Opinion Is Our Flag Window Shut?

[Bluelegs]

What blows my mind is how we went from playing terrific finals football in 2021 to turgid also rans in 22-23. Barely a player that’s improved since then and nothing of note coming through.

We look great statistically but find ways to lose.

I feel another coach might get more out of us but maybe the players’ bellies are full and they’re happy with 21?

The list and gameplan needs a major overhaul that may take years to pull off. I don’t think we can go back to the well with this group or this plan given 4 straight finals losses.

Yeah our team hasn't gotten close to that 2021 finals form since. I think they try their guts out but just had a lot of guys peak at the right time in 21. Improvement from here comes from new players coming into the side.

 

[KickLongTackleHard]

Keeping the window open relies on snagging ready made free agents or trades to go with a top 10 pick.

Jackson hasn’t been replaced on field. Brown and TMac have declined rapidly since 2021.

JVR and Jefferson are key and we need some footskills into the middle to balance out the bulls again.

A refresh of the assistant coaches will help to address our weaknesses as opposition see them.

Gawn and May are key pillars we need to keep performing if the window is to remain open. They aren’t replaceable.

 

[Tulip]

Yeah our team hasn't gotten close to that 2021 finals form since. I think they try their guys out but just had a lot of guys peak at the right time in 21. Improvement from here comes from new players coming into the side.

We don't handle big occasions well, particularly when there is expectation. We were fortunate to play a whole campaign away from home under a coach who the players love in a city that got behind us.

 

[Crusty Demon]

I blame Burgess leaving and this god awful #demonspirit thing..

 

[Dancing Potato]

We must be the side with the highest ratio of low football IQ players.

Can never question the effort, but holy shit the decision making is something else.

We need to invest in players with skill and smarts if we want any hope of propping this window open. Never going to get there with half our team playing a game of who can blaze away the most.

 

[stEdy]

We should relocate to Joondalup - The Joondalup Demons sounds good.

 

[LarryDavidNeitz]

We’re going to find out over the next few months whether the club is serious about Premierships or if the Board and leadership are satisfied with winning one flag and crediting themselves with the resulting revenue and membership surge.

We’ve become smug and comfortable, refusing to refresh and make the changes you need to stay at the top and as a result we’re drifting backwards.

This is why I react so strongly to bullshit decisions like extending Goodwin, Schache, giving out longer than necessary contracts to everyone we re-sign. It promotes the comfort zone, makes it harder to make major change, sends a message that if we just keep acting like we’re perennial premiership contenders then it will all be fine.

Sack some assistant coaches starting with Stafford and embark on a major refresh of the list. Be as ruthless as you need to be telling the likes of Tmac and Brown there is no chance they play senior football for Melbourne again.

Need to face facts that we have so little young talent coming through we picked a sub we didn’t want to put on the ground.

Need to see 7/8 new players and at least 2 new assistant coaches next year.

 

[Major Colvin]

Look guys - I'm sorry but we aren't winning another flag with Gawn, Petracca, Oliver and of course, Goodwin.

It's Luke Beveridge at the Dogs 2.0 - somehow jagged a premiership but they have no idea how, and no chance or replicating it.

We were never a dynasty team - just a flash in a plan wonder who cant win one final at the MCG from 4 starts.

Absolutely disgraceful club

 

[demondavey]

Probably got one more year with Gawn and May. We will need some major change to fix what we have failed to address from last year. Our ball use and entry into the 50 is totally sub par as modern defensive units are designed for zoning and rebounding quickly. Lowering the eyes needs to be the theme of pre season, and we need recognised forwards who aren’t past it.

I don’t even know what else to say, it’s not my job to fix it and the people that are paid aren’t doing it. Glad we lost last night (in a way) as this is going to force some really big shifts in attitudes and approaches to the future given not one but two straight sets exits.

 

[jhong]

When the coach seems to believe what worked in 2021 will still work with no tactical innovations makes me think window is shut for the next couple is years at least .

 

[The Dr]

We're not a super team, and many other teams look just as good as us, if not better, so I'm not expecting a fairytale return to the top of the ladder or anything.

But I think we're good enough to finish top four again, and from there we could challenge (unless we do the old 'Melbourne finals choke', lol).

