WorkChoices impact cover up

[Dry Rot]

A year on, why won't Hockey release any research or data from the Office of the Employee Advocate* on the impact of WorkChoices and AWAs?

Why is it good enough for Hockey to attack the research of employment academics, yet not release the hard data he has?

And why is the PM starting to answer Hockey's questions during Question Time?




*Great name, almost as good as WorkChoices.

 

[stickman11]

A year on, why won't Hockey release any research or data from the Office of the Employee Advocate* on the impact of WorkChoices and AWAs?

Why is it good enough for Hockey to attack the research of employment academics, yet not release the hard data he has?

And why is the PM starting to answer Hockey's questions during Question Time?




*Great name, almost as good as WorkChoices.

The real effect of Work Choice will be evident when the economy heads backwards, then we will see peoples wages slide backwards.

 

[1jasonoz]

The real effect of Work Choice will be evident when the economy heads backwards, then we will see peoples wages slide backwards.

Thats the problem the public probably won't as AWA's are now hidden by the government after being embarressed by the revelations about the conditions and wages beign ripped from average workers wages. Prior to work choices all agreements where open to public scrutiny, now under Workchoices AWA's are kept hidden from the public.

 

[Z_K]

If the report is called something like 'Workchoices: One year on', then I've got it. Got it today.

Is that the one?

 

[Tim56]

Thats the problem the public probably won't as AWA's are now hidden by the government after being embarressed by the revelations about the conditions and wages beign ripped from average workers wages. Prior to work choices all agreements where open to public scrutiny, now under Workchoices AWA's are kept hidden from the public.

Why should an agreement between two consenting parties be open for anyone to go in and look at. It is the business of the employer, the employees, and no one else.

The hard data is collected by ABS which shows that average wages, adjusted for inflation have increased 1.5% since the introduction of Workchoices, and several hundred thousand jobs have been created. The simple fact is that you are not interested in looking at the real numbers that matter, but numbers that you can distort to get the answers you want. A prime example is where someone says x% of agreements cut leave, without mentioning the trade off in extra salary, shorter hours etc.

 

[1jasonoz]

Why should an agreement between two consenting parties be open for anyone to go in and look at. It is the business of the employer, the employees, and no one else.

The hard data is collected by ABS which shows that average wages, adjusted for inflation have increased 1.5% since the introduction of Workchoices, and several hundred thousand jobs have been created. The simple fact is that you are not interested in looking at the real numbers that matter, but numbers that you can distort to get the answers you want. A prime example is where someone says x% of agreements cut leave, without mentioning the trade off in extra salary, shorter hours etc.

Why should an agreement between two consenting parties be open for anyone to go in and look at. It is the business of the employer, the employees, and no one else.

Then why are non-AWA agreements still avaiable for the public to view?

Why where individual contracts able to be vetted BEFORE the bad press over the loss of conditions and wages by workers on AWA became publc? Why the sudden change?

The hard data is collected by ABS which shows that average wages, adjusted for inflation have increased 1.5% since the introduction of Workchoices, and several hundred thousand jobs have been created. The simple fact is that you are not interested in looking at the real numbers that matter, but numbers that you can distort to get the answers you want. A prime example is where someone says x% of agreements cut leave, without mentioning the trade off in extra salary, shorter hours etc

The hard data is collected by ABS

The 'Hard' data is collected by the Office of Employment Advocate and the other new Office of Workplace Services, these are the providors of the data that compares wages, conditions and reduction in wages and conditions across the entire spectrum of the IR system, but they are now refusing to provide any data on AWA's, but will still provide data on non AWA agreements.

The hard data is collected by ABS which shows that average wages, adjusted for inflation have increased 1.5% since the introduction of Workchoices, and several hundred thousand jobs have been created. The simple fact is that you are not interested in looking at the real numbers that matter, but numbers that you can distort to get the answers you want. A prime example is where someone says x% of agreements cut leave, without mentioning the trade off in extra salary, shorter hours etc

1/ Yes your in the conservative group that argued that Workchoice suddenly produced jobs in the mining industry through new projects as soon as Workchoices was introduced. It may come as a shock to you and the others who have no idea about how the mining industry works, mining projects aren't planned and implemented over night as the conservatives have claimed, they can take up to 20+ years of planning, and to claim that because a mining project was started purely because of an IR system is idiotic in its purest form.

2/ The 1.5% wage increase, does that include Agreements agreed to BEFORE Workchoice came into force, and does it incorrectly attempt to included wage increases achieved by managers as Howard an Co, as average workers wage increases?

3/ Yes Howard stating at the signing of a Woodside Petroluem LNG contract that Woodside could only gain the productivity it does through AWA's; problem Woodside uses COLLECTIVE AGREEMENTS!!

4/ Are you actually argueing that its the IR laws that is driving the economic boom we are enjoying?

The simple fact is that you are not interested in looking at the real numbers that matter, but numbers that you can distort to get the answers you want.

1/ I'm more than interested in the real numbers, you may want to learn to REAL numbers, productivity has collapsed under the Howard government, and more so since the Workchoices Act came into force.

2/ Real wage increases for workers on AWA's are less than half the rate of workers on non AWA's, almost 85% of all AWA's remove lower overtime loading, etc.

