List Mgmt. 2023 GWS Giants List Management - Academy, Free Agent, Trade, Draft

[Giant Strides]

Trade Period, October 6–18

• Restricted & Unrestricted Free Agency Period: Friday, October 6, 9am – Friday October 13, 5pm (bid matching ends Monday October 16, 5pm)
• Trade Period (1), picks & players: Monday, October 9, 9am – Wednesday October 18, 7.30pm

Quiet Period, October 19–November 20

• Trade Period (2), picks only: Monday, October 23, 9am – Friday November 10, 5pm
• List Lodgement 1*: Tuesday, October 31, 2pm
• Delisted Free Agency Period (1): Wednesday, November 1, 9am – Wednesday November 8, 5pm
• Delisted Free Agency Period (2): Friday, November 10, 9am–5pm
• List Lodgement 2*: Tuesday, November 14, 2pm

Here's the list of GWS players who are out of contract in 2023 (I'll progressively cross them out as they re-sign):

• Lachie ASH
• Callan WARD (Free Agent)
• Brayden PREUSS
• Tom GREEN
• Finn CALLAGHAN
• Lachlan KEEFFE (Free Agent)
• Jake RICCARDI
• Harry HIMMELBERG (Free Agent)
• Cam FLEETON - delisted (25/9/23)
• Matt FLYNN (Free Agent) - signed by West Coast as an Unrestricted Free Agent
• Xavier O'HALLORAN
• Jack BUCKLEY
• Callum BROWN

Rookie lists:

• Phil DAVIS (Free Agent) - retiring at end of 2023 season
• Jacob WEHR (Free agent)
• Dan LLOYD (Free Agent) - retiring at end of 2023 season
• Cooper HAMILTON
• Wade DERKSEN
• Nick MADDEN (Cat B) - assumed re-signed due to 2 sources of info
• Jason GILBEE (Cat B) - delisted (25/9/23)

Current list sizes (for when we get to list/draft/trade speculation):

• main list = 36 minus 3 (Fleeton, Flynn + Kennedy delisted with a view to be re-selected in the rookie draft)
• rookie A = 6 minus 2 (Davis, Lloyd)
• rookie B = 2 minus 1 (Gilbee)
• total = 44 minus 5

This is the future pick spreadsheet that comes into play only at trade time, as future picks are used in end of season (2023) trading:


Here's the 2023 AFL Academy Squad, so these (roughly) represent the best players for next year as they stand now:

2023 NAB AFL ACADEMY​

NAME	SURNAME	STATE	STATE LEAGUE CLUB	COMMUNITY CLUB
Lachlan	Cabor	NSW/ACT	Sydney Swans Academy	Shellharbour
Nate	Caddy	VIC M	Northern Knights	Yarrambat
Jack	Callinan	TAS	Tasmania Devils	Clarence
Caiden	Cleary	NSW/ACT	Sydney Swans Academy	Sydney University
Daniel	Curtin	WA	Claremont	West Coast
Jack	Delean	SA	South Adelaide	Reynella
Zane	Duursma	VIC C	Gippsland Power	Foster
Mitchell	Edwards	WA	Peel Thunder	South Mandurah
William	Green	VIC M	Northern Knights	Northcote
Riley	Hardeman	WA	Swan Districts	Caversham
William	Lorenz	VIC M	Oakleigh Chargers	Boroondara Hawks
Kane	McAuliffe	SA	North Adelaide	Central Augusta
Colby	McKercher	TAS	Tasmania Devils	Launceston
Ashton	Moir	SA	Glenelg	Plympton
Connor	O'Sullivan	NSW/ACT	Murray Bushrangers	Albury
William	Patton	SA	West Adelaide	Mitcham
Nathan	Philactides	VIC M	Oakleigh Chargers	Blackburn
Ethan	Read	QLD	Gold Coast Suns Academy	Palm Beach Currumbin
Archer	Reid	VIC C	Gippsland Power	Inverloch-Kongwak
Harley	Reid	VIC C	Bendigo Pioneers	Tongala
Archie	Roberts	VIC M	Sandringham Dragons	Hampton Rovers
Jake	Rogers	QLD	Gold Coast Suns Academy	Broadbeach
Ryley	Sanders	TAS	Sandringham Dragons	North Launceston
Cooper	Simpson	VIC C	Dandenong Stingrays	Mount Martha
George	Stevens	VIC C	GWV Rebels	South Warrnambool
Koltyn	Tholstrup	WA	Subiaco	Newtown-Condingup
Orlando	Turner	NT	West Adelaide	South Alice Springs
Jed	Walter	QLD	Gold Coast Suns Academy	Palm Beach Currumbin
Nick	Watson	VIC M	Eastern Ranges	East Ringwood
Darcy	Wilson	VIC C	Murray Bushrangers	Wangaratta Rovers

Happy speculating for 2023!

