USA 2024 US Presidential Election: Trump vs Harris (pt II)

[Blue1980]

Remind us. As a regularly mocked user, what powers do you have?

I had no idea thats how it worked. One can't mock those in power? I thought these guys were the champions of free speech?

 

[zumahawk]

It's a bit more than part of a 'playbook'. What the anti-woke are really trying to correct is the course of social movements which began in the 1970s, which they'd describe as 'political correctness gone mad'.

The real problem of the Democrats is that they've abandoned any real commitment to economic fairness. They are Wall Street. They haven't given a serious f*** about the people since the 1960s.

At the same time, they've inherited and pushed the social legacies of the 1970s, which leaves them looking like what they are: a party with a token commitment to disadvantage while ignoring the fact that the US is one of the most unequal countries in the world.

A few decades of pushing this brand created Don and crucified the Dems.

It's not 'anti-woke' which will save them, it's anti-greed.

I don't think it's as much what the Dems got wrong. Only 4 years ago Biden smashed Trump. It's a MAGA issue- it's the Repubs that need to take their party back from the extreme far right. I mean Matt Gaetz Attorney General!!! Dems just need to breathe and wait for Trump's second round shitshow to begin and ultimately end. Everything is temporary.

 

[Xtreme]

Remind us. As a regularly mocked user, what powers do you have?

Oh please you're all just jealous
If you truly were trying to mock someone over the internet you realize that you can be in legal trouble for cyber bullying ? FANCY THAT!

Power is temporary. Goes back and forth between Democrats and Republicans.

Trumps about to have his 9th year in power sooooooooooooooo

 

[ElectricG]

Thing is they really didn't lean into that at all in their campaign. The issue is they were too wishy washy, and not a clear narrative, message.

Blaming "woke" is just a cop out, the landscape on that stuff hasn't changed in the last 4-5 years, cost of living was the main issue and basically all incumbent govts in the western world have been losing regardless of what side of politics they are on.

I mean you have a large amount of people who voted trump then dems down ballot. People voting for Trump and AOC, reasons given by those people is they both seem real, in other words a lot of people would prefer literally anything than the status quo.

I’ve said it on here before, but I actually think that stuff has started to settle a bit. It went wild in mid 2010s until covid started its decline. It’s basically just decrepit gen-xers, influencers, and rich people who still hang on in 2024. When was the last time you heard about manspreading?
Even in spite of that, I do honestly believe Trump won because of culture wars. The damage was already done with their prior antics, which is why the they/them commercials were so effective.

To be clear, I don’t think it makes this makes a vote for trump justified. I would’ve voted for president AOC over him. But they just really need to understand how much people hate that sort of carryon now. The answer is simple: they need to promise they’re not going to be that type of party any more, and honour that promise.

 

[zumahawk]

Oh please you're all just jealous
If you truly were trying to mock someone over the internet you realize that you can be in legal trouble for cyber bullying ? FANCY THAT!



Trumps about to have his 9th year in power sooooooooooooooo

Ok matey.

 

[zumahawk]

I’ve said it on here before, but I actually think that stuff has started to settle a bit. It went wild in mid 2010s until covid started its decline. It’s basically just decrepit gen-xers, influencers, and rich people who still hang on in 2024. When was the last time you heard about manspreading?
Even in spite of that, I do honestly believe Trump won because of culture wars. The damage was already done with their prior antics, which is why the they/them commercials were so effective.

To be clear, I don’t think it makes this makes a vote for trump justified. I would’ve voted for president AOC over him. But they just really need to understand how much people hate that sort of carryon now. The answer is simple: they need to promise they’re not going to be that type of party any more, and honour that promise.

Just 4 years ago Biden smashed Trump. People overestimate Trump's power. It will all be fine.

No need for people to continue weaponising the word 'woke'. It's silly.

 

[JB1975]

I don't think it's as much what the Dems got wrong. Only 4 years ago Biden smashed Trump. It's a MAGA issue- it's the Repubs that need to take their party back from the extreme far right. I mean Matt Gaetz Attorney General!!! Dems just need to breathe and wait for Trump's second round shitshow to begin and ultimately end. Everything is temporary.

