JimmyRabbit49
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Might be unpopular but I really can’t see where Docherty fits in our best 23 next year
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AFLW 2024 - Round 9 - Indigenous Round - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
Prediction 2025 - Best 23 + Emergencies - Rolling
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- Jun 4, 2016
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Newman Weitering McGovern
Saad JSos Cowan
Docherty Walsh Acres(Ollie while inj)
Elijah Mckay Fogarty
Kemp Charlie durdin OR Motlop
TDK Cripps Hewett
Cerra, pick 3, 7th defender, Moir etc.
I don't need to think too hard to see Doch to me is almost certainly on a wing or the 7th defender off the bench.
- Mar 25, 2019
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Not saying you're wrong here but that would be the slowest team of all bloody time. Something we've been told we're looking to change next year.
Can't imagine we go into next season with so few changes to the 22
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No... It wouldn't...
Midfield of cerra Walsh Cripps Hewett pick 3 is going to happen. It's also not slow. Not fast. Not slow
Wings of acres / Docherty / Ollie / maaaaybe pick 3 and Binns will happen. Not slow.
Half backs of Saad and Cowan - not slow.
McKay's probably the fastest tall in the league. Kemp and Moir are fast. TDK is dynamic.
Are we just going to judge this team on the back half of last year when not a one of them could run let alone fit enough to run consistently at speed.
And our 22 changed so much every week due to injury and all sorts this team is nothing like any team we put out at any stage of the year so I don't have a clue what you mean by that either.
JimmyRabbit49
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I’d have O Hollands as the 7th defender and Binns on the wing over Docherty.
Also have both Durdin and Motlop ahead of Fogarty
- Mar 25, 2019
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Some fair points, I feel like the coaching team will be pushing hard to get Lord and Wilson into the team or get one of Hewett/Cerra out of the core midfield mix.
I also trust EP's info as much as any, but I just struggle to see JSOS getting games at CHB. He's not equipped athletically for the best KPFs in the comp.
I’d say in order of probability, at least for the first chunk of the season is:
1 Moir
2 Lord
3 Wilson
That being said, yet to actually see Wilson. Who knows.
Would be pretty stoked if all 3 have forced their way into the team, like the attributes they bring.
- Jun 9, 2008
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I’d say there’s a lot of hope in this thread rather than genuine opinions.
For example Jack Silvagni is apparently our best CHB option in 2025 despite never spending more than a few minutes down that end of the ground.
JustOneTime
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It is more about the gaping hole that is there. Kemp/Young/Mcgovern are no chance of filling that hole week in week out. Tried and failed.
We then look to another, and right now, the only other is JSoS. Our list mgmt team have left us short here until we see some add-on rookies.
So a reach yes; and hope for now.
That same hope you have for Moir who did nothing at VFL level the whole year and then showed 2-4 passages of play that were good. I'm hoping too with him. It's Moir for you and JSoS for me.
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Moir has played two quarters of AFL football and looked amazing in both. Our VFL side is abysmal.. so good luck to any forward getting a kick in that outfit let alone one in their first year.
In Moir's two quarters at AFL level he's had 8 disposals, kicked 2 goals, laid 3 tackles and taken 2 contested marks. Adjusted per-game averages of 16 disposals, 4 goals and 6 tackles suggest there is a lot of upside.
Meanwhile, you're hoping for a career medium-sized forward in their 9th season, coming fresh off an ACL, to embark on a positional change and hold down CHB despite never playing there.
One is optimism, the other is fantasy.
JustOneTime
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More recently...Liam Jones, Zac Williams, Hewett as a mid, Docherty playing def HFF, JSoS to ruck, Mckay to ruck, Boyd to defence etc.
I think you are stuck in how the AFL used to be. And like most, when things get hard, you prefer to try a shiny new thing as you see the current things tarnished beyond re-use.
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Massive difference between someone playing as a flanker, versus, a 3rd tall forward being repositioned, due to an ACL, to try and play as an undersized KPD
JustOneTime
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True. But If Rory Lobb can become top 5 key defender in a period of weeks after ten years never playing there and overall being a crap player; it is worth a try before throwing JSoS on the scrapheap.
Worth it for JSoS and worth it for us as we have a hole to fill. Agree the height might not be quite right but I'm intrigued on what his current height actually is. Think he is taller now that his original 193. More 194/5.
Worth it for JSoS and worth it for us as we have a hole to fill. Agree the height might not be quite right but I'm intrigued on what his current height actually is. Think he is taller now that his original 193. More 194/5.
