2022 tall forward line

[TimmyD11]

Am I the only one thats kind of over Dixon? He’s perpetually underwhelming and proven himself not to be good enough when it counts. I’m very keen to see us without him and not having to rely on him. Frankly if Hayes proves to be good enough to get a dozen games I think it should be for any one of our other talls including Dixon. Part of the issue of the 4 talls last season was even though Ladhams has very good mobility for a ruck, playing him and Dixon next to each other is two ruck sized FFs so trying to play Hayes next to Dixon wouldn’t be any better if not worse. I can 100% see Hayes playing from the goal square with Georgiades, Marshall and Finlayson playing off him while Hayes gets a couple of seasons under his belt before he takes over from Lycett. I would absolutely love if all those guys proved to be good enough to squeeze out Dixon sooner rather than later!!!

 

[PowerLil]

Am I the only one thats kind of over Dixon? He’s perpetually underwhelming and proven himself not to be good enough when it counts. I’m very keen to see us without him and not having to rely on him. Frankly if Hayes proves to be good enough to get a dozen games I think it should be for any one of our other talls including Dixon. Part of the issue of the 4 talls last season was even though Ladhams has very good mobility for a ruck, playing him and Dixon next to each other is two ruck sized FFs so trying to play Hayes next to Dixon wouldn’t be any better if not worse. I can 100% see Hayes playing from the goal square with Georgiades, Marshall and Finlayson playing off him while Hayes gets a couple of seasons under his belt before he takes over from Lycett. I would absolutely love if all those guys proved to be good enough to squeeze out Dixon sooner rather than later!!!

No. You're not the only one.

 

[JimmyBC]

It's taking the kick it to Dixon 5 on 1 out of play everyone should want a look at forward line without him at some point, I expect Ken to play him until he's a 35 year old husk however.

 

[philthy05]

I think Dixon is a very good player who has been a workhorse for us but he works harder not smarter. Everything for him is 10x harder than it should be. Watching hawkins or Riewoldt down the other end get the same results with 15% of the effort is so deflating.

we also as a team are too Dixon focused and play stupid and predictable football.

We got a brief look at a Georgiades and Marshall forward line at a couple of stages when we moved Dixon out of the 50 and I saw us experiment with those 2 for a short time. We looked more organised and had more space inside 50 (players were less drawn to one spot I guess?). I don’t remember what the games were but it was early on in the season if I recall correctly.

i would still want a big strong target to pair with those two in the future post Charlie tho.

 

[TeeKray]

Dixon requires a lot of opposition planning and attention before and during a game, don't underestimate that aspect of what he brings to the team. Opposition defences are almost completely set up around stopping him. It's up to the rest of our forwards to capitalise on that.

 

[JimmyBC]

More like they put all the work into Dixon & know our dumbass players will continue to bomb to the outnumber instead of using it to our advantage, it's not just our other forwards fault they are constantly ignored by players upfield.

 

[Andre]

More like they put all the work into Dixon & know our dumbass players will continue to bomb to the outnumber instead of using it to our advantage, it's not just our other forwards fault they are constantly ignored by players upfield.

Yeah, opposition coaches know stop Dixon and you're 80% of the way to stopping our forward line. If we targeted our other forwards as much as we did Dixon, then he wouldn't get as much attention. Then we do use him he'd have more impact. Dixon is far from perfect, but Bassett and Hinkley use him so poorly.

 

[El_Scorcho]

Dixon's situation is a bit like with Westhoff where there is an incredible player in there, but the way we use him generally doesn't get the best out of him or our forward line.

Lumping the ball on his head 30 times a game is absolutely coached, it's absolutely our gameplan and the logic to it is sound. Intercept marks are so vital to the modern game, and Dixon never gets outmarked. So we know we're going to have a loose ball in the forward line 80% of the time if we can go long to him. The problem is that good teams have elite rebounding defenders who thrive off of this and kill us in getting those loose balls and rebounding. Caleb Daniel

35

Caleb Daniel

Age

28

Ht

171cm

Wt

72kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.3

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

9.8

5star

M

3.5

4star

T

2.9

4star

CL

1.4

4star

D

19.5

4star

K

11.1

4star

HB

8.4

4star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.0

3star

CL

1.0

3star

D

16.4

4star

K

7.2

3star

HB

9.2

5star

M

3.4

4star

T

2.6

4star

CL

0.2

2star

is exactly the sort of player who thrives off of those loose balls.

So IMO we need to adjust a bit more and pull back on lumping it on Dixon's head. It's still a perfectly good get out of trouble option, but that's all it should be.

I think Dixon is the only key forward who is a lock to start round 1. All the others could be in or out based on form or balance. We just need to go to a more balanced style of forward entry. We've got the talent up there to be very effective doing that.

 

[Granny Duurs is Lovely]

Dixon's situation is a bit like with Westhoff where there is an incredible player in there, but the way we use him generally doesn't get the best out of him or our forward line.

Lumping the ball on his head 30 times a game is absolutely coached, it's absolutely our gameplan and the logic to it is sound. Intercept marks are so vital to the modern game, and Dixon never gets outmarked. So we know we're going to have a loose ball in the forward line 80% of the time if we can go long to him. The problem is that good teams have elite rebounding defenders who thrive off of this and kill us in getting those loose balls and rebounding. Caleb Daniel is exactly the sort of player who thrives off of those loose balls.

So IMO we need to adjust a bit more and pull back on lumping it on Dixon's head. It's still a perfectly good get out of trouble option, but that's all it should be.

