Strategy Why take Will Ashcroft with the first pick?

[Thetrader15]

By not bidding on either Daicos or Darcy, they were able to turn some third rounders into two picks in the 30s and take Paul Curtis and Miller Bergman.

North don't lose their picks when they bid.

 

[Thetrader15]

None of the American sports with their drafts have this type of bidding system, especially "father/son", all exchanges are purely done via trading picks/players as we do. American sport drafts differ only in that they get to trade multiple years of picks

And aren't American sports really missing out not having the FS rule. There's just no history or romance in their sports.

 

[DocSholl]

North don't lose their picks when they bid.

Yes I know. They did side deals with The Dogs and Collingwood in exchange for not bidding, allowing them to move up the order. They turned picks 42, 47, 48 and two future thirds into 32, 36, 57 and a future third.

 

[Thetrader15]

Yes I know. They did side deals with The Dogs and Collingwood in exchange for not bidding, allowing them to move up the order. They turned picks 42, 47, 48 and two future thirds into 32, 36, 57 and a future third.

That sounds like draft tampering...

 

[master bate]

Brisbane did a deal with GWS.

Just as Collingwood did deals with North and GWS a year ahead of the Daicos draft.

Ned Guy made list managers film their teleconference saying there were no side agreements but it's impossible to prove.

Whether it's responsible to take an inferior player with pick 1, especially a key forward and lump all that pressure on them? Probably isn't. But at least up at GWS Cadman will fly under the radar.

North were punished heavily for their mistake in taking JHF pick 1 when he could've had a whole lot less pressure on him as a pick 2.

 

[Lemma]

JHF probably would've just used not being at pick 1 as a reason to piss and moan

 

[sherrif]

Our future first round pick is with the Dogs, so the deficit will come off our later picks. We're likely going into deficit next year anyway, so the likely benefit to GWS next year is that their third round pick may move up a slot or two.

It would be a disaster for Brisbane if they had to make up a first round deficit the following year as they have two players likely to require points for bids in the top 25 picks.

 

[JasRulz63]

It would be a disaster for Brisbane if they had to make up a first round deficit the following year as they have two players likely to require points for bids in the top 25 picks.

In the 2023 draft?

 

[sherrif]

In the 2023 draft?

I cant find the article but I thought you had two highly rated key position prospects that would require bids. Either way I don't think there is any chance you'll go into deficit. Live trading when the bid for Ashcroft comes will give you the chance to swap picks in the 30's for multiple picks and extra points later in the draft. You could add an extra future third rounder in to make that pick exchange provide evtra points as swell. Eg. The bid comes for Ashcroft and then you trade picks 34 and 38 with a future third to a team like Hawthorn who has a lot of later picks. Plus after that pick exchange even if there is a bid for Fletcher before Davey all of the later picks you have would have moved up 4 or so places due to the Ashcroft bid for your second matching of points. Eg if your pick 55 was left over from the Ashcroft match it would have climbed up the draft order.

 

[JasRulz63]

I cant find the article but I thought you had two highly rated key position prospects that would require bids. Either way I don't think there is any chance you'll go into deficit. Live trading when the bid for Ashcroft comes will give you the chance to swap picks in the 30's for multiple picks and extra points later in the draft. You could add an extra future third rounder in to make that pick exchange provide evtra points as swell. Eg. The bid comes for Ashcroft and then you trade picks 34 and 38 with a future third to a team like Hawthorn who has a lot of later picks. Plus after that pick exchange even if there is a bid for Fletcher before Davey all of the later picks you have would have moved up 4 or so places due to the Ashcroft bid for your second matching of points. Eg if your pick 55 was left over from the Ashcroft match it would have climbed up the draft order.

I think that's GC with the two highly related KPPs coming through the draft next year. We have a couple but they're not particularly highly rated at this stage.

I do agree with your point about live trading during the draft to try and lessen the deficit, we've done it in the past.

 

[irel]

Brisbane has two highly regarded KP 17 year old coming through for next year's draft. Billy Richardson and Bradley McDonald.
Both were selected for the U17's All-Star match on Grand Final day. It is clear indication that they are rated among the clubs. Both did reasonably well and the expectation is they will move up the rankings as greater focus is moved to next years prospects.

Brisbane's pick trading has two fold purpose. Accumulate points for next year to cover for the possibility of matching bids on Billy and Bradley and have enough points to cover Ashcroft and Fletcher this year. Going into a significant deficit next year may impact the ability to draft our emerging academy talent.

 

[halfback dasher]

Brisbane has two highly regarded KP 17 year old coming through for next year's draft. Billy Richardson and Bradley McDonald.
Both were selected for the U17's All-Star match on Grand Final day. It is clear indication that they are rated among the clubs. Both did reasonably well and the expectation is they will move up the rankings as greater focus is moved to next years prospects.

Brisbane's pick trading has two fold purpose. Accumulate points for next year to cover for the possibility of matching bids on Billy and Bradley and have enough points to cover Ashcroft and Fletcher this year. Going into a significant deficit next year may impact the ability to draft our emerging academy talent.

Yet knowing this they courted and got Dunkley in .

 

[rye]

Yet knowing this they courted and got Dunkley in .

