List Mgmt. 2014 Draft + DFA Talk Part II

[Stitch]

Our forward line is at it's most dangerous when we have Dusty/Deledio/Cotchin resting in the fwd 50.
Our forward line is most efficient when we have quality delivery into the forward 50.
This only happens if we have better midfielders. #12 get a midfielder.

 

[TigerTime3]

Re: Wright. If there, get him.

We've only got two proven tall KPFs or rucks (Riewoldt and Maric).

Jack's been amazing to play with the amount of injuries he's had without missing games, absolutely amazing. But what if he gets injured in 2017 and 31yo Maric retires? Do we want to rely entirely on Tyrone Vickery... Griffiths... and Hampson?? They're no guarantee to become good players. McBean is our great white hope, but realistically he hasn't played a game and is still skinny. We'd be relying a lot on landing a big trade or a big FA and we would likely have to pay significant overs because we're desperate.

If Wright is available and if he's as good as they say - we must take him.

We have heaps of potential with our non-back talls, but only 2 of them are proven, and 1 of them is nearing 30.

I know it was the ethos at Sydney under Roos (and seems that Horse inherited it) to take mids and trade for bigs. I think that we've taken a similar approach. Obviously we still select talls in the draft, just with our later picks.

Lately, yes. We've picked up Maric and Chaplin for chips and drafted midfielders early.

Before 2010:

Pick 13: Jack Riewoldt
Pick 18: Alex Rance
Pick 19: Ben Griffiths
Pick 8: Ty Vickery

Essentially we shored up our talks and then focused on mids. This is ideal IMO.

Just remember where we got our quality from though - it's been with first round picks.

 

[Rubber Hips]

I know it's not player related...but... I really wish we had gone after and got Neil Balme...perfect for our club

 

[Rubber Hips]

Our forward line is at it's most dangerous when we have Dusty/Deledio/Cotchin resting in the fwd 50.
Our forward line is most efficient when we have quality delivery into the forward 50.
This only happens if we have better midfielders. #12 get a midfielder.

Agree - but a small goal kicking pressure forward (Milne type) would make our F50 very potent

 

[Dr Tigris]

Our three talls structure failed in 2014. So on that likely to fail in 2015. However, they will have learnt a lot and to me watching the big reasons for failure were poor entry and poor performance by the 3 talls. Jack ended up doing OK overall in 2014. The other 2 had their moments, but were not really good. Griff is coming on and that was a learning to play AFL year for him. But if TV and Griff can use their athleticism and size, along with their skills then they can be a good CHF/FF combo allowing JR to move as he wills. It can work so long as TV and Griff hold down their spots. Then Jack becomes the joker in the pack. When he gets to roam he is deadly. Last season we screwed that up for 13 games and did it only OK after that. I will be interested to see if they go 3 tall forwards again. Lots to like about the idea. But lots of work to do to make it happen fruitfully. In any case our 2015 structures have no effect on this draft decision. Too early for a youngster to make a difference.

 

[TigerSE]

I don't think Wright will be there at our pick Durdin is the one tall we should take if he is there

 

[TigerTime3]

Whoever we get, I won't be upset based off a few highlights videos!

It's easy to get caught up in the pre-draft media hype but deep down we all know that our least preferred player right now could become our favourite player in 3 years time!

Some players sound amazing and look amazing but turn out crap. Or we have an idea in our head that they represent "playing it safe" for example, so we dislike them not due to their ability, but due to the concepts and ideas we associate them with.

 

[Tigerbob]

Do some research then instead of making up arbitrary observations.

I think people classifying Wright as a ruckman are wrong though. He is Forward/Ruckman like Tyrone and those players are worth their weight in gold.

1. I agree with you regarding tigs2010 what a pointless point he tried to make with no research. Should of just shut his trap instead of trying to sound important.

2. Wright is a Ruck Forward. Think Brad Ottens Geelong variety. He's equally good in both positions. I agree, worth wait in gold.

All this says that with all the players left at our pick, Ellis surely cannot be taken.

 

[Thrillhouse!]

