AFL Canberra Div3/Div2

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NovIsBack said:
Only thing is that woden and Cooma are affiliated.
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Like I said not everyone is going to be happy with whatever direction you go with. By doing the right thing by woden and cooma and keeping them together affects all the other clubs in a negative way imo. My understanding is that they are only affiliated as players can move between the grades (I assume on form or is it just to get a game?). In terms of volunteers and managers and coaches etc they don't share anything and operate as 2 seperate clubs. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Surely we don't run a competition to satisfy the few players that can't get a game, whilst we neglect the issues of all the other clubs.
 
MotleyLemon said:
Sounds fine outside of the Div 3 teams basically being shafted away from the rest of their clubs.

Probably would prefer if they were to play the early game, and rising stars the late game, as per finals just gone.

Obviously this makes it hard with travel for interstate teams, but maybe it's time some of them were pushed up anyway...
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Its Eastlake, Ainslie, Belco and Tuggers that are affected in this way. As it currently stands my understanding is that for these teams (maybe not tuggers) NEAFL & Div 1 are treated as seperate clubs to div 2 & 3. SO in this format essentially nothing changes except now its Div 1 & 2 with Div 3 being the seperated team.

The issues with Div 3 playing the earlier game are then you have clubs like Coota, Cooma, Yass & Goulburn playing away games at 9am in the morning. I hardly think they would be happy with that and therefore I imagine a drop off in numbers for those clubs, which wouldn't be good for anyone. Not to mention that most grounds wouldn't be suitable for night time footy and there aren't enough hours of daylight during winter to play 4 games on one day at the same venue.

Imo you can't push teams up unless they have a reserves team, otherwise it throws the whole balance of the competition out. Just like it is now.
 
12 Magpies said:
Its Eastlake, Ainslie, Belco and Tuggers that are affected in this way. As it currently stands my understanding is that for these teams (maybe not tuggers) NEAFL & Div 1 are treated as seperate clubs to div 2 & 3. SO in this format essentially nothing changes except now its Div 1 & 2 with Div 3 being the seperated team.

The issues with Div 3 playing the earlier game are then you have clubs like Coota, Cooma, Yass & Goulburn playing away games at 9am in the morning. I hardly think they would be happy with that and therefore I imagine a drop off in numbers for those clubs, which wouldn't be good for anyone. Not to mention that most grounds wouldn't be suitable for night time footy and there aren't enough hours of daylight during winter to play 4 games on one day at the same venue.

Imo you can't push teams up unless they have a reserves team, otherwise it throws the whole balance of the competition out. Just like it is now.
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Is there any news on how many current NEAFL players Belco (and Qbn for that matter) are going to lose? I know that quite a few of them weren't being paid this year already, are they going to stick around to play in the new Div 1 comp? Will Belconnen/Qbn be actively recruiting and signing players for their Div 1 team? Not sure you can push the likes of Molonglo, Harman, Gungahlin etc up against that kind of thing... Obviously those teams would play each other throughout the year, so not every game is a blow out, but still, seems a bit strange at this stage to me.

IMO, Belco and QBN should have toughed it out in the NEAFL for the remainder of their contracts before contributing the money, along with other AFL Canberra clubs, the money for a standalone Canberra rep team. Would have avoided the kind of two-tiered competition you're talking about, with at least 4 or 5 teams who could be competitive in Div 1.
 

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MotleyLemon said:
Is there any news on how many current NEAFL players Belco (and Qbn for that matter) are going to lose? I know that quite a few of them weren't being paid this year already, are they going to stick around to play in the new Div 1 comp? Will Belconnen/Qbn be actively recruiting and signing players for their Div 1 team? Not sure you can push the likes of Molonglo, Harman, Gungahlin etc up against that kind of thing... Obviously those teams would play each other throughout the year, so not every game is a blow out, but still, seems a bit strange at this stage to me.

