2017 - The most one sided finals series ever

[Tyler Hodges]

If GWS were handed the flag with their concessions, they would be lining up against Gold Coast in two weeks time. They still had to earn it.

They have 22 players on the current list that are top 20 draft picks. GC blowing their concessions is one of the most underrated disasters in the history of the league and is the anomaly in this experiment, not the GWS hard work leading to success- it had to happen.

 

[JoondalupJ]

So how do you make the finals closer then?

Simple , don't expand the un-expandable, don't make bigger what doesn't fit, don't fiddle with the rules to a point where you change the whole idea of the sport, DON'T DILUTE THE EFFING COMPETITION FOR TELEVISION PROMOTION AND MONEY MAKING AND GAMBLING. AND LOSE QUALITY!!!! What about that ?

 

[Freshwater]

So how do you make the finals closer then?

You don't do anything, you don't have to make stuff happen. I will happen organically.
I don't like the bye before finals, I want the season to just roll on with the enormous momentum it had after the last round.

 

[JoondalupJ]

Round 9
Carlton 15.14 (104) Hawthorn 14.12 (96) Princes Park 30,750 21 May 1983
St Kilda 16.12 (108) Richmond 13.15 (93) Moorabbin Oval 20,686 21 May 1983
Footscray 22.13 (145) Fitzroy 13.21 (99) VFL Park 22,336 21 May 1983

Round 10
North Melbourne 29.19 (193) Carlton 11.16 (82) Arden Street Oval 22,776 28 May 1983

Round 12
Footscray 15.12 (102) Geelong 14.7 (91) Western Oval 25,382 11 June 1983
Hawthorn 25.17 (167) Fitzroy 21.8 (134) Princes Park 20,559 11 June 1983
Richmond 21.15 (141) Carlton 13.13 (91) MCG 48,243 13 June 1983

Round 13
Melbourne 18.15 (123) Richmond 15.19 (109) MCG 28,468 18 June 1983
Fitzroy 34.16 (220) North Melbourne 10.10 (70) Junction Oval 19,770 18 June 1983
Carlton 26.15 (171) Footscray 12.10 (82) Princes Park 23,710 18 June 1983

Nothing new about all this.
I can well remember my Blues kicking 9 goals in second quarter to blitz Hawks (eventual premiers) in classic high standard game in 1983 in round 9.
Meanwhile in for a rude shock the next week when North thumped us by 111 points at Arden Street.
Never saw that coming.
Meanwhile Dogs beat Lions by 50 points in round 9, we flog Dogs by 89 points 3 weeks later and the next week ,the team we lost to by 111 points get done by 150 points to the team Lions lost to by 50 points that we beat by 89 points..... That all within 4 weeks of each other of team A, B, C, D, etc etc

North were on top of ladder when they got done by 150 points.

Meanwhile 34 years on Crows were 10 goals to nothing down against North earlier this year.
Nothing new to see here.
Just reminds how even at this level, the mental side of game for humans always plays an important role.

iTS DIFFERENT MATE SORRY, JUST DIFFERENT , ANOMALIES HAPPEN , BUT NOW EVERY WEEK IN TOO MANY GAMES, THE STANDARD ISN'T THERE, IT MAY PAN OUT THE SAME TO A DEGREE IN YOUR SCORING STATS, OVER YEARS, BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING. NOW ITS REGULAR AND UNENDING , AND THIS LAST WEEKEND JUST PROVED IT.
tHE ONLY WAY TO GO TO EXtreme (sorry thwe bloody cap button) elite standard is to have 14 teams .
Imagine taking four teams out imagine the line ups in some clubs like Freo, or Melbourne or Saints or Port even , imagine Fremantle with Toby Greene , hey? Thats one example you pick a few yourself. We have too many teams, and this year has been all over the place proving one point after round six with Sydney then showing how tha quality runs out, because the game is so messy with the rule guessing game. So yes on occasion scores turned around week for week on very few occasions , not now , what? 9 games a week , and they are all over the joint and S**t can Harry can over run super scoop. And visaversa next week x 9 games.
Mental side to the game is nearly everything now, football well about 70 percent of players are footballers who can kick and not fumble and actually handball and play tough , but then they never know how tough to play the game because the prancers are on them like hot cakes. All I want to see is less teams , 16 if we have to and some clarity in the rules. which are so damned complicated that we see garbage argued about every week, example Shuey and that free??????????????????????????????????? there you go stat man.