But we have to be really smart at the draft and trade table, and we also need Goody and Co to actually find a solution to our mid-forward woes. The latter is what concerns me most tbh.


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[Topkent]

We're not a super team, and many other teams look just as good as us, if not better, so I'm not expecting a fairytale return to the top of the ladder or anything.

But I think we're good enough to finish top four again, and from there we could challenge (unless we do the old 'Melbourne finals choke', lol).

But we have to be really smart at the draft and trade table, and we also need Goody and Co to actually find a solution to our mid-forward woes. The latter is what concerns me most tbh.


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I personally think it's gonna be a struggle for us to make top 4 again. I think we had the fairytale in 21, but are not a better side than then and everyone around us has improved.

If this was another sport I'd suggest trading Oliver for a Key forward and maybe we'd see some actual change. But let's be real we will draft a single player in the top 10, they'll show glimpses as a mid and Gawn and May will be one year older.

You look at the moves other clubs do and I can't help but feel we've been bent over at the contract table by Trac Oliver and Gus and that's our team going forward with parts around it

 

[Bluelegs]

I personally think it's gonna be a struggle for us to make top 4 again. I think we had the fairytale in 21, but are not a better side than then and everyone around us has improved.

If this was another sport I'd suggest trading Oliver for a Key forward and maybe we'd see some actual change. But let's be real we will draft a single player in the top 10, they'll show glimpses as a mid and Gawn and May will be one year older.

You look at the moves other clubs do and I can't help but feel we've been bent over at the contract table by Trac Oliver and Gus and that's our team going forward with parts around it

The big concern with our midfield is the core of them are all shocking ball users, especially when it comes to delivering the ball inside 50, and the guys who aren't like ANB, Chandler, Spargo etc, are limited and would be the first to be pushed out by anyone we bring in, leaving us with that crap midfield balance.

We probably need to find someone to replace Petracca in the midfield so he can play as a permanent forward and we can find some mids with actual skill.

 

[demondavey]

I personally think it's gonna be a struggle for us to make top 4 again. I think we had the fairytale in 21, but are not a better side than then and everyone around us has improved.

If this was another sport I'd suggest trading Oliver for a Key forward and maybe we'd see some actual change. But let's be real we will draft a single player in the top 10, they'll show glimpses as a mid and Gawn and May will be one year older.

You look at the moves other clubs do and I can't help but feel we've been bent over at the contract table by Trac Oliver and Gus and that's our team going forward with parts around it

Petracca is a match winner as evidenced in 2021, you’ve got to pay big gold bars for guys like that. Oliver is losing credibility as a midfielder due to his kicking and the Brayshaw deal is unfortunate now.

Petty and JVR as key forwards next year surrounded by Fritsch, Pickett and ANB is a better prospect. I’d be wanting to see Rivers play midfield more. May next year worries me, the decline could be swift.

 

[demondavey]

The big concern with our midfield is the core of them are all shocking ball users, especially when it comes to delivering the ball inside 50, and the guys who aren't like ANB, Chandler, Spargo etc, are limited and would be the first to be pushed out by anyone we bring in, leaving us with that crap midfield balance.

We probably need to find someone to replace Petracca in the midfield so he can play as a permanent forward and we can find some mids with actual skill.

I think Rivers needs to be transitioned to the midfield.

 

[demondavey]

We also can’t be just trading in, we’ve got to develop players. I don’t know enough about our developing kids to know whom would be able to slot in next year.

 

[Tulip]

Petty and JVR as key forwards next year surrounded by Fritsch, Pickett and ANB is a better prospect.

I’m just not enthused by this. It’s better than this year, sure, but is that really good enough?

Meanwhile, someone needs to have a word with Pickett. Feel like we’ve done everything to keep him happy and make him dig in, and now he’s a law unto himself.

 

[Major Colvin]

I honestly dont want us to make finals again under Goodwin - his record speaks for itself

Best case scenario is we bottom out spectacularly next year and decide to cut him loose (won't happen though)

We're treading water until this loser moves on

 

[demondavey]

When the coach seems to believe what worked in 2021 will still work with no tactical innovations makes me think window is shut for the next couple is years at least .

I think a couple of years is going to be worse. Next year is the last of May and Gawn I reckon in terms of being seriously influential players. I don’t think we are far off, and we shouldn’t underestimate the loss of Petty and Melksham and then JVR last night. If you were to take 3 starting forwards out of any top 8 side you’d be losing serious heat.

