AFL to mediate on Warnock deal.

[worsfold]

personally I think Carlton are after the wrong ruckman, but to be fair carlton should only have to match anyother offer from other clubs.

but in saying that its hard to do when you only have picks 6 and 24.

If melb offer pick 17 or 19 that does not equate to carltons pick 6, have any other clubs offered a top 10 pick for warnock - no so the next best they can offer is 24 deal with it freo the guys a loser anyway.

 

[Quigley]

I have heard people practicing in the area saying that it falling over on a restraint of trade challenge is no sure thing. The collective bargaining agreement is something which makes it more likely to stand up apparently.

Is it likely that the player has asked the AFL to mediate. The CBA gives players certain rights come draft time and he can approach the AFL if there is a special case.

On trading wasn't it introduced last year that teams could trade future picks? If so and with two compromised drafts coming up I would have thought teams would be getting into that to balance out trades.

 

[nurries]

personally I think Carlton are after the wrong ruckman, but to be fair carlton should only have to match anyother offer from other clubs.

but in saying that its hard to do when you only have picks 6 and 24.

If melb offer pick 17 or 19 that does not equate to carltons pick 6, have any other clubs offered a top 10 pick for warnock - no so the next best they can offer is 24 deal with it freo the guys a loser anyway.

Let me guess.......Seaby perhaps?

 

[DaVe86]

Personally I agree but that isn't the point.

If Fremantle believe Warnock is worth more than pick 24 alone then they are entitled to use the system however way fit to trade him or retain him depending on what option they wish to use. Freo are also entitled (like any club) to test the market to find a deal in their best interest. Whether Freo are diplaying some level of "bravado" or not is irrelevant and in any case it is their right (as annoying as it may be).

Because the AFL want to see a deal done they are interfering in the natural process of the current trade system. Instead of intervening on "select" trades they should concentrate on making the trade system better.

Yep good post....Freo are playing a risky game. They stand to lose a bit if Warnock wants out and enters the PSD. But if that's how they want to negotiate, then they have every right.


If it is true that Freo have asked for pick 6, then they are dreaming...but they have the right and its a normal part of negotiation to start high.

Atleast Freo aren't bending over backwards in years gone past.

But, let the negotiations go. If Carlton want their man, the current system demands they find the right price. If Freo are unwilling to accept, the stand to lose big time.

 

[Star]

The AFL is keen for a deal to be reached on Warnock.

It has become frustrated with clubs in recent years for waiting until the last hour of trade week to finalise deals.

The AFL also does not want Warnock to enter the pre-season or national draft and price himself out of the salary caps of competing clubs.

What the hell is it to them?

Those suggesting they don't want a repeat of the Veale deal - they made their bed on that one and no change was made to the rules.

The way I figure, if Carlton and Freo abide by them, then the AFL should not stick their noses in

 

[Canyouhearthedrums]

I have heard people practicing in the area saying that it falling over on a restraint of trade challenge is no sure thing. The collective bargaining agreement is something which makes it more likely to stand up apparently.

Is it likely that the player has asked the AFL to mediate. The CBA gives players certain rights come draft time and he can approach the AFL if there is a special case.

On trading wasn't it introduced last year that teams could trade future picks? If so and with two compromised drafts coming up I would have thought teams would be getting into that to balance out trades.

It's not that the system as a whole would really fall over, it's only the discreet question of how they can deal with a player once a contract is over.

Clubs have their cake and eat it at the moment - shite players get their employment terminated as soon as the contract is up. But good players remain at their beck and call, despite there being no legal agreement or relationship in existance.

 

[nurries]

Yep good post....Freo are playing a risky game. They stand to lose a bit if Warnock wants out and enters the PSD. But if that's how they want to negotiate, then they have every right.


If it is true that Freo have asked for pick 6, then they are dreaming...but they have the right and its a normal part of negotiation to start high.

Atleast Freo aren't bending over backwards in years gone past.

But, let the negotiations go. If Carlton want their man, the current system demands they find the right price. If Freo are unwilling to accept, the stand to lose big time.

Get us a pick between 10-20 and we will negotiate. Simple really

 

[dees 4 life]

Has Warnock said "no to Melbourne?
I think we would give up our pick 19, which seems about fair.

 

[pistol17]

The thing about this situation is Carlton could have walked away by now, they obviously desperately want Warnock at the blues next year otherwise we wouldnt be having a mediator from the AFL come and help out.

I heard Steven Icke on the radio this morning saying along the lines of Pick 24 is more than adequate when you consider how many talented young players are in this draft. This SHOULD NOT matter IMO. What if it was last years draft would that mean Carlton would have no problems giving Fremantle Pick 6 or an upgrade on Pick 24.

After all the crap the dockers have copped for their trading and drafting it is good to see some back bone and balls for a change. In years gone by they would have bent over then got on their knees. Hopefully for Warnocks sake something can be arranged between the two clubs.

 

[rotto]

personally I think Carlton are after the wrong ruckman, but to be fair carlton should only have to match anyother offer from other clubs.

but in saying that its hard to do when you only have picks 6 and 24.

thats why judd didnt go to collingwood, they wont in the position to trade unless they gave up quality players.

for carlton to get the deal done that need to give up a top 22 player which they are not prepared to do.