 

[irel]

Yet knowing this they courted and got Dunkley in .

Yeah, so what?

 

[JasRulz63]

Brisbane has two highly regarded KP 17 year old coming through for next year's draft. Billy Richardson and Bradley McDonald.
Both were selected for the U17's All-Star match on Grand Final day. It is clear indication that they are rated among the clubs. Both did reasonably well and the expectation is they will move up the rankings as greater focus is moved to next years prospects.

Brisbane's pick trading has two fold purpose. Accumulate points for next year to cover for the possibility of matching bids on Billy and Bradley and have enough points to cover Ashcroft and Fletcher this year. Going into a significant deficit next year may impact the ability to draft our emerging academy talent.

I feel like traditionally the academy players (especially the Lions ones) have moved down the rankings during their draft year as opposed to up them, with a few exceptions.

 

[irel]

I feel like traditionally the academy players (especially the Lions ones) have moved down the rankings during their draft year as opposed to up them, with a few exceptions.

These boys are already reasonably highly rated. It may not be a surprise if they do a Hipwood and raise up the rankings during their draft year.

 

[eaglespremiers]

AFAIK Ashcroft is so far in front of everyone else that it would raise questions if they did this.

There are better players in the draft than Ashcroft.

 

[Zim^zuM]

I think one big reason would be to take competition away on later picks. If GWS bid then Brisbane's next pick would be?

Eg when Adelaide bid on Jamara. Which was perfect for them as the Dogs had interest in Rowe. But all their picks got eaten up making it easier for Adelaide to know when to select him.

 

[bird_man]

Brisbane has two highly regarded KP 17 year old coming through for next year's draft. Billy Richardson and Bradley McDonald.
Both were selected for the U17's All-Star match on Grand Final day. It is clear indication that they are rated among the clubs. Both did reasonably well and the expectation is they will move up the rankings as greater focus is moved to next years prospects.

Brisbane's pick trading has two fold purpose. Accumulate points for next year to cover for the possibility of matching bids on Billy and Bradley and have enough points to cover Ashcroft and Fletcher this year. Going into a significant deficit next year may impact the ability to draft our emerging academy talent.

Problem even more reason to not give a stuff to be honest

If just one goes first round they will have to use a first round pick for points, so all that is happening is they are losing a few more points to put towards academy players.

These can be easily made up as long as they aren't predicted to go top couple of picks

 

[JasRulz63]

I think one big reason would be to take competition away on later picks. If GWS bid then Brisbane's next pick would be?

Eg when Adelaide bid on Jamara. Which was perfect for them as the Dogs had interest in Rowe. But all their picks got eaten up making it easier for Adelaide to know when to select him.

Even if GWS didn't bid on Ashcroft, we're a non factor in this draft anyway because we also plan to match a bid on Fletcher. GWS bidding or not bidding on Ashcroft is unlikely to affect their hand at this draft.

 

[Zim^zuM]

Even if GWS didn't bid on Ashcroft, we're a non factor in this draft anyway because we also plan to match a bid on Fletcher. GWS bidding or not bidding on Ashcroft is unlikely to affect their hand at this draft.

But can it affect the next draft and trade period?

 

[JasRulz63]

But can it affect the next draft and trade period?

We've traded out our future first rounder, our second round pick is Geelong's and third round picks are from teams likely to finish above GWS, so maybe they'd be able to move their third round pick up one pick or so?

 

[Zim^zuM]

We've traded out our future first rounder, our second round pick is Geelong's and third round picks are from teams likely to finish above GWS, so maybe they'd be able to move their third round pick up one pick or so?

I think the finer details are irrelevant. Where do you draw the line? What's the point in North picking him at 2? Mayaswell pass at 3. No point in Essendon selecting him at 4. So let it be so Brisbane select him at 34?

I'll use the doggies as an example again. 2 years in a row we had to basically use our whole draft hand for Jamara and Darcy. Meaning the rest of our picks are compromised. That's better for opposition clubs than not only landing Darcy, but maybe even a second decent player that is good enough for the best 22 quickly.

 

[JasRulz63]

I think the finer details are irrelevant. Where do you draw the line? What's the point in North picking him at 2? Mayaswell pass at 3. No point in Essendon selecting him at 4. So let it be so Brisbane select him at 34?

I agree, but you asked. I personally have no issue with teams bidding what they think a player is worth, and Ashcroft probably goes pick 1 in the draft. I also do think teams should do what benefits them over what's good 'for the rest of the competition', such as 'wink wink' favourable trades in exchange for not bidding on a player.

 

[Zim^zuM]

I agree, but you asked. I personally have no issue with teams bidding what they think a player is worth, and Ashcroft probably goes pick 1 in the draft. I also do think teams should do what benefits them over what's good 'for the rest of the competition', such as 'wink wink' favourable trades in exchange for not bidding on a player.

Agreed, teams need to look after their own interests. So that's either weakening another teams draft if possible on F/S stuff, teams trading picks to exploit this stuff etc, spliting picks, trading for futures etc.

But with Brisbane in a window, and getting the best kid who can play straight away, GWS have rocks in their head if they don't bid and make them pay.