AFLPA Statement

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IMO the bolded bit sounds unfair, but I don't know all of the rules in this area.


http://www.aflplayers.com.au/article/statement-from-acting-pa-ceo-ian-prendergast/

“Following the serious development of players being issued show cause notices by ASADA, and the subsequent media coverage, I’d like to provide clarity around the current situation and process from here.

The players met on Monday night and were briefed by their legal team, consisting of AFL Players’ Association lawyers Bernie Shinners and Brett Murphy, in addition to Tony Hargreaves; who are jointly instructing David Grace QC and Ben Ihle of Counsel.

The players’ legal team has now written to ASADA to request an extension to the 10 day period in which they were asked to respond, and to request a copy of all documents and other materials that ASADA proposes to put to the Anti-Doping Rule Violation Panel in respect of the players.

To date, the players’ lawyers have not been provided with the evidence which would enable players to respond to the show cause notices, and their requests to be provided with this material have been refused.

The CEO of ASADA, Ben McDevitt, has publicly urged players to come forward and co-operate with ASADA, and suggested that players may be able to utilise a plea of ‘no significant fault or negligence’, and have their penalties reduced on the basis of ‘substantial assistance’.

In saying this, Mr McDevitt seems to be suggesting that players have not fully co-operated with ASADA, yet nothing could be further from the truth. The players have done nothing but cooperate with ASADA, as they were advised to do by their Association, their club, the AFL and by ASADA officials. ASADA’s investigators have praised the players, who they considered professional, co-operative and sincere in their efforts to assist the investigation.

In circumstances where not one player believes he has taken a prohibited substance, and where the players have not been provided the evidence on which ASADA relies to make this claim, why would any player consider the approach that Mr McDevitt suggests.

- This is false, Jobe Watson believes he took AOD, a prohibited substance.

ASADA, as a model litigant, has a duty to provide players with the evidence to enable them to respond to the show cause notices. If it refuses to provide this information voluntarily, then the players will be forced to take legal action to ensure that ASADA complies with its model litigant obligations and acts fairly with respect to the players.

The players’ legal team will also ask ASADA to stay the show cause process, including referral of these matters to the ADRVP, until after the club’s Federal Court action has been concluded.

It is important to note that this request is not a delaying tactic – the players are, in fact, keen for this matter to be resolved, given the length of time in which this has now dragged on.

However, it makes no sense to subject players to the next stage in this process, in circumstances where the club’s legal action may subsequently render the process invalid. We therefore urge ASADA and the Club to take steps to expedite this process in the Federal Court to finalise this matter at the earliest opportunity.

Again, the players’ lawyers are yet to be provided any evidence implicating players in a breach of the AFL Anti-Doping Code. In the absence of any such evidence, questions of ‘defences’ and ‘reduced sanctions’ are premature.

Nevertheless, if the evidence does establish a breach of the code, then the steps taken by players to assure themselves that substances administered were compliant with the WADA Code must be taken into account.

The players took all reasonable steps to ensure that the substances they were to be administered were compliant with the WADA Code, and were provided with written guarantees to this effect. If it turns out that those substances were not compliant, and the players were deceived by those who they were asked to trust, they should not be punished as a result.”
 
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does anyone think any of this is fair? Providing no evidence? Suggesting the players haven't cooperated?

ASADA are looking shakier by the day. I honestly think they just want this to go away now
I can't really see where anyone said they haven't co-operated.

McDevitt basically said, I think, don't fight, cop your whack and it might only be 6 months. I could be wrong as I didn't listen to all of the interviews in what the media have dubbed "the most extensive and unprecedented PR blitz since Hanke registered an account on BigFooty".
 

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Players getting the evidence seems fair, it is likely it happens a little further down the process Im sure.

Though with deals being offered it would help the players make there choice a lot easier if they knew what ASADA was working with, not an outrageous request.
 
I can't really see where anyone said they haven't co-operated.

McDevitt basically said, I think, don't fight, cop your whack and it might only be 6 months. I could be wrong as I didn't listen to all of the interviews in what the media have dubbed "the most extensive and unprecedented PR blitz since Hanke registered an account on BigFooty".
I laughed :D

But he basically did say that by saying the players need to now cooperate, implying they haven't
 
IMO the bolded bit sounds unfair, but I don't know all of the rules in this area.


http://www.aflplayers.com.au/article/statement-from-acting-pa-ceo-ian-prendergast/

“Following the serious development of players being issued show cause notices by ASADA, and the subsequent media coverage, I’d like to provide clarity around the current situation and process from here.

The players met on Monday night and were briefed by their legal team, consisting of AFL Players’ Association lawyers Bernie Shinners and Brett Murphy, in addition to Tony Hargreaves; who are jointly instructing David Grace QC and Ben Ihle of Counsel.

The players’ legal team has now written to ASADA to request an extension to the 10 day period in which they were asked to respond, and to request a copy of all documents and other materials that ASADA proposes to put to the Anti-Doping Rule Violation Panel in respect of the players.

To date, the players’ lawyers have not been provided with the evidence which would enable players to respond to the show cause notices, and their requests to be provided with this material have been refused.

The CEO of ASADA, Ben McDevitt, has publicly urged players to come forward and co-operate with ASADA, and suggested that players may be able to utilise a plea of ‘no significant fault or negligence’, and have their penalties reduced on the basis of ‘substantial assistance’.