IMO, Belco and QBN should have toughed it out in the NEAFL for the remainder of their contracts before contributing the money, along with other AFL Canberra clubs, the money for a standalone Canberra rep team. Would have avoided the kind of two-tiered competition you're talking about, with at least 4 or 5 teams who could be competitive in Div 1.
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That's the difficulty, but in every league you have teams that struggle to compete with the to teams. I don't know exactly how many players will be staying on but I imagine a few will and I imagine both Belco and queanbeyan will be very strong. If we go down the path of other teams won't be able to compete with them so therefore they shouldn't be in the same league we could end up with a 2 team comp.
In my opinion teams won't find a way to compete until they have to. It won't happen overnight but it defiantly won't happen if no one tries.
 
Looks like the Jets have done well getting Adrian Pavese as their head coach for season 2015. If they get to use the new oval and facilities more in 2015, should be easy for recruitment I would reckon...
 
Good to see so much healthy discussion on here. I think the league have a massive job ahead of them but also a great chance to make something great out of ACTAFL . However they structure it I truly hope that personal agenda's don't creep in and take away that chance.
 
12 Magpies said:
Hopefully they make some decent decisions for a change.
Its tough for the league, but I think the best thing for the whole competition is to push teams up to the top division. I understand that the top couple of teams are a lot stronger than the rest at the moment, but its a joke that the top division in Canberra has so little amount of teams in it. Push the teams up like South Coast, Molonglo, Gungahlin and make it a 10 team comp. At least in this scenario the teams that aren't quite up to the standard at the moment will at least compete against each other and won't have to play the top team 4 times in a season and get flogged by them every time.
Then match them up with their respective reserve teams in division 2 and they play on the same day at the same venue against the same team each and every week. Less volunteers required, resources aren't stretched as much, more people at the ground, greater atmosphere, greater canteen takings and therefore players are going to want to be involved in footy a whole lot more.
In Div 3 you then have Coota, Cooma, Yass, Goulburn, Woden, Harman, Ainslie, Eastlake, Belco and Tuggers who play at 2pm each week and treated as basically a separate comp to div 1 & 2.
With NEAFL now only containing Ainslie & Eastlake surely that will be treated as a completely different comp and played totally separately to the Canberra comp. Therefore Div 1 will always be played at 2pm, Div 2 at 11.30pm, Rising Stars at 9am and Div 3 separate again and played at 2pm.

Surely this setup makes the most sense. In terms of creating the best competition possible this is the only structure that can work. Take out the selfishness of clubs wanting to play in premierships each year and work out whats best for football in this town/area. The current set up is killing football in this town with resources being stretched to an absolute maximum and no atmosphere at any of the games. AFL Canberra, pull your fingers out of your arse and do the right thing by football overall. You're never going to please everyone, so do whats right for the long term.

Anyone disagree with what I've proposed? I'd be interested in what the majority of people around here think.
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I doubt you could push up Molonglo, Southcoast and Gunghalin into Div 1, None of them have had results in div 2, bar Molonglo getting the minor premiership this year, further more you definitely could not push their reserves into div 2. None of them made the finals in Div 2 and that would just be asking for floggings each week. ANU and ADFA both got pushed up after years of dominating Div 2 & 3 so seemed right, wouldn't work for the 3 you have listed. It would definitely kill Molonglo and maybe Southcoast (in the Canberra comp).
 
moon28 said:
I doubt you could push up Molonglo, Southcoast and Gunghalin into Div 1, None of them have had results in div 2, bar Molonglo getting the minor premiership this year, further more you definitely could not push their reserves into div 2. None of them made the finals in Div 2 and that would just be asking for floggings each week. ANU and ADFA both got pushed up after years of dominating Div 2 & 3 so seemed right, wouldn't work for the 3 you have listed. It would definitely kill Molonglo and maybe Southcoast (in the Canberra comp).
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Theres going to be floggings in every league regardless of whos in it. The point of pushing teams up together gives struggling teams chances to compete against teams at the same level that they are at.

