News 2023 St Kilda Media Thread

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Close to full potential, anyway.
Thought that was a very interesting comment.
They know what has to be done list-wise.


I think he's softening the fans up for changes. We look like we are performing well for what's available but nowhere near full capacity. I think the side looked better under Ratts at times. We haven't really stamped ourselves at any point.
 
I think he's softening the fans up for changes. We look like we are performing well for what's available but nowhere near full capacity. I think the side looked better under Ratts at times. We haven't really stamped ourselves at any point.
He's also trying to manage our expectations for this year I think. A bit different to Ratten's 'Why not us?' mantra every year.
 

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I think he's softening the fans up for changes. We look like we are performing well for what's available but nowhere near full capacity. I think the side looked better under Ratts at times. We haven't really stamped ourselves at any point.
Wasn’t like him to actually put it out there - usually gives nothing. I guess they’ve seen enough to know what this list is capable of now and that they feel we’re pretty much at the max.


Interesting comment, based on the sometimes heated debate on here around Mitch, where he said that pre-season he wasn’t clunking the marks but the huge amount of work he’s done ( one of the top 5) has really paid off.

Also sounds like he is eyeing him off as a midfielder eventually, just needed him forward due to Max and Membrey being unavailable.
 
Wasn’t like him to actually put it out there - usually gives nothing. I guess they’ve seen enough to know what this list is capable of now and that they feel we’re pretty much at it max.


Interesting comment, based on the sometimes heated debate on here around Mitch, where he said that pre-season he wasn’t clunking the marks but the huge amount of work he’s done ( one of the top 5) has really paid off.

Also sounds like he is eyeing him off as a midfielder eventually, just needed him forward due to Max and Membrey being unavailable.
I think he's a bit more guarded in the official club pressers.

Sounds like we have a couple of really hard workers in Mitchito and Windhager who will drive the club's culture in the next decade. King, Mattaes and Nasiah seem like good trainers as well.
 
I think he's softening the fans up for changes. We look like we are performing well for what's available but nowhere near full capacity. I think the side looked better under Ratts at times. We haven't really stamped ourselves at any point.

Perhaps sometimes people can read too much into peoples media comments? I agree he might be softening the listeners to some list changes, but I very much doubt Lyon is satisfied with where we are at, thats not in his DNA. We still have a number of very good players to return to put more pressure on places, that will create more growth in itself.

The structure and games we played at the start of the year had far more potential to take us forward than anything we showed under Ratten. We basically controlled enitre games that never happened under Ratten.
 
Wasn’t like him to actually put it out there - usually gives nothing. I guess they’ve seen enough to know what this list is capable of now and that they feel we’re pretty much at the max.


Interesting comment, based on the sometimes heated debate on here around Mitch, where he said that pre-season he wasn’t clunking the marks but the huge amount of work he’s done ( one of the top 5) has really paid off.

Also sounds like he is eyeing him off as a midfielder eventually, just needed him forward due to Max and Membrey being unavailable.

Maybe a bit of a sting to make the players fight harder for their spots too?
 
Perhaps sometimes people can read too much into peoples media comments? I agree he might be softening the listeners to some list changes, but I very much doubt Lyon is satisfied with where we are at, thats not in his DNA. We still have a number of very good players to return to put more pressure on places, that will create more growth in itself.

The structure and games we played at the start of the year had far more potential to take us forward than anything we showed under Ratten. We basically controlled enitre games that never happened under Ratten.


Structure is much better and we never look out of games under Lyon...well except Adelaide, but we have lopped the peaks down too. I think we are seeing a lot of older players playing a team game to bring the kids into games too which loses some of their impact. It's an investment over instant gratification that good sides do.

I'd say some players have dropped off this year. Ross, Gresham, Steele (injured), Membrey, Windhager and Paton. Heaps of kids have stepped up though but there are a another bunch of injured guys like Dmac and Billings that haven't been able to play as well.

I think we have gears to go up from here and would be disappointed if he thinks that's peak performance.
 



Please and thank you.


I've put it in a quote because it's fairly long.

It takes a team to win premierships and create dynasties in the AFL.
However, having a few megastars in their prime can certainly help your cause.

Adelaide and Gold Coast stand out to me as two teams who have significant depth of talent in their wings when it comes to players aged 23 and under.

But when judging only the top-three players at each club who fit in that age bracket, it is Port Adelaide which comes out on top.

Between Zak Butters, Connor Rozee and Jason Horne-Francis, the Power look to have locked in a damaging midfield with plenty of X-Factor for the better part of the next decade.

Butters’ performances have been off-the-charts this season and if he keeps up his form, he may well win this year’s Brownlow Medal.

He might already be, but Collingwood’s Nick Daicos is my tip to be the best player in the competition in five years’ time, closely followed by Butters and Sydney’s Chad Warner.