EDIT: 11/12/22 - Added Free Agent status to OOC player list
EDIT: 24/2/23 - Crossed out Tom Green

12

Tom Green

Age

23

Ht

192cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.5

3star

K

4.3

2star

HB

7.3

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.3

4star

CL

2.8

4star

D

11.5

3star

K

4.3

2star

HB

7.3

4star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.3

3star

CL

2.8

4star

D

11.5

3star

K

4.3

2star

HB

7.3

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.3

4star

CL

2.8

5star

from OOC player list! (Woo Hoo!!) & Added 2023 Coates Talent League Fixture Link
EDIT: 27/2/23 - Crossed out Finn Callaghan from OOC player list! (Woo Hoo Hoo!!!)
EDIT: 27/4/23 - Crossed out Jacob Wehr from OOC player list
EDIT: 10/5/23 - Crossed out Jack Buckley from OOC player list
EDIT: 9/7/23 - Crossed out Callum Brown from OOC player list
EDIT: 18/7/23 - Crossed out Lachie Ash from OOC player list
EDIT: 20/7/23 - Crossed out Xavier O'Halloran from OOC player list
EDIT: 3/8/23 - Crossed out Harry Himmelberg from OOC player list
EDIT: 9/8/23 - Crossed out Wade Derksen from OOC player list
EDIT: 17/8/23 - Noted Dan Lloyd retiring at end of season
EDIT: 19/8/23 - Crossed out Jake Riccardi from OOC player list
EDIT: 28/8/23 - Noted Phil Davis

1

Phil Davis

Age

34

Ht

197cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.0

3star

K

7.6

3star

HB

5.4

4star

M

5.2

5star

T

1.7

4star

MG

55.5

1star

D

8.5

2star

K

4.4

2star

HB

4.1

3star

M

3.4

3star

T

1.3

2star

MG

55.5

1star

D

14.0

4star

K

8.0

3star

HB

6.0

4star

M

5.8

5star

T

1.4

4star

retiring at end of season
EDIT: 25/9/23 - Noted Cam Fleeton & Jason Gilbee delisted
EDIT: 4/10/23 - Noted Flynn, Preuss & Keeffe situations
EDIT: 9/10/23 - Updated Flynn to WCE, removed Preuss from OOC player list
EDIT: 12/10/23 - Updated Madden with 2 sources of information
EDIT: 19/10/23 - Updated Keeffe & Hamilton re-signed
EDIT: 31/10/23 - adjusted main list numbers with Adam Kennedy

40

Adam Kennedy

Age

32

Ht

183cm

Wt

80kg

Pos.

D/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.9

4star

K

8.4

3star

HB

6.5

4star

M

4.4

4star

T

1.8

4star

MG

245.6

4star

D

1.0

1star

K

1.0

1star

HB

0.0

1star

M

0.0

1star

T

0.0

1star

MG

10.0

1star

D

18.6

5star

K

9.8

4star

HB

8.8

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

1.4

4star

delisting (with a view to be re-selected in rookie draft)

 

[Orange crush]

I don't think it's wierd, just pragmatic, in terms of the carnival ... but if you mean the team selection, then yes I agree. I'll leave PMB to provide any more comprehensive rationale.

I'd also note, that within Div 2 there were 6 teams, but only 3 games. So teams did not play every other team. For instance, GWS effectively finished 2nd (2-1 record, 153%) based on losing to Swans but defeating Tasmania & NT, and playing neither of the Queensland teams. On the other hand, Swans played both Lions (1st) and Gold Coast (3rd) academies, losing to both.

So, I've taken that AA team with a grain of salt. IIRC, the two "GWS Academy" named players are in the Murray zone, so that we can't match for either of them anyway!

