost patience with all 3 of these guys and they should be dropped. We have Strauss, Gysberts, Maric and Cheney all knocking down the door for a senior spot. Jurrah will be back, but if we are relying on 1 player to change the way the whole club is playing, then we are kidding ourselves. The senior players must be held responsible for a performance like yesterday, and Bailey must grow some balls and start dropping some of these guys back to Casey, immediately....

Absolutely agree with this, although I think you might have a been a touch harsh on Lynden, given that he was reasonable against Collingwood and had to earn his spot through some good performances in the VFL. I also believe that talls need a bit longer to re-adapt to the pace of AFL football after playing a few consecutive weeks at the lower levels of the game.

As such, I think he should get another go next week, but Rivers and Miller are total liabilities at the moment and must go back to the reserves.

 

[Dez!]

Can see us maybe winning 1 or 2 of these games tops. Maybe Richmond, maybe Swans. Maybe...

And I'd accept the fact we have been inconsistent due to our inexperienced team. If our young players were crumbling under the pressure, I'd accept that. But they are standing tall. Look at our best few players yesterday! Grimes, Trengove and Scully were all in our best players. Bate was the other standout who is still young. Where are our senior players and why don't they stand up and be counted when it matters?

Green and Bruce were serviceable yesterday while Moloney, Jones and Davey struggled massively.

Getting Junior McDonald and Colin Sylvia back into the team will do enormous amounts for us, especially Junior who is on track for Bluey number 3.

Our youngsters needed our senior players to help them out, and yet again they went missing. Moloney and Davey continue to struggle once a tag is placed on them. Bruce and Rivers have lost all ability to be useful. Warnock is extremely inconsistent and can't be trusted with using the ball in any way in defense. Miller and Dunn continue to get game time when clearly they wouldn't get a game for any other side and are not a part of our future. Joel Mac was shocking when it mattered yesterday. Jamar lowered his colours as well, but i'll give him a pass as he has been monstrous all year.

Why you continue to mention Dunn is beyond me, his two games since returning have seen 1 very good game last week and 1 decent game yesterday. What do you expect him to do when the ball barely went down into the forward line?

I would rather see us giving another 2-3 youngsters a game now instead of some of these players. Namely, Rivers, Miller and Dunn. Lost patience with all 3 of these guys and they should be dropped. We have Strauss, Gysberts, Maric and Cheney all knocking down the door for a senior spot. Jurrah will be back, but if we are relying on 1 player to change the way the whole club is playing, then we are kidding ourselves. The senior players must be held responsible for a performance like yesterday, and Bailey must grow some balls and start dropping some of these guys back to Casey, immediately....

Again mentioning Dunn, why? He was good his first game back last week and presented well and offered a target and yesterday he was decent considering the limited opportunities the forward line got.

I agree Miller and Rivers need to go back to Casey, or in Millers case anywhere but the Melbourne Football Club.

Strauss and Maric have hardly been knocking the door down at Casey. Cheney has been playing extremely well but I see him in the Rivers mould, too small for the big forwards and too slow for the small forwards all of that with a massively lack of accountability does nothing for me.

 

[bing181]

Green and Bruce were serviceable yesterday while Moloney, Jones and Davey struggled massively.

Getting Junior McDonald and Colin Sylvia back into the team will do enormous amounts for us, especially Junior who is on track for Bluey number 3.

Why you continue to mention Dunn is beyond me, his two games since returning have seen 1 very good game last week and 1 decent game yesterday. What do you expect him to do when the ball barely went down into the forward line?

Again mentioning Dunn, why? He was good his first game back last week and presented well and offered a target and yesterday he was decent considering the limited opportunities the forward line got.

Strauss and Maric have hardly been knocking the door down at Casey. Cheney has been playing extremely well but I see him in the Rivers mould, too small for the big forwards and too slow for the small forwards all of that with a massively lack of accountability does nothing for me.

+1. Good post, especially re Strauss, Maric etc. People should go back and read the reports from Casey last week. Not good.

As for the overall thread ... no-one takes the blame, but the players take the responsibility for turning up to play. Or not.

 

[1980GFVideo]

If Bailey doesn't get them up for around 15 wins over the next year and a half he should go

I know Matthews has said that coaching again is unlikely and you may not want him but your list looks very similar to Brisbane when they were under performing under Northey and Merrett.

If a coach who understands that to be successful quickly you need to arrive after the talent has been compiled and the present coach is not getting the best out of them then Melbourne are the team to really whet the appetite of such a guy.

Bailey took you on at a time when many prospective coaches would have stepped back and felt that there was too much hard times to go through before they would win fans over. Might be unfair on Bailey given he has been through the mill but football can be cruel and it will be interesting to see how the Melbourne Board are thinking.

Bailey knows football but I see a Brisbane Lions of 1999 just waiting for someone with that extra edge that Bailey doesn't seem to have to really get results from what you have.

I know you guys love Gary Lyon but id be suprised if you had any interest in him.

 

[stretcharmstrong]

I know Matthews has said that coaching again is unlikely and you may not want him but your list looks very similar to Brisbane when they were under performing under Northey and Merrett.