Thats the reason Gunaghlin didn't work in my opinion. They got pushed up by themselves and therefore every game they played they were flogged. I doubt any game that they played they would have felt a chance of winning. Adfa and Anu are a good example this year. At least they had themselves to compete against which gives your team something to look forward to throughout the season and builds confidence which then results in better preformances against better teams. Having said that if you look at the other leagues around the country even the best league outside the AFL has floggings. The worst team in the VFL finished the season 0 wins 18 losses and a percentage of 45%. You can't create a league that is completely even, there are always going to be strong teams and weak teams in every league, that doesn't mean that you should just kick out all the poorer teams and leave only the top teams.

After what will initially be a painful year or 2 teams will find ways to improve their clubs and find a way to compete against the best teams in canberra. Short term gain for long term gain I suppose. The league can't be run on a year by year proposition. Whats their long term plan? Surely they have one of them. Obviously the NEAFL comp has stuffed them around in the last few years, but they still need to have a plan.

There wouldn't be another league in Australia that is set up the way ours is, and I believe there is good reason for that. I'm happy to be corrected on that.
 
12 Magpies said:
Theres going to be floggings in every league regardless of whos in it. The point of pushing teams up together gives struggling teams chances to compete against teams at the same level that they are at.

Thats the reason Gunaghlin didn't work in my opinion. They got pushed up by themselves and therefore every game they played they were flogged. I doubt any game that they played they would have felt a chance of winning. Adfa and Anu are a good example this year. At least they had themselves to compete against which gives your team something to look forward to throughout the season and builds confidence which then results in better preformances against better teams. Having said that if you look at the other leagues around the country even the best league outside the AFL has floggings. The worst team in the VFL finished the season 0 wins 18 losses and a percentage of 45%. You can't create a league that is completely even, there are always going to be strong teams and weak teams in every league, that doesn't mean that you should just kick out all the poorer teams and leave only the top teams.

After what will initially be a painful year or 2 teams will find ways to improve their clubs and find a way to compete against the best teams in canberra. Short term gain for long term gain I suppose. The league can't be run on a year by year proposition. Whats their long term plan? Surely they have one of them. Obviously the NEAFL comp has stuffed them around in the last few years, but they still need to have a plan.

There wouldn't be another league in Australia that is set up the way ours is, and I believe there is good reason for that. I'm happy to be corrected on that.
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I think you're a bit delusional about this. Outside of Ainslie/Belconnen/Eastlake/Queanbeyan, there is simply no club backing for any of these other teams. You can't have that against teams that are actively recruiting and paying players. The next two years you'll likely have pretty dominant Belconnen and Queanbeyan teams, the possibly a drop to Ainslie/Eastlake/Tuggeranong, and then that's it. You're basically asking Molonglo (and others) to go up two divisions from where they played this year, and they didn't even win the GF.

If the competition is going to be so clear cut into two tiers, why not make two competitions?
 
12 Magpies said:
Theres going to be floggings in every league regardless of whos in it. The point of pushing teams up together gives struggling teams chances to compete against teams at the same level that they are at.

Thats the reason Gunaghlin didn't work in my opinion. They got pushed up by themselves and therefore every game they played they were flogged. I doubt any game that they played they would have felt a chance of winning. Adfa and Anu are a good example this year. At least they had themselves to compete against which gives your team something to look forward to throughout the season and builds confidence which then results in better preformances against better teams. Having said that if you look at the other leagues around the country even the best league outside the AFL has floggings. The worst team in the VFL finished the season 0 wins 18 losses and a percentage of 45%. You can't create a league that is completely even, there are always going to be strong teams and weak teams in every league, that doesn't mean that you should just kick out all the poorer teams and leave only the top teams.

After what will initially be a painful year or 2 teams will find ways to improve their clubs and find a way to compete against the best teams in canberra. Short term gain for long term gain I suppose. The league can't be run on a year by year proposition. Whats their long term plan? Surely they have one of them. Obviously the NEAFL comp has stuffed them around in the last few years, but they still need to have a plan.

There wouldn't be another league in Australia that is set up the way ours is, and I believe there is good reason for that. I'm happy to be corrected on that.
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Just to go on further here, surely it would make more sense for the top division of Canberra footy to play in another league if they are not happy with the number of clubs, ie the Riverina league? Then have Div 2 competing as it was this year...