I think Dixon is the only key forward who is a lock to start round 1. All the others could be in or out based on form or balance. We just need to go to a more balanced style of forward entry. We've got the talent up there to be very effective doing that.

Absolutely this. We were (slightly) better matched to take on the Demons last season that the Bulldogs for exactly this reason. Either team had the capacity to beat us out of the middle but the Dees get a large amount of rebound from their talls intercepting (Lever and May) whereas the Doggies get their rebound from smalls gathering loose contested ball (Daniel and Dale). We needed to outmark the bulldogs in the air to be able to overcome that strength of theirs - this was largely overlooked in the build up to the Prelim because our smalls had decimated the Cats despite it being an area the Bulldogs were much stronger in. If Georgiades had been available I believe he would have been picked for exactly this reason.

What this all points to is we need to be able to play to our talls AND we need to be able to play to our smalls. 80% kicks to Dixon to bring the ball to ground if we want to use the smalls. Split the talls and take the best option / player with the undersized defender to play to our talls.

If we're picking players for that Dixon is the first picked. His ground game is incredible for someone his height and strength. Hayes and Georgiades have the worst ground games so they're the least flexible between the two modes of play. To me that says we play Dixon, Finlayson and Marshall as our preferred 3 talls as they can each be flexible between the two modes of play. Would prefer we did this and had a defensive mindset at second tier ruck contests (rove the opposition taps) than play 2 rucks and have a poor ground game in the forward 50.

 

[JimmyBC]

It's not all coaching I doubt they tell him to demand the ball when he props stops and wrestles providing an awful stationary outnumbered target.

 

[Schulzenfest]

It's not all coaching I doubt they tell him to demand the ball when he props stops and wrestles providing an awful stationary outnumbered target.

You say that, and yet it's been happening for 6 years. So at worst it's actively been coached into him and at best it hasn't been coached out of him, and either way Bassett is to blame.

 

[JimmyBC]

You say that, and yet it's been happening for 6 years. So at worst it's actively been coached into him and at best it hasn't been coached out of him, and either way Bassett is to blame.

I can't stand Bassett either but Charlie is not a smart player nor is he an instinctive on the move natural forward.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

I can't stand Bassett either but Charlie is not a smart player nor is he an instinctive on the move natural forward.

That's one of the reasons why I want Dixon at CHF and Georgiades can play deep closer to goal. We would have to change how we deliver the ball deep inside 50 with this set up, but let Dixon roam from the centre circle to about 10-15m past the forward 50m arc and he can terrorise the defenders and the smart flankers feed off him and his 1 armed/handed marking attempts.

That way he doesn't have to run so far to the left hand corner of the centre square when we kickin from points and target him.

 

[FightForYourRight]

I don't think Dixon is un-droppable anymore tbh

Would you consider him at Full Back? I would.

 

[El_Scorcho]

It's not all coaching I doubt they tell him to demand the ball when he props stops and wrestles providing an awful stationary outnumbered target.

I absolutely 100% think they tell him to do that. If he's stationary, the kick that the gameplan dictates needs to land on his head is more likely to do so.

I can't stand Bassett either but Charlie is not a smart player nor is he an instinctive on the move natural forward.

I don't think he's a genius, but I think he was far more of a natural key forward at the Gold Coast. We've tried something fancy with him and it works some of the time, but not others as Granny Duurs is Lovely put very eloquently. It works until we face an elite small backline.

 

[robbo1981]

Dixon just needs to try to mark first bring it to ground second simple.
Just putting up 1 hand when he can go with 2 is ridiculous granted alot of the time he has someone hanging off 1 arm if not 2.

 

[PJ Power]

Dixon needs to create separation from his opponent and find space. The need to wrestle all the time is the product of either laziness or poor forward craft

 

[El_Scorcho]

Dixon needs to create separation from his opponent and find space. The need to wrestle all the time is the product of either laziness or poor forward craft

It's neither of those things, it's gameplan. He's doing what he's told. Suck defenders into the contest and don't get outmarked

 

[Joshykins]

It's neither of those things, it's gameplan. He's doing what he's told. Suck defenders into the contest and don't get outmarked

C'mon he's only been doing it for three years now...
Not sure why people mock the one handed tactic when it's clearly an instruction to him

 

[philthy05]

I’ve got no doubt Dixon is playing entirely to the instructions of the coaching staff

but I also think he plays fairly dumb football and makes dumb decisions which play into his opponents hands and means Dixon has to work really hard to get results.

he’s still been super important to us tho obviously

 

[JimmyBC]

I feel like excuses will be made for Dixon until he's 35 ooh he's so big and scary with his beard ooh ahh.

 

[Joshykins]

I’ve got no doubt Dixon is playing entirely to the instructions of the coaching staff

but I also think he plays fairly dumb football and makes dumb decisions which play into his opponents hands and means Dixon has to work really hard to get results.

he’s still been super important to us tho obviously

I feel like excuses will be made for Dixon until he's 35 ooh he's so big and scary with his beard ooh ahh.

As long as he's quick in a straight line and happy to use his size, he'll be useful. Don't forget how handy his ball use can be up the ground (where he clearly ought to be playing)

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

The new quadrangle of doom will get a few games in 2022.

 

[Frank Hansen II]

I can't stand Bassett either but Charlie is not a smart player nor is he an instinctive on the move natural forward.

He also misses far too many gettable shots which is just as deflating.

 

[Duckimus Prime]

Man you’ve carried a grudge against me for a while.

Coming from the guy whose argument on here is "Nah uh, you're wrong coz I said so".