Trump wasn't born in a vacuum. Shat out into a toilet, perhaps. Anyway... I believe that there's a longer story here in which the failure of the Democrats to correct the grotesque inequality which has steadily increased since the 1970s helped to create the Donolith.

The convulsions don't make for a linear story, and the Dems will be back in the White House soon enough, but the forces which gave rise to MAGA will keep shaking the system.

 

[Blue1980]

I’ve said it on here before, but I actually think that stuff has started to settle a bit. It went wild in mid 2010s until covid started its decline. It’s basically just decrepit gen-xers, influencers, and rich people who still hang on in 2024. When was the last time you heard about manspreading?
Even in spite of that, I do honestly believe Trump won because of culture wars. The damage was already done with their prior antics, which is why the they/them commercials were so effective.

To be clear, I don’t think it makes this makes a vote for trump justified. I would’ve voted for president AOC over him. But they just really need to understand how much people hate that sort of carryon now. The answer is simple: they need to promise they’re not going to be that type of party any more, and honour that promise.

I think the kernel of truth in there is especially around the time Hilary was running she was leaning into the "me woman, me deserve president, me smashing patriarchy rarrrrh! Bernie Bros racist cos bros".

The issue is they haven't really replaced that narrative with anything substansive to help peoples material conditions. So they go republican lite on their messaging on the border, immigrants, trans issues etc and just give sorta wishy washy solutions which might kinda help your material conditions, but also things are currently good so STFU.

The issue with the identity politics messaging is it comes across as pandering in a lot of cases, while they still cosy up to the donor class and reign hell on Gaza and continue the same foreign policy as always.

 

[zumahawk]

Trump wasn't born in a vacuum. Shat out into a toilet, perhaps. Anyway... I believe that there's a longer story here in which the failure of the Democrats to correct the grotesque inequality which has steadily increased since the 1970s helped to create the Donolith.

The convulsions don't make for a linear story, and the Dems will be back in the White House soon enough, but the forces which gave rise to MAGA will keep shaking the system.

MAGA type groups have always been a huge part of the US system. Racism, sexism and xenophobia is in its DNA. Grotesque inequality sums up Trump, Musk to a tee.

 

[Blue1980]

Just 4 years ago Biden smashed Trump. People overestimate Trump's power. It will all be fine.

No need for people to continue weaponising the word 'woke'. It's silly.

I said it before, reverse the 2 incumbents and both times the incumbents would still lose (if it was dems in 2020 and republicans 2024)

 

[Blue1980]

Trumps about to have his 9th year in power sooooooooooooooo

Why did it matter if he won this time if he was in power anyway?

 

[Xtreme]

Ok matey.

Trump is the greatest president of all time. Nothing can change that, not 100000000000000 felony charges or convictions!

 

[zumahawk]

I said it before, reverse the 2 incumbents and both times the incumbents would still lose (if it was dems in 2020 and republicans 2024)

Correct. Always so desperate for a narrative aren't we. Just a case of the blues and reds taking it in turns to govern the country for a bit. Both parties have tremendous power.

 

[zumahawk]

Trump is the greatest president of all time. Nothing can change that, not 100000000000000 felony charges or convictions!

I'm curious. What charges would change your mind? Murder? Paedophilia?

 

[stefcep]

In my observation it means any combination of the following:

• having socially progressive views that are a bit niche or strange
• having socially progressive views that exaggerate the problem or are illegitimate
• having concern for legitimate minority issues but having them too high in their list of priorities, or generally just being too strident

Naturally the line is drawn in different places for different people. It’s more like the word “ridiculous” in that it doesn’t come with a t test for what meets its criteria.

If you can’t process the meaning of it, it probably means you aren’t able to realise when this type of thing goes too far. If this is the case, you still don’t need to persist with pretending to not know what it means.

You've missed the most important part : the who.

Its usually white, middle class, well to do people who have no lived experience of and are not directly affected by the causes they champion, and in fact may even contribute to them. The sort that join in protesting about climate change inaction, but fly overseas all the time and live incredibly wastefully.

Of course these people know what the word "woke" means: they are just being their smug, condescending, arrogant selves. What they really mean is that YOU don't know what it means because YOU'RE too stupid and YOU'RE just saying something you heard someone else say.

