Analysis 2023 All Australian Team Awards Night

[Golden_6]

English has had a very consistent year with only 3-4 poor performances out of 21 games. Coaches votes are irrelevant because he rarely has standout games but is consistently in our best 4-5 players each week.

 

[GWT6]

English has had a very consistent year with only 3-4 poor performances out of 21 games. Coaches votes are irrelevant because he rarely has standout games but is consistently in our best 4-5 players each week.

Best 4-5 players would normally get coaches votes - especially in a winning side. Looks like you are overestimating his performance.

 

[Roby]

It's possible Libba isn't going to make it after Brad Johnson

Brad Johnson

Age

48

Ht

182cm

Wt

87kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.7

5star

K

14.1

5star

HB

5.6

4star

M

5.9

5star

T

1.6

4star

G

1.5

5star

No current season stats available

D

12.8

4star

K

10.2

4star

HB

2.6

3star

M

2.2

3star

T

1.2

3star

G

0.6

3star

left him out of his team yesterday.

 

[Golden_6]

Best 4-5 players would normally get coaches votes - especially in a winning side. Looks like you are overestimating his performance.

I just said that he doesn't often have outstanding/BOG type games so the raw numbers aren't going to be. He's polled coaches votes in 8 games and on the Dogs board has received top 5 voting in 12 games. The case for English isn't his absolute best footy, it's the fact he's turned up and performed every single week for the entire season at a high level, bar 3 or 4 weeks.

Jackson didn't receive a single coaches vote until round 9 and Gawn had 18 in the first 17 weeks. Recency bias is very much a thing.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

It's possible Libba isn't going to make it after Brad Johnson left him out of his team yesterday.

Wouldn't be a complete howler there are a LOT of mids there's always 10 unlucky ones. Having 2mids in a side that is 8th or whatever seems a bit weird although Carlton did.

 

[Blackhawk42]

It's possible Libba isn't going to make it after Brad Johnson left him out of his team yesterday.

Lachie Neale has to be hanging on by a thread. Again, the issue of consistency over a full season raises it head.

 

[theasian]

Libba has a good chance because the Inside Bulls who normally would be selected like Oliver (injury) Neale (less impact) are probably out of contention.

They would select at least one inside bull and his competition mostly seems like Serong .

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Lachie Neale has to be hanging on by a thread. Again, the issue of consistency over a full season raises it head.

Would surely only be on the bench anyway, probably depends where the Lions finish. They finish top 2 Neale makes it

 

[theasian]

It's possible Libba isn't going to make it after Brad Johnson left him out of his team yesterday.

He's not on the Selction panel though.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

He's not on the Selction panel though.

If a Dogs supporter isn't putting him in though...

 

[theasian]

If a Dogs supporter isn't putting him in though...

He's certainly had a better season than Neale.

 

[adammania9]

Libba has been wonderful, but Bont, Petracca, Rozee, Butters, Dawson and Merrett have all been better. Then there’s still Neale, Taranto, Serong and Anderson to compete with

 

[Guardian Hawk]

I must say I find it annoying how many refer to where a team finishes in the AA thread.

This is not the NBA. No 1 player is the difference between a team being up the top or down the bottom.

AA should not be a measure of who has the best teammates. It's an individual award and individual performance should be all that matters.

 

[gandaal]

I must say I find it annoying how many refer to where a team finishes in the AA thread.

This is not the NBA. No 1 player is the difference between a team being up the top or down the bottom.

AA should not be a measure of who has the best teammates. It's an individual award and individual performance should be all that matters.

Doubt you were so annoyed when Hawks were winning flags and dominated the AA team.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Doubt you were so annoyed when Hawks were winning flags and dominated the AA team.

Show us where hawks ever dominated the AA?
I think one year we had 3 selections, moat years we had players miss out when they deserved a spot.
Pretty sure Josh Gibson never made a side despite being arguably the best half back for about 6 seasons

 

[Guardian Hawk]

Doubt you were so annoyed when Hawks were winning flags and dominated the AA team.