But there are some big key forwards that also excite me.

It is just a matter of time before St Kilda’s Max King wins a Coleman Medal, while Bulldog Aaron Naughton is capable of the same thing if he stays forward.

Melbourne’s Jacob van Rooyen could also be right up there in the Coleman Medal count in three or four years’ time if he continues on his current trajectory, after an eye-catching debut season this year.

Zak Butters might win this year’s Brownlow Medal. Picture: Getty Images

Zak Butters might win this year’s Brownlow Medal. Picture: Getty Images

There’s no excuses for the Suns in coming years given the talent they have coming through.

The likes of Noah Anderson and Matt Rowell need to drive high standards and take this Gold Coast side to a long-awaited finals berth, and hopefully some finals wins.

They might sit lowly on the ladder this season, but I see the most upside in North Melbourne and Hawthorn on the back of the young talent on their lists.

Tarryn Thomas, Harry Sheezel and George Wardlaw will excite Kangaroos fans for many years to come, while Will Day, Dylan Moore and Jai Newcombe headline a larger group of very talented young Hawks.

The future of the game from a talent perspective is in good shape.

Here are my best players aged 23 and under at every club.

*All players to have featured in at least one AFL game this season were considered for selection.

1. PORT ADELAIDE​

1. Zak Butters

2. Connor Rozee

3. Jason Horne-Francis

This group is a standout in my eyes. There’s possibly a Brownlow medallist this year in Butters, who has taken all before him in the midfield this season. Rozee has been a revelation with his dynamic speed and agility since being injected into the midfield last year and Horne-Francis has been a super recruit with his hardness and two-way running. Unlike some midfield groups, this trio are also dangerous around goals when they push forward.

2. FREMANTLE​

1. Andrew Brayshaw

2. Caleb Serong

3. Luke Jackson

This ranking might surprise a few, but I’m a big rap for these three Dockers. Brayshaw is a ball-winner with great two-way running ability, but also gets bonus points for the leadership he brings. Serong’s inside work has been exceptional for a 22-year-old and Jackson has elevated his game in recent weeks after a slow start at his new club.

3. SYDNEY​

1. Chad Warner

2. Errol Gulden

3. Nick Blakey

I love what Chad Warner stands for. The harder it is, the better he performs, and he showed that under duress in last year’s grand final. Gulden brings great class and has added some hardness with his maturing body, while Blakey is growing in stature down back and brings great run and dash to kickstart the Swans’ offence. His intercept ability is understated.

4. GOLD COAST​

1. Noah Anderson

2. Matt Rowell

3. Jack Lukosius

I wanted to include Ben King and Charlie Ballard, but five doesn’t go into three. Lukosius got the nod, especially on the back of what he has been able to do in King’s absence this year. He’s kicked five goals in three separate games this season and also has the versatility in his game to be moved to defence or even a wing. Anderson and Rowell complement each other so well and it’s been great see Rowell get back to his powerful best this season after overcoming some injury concerns.

5. COLLINGWOOD​

1. Nick Daicos

2. Isaac Quaynor

3. Nathan Murphy

If Daicos doesn’t win the Brownlow Medal this year, he will snag one soon enough. He’s the best ball user and decision maker in the competition at the moment. Defenders Quaynor and Murphy are often unheralded, but I rate them highly for what they bring to the team. Quaynor is super competitive and hard to beat one-on-one and Murphy is a reliable hybrid defender who can do a job on medium and small forwards.

6. WESTERN BULLDOGS​

1. Aaron Naughton

2. Bailey Smith

3. Jamarra Ugle-Hagan

Naughton hasn’t had his best year, but still provides a strong target in the air and is averaging 1.8 goals a game as a key forward. He also has the potential to be an All-Australian defender if the Bulldogs decide to make the switch. I’d like to see Luke Beveridge try it sooner rather than later. Smith is a competent midfielder who can also play forward, but needs to continue to work on his ball use to further elevate his game. Ugle-Hagan is growing before our eyes. The next challenge for him is to master his set-shot goalkicking.

7. CARLTON​

1. Sam Walsh

2. Adam Cerra

3. Tom De Koning

It will be far from ideal for the Blues if they lose one of their best young talents in De Koning to a trade at the end of the year. Walsh and Cerra are two important players to the team and consistently bring great effort. They just need to work on hitting more targets by foot when entering forward 50 to further increase their impact.

8. HAWTHORN​

1. Will Day

2. Dylan Moore

3. Jai Newcombe

I love what the Hawks are doing with their developing young list. Day has excelled since being moved into the midfield, with his creative nous, speed and quality ball use. Moore is a weapon in the forward half who sets up goals when he’s not kicking them himself, and Newcombe is a tough-nut in the contest. These three players all have an attacking mindset and will be a big part of Sam Mitchell’s plans going forward.