I guarantee you if we take wright this year and then next season comes around and if we got a few injuries to mids and started getting smashed around the ball. People will be whining about midfield depth. Because the gap between our core mids and the rest is ridiculous.

We need mids this draft.

Weller > de goey > duggan > cockatoo

 

[tigs2010]

I guarantee you if we take wright this year and then next season comes around and if we got a few injuries to mids and started getting smashed around the ball. People will be whining about midfield depth. Because the gap between our core mids and the rest is ridiculous.

We need mids this draft.

Weller > de goey > duggan > cockatoo

A mid ain't gunna help us next year unless a Petracca or brayshaw slides.

 

[Thrillhouse!]

Yea i understand that. And neither is wright. Im talking down the track. if we didn't have vickery grith McBean i would be all for it. Realistically we have cotch lids martin miles ellis conca* vlas* lennon*

* meaning really haven't set the world on fire. But im confident will be good players. And considering there meant to be out core group. Doesnt run that deep with A grade talent. These days more mids the better. Also can squeeze out the dead wood.

 

[tigs2010]

Yea i understand that. And neither is wright. Im talking down the track. if we didn't have vickery grith McBean i would be all for it. Realistically we have cotch lids martin miles ellis conca* vlas* lennon*

* meaning really haven't set the world on fire. But im confident will be good players. And considering there meant to be out core group. Doesnt run that deep with A grade talent. These days more mids the better. Also can squeeze out the dead wood.

Wright should develop as a ruck so the forwards we have shouldn't matter. He could make a lethal combo with Ty or Griff as we'd lose nothing forward when he rests. As Tigerbob said he projects like a brad Ottens.

If our recruiters are any good they can pick up good mids later anyway. Dean Gore, Touk Miller etc will most likely be available and are more ready to go now anyway.

Always go best available first round or you're just asking for trouble. Can always trade an extra tall for a 1st rounder if we end up with too many as there will always be demand.

 

[DontArgue4]

Wright should develop as a ruck so the forwards we have shouldn't matter. He could make a lethal combo with Ty or Griff as we'd lose nothing forward when he rests. As Tigerbob said he projects like a brad Ottens.

If our recruiters are any good they can pick up good mids later anyway. Dean Gore, Touk Miller etc will most likely be available and are more ready to go now anyway.

Always go best available first round or you're just asking for trouble. Can always trade an extra tall for a 1st rounder if we end up with too many as there will always be demand.

I fully endorse this post

 

[Thrillhouse!]

Personally i would rather a good mid. But if we get wright at 12 it will obviously still be a good get because of the upside. Just worry if we dont take a quality mid. Fj hasnt got a good track record of picking quality in the later rounds .

 

[Thrillhouse!]

New to this. Keep forgetting to hit reply.. lol

 

[tigs2010]

Personally i would rather a good mid. But if we get wright at 12 it will obviously still be a good get because of the upside. Just worry if we dont take a quality mid. Fj hasnt got a good track record of picking quality in the later rounds .

Yeah that last part is the issue. Just gotta not get too cute and take the obvious. Gore would be my pick. Vlastuin should become a mid and Lennon/McDonough should play more this year particularly if we cop some injuries.

 

[Mr Magic]

Tomlinson looks set to re-sign with GWS.

But I agree insofar as structure. I think our backline structure is okay, but our forward line structure isn't.

We had games in previous years where Ty and JR8 looked to hard to defend against with such an open forward line. But teams (like Collingwood with Mick Naxwell) carved us up when we couldn't stop the third man up problem. Also think out entry into the F50 is suspect - enough that it allows a third tall to rotate of their opponent and be the extra man up.

People forget that 2 years ago, Ty and JR8 kicked the most goals for a duo in the AFL - greater than the then duo of Roughead and Franklin.

The interesting aspect of this is how we integrate the third prong in the forward line being a gun midfielder (Cotchin, Martin, Deledio). Having three talls makes that an extremely congested forward 50, and it would be quite difficult to isolate one of those four 1 out.

I actually think Cameron and Tomlinson are almost incompatible because they play too similar and get in each others way. Both rely on mobility.