I think Jsos would thrive at CHB and make that position his own.Smart footballer with adequate skills,what he May lack in height/weight he’ll make up in smarts.
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Moir & Lord should be a “lock” for the first game - the positions should be theirs to lose, not have them lost in the 2s. We know Crippa, Cerra, Hew, Walsh doesn’t work - as much as people want it to, it failed & got found out.
We know what Hewett can do & he won’t lose that sitting in the twos waiting for injury or poor form.
Our small forwards have been horrible, Moir gets the gig everyday.
We need to improve & grow, not rehash the same team.
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- Mar 25, 2019
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You don't have to be smart to play key back, it helps for sure... But the number 1 prerequisite is being supremely athletic and disciplined. Case in point Liam Jones and Sam Frost. Forwards generally rely on their smarts more which is why Jack has carved out a career as a third tall despite being slow off the mark and a mediocre contested mark.
I can't see a world where Jack is locking down a player like Hogan, Waterman, Cameron, King etc. He'd get destroyed in the wrestle and on the lead.
If the club and Jack are committed to it though I guess we'll just have to wait to find out.
Projecting a little on development and injury management.
B: Newman, Weitering, Haynes
HB: Cowan, McGovern, Saad
C: Acres, Cripps, O.Hollands
Foll: De Koning, Walsh, Hewett
HF: E.Hollands, McKay, Fogarty
F: Moir, Curnow, Williams
Int/sub: Docherty, Kemp, Cerra, Durdin, Pick 3.
Expect Kempy to play plenty of defence, so seems right to list on interchange to play a variety of roles, and prefer to split 7th defensive spot among Ollie, Elijah, Doc and Kempy.
With a little licence, reserves
B: Boyd, Young, Pick 38(Dennis/O’Farrell)
HB: Wilson, (Rookie - DGB/Phillips?), Cincotta
C: Binns, Lord, (L.Camporeale)
Foll: Pittonet, (B.Camporeale), Silvagni*
HF: Fantasia, Lemmey, Cottrell
F: O’Keeffe, (McMahon), Motlop
Int: Monahan, Duffy, (Rookie).
Basing some of the names on rumours or personal projection. 10 or a dozen of those listed in the twos are genuine chances to line up in the top team round 1.
Don’t expect Silvagni to be played in the middle, but for balance of this exercise put him there as we need depth and developing in genuine key roles, while JSOS is a utility type. Final rookie spot logically should be a mid /forward if the others are similar to my projections.
Have a liking for overage KPD Christian Mardini, but might miss based on adding prime junior candidate and ready to go depth. Also no objection if we re-rookie either Carroll if circumstances allow. Jack would be hard done by, but it is a numbers game and Lord probably goes past him. Hopefully Matt Carroll retained in VFL list and in line for MSD form and spots dependent.
We should only have a handful of players not AFL ready, so our depth is maturing as we reset our KPD candidates. Taking on McMahon is a no brainer for me. Likely to remain depth, but ensures we have ready to go coverage for the foreseeable future should Lemmey not step up, or manifest more as a defender.
B: Newman, Weitering, Haynes
HB: Cowan, McGovern, Saad
C: Acres, Cripps, O.Hollands
Foll: De Koning, Walsh, Hewett
HF: E.Hollands, McKay, Fogarty
F: Moir, Curnow, Williams
Int/sub: Docherty, Kemp, Cerra, Durdin, Pick 3.
Expect Kempy to play plenty of defence, so seems right to list on interchange to play a variety of roles, and prefer to split 7th defensive spot among Ollie, Elijah, Doc and Kempy.
With a little licence, reserves
B: Boyd, Young, Pick 38(Dennis/O’Farrell)
HB: Wilson, (Rookie - DGB/Phillips?), Cincotta
C: Binns, Lord, (L.Camporeale)
Foll: Pittonet, (B.Camporeale), Silvagni*
HF: Fantasia, Lemmey, Cottrell
F: O’Keeffe, (McMahon), Motlop
Int: Monahan, Duffy, (Rookie).
Basing some of the names on rumours or personal projection. 10 or a dozen of those listed in the twos are genuine chances to line up in the top team round 1.
Don’t expect Silvagni to be played in the middle, but for balance of this exercise put him there as we need depth and developing in genuine key roles, while JSOS is a utility type. Final rookie spot logically should be a mid /forward if the others are similar to my projections.
Have a liking for overage KPD Christian Mardini, but might miss based on adding prime junior candidate and ready to go depth. Also no objection if we re-rookie either Carroll if circumstances allow. Jack would be hard done by, but it is a numbers game and Lord probably goes past him. Hopefully Matt Carroll retained in VFL list and in line for MSD form and spots dependent.