 

[JackOutback]

They have 22 players on the current list that are top 20 draft picks. GC blowing their concessions is one of the most underrated disasters in the history of the league and is the anomaly in this experiment, not the GWS hard work leading to success- it had to happen.

They certainly had a leg-up (which is needed when establishing a football club in non-heartland territory) but their success was not inevitable. They lost plenty of players, they could have opted for players instead of picks, but they chose to manage the draft well. They could have succumbed to egos and pay packets as their players became stars. Of course such success was possible, but I think the management of the club is underrated.

 

[Macpotata]

shithouse finals series.

 

[footyfan1978]

iTS DIFFERENT MATE SORRY, JUST DIFFERENT ,

Got it, it is about the vibe for you. Got it mate!!!
rofl

btw, I agree with you about the standard. That was obvious to me as someone that seen it expand from 12 teams to 14 to 16 and now 18. It dilutes it each time, further and further the standard the teams can get to at the top.
Having said that the population growth in time should in theory mean a return to elite league team standards. But as far as general team form up and down, that is just part of footy cycles in any era as the example I showed from the crazy 1983 stuff.

 

[Dam Wall Busted]

Just a shame that bye the week before finals played such a huge part again in shaping the way the finals panned out. Oh wait.

 

[Tyler Hodges]

They certainly had a leg-up (which is needed when establishing a football club in non-heartland territory) but their success was not inevitable. They lost plenty of players, they could have opted for players instead of picks, but they chose to manage the draft well. They could have succumbed to egos and pay packets as their players became stars. Of course such success was possible, but I think the management of the club is underrated.

They just didn't blow it, it's like a stock C grade based on the tools they have at their disposal, where as GC are F-. They are the only side able to swap elite talent for elite talent at needed spots without weakening their side. No other team can get maximum return for a Adams, Treloar in order to strengthen other areas on the ground because they literally have too much midfield talent. Last year was a huge disappointment, and I don't see them in the GF this year. They are a poor defensive team that only runs 1 way with the fittest roster in the league. Leon Cameron hasn't shown himself to be anything more than mediocre. The only thing they have done well was not pay stupid sums for FA talent, and that's only because the Swans outsmarted them in snagging Buddy. If he goes, Patton/Cameron don't turn into much.

 

[JackOutback]

They just didn't blow it, it's like a stock C grade based on the tools they have at their disposal, where as GC are F-. They are the only side able to swap elite talent for elite talent at needed spots without weakening their side. No other team can get maximum return for a Adams, Treloar in order to strengthen other areas on the ground because they literally have too much midfield talent. Last year was a huge disappointment, and I don't see them in the GF this year. They are a poor defensive team that only runs 1 way with the fittest roster in the league. Leon Cameron hasn't shown himself to be anything more than mediocre. The only thing they have done well was not pay stupid sums for FA talent, and that's only because the Swans outsmarted them in snagging Buddy. If he goes, Patton/Cameron don't turn into much.

Well, if they don't make the grand final, then clearly they haven't just been handed premierships. Winning premierships is a complicated formula that requires a lot of things to go right, not just one thing.

 

[Ricky Vaughn]

They have 22 players on the current list that are top 20 draft picks. GC blowing their concessions is one of the most underrated disasters in the history of the league and is the anomaly in this experiment, not the GWS hard work leading to success- it had to happen.

Are you suggesting that drafting Will Hoskin-Elliot, Matt Buntine, Liam Sumner, Dom Tyson, Jon O'Rourke, Lachie Plowman, Kristian Jaksch, Aidan Corr, Tom Boyd, Cam McCarthy, Jarrod Picket and Paul Ahern isn't a great use of top 15 draft picks?

 

[go you pups]

Are you suggesting that drafting Will Hoskin-Elliot, Matt Buntine, Liam Sumner, Dom Tyson, Jon O'Rourke, Lachie Plowman, Kristian Jaksch, Aidan Corr, Tom Boyd, Cam McCarthy, Jarrod Picket and Paul Ahern isn't a great use of top 15 draft picks?

When you're gifted so many and still top your list up with mature talent like Shaw, Griffen, Deledio, Mummy, Stevie J etc plus the free agent inaugural giants like Scully, Ward, Davis then there is bound to be decent talent who want to move on, whether it be for more cash or opportunity or both.