In saying this, Mr McDevitt seems to be suggesting that players have not fully co-operated with ASADA, yet nothing could be further from the truth. The players have done nothing but cooperate with ASADA, as they were advised to do by their Association, their club, the AFL and by ASADA officials. ASADA’s investigators have praised the players, who they considered professional, co-operative and sincere in their efforts to assist the investigation.

In circumstances where not one player believes he has taken a prohibited substance, and where the players have not been provided the evidence on which ASADA relies to make this claim, why would any player consider the approach that Mr McDevitt suggests.

- This is false, Jobe Watson believes he took AOD, a prohibited substance.

ASADA, as a model litigant, has a duty to provide players with the evidence to enable them to respond to the show cause notices. If it refuses to provide this information voluntarily, then the players will be forced to take legal action to ensure that ASADA complies with its model litigant obligations and acts fairly with respect to the players.

The players’ legal team will also ask ASADA to stay the show cause process, including referral of these matters to the ADRVP, until after the club’s Federal Court action has been concluded.

It is important to note that this request is not a delaying tactic – the players are, in fact, keen for this matter to be resolved, given the length of time in which this has now dragged on.

However, it makes no sense to subject players to the next stage in this process, in circumstances where the club’s legal action may subsequently render the process invalid. We therefore urge ASADA and the Club to take steps to expedite this process in the Federal Court to finalise this matter at the earliest opportunity.

Again, the players’ lawyers are yet to be provided any evidence implicating players in a breach of the AFL Anti-Doping Code. In the absence of any such evidence, questions of ‘defences’ and ‘reduced sanctions’ are premature.

Nevertheless, if the evidence does establish a breach of the code, then the steps taken by players to assure themselves that substances administered were compliant with the WADA Code must be taken into account.

The players took all reasonable steps to ensure that the substances they were to be administered were compliant with the WADA Code, and were provided with written guarantees to this effect. If it turns out that those substances were not compliant, and the players were deceived by those who they were asked to trust, they should not be punished as a result.”

If the players were given written guarantees that all substances were WADA compliant then they need completely independent legal advice, the conflict of interest with the EFC is obvious.
 
Perhaps Malifice or Baldur or another learned friend can advise whether players are actually entitled to see the evidence at the show cause phase of proceedings.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
 
There were murmurs last year that ASADA were displeased with Essendon players being coached for their interviews, certain staff being belligerent and uncooperative and possibly even under the influence during an interview.

McDevitt isn't bargaining. Keep poking the bear though.
 
The players took all reasonable steps to ensure that the substances they were to be administered were compliant with the WADA Code, and were provided with written guarantees to this effect. If it turns out that those substances were not compliant, and the players were deceived by those who they were asked to trust, they should not be punished as a result.”

In your opinion, Mr Prendegrast.

Thought that was a bit cheeky actually.
 
I think ASADA should do what they normally would. If that is to provide evidence at show cause stage, they should. If it is to hold until the ADVRP, they should do that.

This. They either respond satisfactorily or they don't and the process rolls on.
 
does anyone think any of this is fair? Providing no evidence? Suggesting the players haven't cooperated?
If ASADA is following the normal procedure at the show cause phase then it's fair.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
 

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Perhaps the players should have asked ASADA if the substances were allowed instead of asking the club. Isnt that what they're instructed to do. Im guessing with the Thymosin stuff if they had asked they would have been told no you cant use it.
I guess the question is who did they ask and who provided the written guarentee that they complied. Because if it was Dank I think they're stuffed.
 
In your opinion, Mr Prendegrast.

Thought that was a bit cheeky actually.
Reimers disagrees - saying basically they were told very little, and what they were told was in technical terms they couldn't understand.
 
I laughed :D

But he basically did say that by saying the players need to now cooperate, implying they haven't

And when Whately pressed about whether what they'd said so far could count as co-operation for the discount, he said yes, it could.
 
Does ASADA have to provide all documents and other materials, even if many are not very relevant and the total would fill the back of a truck? Be careful of what is not being said, it has not been said that ASADA has refused refused to provide any evidence, just not all documents and other materials.

A not uncommon pre hearing sparring match involves discovery and the like. I am unsure just what ASADA has to provide at this stage.
 
ASADA should need to provide everything they base these show cause notices on, If they don't how can the players respond??
 
Interesting to see the amount of references in the media today re: not receiving a penalty.

AOD appears to be ok when we took it Chief. ASADA seem unable to prosecute it.
 
does anyone think any of this is fair? Providing no evidence? Suggesting the players haven't cooperated?

ASADA are looking shakier by the day. I honestly think they just want this to go away now
Clearly not a fair process as how can you defend a blind argument.

Is not providing evidence for the charges normal practice in the SC process and is it legal?
 
Clearly not a fair process as how can you defend a blind argument.

Is not providing evidence for the charges normal practice in the SC process and is it legal?
don't really know. Seems pretty stupid though if it is normal practice. Counter-intuitive at the best
 
This is a hilarious little standoff.

Why should the players need the evidence - it happened to them, THEY WERE THERE!

Of course their club is still running with the line that they do not have records :rolleyes:. And the players are still running with the line that they were duped.

Now the lawyers and law enforcement folk amongst us will know more then me, but if I get dragged into police headquarters to be questioned for a murder I committed I don't think I have any rights to inspect the police evidence. I am pretty sure they will unleash that on me when they are ready.

Also, stop saying there are offers of deals on the table. There are no deals on offer, just the established process.
 

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