9. ST KILDA​

1. Max King

2. Mitch Owens

3. Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera

Having kicked 11 goals in three games since being sidelined with injury for the first nine rounds, King has quickly reminded us of the enormous talent he is. He draws the footy as a target player and will only continue to get better in time. Owens is super competitive and can always be trusted to give his all, while I’m a big fan of Wanganeen-Milera’s ball use. Mattaes Phillipou can count himself unlucky to miss the top-three cut.

10. ADELAIDE​

1. Izak Rankine

2. Josh Rachele

3. Max Michalanney

What a recruit Rankine has been. Not only does he have some serious creative nous, but he is also winning plenty of contested ball. Rachele has pure talent, reads the game well and is having high numbers of score involvements on the back of his quality ball use forward of centre. Michalanney has shown maturity beyond his years on debut this season. Not many 19-year-olds come in and play a key role down back like he has.

11. GWS GIANTS​

1. Tom Green

2. Finn Callaghan

3. Lachie Ash

There’s a lot to like about Green, who has taken another step forward as a big-bodied midfielder this season. He works incredibly hard to win the ball and often kickstarts the Giants’ offence on the back of his contest and clearance wins. Callaghan has got some tricks and will be a quality player, while Ash gives great energy and run and can also be used as a tagger at times.

12. NORTH MELBOURNE​

1. Tarryn Thomas

2. Harry Sheezel

3. George Wardlaw

The Kangaroos certainly look to have got it right splitting their No.1 pick in last year’s draft to secure both Sheezel and Wardlaw. Sheezel’s ball use is remarkable and he’s going to be an absolute star, while Wardlaw has already shown in his first four games just what a competitor he is. Thomas is already a star who can change games. If he can sort himself out off-field – and he must – these three players will drive this young North Melbourne group forward.

13. MELBOURNE​

1. Trent Rivers

2. Jacob van Rooyen

3. Kysaiah Pickett

After a super premiership year in 2021, Rivers found himself out of form and favour last season but has bounced back this year. He’s a huge part of the Demons’ rock solid defence when they’re at their best and shows real purpose as a backman. At the other end, van Rooyen competes hard and crashes packs in the air but can also win the ball at ground level. Pickett can make something out of nothing and has more upside to come.

14. ESSENDON​

1. Nic Martin

2. Jye Caldwell

3. Archie Perkins

The Bombers found a gem in Martin through the Supplementary Selection Period at the start of last year and he has continued to improve on a wing this year. His running power is elite. Caldwell is a contested midfielder who can be trusted and has proven a great pick-up from GWS, while Perkins knows where the goals are and will only get better when he improves the defensive side of his game.

15. BRISBANE LIONS​

1. Will Ashcroft

2. Zac Bailey

3. Brandon Starcevich

What Ashcroft has been able to do in his first year has been remarkable, slotting straight into an already strong Lions onball brigade. Bailey is a forward who kicks clutch goals but can also have a stint in the middle and impact, while Starcevich is an unsung hero who is regularly given big jobs down back by the coaching staff and doesn’t disappoint.

16. GEELONG​

1. Sam De Koning

2. Max Holmes

3. Oliver Henry

These three are perhaps a touch unlucky to be ranked so low, but haven’t been able to get into gear on a consistent enough basis this year. De Koning and Holmes both had stellar seasons last year but haven’t quite reached the same heights in 2023. In fairness, De Koning has been thrown around a bit. Henry is a very good opportunistic marking forward, but has to keep working on his defensive traits.

17. RICHMOND​

1. Noah Balta

2. Sampson Ryan

3. Jack Ross

Having been a top team in recent years, the Tigers haven’t exposed as many young players as some clubs. Balta is not a natural footballer but has grown into his role and was a premiership player in 2020. Ryan is an athletic and competitive big man who appears to have good footy IQ, while Ross has been in and out of the senior team but has shown good signs as an outside midfielder when he has played.

18. WEST COAST​

1. Reuben Ginbey

2. Bailey Williams
3. Noah Long

The Eagles’ top draft pick from last year, Ginbey has made an eye-catching start to his career. He’s a big body and has not been fazed by taking on big tasks which have been thrown at him. In the absence of Nic Naitanui, Williams has given great effort as an undersized ruckman and should only get better. Long has some tricks and brings some creative flair on the outside but also has the capacity to win his own ball.
 

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Bloody hell, I can't wait for us to win a premiership, maybe then we can stop hearing about GF 2010. Those guys didn't get it done, big deal - every year, there is a team that loses the GF: Let it go. I am sick of hearing about it. I get we haven't been close since - maybe that's our punishment. I'd rather hear about the rest of the season or even the earlier parts of the game.