 

[Ricky Vaughn]

When you're gifted so many and still top your list up with mature talent like Shaw, Griffen, Deledio, Mummy, Stevie J etc plus the free agent inaugural giants like Scully, Ward, Davis then there is bound to be decent talent who want to move on, whether it be for more cash or opportunity or both.

That's not my argument with those players though. Every one of them (except maybe McCarthy) was a poorly used draft pick.

 

[TiggerMan22]

If GWS were handed the flag with their concessions, they would be lining up against Gold Coast in two weeks time. They still had to earn it.

Guess you didnt see what each time got. GWS got ****loads of extra advantages over GC.

 

[JoondalupJ]

Got it, it is about the vibe for you. Got it mate!!!
rofl

btw, I agree with you about the standard. That was obvious to me as someone that seen it expand from 12 teams to 14 to 16 and now 18. It dilutes it each time, further and further the standard the teams can get to at the top.
Having said that the population growth in time should in theory mean a return to elite league team standards. But as far as general team form up and down, that is just part of footy cycles in any era as the example I showed from the crazy 1983 stuff.

Well I hope your right , and logic tells us that yes the population will grow, and maybe fit 18 teams, but Aussie rules is a special game, I might sound like whinging complaining old bastard , but that's because I am, ha ha , and that I worship this game too. Like you.
In the interim, where we really have added, too many teams , and probably Vic needed to merge a couple or move a couple, but it just wouldn't happen , then they would destroy the goose that laid the golden egg, the money base ,Melbourne .
What they've done and I may be imagining this, but I reckon they've deliberately manipulated rules and eased off on some things like heavy tackles protecting against head highs and allowing what isn't handball to be handball because the play is so fast , the under performing non elite group that make the seniors have to be allowed some leway to play the game, some can'y kick , some can run like mad but can't mark, and you get newbies into footy and they get a physical walloping to start , never can keep it up so they get protected, when as in the past a player like Carl Ditterich in his first senior game , he scared the life out of some of the veterans!!, many now, are not AFL senior level.
I just think its sad , I think there has been brilliant open football in the past I would like to see that and holding positions returned too, and the coaches not having to make up a totally different game to win at all costs.
Like the flood and the pack stoppage after stoppage stuff, And MONEY!!!

I do not dislike either of the new teams , but I do hate the reason they came about, even when they wanted the Dogs in Western Sydney and North in the Gold Coast, they wanted to exploit populations especially West Sydney, but I doubt very much if they'll ever win the couple of million over up there, who are there now, or will be in the future , they will be so soccer oriented that even Rugby league might suffer and they have a heard enough time themselves drawing crowds.

So your maybe right about my feelings but I know several young followers who don't watch the game as much as before, I also know two Fitzroy born and bred and lived , blokes who simply don't watch footy full stop.
That has something to do with the loss of their club and also that they too, can't understand half the rules.
Its been my life that sport , nw it feels like its disappearing and there is an weasy way to get it back, and that play football again have positions and cut the team numbers. GC and GWS were 15 years or more, too early.

 

[Freshwater]

Well I hope your right , and logic tells us that yes the population will grow, and maybe fit 18 teams, but Aussie rules is a special game, I might sound like whinging complaining old bastard , but that's because I am, ha ha , and that I worship this game too. Like you.
In the interim, where we really have added, too many teams , and probably Vic needed to merge a couple or move a couple, but it just wouldn't happen , then they would destroy the goose that laid the golden egg, the money base ,Melbourne .
What they've done and I may be imagining this, but I reckon they've deliberately manipulated rules and eased off on some things like heavy tackles protecting against head highs and allowing what isn't handball to be handball because the play is so fast , the under performing non elite group that make the seniors have to be allowed some leway to play the game, some can'y kick , some can run like mad but can't mark, and you get newbies into footy and they get a physical walloping to start , never can keep it up so they get protected, when as in the past a player like Carl Ditterich in his first senior game , he scared the life out of some of the veterans!!, many now, are not AFL senior level.
I just think its sad , I think there has been brilliant open football in the past I would like to see that and holding positions returned too, and the coaches not having to make up a totally different game to win at all costs.
Like the flood and the pack stoppage after stoppage stuff, And MONEY!!!

I do not dislike either of the new teams , but I do hate the reason they came about, even when they wanted the Dogs in Western Sydney and North in the Gold Coast, they wanted to exploit populations especially West Sydney, but I doubt very much if they'll ever win the couple of million over up there, who are there now, or will be in the future , they will be so soccer oriented that even Rugby league might suffer and they have a heard enough time themselves drawing crowds.