Wow, pragmatic but the team itself seems kind of meaningless

 

[PMBangers]

Any of them project to be reasonably high picks? What sort of players are we looking at with both of them? PMBangers

Unfortunately we won't have access to either as they sit outside our Northern Academy zone, but Wilson is your classic modern half back who has the athleticism to effectively shut down opposition and the ball use to hurt on the rebound, not too dissimilar to a Jeremy Howe, and Corrigan is a brute midfielder that eats up contested footy like he's permanently famished

 

[Hendo_21]

Unfortunately we won't have access to either as they sit outside our Northern Academy zone, but Wilson is your classic modern half back who has the athleticism to effectively shut down opposition and the ball use to hurt on the rebound, not too dissimilar to a Jeremy Howe, and Corrigan is a brute midfielder that eats up contested footy like he's permanently famished

Well that sucks

 

[PMBangers]

I keep seeing Curtin touted as a half-back / tall defender, if we pick him up would we try to move him to midfield or wing? We just recently moved Fleeton on for what I'm assuming is an inability to slot him into our backline​

Curtin could realistically be played anywhere at the next level given his traits, his midfield craft is pretty good; stoppage impact, ground level game (for his size), acceleration, strength all handy, I do worry about his ball use under pressure though, floats his disposals a bit when he's got someone on him, but could have that ironed out with the development staff

 

[Teeso]

If we miss out on Elliot Himmelberg, every chance we get him even cheaper the following yr. But with Haynes' contract ending next yr, any chance we have the money to have a crack at Sam Darcy in 2024 given most of the Dog's attention will be on holding onto JUH. Massive contracts for Naughton/JUH can only mean good news for opposition teams trying to pry Darcy away. Given we bid on him in his draft yr, we obviously will be keeping an eye on him. Contracted until 2025 but he is the power forward/ruck hybrid we ideally need and would later takeover from Hogan. Great height and his strength will increase. Would complement Cadman/Riccardi/Gruz perfectly in my opinion.

Kicked 16 goals 15 behinds in 8 VFL games. Averaging 6 marks a game. Held goaless once against Carlton, but has otherwise had lots of scoring opportunities marred by some wayward kickicking. A bit injury prone, but another one where there would be big benefits if we can get his body right.

 

[Hendo_21]

If we miss out on Elliot Himmelberg, every chance we get him even cheaper the following yr. But with Haynes' contract ending next yr, any chance we have a crack at Sam Darcy in 2024 given most of the Dog's attention will be on holding onto JUH. Contracted until 2025 but he is the power forward/ruck hybrid we ideally need and would later takeover from Hogan. Great height and his strength will increase. Would complement Cadman/Riccardi/Gruz perfectly in my opinion.

Kicked 16 goals 15 behinds in 8 VFL games. Averaging 6 marks a game. Held goaless once against Carlton, but has otherwise had lots of scoring opportunities. A bit injury prone, but another one where there would be big benefits if we can get his body right.

If by any chance Darcy or JUH wanted to come here would be moving heaven and earth to get them

 

[Teeso]

If by any chance Darcy or JUH wanted to come here would be moving heaven and earth to get them

Neither would of their own accord nominate us. We need to do the ground work, approach them and be keen. We have to be active to attract players to us at this stage. Only way we maintain a constant flow of elite young and middle aged talent.

Personally, JUH would demand more money and more attention from other clubs as it currently stands. He also has hype factor given his mobility and comparisons to Buddy.

Darcy to me would have less attention, slightly less trade currency required, a lesser proposed salary and would fit our needs better. For me, I think we need to have faith Cadman is that mobile tall forward for us. Gotta believe we traded up to pick 1 for him thinking he had these traits. Effort is there at the moment and he will only get better once his strength and positioning improve. But what I think we need is a contested marking beast up forward in a life post Hogan (since who knows when the soft tissue injuries will creep up on him again). That player holds down the best defender and allow Cadman/Ricca to run and jump. Add to that he is a genuine ruck height, he can also throw his weight around to help Briggsy. Whenever Briggs goes off/injured, we get dominated in the ruck battle. Wouldn't have the issues from back in the past where we used Patton/HH/Keefe in the ruck with minimal ruck craft.

 

[Hendo_21]

Neither would of their own accord nominate us. We need to do the ground work, approach them and be keen. We have to be active to attract players to us at this stage. Only way we maintain a constant flow of elite young and middle aged talent.

Personally, JUH would demand more money and more attention from other clubs as it currently stands. He also has hype factor given his mobility and comparisons to Buddy.