 

[stefcep]

I'm curious. What charges would change your mind? Murder? Paedophilia?

Old men sniffing young children is where I draw the line.

 

[Xtreme]

I'm curious. What charges would change your mind ?

I am still waiting for any sort of screw up
But Donald is too much of a clean skin to get his hands dirty.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

In my observation it means any combination of the following:

• having socially progressive views that are a bit niche or strange
• having socially progressive views that exaggerate the problem or are illegitimate
• having concern for legitimate minority issues but having them too high in their list of priorities, or generally just being too strident

Naturally the line is drawn in different places for different people. It’s more like the word “ridiculous” in that it doesn’t come with a t test for what meets its criteria.

If you can’t process the meaning of it, it probably means you aren’t able to realise when this type of thing goes too far. If this is the case, you still don’t need to persist with pretending to not know what it means.

This is actually one of the best definitions of 'woke' (in its current usage) that I've seen.

And whether intentional or not, it also completely validates the assessment that right wingers use the term for "not right wing". Look at the common factors in your definition:

• socially progressive views
• socially progressive views
• concern for legitimate minority issues

Yes, I see the 'buts' and agree that the line is drawn differently due to personal biases, but your definition is quite a powerful statement as to why 'woke' is not the evil that right wingers so passionately suggest. It's actually appropriate human behaviour.

 

[zumahawk]

In my observation it means any combination of the following:

• having socially progressive views that are a bit niche or strange
• having socially progressive views that exaggerate the problem or are illegitimate
• having concern for legitimate minority issues but having them too high in their list of priorities, or generally just being too strident

Naturally the line is drawn in different places for different people. It’s more like the word “ridiculous” in that it doesn’t come with a t test for what meets its criteria.

If you can’t process the meaning of it, it probably means you aren’t able to realise when this type of thing goes too far. If this is the case, you still don’t need to persist with pretending to not know what it means.

It's just a bully boy tactic and put down for people that are genuinely compassionate for others. It's been weaponised in a moronic way to try and belittle others mainly by old dinosaurs.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Trump is the greatest president of all time. Nothing can change that, not 100000000000000 felony charges or convictions!

You truly are a simpleton.

I previously thought it was an act. But sadly, that appears to not be the case.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Old men sniffing young children is where I draw the line.

If that's where the line truly was, literally no-one would vote for convicted sex offender Trump.

 

[Blue1980]

You've missed the most important part : the who.

Its usually white, middle class, well to do people who have no lived experience of and are not directly affected by the causes they champion, and in fact may even contribute to them. The sort that join in protesting about climate change inaction, but fly overseas all the time and live incredibly wastefully.

Of course these people know what woke means: they are just being their smug, condescending, arrogant selves. What they really mean is that YOU don't know what it means because YOU'RE too stupid and YOU'RE just saying something you heard someone else say.

I can extrapolate out what you said, and I do think it is projection from you.

So you can't fathom or wrap your head around any person who cares about the world or society at large, so assume they are being disingenuous.

Your logic seems to indicate the only people who should care about minorities are minorities themselves, and those minorities also, in turn, only care about themselves. Which is just stupid, and in my opinion a very bleak world view.

But again, props for being honest.

 

[zumahawk]

You've missed the most important part : the who.

Its usually white, middle class, well to do people who have no lived experience of and are not directly affected by the causes they champion, and in fact may even contribute to them. The sort that join in protesting about climate change inaction, but fly overseas all the time and live incredibly wastefully.

Of course these people know what the word "woke" means: they are just being their smug, condescending, arrogant selves. What they really mean is that YOU don't know what it means because YOU'RE too stupid and YOU'RE just saying something you heard someone else say.

It's just a very divisive term. We all need to move on from it and stop insulting each other with vague terms.

 

[zumahawk]

Old men sniffing young children is where I draw the line.

Everyone draws the line at old men sniffing children, bragging about grabbing women by the vagina and sexual assault. Why the need to be so biased?

 

[Xtreme]

You truly are a simpleton.

Petty insults are just that petty insults
At the end of the day Trump won an election that many thought he wouldn't.