Jhye Clark 13
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standupand
Premiership Player
This is why I'm not a massive fan of Cameron. He's happy to be the one on the end of a scoring opportunity, but when it comes to the contest he generally stays out of it.
I disagree. If you are going to have Esava cannon into every contest, you want Cameron at ground level. How often was he fed the ball out of a contest last year, and swings around on the left for a goal?
A: often.
Pure_Ownage
TheBrownDog
Ruck has been a problem since 2012 and never fixed and we are light on for kpd post harry and hendo. Its both to me.
- Aug 18, 2018
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I honestly think that a Blitz/Stanley combo is fine you just need a kpd. So it's the same problem. The kpd problem
standupand
Premiership Player
Fair call. He's a good crumber and an excellent finisher on his left side. Can still learn a lot imo from someone like Hawkins in terms of influencing contests and bringing teammates into the game. Tom is streets ahead in that department in my view.
A Blicavs/Stanley combo is pretty dire. In the finals, they have shown us time and time again they are not the answer.
It is insanity to think otherwise.
- Sep 15, 2005
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This is a hard one; you argue your point well but I'm not sure I completely agree - I think Ratugolea is still exploring his ceiling so to speak; he's already plucked more than a few marks that I wouldn't have thought your average tall AFL player could pluck - he is capable of pulling off the unorthodox, when seemingly out of position - or at least not in a recognisably good position.
I agree that he has screwed it up to date. Impeded team mates, made a mess of things. Plenty of times.
But if/when he starts getting it right with anything approaching consistency then he could be a real headache and a handful. Will he ever repay the investment in his talent? Are we investing enough in his talent? It's a hard balance to strike; we could easily have got it wrong with Tom Hawkins.
I've cooled on him considerably in many ways, but I'd love for him to find that key to consistency because when he's on - which is rare, for sure - he is extremely entertaining and very difficult to curtail.
I thought last year he improved his set shot kicking. Yes he got it wrong from time to time, sometimes badly - but my read was that he was generally more consistent in his ball-drop. That kind of improvement in his craft might be reason to be optimistic that he can improve other facets of his game.
Big year for Sav, no doubt.
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- Sep 15, 2005
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To me he's Buddy Franklin-like in that he is a crafty forward flanker in a KF's body.
Both can be marking targets, but both are probably at their best being utterly opportunistic.
I won't say that ''I'm not a massive fan of Cameron'' - I liked him a lot while he was at the Giants, and I was extremely impressed with his pure skill last year. But like Franklin, he isn't the kind of forward you can structure your forward line around.
I look back only a couple of years to the coup Richmond pulled off in luring a prime-years Tom Lynch to their club for the 2019 season; to me he (Lynch) is more of a player I would be offering the big bucks/long contract to than Cameron. You could keep pumping F50 entries at Lynch and he would split the contest over and again, for years to come. Averages 2.0 contested marks per game over his career compared to Cameron's 1.0 - it doesn't sound a lot but that is the difference in the type of player you can build your forward line around with the type of player who will explode for the multiple goals every few games.
Can't say Cameron is dull to watch at any rate; razor sharp goal sense, haven't really seen it since Menzel, Johnson, Chappy ... left-footed too of course
Cameron contests when he needs to, its called being a smart footballer, something a guy like Ratugolea needs to learn severely.
He is never the target forward. I can remember only a few instances where he has been one out close to goal. He always has to find the ball in a crowd.
One time I do remember he destroyed Barass.
He is Hawkins replacement not his sidekick. Cameron was recruited for that purpose.
- Aug 18, 2018
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I think they got on top enough times that they were easily the best option available to us going forward amd they got the job done enough times. They got us to a grand final and were not the reason we lost it. The only clearly better options would be to go get one of the two or three actually elite rucks out there which isn't going to happen
- Aug 18, 2018
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Which is why, despite me liking a lot of his his work, he absolutely has to go spend some time in the vfl this year as the number 1 target.
People forget good footballers take a couple of years to get back from a broken leg, Sav is new to the game so at 23 i still think his best is infront of him and as a low cost player he is good to keep as a back up anyway
cats_09
Otters United
- Jun 21, 2011
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Genuine question, but what stage is Ratugolea no longer "new to the game"?
He started playing football in 2011, which is 10 years ago, was drafted in 2016 which is 5 years on the list meaning he's coming into his 6th season - surely the "new to the game" is long gone, especially when you're coming into your 6th season with a professional team
I am saying new to this game because Ruckman and Centre half forward are the hardest places to play footy, Ruckman take years to come on they could be a ruckman from u11s but don't come good until 25+..and CHF you need to learn a lot of tricks to be good and they don't grow on tree's
cats_09
Otters United
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Should he then maybe be given an extended run in the VFL to work on his game and focus on developing in a role?
He's really only played the odd VFL match over recent seasons, then comes into the seniors and is playing a hybrid role that's different to what he plays in the VFL
- if we want him long term as a key forward, should he spend time actually playing that role at VFL level, learning that role and the nuances of being a forward
- same for ruck, though probably a bit harder now we have some genuine young rucks to develop
In the seniors he plays between the forward line & ruck, without really looking fully at home in either role - does he need time to focus his development in what's seen as his best long term position
Max Gawn was atrocious up until 2015 - so when he was about 24/25. Always takes the big boys longer. Not sure Sav will make it given his deficiencies - but I'd be giving him another couple of years to see if he will before giving up on him
Yep as i said he is a low cost footballer so keep him as a back up anyway, and as cats_09 said make him play well and learn in the VFL
Rel to this thread , 2022... we lack information. How are all our talls training and looking. For 2022.. we have Dek who looks like he is ready to come in but our young rucks are still years away but we have mature options. Henry has shown our vulnerability down back, id not like to lose Blitz to injury. I think we have started the transition down back, which Im very happy about but it makes our def talls a potential weak spot. Is there a potential KPD that might be available to be added mid year.
Long term, to me we have added good likely types in both areas, perhaps more rucks types recently that KPD... but as you say its been a long time coming. KPD has not been an issue because we have topped up for so long but we probably lack an alternative to Dek if he falls short. Something that we will need to address if none of the talls we have show potential down back.
standupand
Premiership Player
I still have his hit on Harris Andrews in mind when I think of how he contests in the air.
- May 18, 2016
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Only 1 training the house down mention so far. Feel we should be due for at least another 2-3 over the next few weeks.
SOP for the GFC unfortunately. Always makes me question who is in charge of development.
I agree that maybe a little time in a specific role that he would be expected to play in the ones would help him focus on what his game is supposed to be.
- Dec 11, 2009
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Only 1??
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