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ABC's 7:30 on New Hird/Dank evidence - 11 April; 3AW/9 Report Text Msg Contents

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STFU Donnie said:
From the AFL Anti-Doping Code

3. APPLICATION OF CODE

3.1 This Code applies to:
(a) Players, whether in or out of competition;
(b) Clubs and their Officers;
(c) Officials; and
(d) all persons involved in any capacity or manner in Anti Doping Rule Violations.

3.2 Any Player, Club, Officer, Official or other Person to whom this Code applies who
commits an Anti Doping Rule Violation or otherwise breaches the provisions of this
Code is liable to the sanctions provided by the Code.

3.3 A Club will be deemed to have breached this Code should any of its Officers or
Officials breach this Code and may be sanctioned in addition to the Officers or
Officials concerned

And

Official
means a coach, trainer, manager, agent, team staff, official, medical or paramedical
personnel, parent or any other Person working with, treating or assisting a
Player participating in or preparing for the AFL Competition.


It just amazes me that people who talk about this subject remain staggeringly ignorant of the actual issues.
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raffrox said:
As far as the technicalities go, I've got no idea.

From the looks of this though, if Hirdy took a substance that violated the Anti Doping Rule Violations then he is officially gone.
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How do you figure that?

The key is the words "commits an Anti Doping Rule Violation", but it is not a violation for a coach to take a banned drug. It is violation for a coach to give a player a banned drug.
 
LuvMyHawks said:
You have forgotten Hird lied for months that he would not be the coach at the bombers,.!He knew in May that he would be coaching, 6 months before the board actually fired Knights. He lied through his teeth on On the Couch.."I do not intend to coach the bombers", so he continually says.Lie,lie,lie,the golden haired angel..:rolleyes:
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When and where did he know 6 months prior he was going to be coach?
 

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Kaiser Powser said:
Only if you think the texts actually contain banned substances.

Which they don't.
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I'm talking about the way Hird distanced himself at the time and Dank was insinuated to be a rogue agent if anything dodgy was going on. It now looks dishonest.
 
Ubiquinone:

What is the most important information I should know about ubiquinone?

Ubiquinone has not been approved by the FDA to treat any disease, and it should not be substituted for prescription medications.
Ubiquinone has not been evaluated by the FDA for safety, effectiveness, or purity. All potential risks and/or advantages of this product may not be known. Additionally, there are no regulated manufacturing standards in place for these compounds. Some marketed herbal supplements have been found to be contaminated with toxic metals or other drugs. Herbal/health supplements should be purchased from a reliable source to minimize the risk of contamination.

Read more at http://www.drugs.com/mtm/ubiquinone.html#mwZCUx5qOTtPxQze.99
 
Haduken said:
Hird could have been injected with an entire boatload of drugs. He's not a player. The WADA code does not apply to him.

The drugs themselves are not illegal. This weird notion people have that something 'not approved for human use' is therefore illegal to have is just weird. Authorities ban drugs for a variety of reasons. Medical boards clear drugs for human use in hospitals, pharmacies etc.

There is a hell of a lot of grey area in the middle there and no 'blanket bans' applying to the general public.
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Dirt is not approved for human use and it's not illegal to consume it. I cannot understand why so many posters hang their hat on this. I guess it suits their fantasy and good luck to them. But this is still not going anywhere as far as the players are concerned.
 
Chief said:
A breach is a breach. The distancing and shock from Hird and the board now looks completely crafted.
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Well it certainly does...if you want it to.

Or maybe they just realised their club was about to be dragged through the mud for a program that they believed was pushing boundaries but all above board.
 
Tas said:
They got written confirmation from WADA that the the Peds they used were not banned. I am not sure about WADA saying a substance is banned and banning people retrospectively, that is absurd. That is like the Police saying the speed limit is retrospectively 10kmph and how everyone has lost their license. They can make up any rules they like, they wont hold up in court. Rules need to be reasonable.
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Except when talking about drugs in sport it is easy to change the chemical composition a little so that a new drug is created which is not banned but for all intents and purposes is the same as the old drug.
 
Kaiser Powser said:
Well it certainly does...if you want it to.

Or maybe they just realised their club was about to be dragged through the mud for a program that they believed was pushing boundaries but all above board.
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Cool - did WADA and the AFL have full details of their program?
 
mxett said:
:rolleyes:

If they passed their program by ASADA wouldn't it be reasonable to be shocked when told they may have breached WADA policy?
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Was the whole program passed by ASADA? I may have it wrong, but I don't believe it was.
 
This whole issue still hangs on whether ASADA gives AOD 9608 (? or whatever it is) the the all clear once they are done testing it, or whether they will ban it and possibly Essendon players.

Everything raised today is just the typical media beat up. Will be forgotten about in a fortnight.
 

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jenny61_99 said:
Ubiquinone:

What is the most important information I should know about ubiquinone?