That's where I think Tomlinson would be best utilised in a tall forward setup bit like with Richmond like Richo on the wing where he provides that ground level play as well as a lead up option creating space separately from Griffith's on the other flank.

I don't take 2 much notice of duo stats talking about JR and TV. Its like the government arguing no issues if the employment rate goes down. The employment rate us meaningless like the duo stat because it does not measure forward line effectiveness just who kicked the goals over a period. You really need contestability rates of various forward set-ups to get relevant analysis of forward line effectiveness. For example it could be argued the duo rate was good because they got all the ball against weaker opposition and were not really efficient at all.

I don't see a problem with the third option. The problem may be how TV fits in with or without Wright. With Wright TV can play more ruck so that helps that but TV needs to develop his game more IMO especially marking.

Martin and Lids can play forward regardless as guns but not a great need for Cotch to leave the middle except if having a rest

 

[Stylo]

Snoop dog (astute draft watcher) has us taking Duggan, Neal-Bullen, Smith and a couple others. That would be a beautiful result.

 

[Mr Magic]

Wright should develop as a ruck so the forwards we have shouldn't matter. He could make a lethal combo with Ty or Griff as we'd lose nothing forward when he rests. As Tigerbob said he projects like a brad Ottens.

If our recruiters are any good they can pick up good mids later anyway. Dean Gore, Touk Miller etc will most likely be available and are more ready to go now anyway.

Always go best available first round or you're just asking for trouble. Can always trade an extra tall for a 1st rounder if we end up with too many as there will always be demand.

Agree there is plenty of mid talent later with likes of Maynard possibly available 2nd round and we can load up on mids in 2015 to. The opportunities for are when considering trades and FA!

Hunt will make a difference to with a bit of body pressure in the middle to at times supporting Scotch and Miles!

 

[TJTIGER]

Do some research then instead of making up arbitrary observations.

I think people classifying Wright as a ruckman are wrong though. He is Forward/Ruckman like Tyrone and those players are worth their weight in gold.

May be another reason we will likely go the mid option, cos we've got 2 in Tv & Benny G...???

 

[Mr Magic]

May be another reason we will likely go the mid option, cos we've got 2 in Tv & Benny G...???

That's the problem. 2 and a ruck is no good. You arguably need three who can all ruck replacing the conventional ruck!

Thing is Wright looks like a mobile ruck man to me who can impact forward, Durdin has the ruck acumen as well!

 

[big oval ballz]

i thought that generally the draft rule is you take the best pick possible no matter what position .. so wasn't wright rated for a while as the number 1 or close to that etc... and the other mids where looking at are rated around about what our pick is anyways..
if he's there I reckon take him I don't think hell slip to us though and it only makes those tall fwd. / ruck spot even more competitive sink or swim environment... but also our mid field is lacking depth but don't we have a war chest for free agents for the end of next year seems like all the chatter is were going after gun mid etc.

 

[SumTingWong]

Snoop dog (astute draft watcher) has us taking Duggan, Neal-Bullen, Smith and a couple others. That would be a beautiful result.

ND - Duggan, Neal-Bullen, Smith (Boekhurst), Deluca (Hone, Markov, Bower, Yarran)
Rookie - Bradley Walsh, Nick Mellington, Rick Cary, Taylor Grace, Jake Johanson

 

[TJTIGER]

Thing is for me we have shown that we can handle getting beaten in the middle by a ruck & still win the clearances. With greater mid depth we can continue that trend & with mobile athletic forward ruck types like Ty & Griff we can attack more with the mids brigade. To me thats more difficult to combat than us going for a ruck (that people are not sure if he is a pure ruck ??) It gives us a diversity in the middle while also rotating our mids forward, once again much more potent, multi-dimentional & difficult to counter. This seems to me the way the club has been heading. More weapons in more positions. Some will say look at how we got beaten early in 2014 & to an extent I'd agree but this was not soley based on Ivan being out we had multiple keys out, including Lids & Tross ...Just my 2c worth.

 

[captain cotch 9]

If Weller and Duggan are gone i wouldn't mind Goddard.
More versatility than Wright.