It's long been a bug bear of mine. It's not necessarily how many are selected in the team. It's the arguments like - "but X finished in whatever position, so he can't make the AA team". That's a silly argument - no single player is responsible for where the team finishes. Or even "if X win the last 2 games and finish in 4th, XX should be selected" What kind of argument is that? It doesn't matter how the individual has played - aslong as the team makes top 4, they should be selected? For what it's worth, your team is a good example of this. The last few years, people have argued that Carlton shouldn't have as many selections as they've had cos the team can't even make finals. It's a dumb argument. Cripps, Curnow, McKay the year before, etc were not the reason Carlton weren't making finals (they were winning the Brownlow and Coleman x 2 FFS). Their individual seasons were absolutely worthy and it was a combination of other factors that saw the team miss out (other playes and their bottom 6 most notably). Cripps isn't more worthy this year just because the team is doing better.

Also, FWIW, Hawthorn never 'dominated' the AA team. We were the benchmark for about 4 years, winning a threepeat but never had more than 3 selections in the AA side across that span.

 

[Guardian Hawk]

Show us where hawks ever dominated the AA?
I think one year we had 3 selections, moat years we had players miss out when they deserved a spot.
Pretty sure Josh Gibson never made a side despite being arguably the best half back for about 6 seasons

Gibson was finally selected in the last of our threepeat years, after his 2nd best and fairest in a premiership side.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Gibson was finally selected in the last of our threepeat years, after his 2nd best and fairest in a premiership side.

Ah. So 1 aa for years of dominance?

 

[HarryBeef]

Ah. So 1 aa for years of dominance?

Don't think he played enough games in 14, 13 he made the squad but not the team. What other years was he dominant/you reckon he should have made it?

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Don't think he played enough games in 14, 13 he made the squad but not the team. What other years was he dominant/you reckon he should have made it?

11-16 he was by far the best half back in the league.
Maybe longevity each season was an issue, but then at the same time Cyril got selected after like 15 games, so who knows

 

[PhatBoy]

That’s exactly what they are awarded for

Not sure about that. I’m not on either side of the argument but a coach may see one player’s performance in a game as being meritorious purely based on an enormous amount of effort as much as impact.

 

[Guardian Hawk]

Don't think he played enough games in 14, 13 he made the squad but not the team. What other years was he dominant/you reckon he should have made it?

This isn't my argument (and I don't really care)...

But when he was the comfortable best and fairest winner in the premiership side in 2013, he probably should have made it. Michael Johnson made it ahead of him but did not have the better season (and did not finish top 2 in the B&F for Freo). Gibson received nearly double the coaches votes (41-22) and was generally better in most areas.

In 2011, Gibson absolutely obliterated the season record for spoils (a record that still stands today). I can't even find what the next most to that point was anymore as it the next best ever was over 30% less that the new benchmark he set. Compare his data to say Ben Reid (who made AA) and you can see he was pretty unlucky, also for the fact they chose 2 full backs that year (as well as Reid), instead of the 'Gibson role' (i.e. Stewart, etc) as they do now.

In 2016, Gibson had another 188 spoils but also averaged more of the ball than any other tall defender (20+ per game). He was unlucky to miss out to Dane Rampe (amongst others) after trumping him in basically every key metric.

 

[HarryBeef]

11-16 he was by far the best half back in the league.
Maybe longevity each season was an issue, but then at the same time Cyril got selected after like 15 games, so who knows

Yeah he was a gun, not sure if he was by far the best over a 5 year stretch. But definitely deserved a few more you would have thought.

 

[Mr Meow]

It really does feel like this thread's main purpose is to talk about which Hawks have been/will be snubbed for AA selection over the years.

 

[Guardian Hawk]

It really does feel like this thread's main purpose is to talk about which Hawks have been/will be snubbed for AA selection over the years.

But what about in 1961 - Edwards was completely robbed