So your maybe right about my feelings but I know several young followers who don't watch the game as much as before, I also know two Fitzroy born and bred and lived , blokes who simply don't watch footy full stop.
That has something to do with the loss of their club and also that they too, can't understand half the rules.
Its been my life that sport , nw it feels like its disappearing and there is an weasy way to get it back, and that play football again have positions and cut the team numbers. GC and GWS were 15 years or more, too early.

You can't "get rid of clubs" just because you think there are too many. This game is only played here. Even the so-called smaller clubs have massive followings and membership rates.
Coaches and the Presidents behind them are what has always hurt the on field play and are the main reason why footy changes. Smart rule changes at headquarters have helped and dumb rule changes hinder. I hope we never go to zones!
But I think there is a way to improve the game by an off the field rule change. And that is get rid of percentages and just have points for as the next column after wins to adjust the ladder. The grounds aren't mud heaps like the old days where percentages were more relevant. This rule would ensure attacking play. Much more emphasis on scoring rather than defending.

 

[Coaster2012]

It appears every game bar one will be a blow out and looking at the fixture I expect this trend to continue. Do we need to rejig the format?

The exact opposite. It's perfect as it is. The fact that the top 4 sides are playing in the prelim comfortably means you don't want to change it. I don't know how you could suddenly make teams 5-8 more competitive. You can't add more teams to the finals, will make it more lopsided than ever, and you also don't want to make it harder for the top 4 teams to win because that defeats the point of finishing top 4.

It stays.

 

[Scotland]

The exact opposite. It's perfect as it is. The fact that the top 4 sides are playing in the prelim comfortably means you don't want to change it. I don't know how you could suddenly make teams 5-8 more competitive.

OK...?

 

[Coaster2012]

OK...?

Quoted wrong post and poster. As you were.

 

[Scotland]

Gotcha.

I miss us being in close finals...

 

[JackOutback]

You can't "get rid of clubs" just because you think there are too many. This game is only played here. Even the so-called smaller clubs have massive followings and membership rates.
Coaches and the Presidents behind them are what has always hurt the on field play and are the main reason why footy changes. Smart rule changes at headquarters have helped and dumb rule changes hinder. I hope we never go to zones!
But I think there is a way to improve the game by an off the field rule change. And that is get rid of percentages and just have points for as the next column after wins to adjust the ladder. The grounds aren't mud heaps like the old days where percentages were more relevant. This rule would ensure attacking play. Much more emphasis on scoring rather than defending.

Fitzroy fans beg to differ.

You absolutely could get rid of some teams, there would be pain, but for the overall health of the competition it would probably be the wise thing to do. I don't see it happening though.

 

[Duskfire]

was last year actually any better? Up to this point we had had only one close game which was Geelong and hawthorn. GWS and Sydney game was rugby style like tigers/cats this year which GWS ended up winning comfortably. Bulldogs smashed both eagles and hawthorn, Sydney and Adelaide was basically over at quarter time, etc etc

The series is remembered fondly because of the amazing GWS Bulldogs prelim and the grand final. And we could still have it this year.

 

[Freshwater]

was last year actually any better? Up to this point we had had only one close game which was Geelong and hawthorn. GWS and Sydney game was rugby style like tigers/cats this year which GWS ended up winning comfortably. Bulldogs smashed both eagles and hawthorn, Sydney and Adelaide was basically over at quarter time, etc etc

The series is remembered fondly because of the amazing GWS Bulldogs prelim and the grand final. And we could still have it this year.

Close games aren't necessarily good games and good games aren't always close.

 

[JackOutback]

Close games aren't necessarily good games and good games aren't always close.

Definitely; I'm in the camp that thought the Richmond/Geelong game was very good. Close for large parts, then a systematic dismantling at the end, with some quality highlights from Martin and Cotchin.

 

[Tyler Hodges]

Are you suggesting that drafting Will Hoskin-Elliot, Matt Buntine, Liam Sumner, Dom Tyson, Jon O'Rourke, Lachie Plowman, Kristian Jaksch, Aidan Corr, Tom Boyd, Cam McCarthy, Jarrod Picket and Paul Ahern isn't a great use of top 15 draft picks?

And despite all that quality top end talent drafting, they still have a list with 22 first round picks, hard work my arse