Ubiquinone has not been approved by the FDA to treat any disease, and it should not be substituted for prescription medications.
Ubiquinone has not been evaluated by the FDA for safety, effectiveness, or purity. All potential risks and/or advantages of this product may not be known. Additionally, there are no regulated manufacturing standards in place for these compounds. Some marketed herbal supplements have been found to be contaminated with toxic metals or other drugs. Herbal/health supplements should be purchased from a reliable source to minimize the risk of contamination.

Read more at http://www.drugs.com/mtm/ubiquinone.html#mwZCUx5qOTtPxQze.99
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Don't see what is wrong with Ubiquinone, coq10 is such a commonly used supplement and widely available. My grandmother uses that shit and she purchases it from coles or any pharmacy.

I dont know why dank would even bother putting in stuff like starting a "ubiquinone" program, a bit like saying "our players will now start drinking water".
Just a hunch, in most drug related text messages codewords are used, wouldnt be surprised if IV and ubiquinone referred to something else, however if this was true why would he mention thymosin?. mind=blown /tinfoilhat
 
Haduken said:
We are absolutely guilty of poor practices and may have breached some rules around IV usage, but the media witch hunt led by Wilson and Smith has been ridiculous and over the top.

If actual evidence came out incriminating the club, I and I imagine most Essendon supporters would change their tune, but this innuendo and rumour driven rubbish going on. In this light I'll defend Essendon, like anyone would defend their own club.
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I hate Caro and Fatprick Smith... more than any other 'journos' and by a fair margin, but do you really think that Hird's position is tenable if he had knowledge of the IV Usage?
You see this seems to indicate 'oh it was a lesser charge', but all players on your list receiving supplements via IV could be subject to bans of up to 2 years... And it does happen. Look at Rio Ferdinand... he missed and appointment... ban... No suggestion he took any substance, ban...

Now I think it is more likely the bans will be lower, but you don't think journalists have a point that the coach of a club who knowingly put players in a position to receive supplements (even if it was Vitamin B) through IV, which is against WADA and AFL codes regulation, and therefore risks the majority of the playing list being open to long suspensions, plus will cost the club potentially millions in fines and sponsorship... Should be stood down??

If this was Carlton (and as of this moment I am thankful we are not yet embroiled)... I would find the coaches position untenable. I just could not see how the leader of the playing group can stay on after they endorsed a practice that risked the futures of the playing group and the club (not through the substance necessarily, but because of the prohibited method).

Now James Hird taking substances himself... meh.. I don't really care at all. Does it potentially look bad? Yeah it does.. but if it was that alone, it would blow over in a day.

I don't want Essendon brought to their knees (and I dislike them a lot), much like I don't want any club brought to their knees.... But I can certainly see point journalists are making when they are saying Hirdy must step down. It will be amazing if he survives this.
 
Plugger35 said:
Maybe they could burn him at the stake at half time during the game tomorrow night.
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Pluggers right ....but there's a complete fireban in WA due to the hot weather.

Perhaps Freo can pump Essendon by 148 points and the Bombers can sack him for legitimate football reasons - problem solvered
 
> Hird has claimed he was aware of Essendon's supplement plan
> Hird was, and still is adamant that he was unaware of any illegal PEDs used in Essendon's supplement plan
The leaked text messages contradict neither of these statements.
 
Chief said:
I'm talking about the way Hird distanced himself at the time and Dank was insinuated to be a rogue agent if anything dodgy was going on. It now looks dishonest.
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If Dank gave assurances that everything was above board and then the club found out they weren't, you could understand the distancing.
 
Bowakawa said:
> Hird has claimed he was aware of Essendon's supplement plan
> Hird was, and still is adamant that he was unaware of any illegal PEDs used in Essendon's supplement plan
The leaked text messages contradict neither of these statements.
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You are right.. they don't...

But what they do show is he was aware of the methodology...
That is what Essendon are far more likely to be done on than any tests picking up actually prohibited substances.. The biggest thing to come out is that these message implicate Hird in the methodology.
 
It was nice knowing you Essendon
TLCilQ4.png


Source: http://www.crimecommission.gov.au/s...ganised-crime-and-drugs-in-sports-feb2013.pdf
 
jenny61_99 said:
Ubiquinone:

What is the most important information I should know about ubiquinone?

Ubiquinone has not been approved by the FDA to treat any disease, and it should not be substituted for prescription medications.
Ubiquinone has not been evaluated by the FDA for safety, effectiveness, or purity. All potential risks and/or advantages of this product may not be known. Additionally, there are no regulated manufacturing standards in place for these compounds. Some marketed herbal supplements have been found to be contaminated with toxic metals or other drugs. Herbal/health supplements should be purchased from a reliable source to minimize the risk of contamination.

Read more at http://www.drugs.com/mtm/ubiquinone.html#mwZCUx5qOTtPxQze.99
Click to expand...

FDA is the American food and drug administration, they are basically whores to the large drug manufacturers in the USA and they pretty much ban anything they do not manufacture and don't let a lot of products from overseas into the USA. I am not sure I would use the FDA as gospel as to what is fit for human use.

Thre is also a big difference between mass market supplements and ones produced by compound chemists.
 
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