We are right in contention next year if we get things right.

 

[demondavey]

I’m just not enthused by this. It’s better than this year, sure, but is that really good enough?

Meanwhile, someone needs to have a word with Pickett. Feel like we’ve done everything to keep him happy and make him dig in, and now he’s a law unto himself.

Well we haven’t seen Petty play a full season up forward, and I think that the Gawn / Grundy experiment didn’t facilitate him playing there because we had to justify picking Grundy and rotating him with Gawn. I think what he offers is probably similar to Mihocek; an honest effort with aggression and a 2-3 goal return.

JVR has shown enough. He will be bigger, fitter and probably more determined next year given he was part of it this year. I also think the Melksham loss hurt. He was playing his best footy for a long time (probably 2018) levels. Unfortunately a full knee puts him out all year, so we don’t see him in 2024 and he will be 34 halfway through 2025.

Honestly, I don’t think we lose to Collingwood with Melksham and Petty. I know we are all doom and gloom and seething after last night, but we lost two finals by an average of 4.5 points. We are really close to the pin here. The focus needs to be on a new skills coach, Jesus, employ Luke Hodge or Nathan Buckley part time.

Pickett needs to assess whether he wants to stay or go. That simple. He looked angry last night and whilst I love a really good hip and shoulder and jumper punch, the game won’t allow it. He is a very good footballer but he is an angry chap and needs to chill out and forget footy for 6 weeks.

 

[demondavey]

I honestly dont want us to make finals again under Goodwin - his record speaks for itself

Best case scenario is we bottom out spectacularly next year and decide to cut him loose (won't happen though)

We're treading water until this loser moves on

I really don’t think that’s a good outcome. I absolutely want to be top 2-4 next year with a way to redeem ourselves. The time to strike is now with a list coming off big disappointment and thirsty for revenge.

 

[Bluelegs]

I really don’t think that’s a good outcome. I absolutely want to be top 2-4 next year with a way to redeem ourselves. The time to strike is now with a list coming off big disappointment and thirsty for revenge.

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Yeah can't really get behind wishing the team being shit.

 

[1990crow]

Outsider perspective is that list is still good enough but forward line needs a reset.
Know its probably doom and gloom but there's still the squad to go again, and plenty of players around that 22-24 age still to improve.

Fritsch, Pickett, JVR clearly all good pieces.
McAdam will be decent for you guys next year.
But that second key forward is the issue. Should be targeting.

Petracca, Oliver, Viney, Gawn, Brayshaw need to all play midfield because that's where your advantage was in 2021.

 

[Dory_77]

Well we haven’t seen Petty play a full season up forward, and I think that the Gawn / Grundy experiment didn’t facilitate him playing there because we had to justify picking Grundy and rotating him with Gawn. I think what he offers is probably similar to Mihocek; an honest effort with aggression and a 2-3 goal return.

JVR has shown enough. He will be bigger, fitter and probably more determined next year given he was part of it this year. I also think the Melksham loss hurt. He was playing his best footy for a long time (probably 2018) levels. Unfortunately a full knee puts him out all year, so we don’t see him in 2024 and he will be 34 halfway through 2025.

Honestly, I don’t think we lose to Collingwood with Melksham and Petty. I know we are all doom and gloom and seething after last night, but we lost two finals by an average of 4.5 points. We are really close to the pin here. The focus needs to be on a new skills coach, Jesus, employ Luke Hodge or Nathan Buckley part time.

Pickett needs to assess whether he wants to stay or go. That simple. He looked angry last night and whilst I love a really good hip and shoulder and jumper punch, the game won’t allow it. He is a very good footballer but he is an angry chap and needs to chill out and forget footy for 6 weeks.

Agree on Pickett. Had some great moments in both finals and could be a huge lift to the team. Could've been a matchwinner.
Also lost the plot and played dumb giving up frees, 50s, spraying shots.

Some ****ing set shot training would be great too. **** Stafford and his let players do whatever routine. Give them something reliable that works and they practice.

 

[markm106]

This tweet sums it up. If you want to be a doomsdayer be one. The talent is there and a lot of it in its prime. I think we could do with a refresh in the assistant coaches for some fresh ideas etc.