 

[Eagle87]

This is the second time the AFL have "mediated", the last time was Judd last year. Both have involved Carlton. No doubt after they leave the AFL AD & AA will end up with nice consulting roles with Visy.

By the way, based on last year this is the primary tool of mediation:

 

[Mr.X]

It's been a very interesting morning, and it's looking like the Warnock deal to Carlton has stalled badly

Both sides aren't budging, and it looks like he's headed for the draft

 

[Da Bull]

The thing about this situation is Carlton could have walked away by now, they obviously desperately want Warnock at the blues next year otherwise we wouldnt be having a mediator from the AFL come and help out.

I heard Steven Icke on the radio this morning saying along the lines of Pick 24 is more than adequate when you consider how many talented young players are in this draft. This SHOULD NOT matter IMO. What if it was last years draft would that mean Carlton would have no problems giving Fremantle Pick 6 or an upgrade on Pick 24.

After all the crap the dockers have copped for their trading and drafting it is good to see some back bone and balls for a change. In years gone by they would have bent over then got on their knees. Hopefully for Warnocks sake something can be arranged between the two clubs.

I think your reading a little bit to much into it. He would be a very handy aquisition, but to be desperate for him they would give Freo what they want. This isn't happening. Now or ever.

Hopefully a deal can be done, if not we move on.

 

[Lach72]

Icke's justification is that top 20 picks will get you a player who will play 150 games for your club...

Now, Warnock is 21 and should play for the next 7-8 years as a minimum ergo 140-150 games less injury.

Therefore his argument is a pile of poo, particularly when you consider we've done the hard work for them

 

[CROWS08]

The AFL also does not want Warnock to enter the pre-season or national draft and price himself out of the salary caps of competing clubs.

Love this line - So what they are really saying is that they are willing to help Carlton get him at the expense of every other club.

What about the Nick Stevens - Diadak trade fiasco that went on. Stevens ended up goingto the pre season draft and the AFL said squat.
I say butt out AFL and let the clubs work it out.
If it doesnt suit both parties then walk away.

 

[nut]

Thats the funny thing. Why isn't Melbourne getting more of a look in? Their Priority pick or 2nd rndr is about spot on for Warnock. Is Warnock refusing to go to Melb?

Exactly...... why wouldn't he want a chance play with his brother.... Carlton must be offering huge money.... Maybe a position with Visy as a Paper cut expert.

The AFL should stay the hell out of it. Why aren't they helping every other Trade ??????

Maybe they dont want Melbourne to get him for free and become successful again down the track.... Very fishy to me.

If Cameron Wood was worth pick 12 then Warnock as a ready made Ruckman would be worth atleast that.

 

[lavaman]

Stop mentioning Pick 6, because this just shows that you dont understand or recognise football talent and ability.

Wood was a first round pick. And Brisbane got compinsated adequatly for him.

Warnock was not a first round pick so this 'potential' was not like Wood and stop kidding yourselves he has not set the world on fire yet. I say yet because yes he is tall and looks like he could be a goer, but he is not a goer. He is a very average footballer right now. If you were trading based on what a player might be in 5 years then James Sellar is worth the number 1 pick. He was considered a top 5 even top 3 chance at times. He was drafted in the first round. He hasn't done so much yet, but his potential is enormous, we all know how good he can be. So if he does keep getting stronger, we know how good he will be in 5 years so anything less than pick 1 is probably unfair then? UTTER RUBBISH.

Ryan Okeefe can demand a first round pick as he is a quality forward, one of the best. (only one as he is 28)
Daniel Kerr can demand 2 first round picks as he is one of the best mids in the comp.
Robert Warnock has done nothing. Has shown bits and pieces, is young, is tall but has done nothing. You're getting offered a early second round choice. Which is 5 spots from this pick 19 that you would accept from Melbourne and that you all think is fair. 5 spots!!!!

It's cute to see Freo trying to play hard ball and show there Kahunas to every one but we all know how this will end, and unfortunatlly this whole Warnock saga has shown how bloody stupid some Fremantle supporters are!!!
Thank you. That is all.

 

[Bradesmaen]

I think your reading a little bit to much into it. He would be a very handy aquisition, but to be desperate for him they would give Freo what they want. This isn't happening. Now or ever.

Hopefully a deal can be done, if not we move on.

Thats what YOU think. Obviously your club thinks different. How many times do people on BigFooty have to be told that what you want and think is completely different to what the club wants most of the time.

 

[worthy]

Thats the funny thing. Why isn't Melbourne getting more of a look in? Their Priority pick or 2nd rndr is about spot on for Warnock. Is Warnock refusing to go to Melb?

Strange indeed, they are Victorian, have a pick in the right range, wouldn't have much competition for the No. 1 ruck spot, so plenty of opportunity.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Stop mentioning Pick 6, because this just shows that you dont understand or recognise football talent and ability.

Wood was a first round pick. And Brisbane got compinsated adequatly for him.