Darcy to me would have less attention, slightly less trade currency required, a lesser proposed salary and would fit our needs better. For me, I think we need to have faith Cadman is that mobile tall forward for us. Gotta believe we traded up to pick 1 for him thinking he had these traits. Effort is there at the moment and he will only get better once his strength and positioning improve. But what I think we need is a contested marking beast up forward in a life post Hogan (since who knows when the soft tissue injuries will creep up on him again). That player holds down the best defender and allow Cadman/Ricca to run and jump. Add to that he is a genuine ruck height, he can also throw his weight around to help Briggsy. Whenever Briggs goes off/injured, we get dominated in the ruck battle. Wouldn't have the issues from back in the past where we used Patton/HH/Keefe in the ruck with minimal ruck craft.

Cadman was the number 1 pick, if he's not taking the number 1 defender every week then I'm worried something has gone wrong in his development because that should be our expectation.

 

[dlanod]

Definitely on board with these, though I think we'd be lucky to even get a meeting with their management!

 

[dlanod]

Cadman was the number 1 pick, if he's not taking the number 1 defender every week then I'm worried something has gone wrong in his development because that should be our expectation.

...in a few years.

But the concept of the #1 defender on the #1 forward is pretty much out of the window anyway. The best defender usually has intercept chops, so play on the second or third forward to be able to zone off. What you really want is a mobile first option to get on leads and open up space to avoid intercepts, and a second option strong enough to grapple and hold a defender accountable - bonus if they have other strings to their bow. Look at Cameron and Hawkins for example, or us with Greene and Hogan (non-traditional).

 

[captainMyCaptain]

 

[Giant Strides]

The issue with Harry Grant is his height - 171 cms. Talent is certainly there.

Same issue for this year with Harvey Thomas, and he's taller (175 cms).

 

[Danny88]

We haven’t really spoken about some of the mature age players in The draft

I’ve been open in saying I am disappointed we aren’t going harder to bring in talent this trade period. Mainly because the top teams will (Sydney have nailed this trade period) and we seem to be relying on organic growth

But mature age performers in the VFL wafl and safl could all have a more immediate impact than a draftee who will need three years and by then our core will be too old

Any interest form the board on chasing a managh or someone similar?

 

[Hendo_21]

We haven’t really spoken about some of the mature age players in The draft

I’ve been open in saying I am disappointed we aren’t going harder to bring in talent this trade period. Mainly because the top teams will (Sydney have nailed this trade period) and we seem to be relying on organic growth

But mature age performers in the VFL wafl and safl could all have a more immediate impact than a draftee who will need three years and by then our core will be too old

Any interest form the board on chasing a managh or someone similar?

Yeah sure why not, but ultimately it's hard to see even him having much of an impact outside of being fringe 22. It seems like the club is banking on internal development to be what takes them to the next level next year and there's probably a fair argument to be made that if they start the season like they finished it they'll sit around top 4 but also think our depth is going to be tested a lot more this year because we definitely aren't going to have as little injuries, tougher schedule than last year now that we're not in the bottom 4. Age wise we're not really in a position where older guys are going to start to decline, Ward is probably the only guy that gets a regular game that could drop out of the 22 by the end of the season, although another year on Haynes' ticker could mean he gets closer but I still have enough faith in what we saw from him in the first half of the year that he can still be good.

 

[eaglevision]

Hello friends. Cracking season, well done and very unlucky not to have played in GF. Just wondering if your club has plans for pick 6? Would pick 6 and a swap of our F1 be of any appeal or are you looking for something else? On this year’s ladder that’s 6 and 15 for pick 1. Cheers fellas.

 

[Giant Strides]

Just wondering if your club has plans for pick 6? Would pick 6 and a swap of our F1 be of any appeal or are you looking for something else? On this year’s ladder that’s 6 and 15 for pick 1. Cheers fellas.

I have no idea what the club might have up its sleeve, although the indications from Adrian Caruso are squarely that we'll take our picks to the ND.

In terms of swaps, even if WCE were thinking they'll move up the ladder a little, I really doubt that they would entertain such a trade (it doesn't seem enough, even if you figure on GWS dropping down a few spots too). From the Giants' perspective, it would have to depend on whether they rate the guys we might select at #6 (now #7 after McKay compo) & whether they're willing to overlook them for potential greater bounty in future. We would obviously hope that WCE get a second wooden spoon, and we win the comp, so it would be #6 & #18 for #1. That would be worth it - but very unlikely to occur!