There's just no way it will work otherwise, there is too much money involved for clubs who just don't have it.
 

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MotleyLemon said:
Just to go on further here, surely it would make more sense for the top division of Canberra footy to play in another league if they are not happy with the number of clubs, ie the Riverina league? Then have Div 2 competing as it was this year...

There's just no way it will work otherwise, there is too much money involved for clubs who just don't have it.
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Yes but you can't have a 4 team comp. You might be right. Maybe the best thing would be to bring in teams from outside of Canberra or for the big 4 to head elsewhere.
I guess the hard thing to know is how active are these big 4 clubs going to be in recruiting etc when they aren't playing in the strongest league available. I'm sure the usual attraction to these clubs was the opportunity to play against afl reserve teams. With that no longer being a lure are they going to be able to recruit as much? Are they going to receive as much sponsorship not being in the neafl? I doubt it.
You can see just from the past 2 years that the quality of the top division has dropped off considerably from last year due to teams struggling to recruit and pay enough money to players. I don't think that's going to improve with teams now not even in the top league available.
Also do you think players are going to be happy playing div 2 when they don't get picked when they know there are 9 other teams in the league that would give them the opportunity of playing div 1. That alone should make it easier for the poorer clubs to recruit.
I'm not sure if what I've proposed is the right answer. But what I do know is the current format is killing football in this town and something has to change
 
Before every tells the big 4 to go find somewhere to play. Remember that the big 4 formed the basis of the Canberra competition for 70-80 years. Majority of that time in a 6 team comp. QBN and Belconnen may not keep the majority of their NEAFL lists as these players MAY want to compete at that higher level.
In terms of resources these clubs were once like the rest of you and not all that long ago. If the league can come up with an equality measure that can really only be implemented over a few years. You'll find these clubs maybe well resourced but the rest will still compete.

I understand you want to keep the status quo but these clubs belong in the Canberra comp.
 
Batemans Bay can not compete in Div 1and our reserves would get annihalated in div 2. We paid our coach this year and our assistant got travelling money and no one else. We are stretched every week for volunteers. I don't think this years side was that much better than last year. ANU and ADFA went up and Belco and Gungahlin dropped off that is the main reason we jumped up the ladder I think. If the Bay goes up that will be the end of our club in AFL Canberra. we would have to go back to the SCAFL and about 18 blokes a week would miss out on footy because they have no reserves. I also think with the number of forfeits this year div 3 needs to be 16 a side in 2015. I know the one team clubs will not like it but I think it is for the benefit of the comp.
 
no orange peeler said:
Before every tells the big 4 to go find somewhere to play. Remember that the big 4 formed the basis of the Canberra competition for 70-80 years. Majority of that time in a 6 team comp. QBN and Belconnen may not keep the majority of their NEAFL lists as these players MAY want to compete at that higher level.
In terms of resources these clubs were once like the rest of you and not all that long ago. If the league can come up with an equality measure that can really only be implemented over a few years. You'll find these clubs maybe well resourced but the rest will still compete.

I understand you want to keep the status quo but these clubs belong in the Canberra comp.
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I agree 100%. Thats why I think other clubs need to step up and make division 1 a proper competition.
Does anyone have any idea when we are expecting to hear what the format for next year will be? They can't drag this out too long. Clubs are trying to prepare/plan for next year and beyond and at the moment no one has any idea what they are planning for. Surely this will be sorted out in the next few weeks.
 
12 Magpies said:
I agree 100%. Thats why I think other clubs need to step up and make division 1 a proper competition.
Does anyone have any idea when we are expecting to hear what the format for next year will be? They can't drag this out too long. Clubs are trying to prepare/plan for next year and beyond and at the moment no one has any idea what they are planning for. Surely this will be sorted out in the next few weeks.
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Cant see that happening anytime soon .Correct me if im wrong and I may well be !! but I thought that Canberra was now run by Melbourne's operation.
 