We should only have a handful of players not AFL ready, so our depth is maturing as we reset our KPD candidates. Taking on McMahon is a no brainer for me. Likely to remain depth, but ensures we have ready to go coverage for the foreseeable future should Lemmey not step up, or manifest more as a defender.
Steven May/Height and weight
Height 1.90 m, Weight 93 kg
Jack Silvagni/Height and weight
Height 1.91 m, Weight 92 kg
Interesting!
Lobb is huge (over 2m) and athletic. He's another in the Liam Jones mold where they have superior athletic attributes which shine as long as they can learn a defensive system.
JSOS is undersized and unathletic. His strength his his footy brain and heart. His hands aren't particularly good and often got spoiled when he was a forward.
Would he be a more disciplined player than Kemp, Young and McGovern? Yep. But having a fairytale story like Lobb had is not on the cards.
First go!
B: Newman, Weitering, Haynes
HB: McGovern, JSOS, Saad
C: Acres, Cripps, Docherty
Foll: De Koning, Walsh, Hewett
HF: E.Hollands, Curnow, Moir
F: Fogarty, McKay, Williams
Int/sub: Wilson, Lord, Cerra, Motlop, Pick 3.
Happy with that! Moved past a few, as we need to change the dynamic...
B: Newman, Weitering, Haynes
HB: McGovern, JSOS, Saad
C: Acres, Cripps, Docherty
Foll: De Koning, Walsh, Hewett
HF: E.Hollands, Curnow, Moir
F: Fogarty, McKay, Williams
Int/sub: Wilson, Lord, Cerra, Motlop, Pick 3.
Happy with that! Moved past a few, as we need to change the dynamic...
JSOS would be gold at CHB, IMHO!
Why, footy smarts! You just can't teach it, simple!
His hands are good, his running patterns elite, his vision elite, his field kick v.good, his spoiling ability elite.
As a forward, you would have to know where he is at all times, or he will cut you up on the rebound.
There are a few players to get extremely excited about next season. Lord, Kemp, Moir and Haynes. Yes Pick 3 as well. There are a clutch of players coming in who will make a big difference to our side and what qualities it has. Speed and pressure boosts.
Cooper Lord is a player I don't think will miss games next season. There is something special about this player. He has a really quick onballers brain. You see the tackles he makes, he comes off his man, he comes from a fair way sometimes to make them because he reads where the ball is going and reads the situation so well. We don't have much of that, we have a lot of see ball get ball but we don't have much of this.
What else impresses me is his ability to get the ball out. When he gets hands on it, he's hard to tackle, he breaks tackles, moves through traffic and is accurate and dangerous with his handball release. No panic at all. He then spreads exceptionally well. His kicking is another area that impresses me. Accurate and vision. We have a young player with an extremely good football brain and the body and talents to execute what he sees. I think we underrated him last season. I hope we see it this next season.
Moir is another player who has that footy brain and special skillset that we just don't have and you just can't teach. Watching his later VFL work and AFL work, he just has it. He's not a flash in the pan type, he's the full package. He reads the game. Comes from miles away to make a tackle. Gets to positions at just the right time to get hands on the ball. He doesn't need to run 15 Km/game. He's smart. He will win the ball in the position he is playing and he will be a big impact player. He's got that spark that guys like Fev and Betts had. Create something out of nothing regularly. They can just make thing happen by repeatedly getting to the right spots and having excess skills and anticipation. He will play most games.
Kemp is a player that has been criticised a bit but I think that will go away quickly. A lot to playing him out of position has brought that about. Watching his forward work. We have something there. His pace and endurance is excellent and he will use it to get forward and make good position when we look to move the ball quickly. He should often have space due to Curnow and McKay attracting a lot of attention. His hands above his head are good. His reading of the ball in the air is good and he seems to know where to run to get a kick as a forward. What I also love is that at ground level he has the pace and the skill to make an impact. He really is your modern day prototype 3rd tall forward. Fast, good over head, seems to read the game well, good endurance and good at ground level. I liked his run down and tackle pressure he brought at the end of last year. IMO he will be a great addition to the forward line.
Haynes there is no excitement about but if we can get a couple of seasons close to his best footy then we have a really good addition here. Haynes is a top line defender who many think has been pushed out or is too old. I would like to think that is not the case.