A prime example is where someone says x% of agreements cut leave, without mentioning the trade off in extra salary, shorter hours etc

Then if workers are truely better off, then why remove the non-disadvantage test from the previous ACT?

Why the sudden secrecy of AWA's and no other agreements, why the refusal of the government to provide data on AWA's?

 

[Goldenblue]

I heard little Johnny on the radio today trying to sell the "success" of his workplace reforms. All I heard from his rotten mouth was bull**** and utter lies. The only people that benefit from these agreements are bosses and businesses not the worker. If anyone believes that workers have benefited believe in fairies.

I recently had our EBA done by our bosses, we lost our conditions and lost wages, tell me if that is a benefit to me.

 

[- PC -]

I recently had our EBA done by our bosses, we lost our conditions and lost wages, tell me if that is a benefit to me.

Why did your boss do your EBA? Isnt that against the principles of AWA/EBAs?

Where was your workers representative? If you had no representative then do you have a union?

Was it sent to be judged as fair and reasonable?

 

[Goldenblue]

Why did your boss do your EBA? Isnt that against the principles of AWA/EBAs?

Where was your workers representative? If you had no representative then do you have a union?

Was it sent to be judged as fair and reasonable?

Let me correct myself. Our union (which I am NOT a member of) went to the bosses and were told to like it or lump it. If we did not accept it, we were to be forced onto individual agreements. We had no choice with Work"choices".

Work"choices" an oxymoron.

 

[CharlieG]

Work"choices" an oxymoron.

The Ministry of Love is responsible for hate, the Ministry of Truth is responsible for lies, the Ministry of Plenty is responsible for rationing and the Ministry of Peace is responsible for war.

Welcome to the Australia of John Winston Smith Howard, Deputy Sheriff of Oceania.

 

[- PC -]

Let me correct myself. Our union (which I am NOT a member of) went to the bosses and were told to like it or lump it. If we did not accept it, we were to be forced onto individual agreements. We had no choice with Work"choices".

Work"choices" an oxymoron.

Interesting...have you rung Today Tonight?

 

[Dry Rot]

I recently had our EBA done by our bosses, we lost our conditions and lost wages, tell me if that is a benefit to me.

Surely enhanced sharholder wealth (and quite probably your boss's bonus) gives you a warm inner glow?

 

[Rainman1]

AWA's being introduced at a time when those on welfare, such as those on disability pensions are being directed into the work force, to work part-time, wouldn't happen to have an affect on the growth of jobs? Do the numbers state how many of these jobs are full-time and how many part-time and casual? I don't mean to sound cynical, but I would be suprised if anywhere near half of them were full-time.

 

[Underdog]

I am more then happy on an AWA

 

[quotations]

I am more then happy on an AWA

That's because you're a sack.

 

[stickman11]

4/ Are you actually argueing that its the IR laws that is driving the economic boom we are enjoying?



1/ I'm more than interested in the real numbers, you may want to learn to REAL numbers, productivity has collapsed under the Howard government, and more so since the Workchoices Act came into force.

2

The only boom is in the minerals sector and how long is that going to last. Most other areas are looking quite weak. I shouldn't think too many people are making much in retail...

 

[opng]

And workchoices is the reason ive decided so early to vote rudd, its not so much me cause im set up pretty well i just want the message sent out that i dont want this type of thing for my kids. if not for the IR laws i probably would have voted howard but i just cant deliver this to my kids i want them to have a productive future not become the working poor.

 

[skilts]

Surely enhanced sharholder wealth (and quite probably your boss's bonus) gives you a warm inner glow?

Ah yes, that familiar feeling which occurs just before you vomit.

 

[stickman11]

Ah yes, that familiar feeling which occurs just before you vomit.

Shouldn't it be workaintgotachoice

 

[Mossie]

A man died and went to Heaven. As he stood in front of the Pearly Gates,
he saw a huge wall of clocks behind him.

He asked, "What are all those clocks?"

St. Peter answered, "Those are Lie-Clocks. Everyone on earth has a
Lie-Clock. Every time you lie the hands on your clock move."

"Oh", said the man. "Whose clock is that?"

"That's Mother Teresa's", replied St. Peter. "The hands have never
moved,indicating that she never told a lie."

"Incredible", said the man. "And whose clock is that one?"

St. Peter responded, "That's Abraham Lincoln's clock. The hands have
moved twice, telling us that Abraham told only two lies in his entire life."


"Where's John Howard's clock?" asked the man.

"Howard's clock is in Jesus's office. He's using it as a ceiling fan."

 

[Goldenblue]

Interesting...have you rung Today Tonight?

Let me guess, you run a business?

 

[Goldenblue]

Surely enhanced sharholder wealth (and quite probably your boss's bonus) gives you a warm inner glow?

I think the warm glow will happen when Johnny and his mates are out on their ears.

 

[CattyBossDog]

I think the warm glow will happen when Johnny and his mates are out on their ears.

HAhahaha. You think the other party are going to give control back to the common worker do you?


Good one!

 

[Goldenblue]

HAhahaha. You think the other party are going to give control back to the common worker do you?


Good one!

No, I don't believe that at all smartass, however I am still mad enough to see Howard get tossed out and that will be my "workchoice" for him. My choice to have him lose his job and that's good enough for me.

 

[- PC -]

Let me guess, you run a business?

No why? I am surprised the whole workforce just accepted it.