12 Magpies said:
I agree 100%. Thats why I think other clubs need to step up and make division 1 a proper competition.
Does anyone have any idea when we are expecting to hear what the format for next year will be? They can't drag this out too long. Clubs are trying to prepare/plan for next year and beyond and at the moment no one has any idea what they are planning for. Surely this will be sorted out in the next few weeks.
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A draft proposal was given at a league meeting with club reps last week, the AFL is now meeting with the 'most affected clubs' and the big clubs individually not nut out the proposal and gain their 'interest'. At the moment the proposal cannot leave those meetings but I think there will soon be a lot of whole of club meetings to discuss the proposals and whether the interest is there.

IF they proposal carries they plan to have it out by the end of October

sorry I cannot elaborate with the details at the moment.
 
Heard that Juggers and Woden blues merger was discussed at afl canberra meeting !!! Was told if blues don't merge they will not be registered for next season , has anyone heard about this ?
 
woopwoop82 said:
Heard that Juggers and Woden blues merger was discussed at afl canberra meeting !!! Was told if blues don't merge they will not be registered for next season , has anyone heard about this ?
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Has anyone heard anything about anything? 21st of October and clubs still don't know what division they will be playing in next year or who against. How does the league expect clubs to prepare for next season if they don't know what they are preparing for. In about 3 weeks time I imagine most clubs, especially those in Division 1 will be starting preseason and they don't know where they are going to be.
I really feel for the lower clubs, like ANU, ADFA and the likes of Molonglo and Gunaghlin. I've heard that both Molonglo and Gungahlin are trying to be pushed up, and also heard that ANU & Adfa may be pushed back down. How can any of those clubs sign up coaches or recruit players etc if they don't know what division they will be playing in. And by the time they find out it will be too late with all the decent coaches and players signed up already.
And then the league wonders why these teams can't compete in Division 1.
If the rumours I've heard are true about the leagues direction for 2015 then in my opinion certain peoples positions within the league needs to be reconsidered. I hope people are being being held accountable for the determental effect they are having on senior football in this region.
 
Plugga28 said:
Did guys see this article in the Canberra Times on the weekend.... http://www.canberratimes.com.au/spo...f-firstgrade-restructure-20141017-116dvy.html
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I like the idea. Its not ideal, but I think its a good thing that the league is trying to push up teams and finding ways like that to make them more competitive. Still if this is the way they are going clubs need to know to start preparing. Surely the league know the importance of the off season in terms of a clubs success for the following season.
I don't understand pushing up Gungahlin and Molonglo and then dropping down one of ADFA or ANU. I feel for whichever club gets pushed back down after only the one year of being up. Seems that whichever team that has that happen to them have wasted a year of their life for nothing. Both teams managed to beat each other once and also beat another div 1 side, so I would have thought that would give them enough confidence to stay up and continue to build on that confidence next season.
 
12 Magpies said:
I like the idea. Its not ideal, but I think its a good thing that the league is trying to push up teams and finding ways like that to make them more competitive. Still if this is the way they are going clubs need to know to start preparing. Surely the league know the importance of the off season in terms of a clubs success for the following season.
I don't understand pushing up Gungahlin and Molonglo and then dropping down one of ADFA or ANU. I feel for whichever club gets pushed back down after only the one year of being up. Seems that whichever team that has that happen to them have wasted a year of their life for nothing. Both teams managed to beat each other once and also beat another div 1 side, so I would have thought that would give them enough confidence to stay up and continue to build on that confidence next season.
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Still seems to me that Ainslie and Eastlake are being punished for sticking to their contracts with the NEAFL. Why would they put money into developing players, and then have them play for another club? Weakens them through the grades. I could understand it if it was an out and out Canberra rep team in the NEAFL, but given that Ainslie and Eastlake both have sides in the other grades of Canberra football, I can't see this being particularly reasonable. Their NEAFL teams and Div 1 sides will presumably have a similar game plan etc, what value does either club get out of having their drop offs playing other sides? How do the other sides feel about blokes not training with them all week, then showing up on game day from another club and forcing blokes back a grade/to miss out on a game altogether?

Don't mean to whinge, as it's obviously a pretty tough situation, but just a few thoughts...
 

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