Warnock was not a first round pick so this 'potential' was not like Wood and stop kidding yourselves he has not set the world on fire yet. I say yet because yes he is tall and looks like he could be a goer, but he is not a goer. He is a very average footballer right now. If you were trading based on what a player might be in 5 years then James Sellar is worth the number 1 pick. He was considered a top 5 even top 3 chance at times. He was drafted in the first round. He hasn't done so much yet, but his potential is enormous, we all know how good he can be. So if he does keep getting stronger, we know how good he will be in 5 years so anything less than pick 1 is probably unfair then? UTTER RUBBISH.

Ryan Okeefe can demand a first round pick as he is a quality forward, one of the best. (only one as he is 28)
Daniel Kerr can demand 2 first round picks as he is one of the best mids in the comp.
Robert Warnock has done nothing. Has shown bits and pieces, is young, is tall but has done nothing. You're getting offered a early second round choice. Which is 5 spots from this pick 19 that you would accept from Melbourne and that you all think is fair. 5 spots!!!!

It's cute to see Freo trying to play hard ball and show there Kahunas to every one but we all know how this will end, and unfortunatlly this whole Warnock saga has shown how bloody stupid some Fremantle supporters are!!!
Thank you. That is all.

Oh don't give us that bullshit. So after James Hird won a brownlow medal, did anyone offer pick 40 and say "He was pick 60ish when he got taken first time around, he's surely only worth pick 40 now!".. No, they didn't.. so take that bullshit approach and eat it.

 

[saladin]

blame collingwood. They gave pick 14 for Wood. Freo look at that, then figure that Warnock is more promising than Wood (which is probably true, but not by much) and ask for a pick accordingly.

Don't forget, all three parties - both clubs and the player - are playing games. Warnock may not simply be the victim here. Say melbourne offer pick #17. Freo accept, but Warnock refuses because he wants to go to carlton. Freo are then between a rock and a hard place, and threatening to re-draft him is not overly surprising - even though they'd probably never do it.

 

[worthy]

Stop mentioning Pick 6, because this just shows that you dont understand or recognise football talent and ability.

Wood was a first round pick. And Brisbane got compinsated adequatly for him.

Warnock was not a first round pick so this 'potential' was not like Wood and stop kidding yourselves he has not set the world on fire yet. I say yet because yes he is tall and looks like he could be a goer, but he is not a goer. He is a very average footballer right now. If you were trading based on what a player might be in 5 years then James Sellar is worth the number 1 pick. He was considered a top 5 even top 3 chance at times. He was drafted in the first round. He hasn't done so much yet, but his potential is enormous, we all know how good he can be. So if he does keep getting stronger, we know how good he will be in 5 years so anything less than pick 1 is probably unfair then? UTTER RUBBISH.

Ryan Okeefe can demand a first round pick as he is a quality forward, one of the best. (only one as he is 28)
Daniel Kerr can demand 2 first round picks as he is one of the best mids in the comp.
Robert Warnock has done nothing. Has shown bits and pieces, is young, is tall but has done nothing. You're getting offered a early second round choice. Which is 5 spots from this pick 19 that you would accept from Melbourne and that you all think is fair. 5 spots!!!!

It's cute to see Freo trying to play hard ball and show there Kahunas to every one but we all know how this will end, and unfortunatlly this whole Warnock saga has shown how bloody stupid some Fremantle supporters are!!!
Thank you. That is all.

Warnock has shown enough for draft selection # to now be irrelevant, Wood was traded on potential, not draft selection #, just like Warnock will be.

 

[lavaman]

Oh don't give us that bullshit. So after James Hird won a brownlow medal, did anyone offer pick 40 and say "He was pick 60ish when he got taken first time around, he's surely only worth pick 40 now!".. No, they didn't.. so take that bullshit approach and eat it.

Are you kidding mate? This is exactly what i'm saying is ridiculous!!!! Read what i wrote again, in particular the bit about the Fremantle supporters and get back to me. Because you have just made my case stronger.

 

[2ndeffort]

I seem to remember the AFL making independent arbitrators available to all clubs for the last 3-4 years to try and make trades go through easier during trade week. The fact that Carlton may have chosen to use this facility does not show any bias, just making the most of what the AFL offer to all clubs. The fact that other clubs dont choose to use the arbitrator is not Carlton's fault.

I agree that Freo have the utmost right to demand whatever they want for Warnock and if we cant meet the asking price then they move on.

I personally think that Freo want to make enough noise about this trade to show the world that they are not a pushover anymore. Once all of the freo fans have puffed out their chests and made some bold statements, right at the last minute Freo will of course roll over and take 26 + junk rather than get 0 in the PSD.

Either way #6 is not on offer and we dont have anything else.

 

[TIGER03]

No way Warnock is worth #24 and Paul Bower. Selection #24 is this upcoming draft is fair and reasonable compensation for a young ruckman that has played a handful of games.

so you say, freo on the other hand would be saying we trade him to carlton we fix your ruck problems. that has to come at a price. what price you say, well its not 24. there is no question if carlton had a pick between 16 - 20 in this trade, the deal would of been done.