If a coach who understands that to be successful quickly you need to arrive after the talent has been compiled and the present coach is not getting the best out of them then Melbourne are the team to really whet the appetite of such a guy.

Bailey took you on at a time when many prospective coaches would have stepped back and felt that there was too much hard times to go through before they would win fans over. Might be unfair on Bailey given he has been through the mill but football can be cruel and it will be interesting to see how the Melbourne Board are thinking.

Bailey knows football but I see a Brisbane Lions of 1999 just waiting for someone with that extra edge that Bailey doesn't seem to have to really get results from what you have.

I know you guys love Gary Lyon but id be suprised if you had any interest in him.

No, no, no. No, no, no, no...please, no. Have disagreed so often with things he has said in various media outlets this year that if he came to the Dees I would surely die of a chronic stress-related stomache ulser or something of the sort. Not saying that I know more about the game than he does or anything, the guy is a legend, and he could prove to be a great coach again - but I have to think of my own health (and sanity) here.

 

[Crusty Demon]

Green and Bruce were serviceable yesterday while Moloney, Jones and Davey struggled massively.

Getting Junior McDonald and Colin Sylvia back into the team will do enormous amounts for us, especially Junior who is on track for Bluey number 3.



Why you continue to mention Dunn is beyond me, his two games since returning have seen 1 very good game last week and 1 decent game yesterday. What do you expect him to do when the ball barely went down into the forward line?



Again mentioning Dunn, why? He was good his first game back last week and presented well and offered a target and yesterday he was decent considering the limited opportunities the forward line got.

I agree Miller and Rivers need to go back to Casey, or in Millers case anywhere but the Melbourne Football Club.

Strauss and Maric have hardly been knocking the door down at Casey. Cheney has been playing extremely well but I see him in the Rivers mould, too small for the big forwards and too slow for the small forwards all of that with a massively lack of accountability does nothing for me.

Yep, and I'll mention him again. Dunn is not going to be on our list when we are having a crack at a grand final. How many games has he played for the MFC? Now, how many useful games has he played for the MFC? I actually put him in the votes against Collingwood. Thought he played well. But he like many of our senior players, are far too inconsistent. Sylvia should replace Dunn this week IMO.

Both Miller and Dunn do very well at VFL level, but both have had numerous chances to make an impact at AFL level, and both have failed. Much rather see us putting time into 2 kids. Granted Maric and Strauss haven't been best on ground at Casey, but I'd much rather put game time and experience into those two players, than seeing Miller and Dunn continue to struggle.

 

[Dez!]

Yep, and I'll mention him again. Dunn is not going to be on our list when we are having a crack at a grand final. How many games has he played for the MFC? Now, how many useful games has he played for the MFC? I actually put him in the votes against Collingwood. Thought he played well. But he like many of our senior players, are far too inconsistent. Sylvia should replace Dunn this week IMO.

Sylvia should replace Miller this week.

Both Miller and Dunn do very well at VFL level, but both have had numerous chances to make an impact at AFL level, and both have failed. Much rather see us putting time into 2 kids. Granted Maric and Strauss haven't been best on ground at Casey, but I'd much rather put game time and experience into those two players, than seeing Miller and Dunn continue to struggle.

Dunn isn't struggling, he played extremely well against Collingwood and against Adelaide when the ball came inside our forward 50 Dunn was also good. You cannot (if you have any sense that is) blame Dunn that we couldn't get the ball inside 50, he did well when the ball was down there but we just couldn't get the ball into attack.

 

[cannons]

No, no, no. No, no, no, no...please, no. Have disagreed so often with things he has said in various media outlets this year that if he came to the Dees I would surely die of a chronic stress-related stomache ulser or something of the sort. Not saying that I know more about the game than he does or anything, the guy is a legend, and he could prove to be a great coach again - but I have to think of my own health (and sanity) here.

Agreed.

After the West Coast match, where he said on radio that Watts will be a fringe player at best in the future, all the while going on about the amazing Naitanui, I just couldn't handle him becoming our coach.

Cringeworthy individual.

 

[demonfan9]

I think there's too much overreacting in this thread.

If people can't see how much we've improved this season, then they are either blind or ignorant. You've gotta remember, it was never a realistic expectation to make the finals right after winning two consecutive spoons. However, with a bit of luck in our games versus Collingwood and Bulldogs, we would have been on the fringe of the eight. Instead, we're probably on track for 7-8 wins which is a definate improvement.

 

[d33my]

Well said demonfan9.
Sure we have a few issues atm, but which club doesnt? Remember, some of us thought we could win at AAMI stadium before the game. Last year no-one would have dreamed of it.

 

[KickLongTackleHard]

I'd consider Leigh Matthews in a heartbeat. Absolute champion coach and player. His record speaks for itself. He would command respect and make the tough calls. Just because he makes a few outlandish statements in media roles that spark a reaction (how suprising) doesn't change the fact he can coach. Only question would be if 'the game has gone past him', I'm in no position to really judge that.

 

[demonfan9]

We lost seven games by over 12 goals in 2008.

I think our biggest loss this year has been by 9 goals.