As for Pick 3. This is going to be a gun. A player like Smith or Draper could add so much to our team. So much. There will be pace, class intense natural footballers there for us to take and this will make us better.
Docherty I forget to mention. I don't get how some can't see where he fits into the team. Defence, Midfield as either wing or on the ball. He was even toyed with as a forward last time he was fit. Docherty is a high class player who most definitely fits into our team.
There is a lot to look forward to next season. Hopefully we get Cerra fit. Hopefully we get Motlop going.
If we can add more players forward who are genuine forwards with high level skills and forward brains we will jump. Same in the middle. We go from only 2 marking options forward to 4 or more our ball movement jumps and we become a dangerous forward side. Some pace and tackle pressure in the middle and we don't get blown away when we haven't got the ball, we just stay in it. Better depth and pace in the middle and we do more damage.
We should have high expectations next season.
Cooper Lord is a player I don't think will miss games next season. There is something special about this player. He has a really quick onballers brain. You see the tackles he makes, he comes off his man, he comes from a fair way sometimes to make them because he reads where the ball is going and reads the situation so well. We don't have much of that, we have a lot of see ball get ball but we don't have much of this.
What else impresses me is his ability to get the ball out. When he gets hands on it, he's hard to tackle, he breaks tackles, moves through traffic and is accurate and dangerous with his handball release. No panic at all. He then spreads exceptionally well. His kicking is another area that impresses me. Accurate and vision. We have a young player with an extremely good football brain and the body and talents to execute what he sees. I think we underrated him last season. I hope we see it this next season.
Moir is another player who has that footy brain and special skillset that we just don't have and you just can't teach. Watching his later VFL work and AFL work, he just has it. He's not a flash in the pan type, he's the full package. He reads the game. Comes from miles away to make a tackle. Gets to positions at just the right time to get hands on the ball. He doesn't need to run 15 Km/game. He's smart. He will win the ball in the position he is playing and he will be a big impact player. He's got that spark that guys like Fev and Betts had. Create something out of nothing regularly. They can just make thing happen by repeatedly getting to the right spots and having excess skills and anticipation. He will play most games.
Kemp is a player that has been criticised a bit but I think that will go away quickly. A lot to playing him out of position has brought that about. Watching his forward work. We have something there. His pace and endurance is excellent and he will use it to get forward and make good position when we look to move the ball quickly. He should often have space due to Curnow and McKay attracting a lot of attention. His hands above his head are good. His reading of the ball in the air is good and he seems to know where to run to get a kick as a forward. What I also love is that at ground level he has the pace and the skill to make an impact. He really is your modern day prototype 3rd tall forward. Fast, good over head, seems to read the game well, good endurance and good at ground level. I liked his run down and tackle pressure he brought at the end of last year. IMO he will be a great addition to the forward line.
Haynes there is no excitement about but if we can get a couple of seasons close to his best footy then we have a really good addition here. Haynes is a top line defender who many think has been pushed out or is too old. I would like to think that is not the case.
As for Pick 3. This is going to be a gun. A player like Smith or Draper could add so much to our team. So much. There will be pace, class intense natural footballers there for us to take and this will make us better.
Docherty I forget to mention. I don't get how some can't see where he fits into the team. Defence, Midfield as either wing or on the ball. He was even toyed with as a forward last time he was fit. Docherty is a high class player who most definitely fits into our team.
There is a lot to look forward to next season. Hopefully we get Cerra fit. Hopefully we get Motlop going.
If we can add more players forward who are genuine forwards with high level skills and forward brains we will jump. Same in the middle. We go from only 2 marking options forward to 4 or more our ball movement jumps and we become a dangerous forward side. Some pace and tackle pressure in the middle and we don't get blown away when we haven't got the ball, we just stay in it. Better depth and pace in the middle and we do more damage.
We should have high expectations next season.
I think Haynes and Weitering get first crack at full back and CHB. Jack will get his opportunity in the preseason match sims and when one of them misses. There will be a lot of time on Curnow, McKay at match sim level so that will sort things out.
I'm for it. Watching his father as a youngster growing up is a big part of that. That is definitely a big part of it. But I think he also has the qualities there to play defence. He will have to play taller at times but so did Stephen. Most defenders do.
Part of being able to play taller than you are is having a good leap, reading the ball and drop zone really early and having good body craft. I've done it for years. I think Jack has that. Stephen did. We will see but I think it's a good idea.
I get excited from reading your posts! Just filled with deep knowledge and reserves observations.
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts in particular on what is keeping Lord and Moir out? What was stopping them from being best 22 in 2024, and what is different in 2025?