"Players literally poured out their blood, sweat, and tears" - Joey, please look up "literally" in the dictionary. I would have gone with "Players literally worked incredibly hard" or "Players metaphorically but in a very real sense poured out their blood, sweat, and tears" perhaps?

Sick of this loser history, really hope Bassat's plan comes off and we can actually create something worth reliving again and again.
 

i agree. not so much about this week, but in general this year an d the importance of goals.
 
It was interesting that Ross said he thought that the team was currently playing to its full potential. I suspect there will be some big list changes this off-season.

Lost to the Pies by 6 points, lost to Port by 7 points - don't think the changes have to be that big.
 
Bloody hell, I can't wait for us to win a premiership, maybe then we can stop hearing about GF 2010. Those guys didn't get it done, big deal - every year, there is a team that loses the GF: Let it go. I am sick of hearing about it. I get we haven't been close since - maybe that's our punishment. I'd rather hear about the rest of the season or even the earlier parts of the game.

"Players literally poured out their blood, sweat, and tears" - Joey, please look up "literally" in the dictionary. I would have gone with "Players literally worked incredibly hard" or "Players metaphorically but in a very real sense poured out their blood, sweat, and tears" perhaps?

Sick of this loser history, really hope Bassat's plan comes off and we can actually create something worth reliving again and again.
It's a mini-doco on our clubs history, what do you expect? Did you actually watch the video?
 
Bloody hell, I can't wait for us to win a premiership, maybe then we can stop hearing about GF 2010. Those guys didn't get it done, big deal - every year, there is a team that loses the GF: Let it go. I am sick of hearing about it. I get we haven't been close since - maybe that's our punishment. I'd rather hear about the rest of the season or even the earlier parts of the game.

"Players literally poured out their blood, sweat, and tears" - Joey, please look up "literally" in the dictionary. I would have gone with "Players literally worked incredibly hard" or "Players metaphorically but in a very real sense poured out their blood, sweat, and tears" perhaps?

Sick of this loser history, really hope Bassat's plan comes off and we can actually create something worth reliving again and again.

I only played one year for one grand final loss, in that grannie since we had shit coach, I spent 95% of it on the bench even with FB coming off first 2mins vomiting all over himself. I can legit remember everything I watched that day and that was 22 years ago, right down to the ruckman that stole my beer and my seat in the after party. I gave it to everyone since all I could do was yell and sit on a seat, this then teen knew many words...
When you're there in those moments they stick with you and what you could have done better, like instead of being a shit forward that could jump & run, when we were leaking like a sieve, what if I gave a shit about defensive effort instead of being scared about my failing body? If I was in lenny's shoes and won an award that day instead of sit on a pine, you bet your arse I'd look back on it fondly instead of bemoaning how useless I was, the coach was, our FB was and that tall shitter that stole my drink etc.
 
It's a mini-doco on our clubs history, what do you expect? Did you actually watch the video?
What a weird question. Yes George, of course I watched it, otherwise how could I have commented on it? Did you actually read what I wrote?

I expected something about the other great matches we've played at the MCG, since we've played there countless times. The 97 preliminary against North. The 71 GF. Even the 2009 prelim(?) Vs the Bulldogs. Our history is so much richer than a handful of missed opportunities, the same faces, the same stories.

But what do I really expect? I expect our football club to one day actually stop ****ing around in no man's land and actually wrote a new chapter that will be something more than a footnote, a shrug, an absent-minded fart from the footy gods. Something that will be worth remembering by more than just die-hard Saints fans.

I think we are actually building something now and I desperately hope that this time it is not another false dawn like the last 10 years have been.
 
What a weird question. Yes George, of course I watched it, otherwise how could I have commented on it? Did you actually read what I wrote?

I expected something about the other great matches we've played at the MCG, since we've played there countless times. The 97 preliminary against North. The 71 GF. Even the 2009 prelim(?) Vs the Bulldogs. Our history is so much richer than a handful of missed opportunities, the same faces, the same stories.

But what do I really expect? I expect our football club to one day actually stop ******* around in no man's land and actually wrote a new chapter that will be something more than a footnote, a shrug, an absent-minded fart from the footy gods. Something that will be worth remembering by more than just die-hard Saints fans.

I think we are actually building something now and I desperately hope that this time it is not another false dawn like the last 10 years have been.
Weird question? Not at all. It doesn't seem like you watched the video because you decided to comment only on the loss but not the other half of the video which was the win. It's a doco that tells the history of the club, irrespective of wins or losses. Flipping out about it is the weird bit. The overreaction is bizarre.

It's the first part of a six part series by the way. How about waiting until it's finished before flipping out lol. This woe is me bullshit gets tiring after a while. Accept it for what it is.
 
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