So, I think it would be a "maybe" from us and probably a "no" from Eagles anyway.

WCE would probably want both of our picks this year plus next year's F1 for their F1, and that would be a "no" from me.

 

[Giant Strides]

We haven’t really spoken about some of the mature age players in The draft

Any interest form the board on chasing a managh or someone similar?

The only thing I'd comment is that we've only had moderate success with picking mature talent via the ND. Probably Matt de Boer the most successful - and he could have been PSD, rookie draft or even DFA. Otherwise we've picked Jacob Wehr, Tom Hutchesson, Zac Langdon, Tendai Mzungu. I've ignored Jake Riccardi as a 19-year old. So, I'm not sure we're able to pick good prospects TBH.

Personally, I don't have a problem with using our last pick (if we take 4 picks to the ND), or a pick in the rookie draft to get a mature player. Particularly a handy midfielder who might add some depth to us this year. Do I think the club will, though? Probably not so much.

 

[eaglevision]

I have no idea what the club might have up its sleeve, although the indications from Adrian Caruso are squarely that we'll take our picks to the ND.

In terms of swaps, even if WCE were thinking they'll move up the ladder a little, I really doubt that they would entertain such a trade (it doesn't seem enough, even if you figure on GWS dropping down a few spots too). From the Giants' perspective, it would have to depend on whether they rate the guys we might select at #6 (now #7 after McKay compo) & whether they're willing to overlook them for potential greater bounty in future. We would obviously hope that WCE get a second wooden spoon, and we win the comp, so it would be #6 & #18 for #1. That would be worth it - but very unlikely to occur!

So, I think it would be a "maybe" from us and probably a "no" from Eagles anyway.

WCE would probably want both of our picks this year plus next year's F1 for their F1, and that would be a "no" from me.

I’d say you’re right. We could include 37 but I assume it’s still a no from you guys:

GWS OUT: 7, 16, F1
GWS IN: 37, WCE F1

 

[Orange crush]

I’d say you’re right. We could include 37 but I assume it’s still a no from you guys:

GWS OUT: 7, 16, F1
GWS IN: 37, WCE F1

i'd take that for your first this year

 

[eaglevision]

i'd take that for your first this year

I’m sure most people would. I personally wouldn’t take 2 and 3 for Reid which is why a few of us are exploring ways of trading into the draft using other capital. Haynes sounds like he isn’t going anywhere either.

 

[Orange crush]

I’m sure most people would. I personally wouldn’t take 2 and 3 for Reid which is why a few of us are exploring ways of trading into the draft using other capital. Haynes sounds like he isn’t going anywhere either.

You are one of the first people to understand 7 isn’t going as a salary dump

 

[eaglevision]

You are one of the first people to understand 7 isn’t going as a salary dump

Tell that to the North board…

 

[Giant Strides]

Tell that to the North board…

Small group of posters on that board get it. On the Hawks board there's only 1 poster who does (ironically his handle is "naysayer"). Now the Adelaide board has become infected. Too many posters with greedy tendencies and little common dog.

 

[Giant Pete]

As I’ve said previously, I’d be happy to trade pick 15 into next years draft. By the time they come on Cogs and Toby will be near the end you would think.

 

[Danny88]

Yeah sure why not, but ultimately it's hard to see even him having much of an impact outside of being fringe 22. It seems like the club is banking on internal development to be what takes them to the next level next year and there's probably a fair argument to be made that if they start the season like they finished it they'll sit around top 4 but also think our depth is going to be tested a lot more this year because we definitely aren't going to have as little injuries, tougher schedule than last year now that we're not in the bottom 4. Age wise we're not really in a position where older guys are going to start to decline, Ward is probably the only guy that gets a regular game that could drop out of the 22 by the end of the season, although another year on Haynes' ticker could mean he gets closer but I still have enough faith in what we saw from him in the first half of the year that he can still be good.

This is the crux of my concern

Both gf teams u traded hard to get players in this year. If you aren’t growing you are standing still. Look at Callahan for example. We are hoping next year he really takes the comp apart, but it took 3 years for that to be a hope rather than a reality

In three years Toby will be 33…. Cogs Kelly Whitfield are all in that same age group

The time is now